On Nov 17, 6:59*am, "Eisboch" wrote:
Here's an idea for the bailout versus bankruptcy debate as options for GM
(and possibly Ford and Chrysler)

Do both.

Agree to a government (taxpayer) financed cash infusion as part of the
reorganization plan in Chapter 11 bankruptcy.

GM apparently has multiple, costly contractual obligations to suppliers, for
unused facilities, pension plans, etc. that can only be restructured in a
bankruptcy situation, under the watch of a bankruptcy judge.

To pour money into GM without addressing these issues is, *in the words of
the famous chant, "More of the same". * GM will still be obligated to these
contracts, including retired pension and existing labor unions contracts.

Under Chapter 11 reorganization, GM can end contributions for existing
retired pensions. *The cost of these pensions will be absorbed into an
existing federal pension insurance program (forget the name of it).

This arrangement will also afford GM to be completely restructured, lean and
mean, and costly contractual obligations that are no longer of benefit can
be terminated by the bankruptcy judge.
The judge can also require labor union contracts to be renegotiated,
management replaced and/or restructured, including salary and perk caps.

Then, with the "new" GM structure in place, a taxpayer financed investment
makes sense to kick start the reorganized company with the money spent to
develop and market modern, fuel efficient vehicles at a cost that can be
competitive with the likes of Toyota and Honda.

It makes sense to me. * I also think that Toyota and Honda are walking down
the same path as the US auto industry and eventually will become bloated and
inefficient. * We should restructure the US industry now, and stay ahead of
the curve.

Eisboch

Well, GM has already ripped the Canadian Govt. for millions in a loan.
**** your idea. As a taxpayer, I'm not giving them anything. Gee,
silver-spooner, why not give them some of your money.
The fat-payed CEO, and other over-payed leeches down the line , should
be held responsible.

wrote in message
...

On Nov 17, 6:59 am, "Eisboch" wrote:

Well, GM has already ripped the Canadian Govt. for millions in a loan.
**** your idea. As a taxpayer, I'm not giving them anything. Gee,
silver-spooner, why not give them some of your money.
The fat-payed CEO, and other over-payed leeches down the line , should
be held responsible.

-----------------------------

"silver-spooner"? LOL. That's a new one.

You sound a bit more frustrated today than usual. Cut back on your
overtime? Union dues go up? Or did your shop steward inform you that your
latest grievance was denied?

Eisboch

On Nov 17, 11:10*am, "Eisboch" wrote:
wrote in message

...

On Nov 17, 6:59 am, "Eisboch" wrote:

Well, GM has already ripped the Canadian Govt. for millions in a loan.
**** your idea. As a taxpayer, I'm not giving them anything. Gee,
silver-spooner, why not give them some of your money.
The fat-payed CEO, and other over-payed leeches down the line , should
be held responsible.

-----------------------------

"silver-spooner"? * LOL. * That's a new one.

You sound a bit more frustrated today than usual. *Cut back on your
overtime? *Union dues go up? *Or did your shop steward inform you that your
latest grievance was denied?

Eisboch

The company just got the union to up the manhours worked to two, for a
days pay...

Rowdy Mouse Racing, Don't need no stinkin' union...

wrote:
On Nov 17, 11:10 am, "Eisboch" wrote:
wrote in message

...

On Nov 17, 6:59 am, "Eisboch" wrote:

Well, GM has already ripped the Canadian Govt. for millions in a loan.
**** your idea. As a taxpayer, I'm not giving them anything. Gee,
silver-spooner, why not give them some of your money.
The fat-payed CEO, and other over-payed leeches down the line , should
be held responsible.

-----------------------------

"silver-spooner"? LOL. That's a new one.

You sound a bit more frustrated today than usual. Cut back on your
overtime? Union dues go up? Or did your shop steward inform you that your
latest grievance was denied?

Eisboch

The company just got the union to up the manhours worked to two, for a
days pay...

Rowdy Mouse Racing, Don't need no stinkin' union...


Or brains, apparently. So...how much have you saved for that kid's college?

"Boater" wrote in message
...
wrote:
On Nov 17, 11:10 am, "Eisboch" wrote:
wrote in message

...

On Nov 17, 6:59 am, "Eisboch" wrote:

Well, GM has already ripped the Canadian Govt. for millions in a loan.
**** your idea. As a taxpayer, I'm not giving them anything. Gee,
silver-spooner, why not give them some of your money.
The fat-payed CEO, and other over-payed leeches down the line , should
be held responsible.

-----------------------------

"silver-spooner"? LOL. That's a new one.

You sound a bit more frustrated today than usual. Cut back on your
overtime? Union dues go up? Or did your shop steward inform you that
your
latest grievance was denied?

Eisboch

The company just got the union to up the manhours worked to two, for a
days pay...

Rowdy Mouse Racing, Don't need no stinkin' union...


Or brains, apparently. So...how much have you saved for that kid's
college?

Funny thing about that. If the parents spent all their money on BMW's and
vacations and have no real assets, the FAFSA application and program will
allow them huge amounts of financial aid. But if the parents were middle
class and saved for the kid's education, then little aid is available. If
there are savings put aside in hte kid's name, then 1/3 of that will go each
year to the education costs. I paid for my kid's education and saved 50% on
the younger ones university education as she earned a 1/2 ride scholarship
for grades. Private University, so still cost a little more per month than
the older one sho went to a Calif. public University. If Justwait's kid has
decent grades, and he has no money, the kid still gets to go to college.

On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 12:45:15 -0500, Boater wrote:

wrote:
On Nov 17, 11:10 am, "Eisboch" wrote:
wrote in message

...

On Nov 17, 6:59 am, "Eisboch" wrote:

Well, GM has already ripped the Canadian Govt. for millions in a loan.
**** your idea. As a taxpayer, I'm not giving them anything. Gee,
silver-spooner, why not give them some of your money.
The fat-payed CEO, and other over-payed leeches down the line , should
be held responsible.

-----------------------------

"silver-spooner"? LOL. That's a new one.

You sound a bit more frustrated today than usual. Cut back on your
overtime? Union dues go up? Or did your shop steward inform you that your
latest grievance was denied?

Eisboch

The company just got the union to up the manhours worked to two, for a
days pay...

Rowdy Mouse Racing, Don't need no stinkin' union...


Or brains, apparently. So...how much have you saved for that kid's college?

The kid has shown the initiative and discipline to get herself a nice, big
scholarship.

She's even shown some courage, which is something you know nothing of.

*Krausii Liesallthetime Marylandus* -- you gotta love it!
--
A Harry Krause truism:

"It's not a *baby* kicking, beautiful bride, it's just a fetus!"

JohnH wrote:


The kid has shown the initiative and discipline to get herself a nice, big
scholarship.

She's even shown some courage, which is something you know nothing of.



Because she rides a motorcycle? That earns a scholarship and
demonstrates courage?

Besides, what the hell do you know about scholarship? You weren't smart
enough to get a IIA deferment.

Daddy better save up some buckaroos for college. There are no guarantees.

"Boater" wrote in message
...


Daddy better save up some buckaroos for college. There are no guarantees.

There are according to big "O".

Eisboch

On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 16:06:27 -0500, Boater wrote:

JohnH wrote:


The kid has shown the initiative and discipline to get herself a nice, big
scholarship.

She's even shown some courage, which is something you know nothing of.



Because she rides a motorcycle? That earns a scholarship and
demonstrates courage?

Besides, what the hell do you know about scholarship? You weren't smart
enough to get a IIA deferment.

Daddy better save up some buckaroos for college. There are no guarantees.

Think about it....how *did* I get a bachelors, a masters, and most of
another masters....drafted....and retired. My daddy saved up nothing for
college.
--
A Harry Krause truism:

"It's not a *baby* kicking, beautiful bride, it's just a fetus!"

On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 16:06:27 -0500, Boater
wrote:

Besides, what the hell do you know about scholarship? You weren't smart
enough to get a IIA deferment.

I was, had two academic (Holy Cross/Fordham) and two athletic (Boston
College/Wake Forest) full boat scholarships available to me and I
didn't take them.

Now, make something out of that.

Moron.