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Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Any chance?
It looks like no utility out there can write BSB/KAP files. Many can read. Annoying. I have some wonderful paper marine charts and could make a perfect raster scan (TIFF) out of them. Then would need a calibrating utility (a là OziExplorer) that can output to BSB format, once datum, mag. dev, etc is entered. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Atlas wrote:
Any chance? It looks like no utility out there can write BSB/KAP files. Many can read. Annoying. I have some wonderful paper marine charts and could make a perfect raster scan (TIFF) out of them. Then would need a calibrating utility (a là OziExplorer) that can output to BSB format, once datum, mag. dev, etc is entered. If you are saying you prefer Maptech to Oziexplorer, you must be nuts! Dennis. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Maybe Oziexplorer staff have been on a boat.. Maptech staff don't even
know how to spell baot... Hanz Dennis Pogson wrote: Atlas wrote: Any chance? It looks like no utility out there can write BSB/KAP files. Many can read. Annoying. I have some wonderful paper marine charts and could make a perfect raster scan (TIFF) out of them. Then would need a calibrating utility (a là OziExplorer) that can output to BSB format, once datum, mag. dev, etc is entered. If you are saying you prefer Maptech to Oziexplorer, you must be nuts! Dennis. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
If you are saying you prefer Maptech to Oziexplorer, you must be nuts! Dennis. You didn't answer to my question, but...... yes. I like Maptech Chart Navigator Pro better: - AWESOME, clean, neat and compliant user interface. Ozi's a mess of buttons, ugly, developed with prehistoric devtool.... Delphi? - AWESOME "cruise mode"; it looks like proper on board marine chart plotter - Intuitive. Can't say the same with Ozi. To understand how Ozi works I had to go through the manual. Never done such a thing with Chart Navigator Pro - Use mouse wheel and +/- keys to zoom. Ozi uses page/down/up...... CRAP! - Automatically change maps at smaller/larger scales. Don't know if Ozi can do that..... - Perfectly usable routes/waypoints data/lists For me that's fair enough, that's what I need from a marine navigation software...... The only BIG regret about Maptech, is it's inability to import raster maps and calibrate. Ozi does. But can't save in BSB format. Now you go explaining why you prefer Ozi |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Atlas wrote:
If you are saying you prefer Maptech to Oziexplorer, you must be nuts! Dennis. You didn't answer to my question, but...... yes. I like Maptech Chart Navigator Pro better: - AWESOME, clean, neat and compliant user interface. Ozi's a mess of buttons, ugly, developed with prehistoric devtool.... Delphi? - AWESOME "cruise mode"; it looks like proper on board marine chart plotter - Intuitive. Can't say the same with Ozi. To understand how Ozi works I had to go through the manual. Never done such a thing with Chart Navigator Pro - Use mouse wheel and +/- keys to zoom. Ozi uses page/down/up...... CRAP! - Automatically change maps at smaller/larger scales. Don't know if Ozi can do that..... - Perfectly usable routes/waypoints data/lists For me that's fair enough, that's what I need from a marine navigation software...... The only BIG regret about Maptech, is it's inability to import raster maps and calibrate. Ozi does. But can't save in BSB format. Now you go explaining why you prefer Ozi As with all software, one tends to stick to the allpication one knows best. I use Ozi partly because I don't want to be dependant on the supplier of the software for issuing expensive amendments, charging for upgrades etc., etc. Chart Navigator Pro may well be far better than the basic Maptech Navigator I am familiar with, but if you have to rely on the application to load only one type of map/chart, I would find this unduly restrictive. Granted, it takes a few years' use to get familiar with all the functions in Ozi, and this does put people off. I've been using it for around 8 years now, and I still don't know all it is capable of! Since I have many different charts in several different file formats, this alone makes Ozi the king for me, but others may disagree. Also worth a lot is the ability to edit my charts without having to rely on a third party, create my own symbols, any size, any colour, work with routes, waypoints, tracks etc., etc. Dennis. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Atlas wrote:
Any chance? It looks like no utility out there can write BSB/KAP files. Many can read. Annoying. I have some wonderful paper marine charts and could make a perfect raster scan (TIFF) out of them. Then would need a calibrating utility (a là OziExplorer) that can output to BSB format, once datum, mag. dev, etc is entered. Are you talking about charts for U.S. waters? Those are all already available as free downloads. As are the S-57 Vector charts. Download and install the trial version of Rosepoint Software's Coastal Explorer and it will go on line and download all those chart for you: http://rosepointnav.com/CoastalExplorer/default.htm Coastal Explorer is packaged with some additional bells and whistles and sold as Maptech's Chart navigator Pro: http://www.maptech.com/water/chartNa...rPro/index.cfm Jack -- Jack Erbes in Ellsworth, Maine, USA - jackerbes at adelphia dot net (also receiving email at jacker at midmaine.com) |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Atlas" wrote in
: Any chance? It looks like no utility out there can write BSB/KAP files. Many can read. Annoying. I have some wonderful paper marine charts and could make a perfect raster scan (TIFF) out of them. Then would need a calibrating utility (a là OziExplorer) that can output to BSB format, once datum, mag. dev, etc is entered. I searched for this a few years ago and didn't find anything public domain. I agree that it's sad, but not muc demand for it. The only reason that I wanted it was that my NorthStar 961 only read BSB charts and I wanted to encode some charts and include them on the 961. -- Geoff |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
I have some wonderful paper marine charts and could make a perfect
raster scan (TIFF) out of them. Then would need a calibrating utility (a là OziExplorer) that can output to BSB format, once datum, mag. dev, etc is entered. Once you have solved the BSB calibration problem, how are you intending to solve the many problems of scanning to a usable file type which does not resemble a pig's ear? Of all the many hundreds of electronic charts I possess, only about two are scanned from paper charts, partly because I found that buying a scanner large enough to scan a complete chart at one pass would cost me about the same as a new Ferrari! Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. The BSB electronic charts thus obtained are every bit as good as the paper originals, and can be used in Ozi or Maptech without extra calibration. DP |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
As with all software, one tends to stick to the allpication one knows
best. I use Ozi partly because I don't want to be dependant on the supplier of the software for issuing expensive amendments, charging for upgrades etc., etc. Partially true, Ozi "full" needs money....... Chart Navigator Pro may well be far better than the basic Maptech Navigator Absolutelly. I remember about an old Offshore navigator version 5.something that I didn't like much.... Chart Navigator Pro is redesigned from scratch, and looks super to me, but it's my opinion... You can test it freely....... Since I have many different charts in several different file formats, this alone makes Ozi the king for me, but others may disagree. What formats are you using? Basically I've noticed that BSB/S57 are most common and maptech supports them both..... yes with Ozi you can go through the raster/calibration method. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Jack Erbes" wrote in message ... Atlas wrote: Any chance? It looks like no utility out there can write BSB/KAP files. Many can read. Annoying. I have some wonderful paper marine charts and could make a perfect raster scan (TIFF) out of them. Then would need a calibrating utility (a là OziExplorer) that can output to BSB format, once datum, mag. dev, etc is entered. Are you talking about charts for U.S. waters? Those are all already available as free downloads. As are the S-57 Vector charts. No, I'm interested in the mediterranean area..... |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Dennis Pogson" wrote in message ... I have some wonderful paper marine charts and could make a perfect raster scan (TIFF) out of them. Then would need a calibrating utility (a là OziExplorer) that can output to BSB format, once datum, mag. dev, etc is entered. Once you have solved the BSB calibration problem, how are you intending to solve the many problems of scanning to a usable file type which does not resemble a pig's ear? Of all the many hundreds of electronic charts I possess, only about two are scanned from paper charts, partly because I found that buying a scanner large enough to scan a complete chart at one pass would cost me about the same as a new Ferrari! Hehehe.. partially true he you can obtain rasters from scanning centers for a few bucks without buying the machine.... Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. Yeah, but most of them are old! |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Download and install the trial version of Rosepoint Software's Coastal
Explorer and it will go on line and download all those chart for you: http://rosepointnav.com/CoastalExplorer/default.htm Coastal Explorer is packaged with some additional bells and whistles and sold as Maptech's Chart navigator Pro: Wow........ I had a look at the user interface and...... yes! It is the same product!!! Betwwen the two, what is the most complete product?? |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Download and install the trial version of Rosepoint Software's Coastal
Explorer and it will go on line and download all those chart for you: http://rosepointnav.com/CoastalExplorer/default.htm Coastal Explorer is packaged with some additional bells and whistles and sold as Maptech's Chart navigator Pro: Yes Jack you're right, RosePoint did the dirty work and Maptech licenses the product. At this point, all my respect and Kudos go to to Rose Point!!! Absolutelly! And I've digged around and read about enthusiastic reviews of Coastal Explorer.... FANTASTIC!!!! I'm thinking if Coastal Explorer has more map flavour options.... it could be just beacuse they aren't......... Maptech!!! |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Atlas wrote:
snip Wow........ I had a look at the user interface and...... yes! It is the same product!!! Betwwen the two, what is the most complete product?? I've not seen the MapTech version so I can't really compare them. Reading about it, I noticed that CNP comes with the satellite imagery and some other things that are not in the CE package. I loaded CE trial just out of curiosity, I've not purchased it or navigated with it. The GPS input times out after 15 minutes but otherwise it can be used indefinitely for route planning and route and waypoint reviews. I use it to work on the routes I keep on my Garmin 76Cx handheld. It is much more pleasant to use than is the Garmin MapSource program. Coastal Explorer is not perfect, in using it I found some minor annoyances and some features that were maybe not fully developed yet. But it does have a wonderful user's interface and is quite easy to use. Too bad about your being in the Med, if you move to America you can get free charting. :) Jack -- Jack Erbes in Ellsworth, Maine, USA - jackerbes at adelphia dot net (also receiving email at jacker at midmaine.com) |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by
resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. Right, so you're saying just steal them instead of paying. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Atlas wrote:
snip Yes Jack you're right, RosePoint did the dirty work and Maptech licenses the product. At this point, all my respect and Kudos go to to Rose Point!!! Absolutelly! And I've digged around and read about enthusiastic reviews of Coastal Explorer.... FANTASTIC!!!! I'm thinking if Coastal Explorer has more map flavour options.... it could be just beacuse they aren't......... Maptech!!! Maptech has some sort of business relationship with the U.S. national hydrographic agency, NOAA I think. For years, Maptech was about the only source for electronic charting data that was based on images of the NOAA paper charts. And the format on those was primarily the BSB that Maptech developed. And they sold the charts too of course. A few years ago, the NOAA made the electronic charts available to the public as free downloads. The downloaded charts are exactly the same Maptech's, I think Maptech has continued to do the electronic chart making work for NOAA. The S-57 charts have come a long ways in recent years and will eventually replace the raster charts I think. The U.S. government policy on the free maps and charting (both marine and topo) is that doing that is in the best interests of the health and welfare of the general public. And also, the information is developed with our tax Dollars so it just does not seem right to make us pay for it again. But many other national agencies charge for the charting and in some cases the prices are quite high. If you study the help files for Ozi Explorer I think you can find a path that will let you scan and calibrate paper charts or imported images that are not already calibrated. I used the Ozi Explorer trial version to prepare maps for use with Ozi Explorer-CE (which I purchased). I was using Ozi-CE on a PDA with marine and topo maps. Again, I had the luxury of starting with the good (and free) NOAA and USGS downloaded maps. Jack -- Jack Erbes in Ellsworth, Maine, USA - jackerbes at adelphia dot net (also receiving email at jacker at midmaine.com) |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Bill Kearney wrote:
Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. Right, so you're saying just steal them instead of paying. I don't use BSB charts, but they are there if anyone wants them. Also, if my neighbour offers me a copy of some well-known software, and I offer him a copy of another application in return for his generosity, I don't regard myself as having "stolen" anything. Perhaps if you spent some time studying the P&L accounts of the leading software companies, you would see what I mean. BTW I don't use E-Mule, but millions do. DP |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Dennis Pogson" wrote in
: Bill Kearney wrote: Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. Right, so you're saying just steal them instead of paying. I don't use BSB charts, but they are there if anyone wants them. Also, if my neighbour offers me a copy of some well-known software, and I offer him a copy of another application in return for his generosity, I don't regard myself as having "stolen" anything. Perhaps if you spent some time studying the P&L accounts of the leading software companies, you would see what I mean. So just what do the P&L statements of the leading SW companies show? And what if these aren't from the *leading* software companies? Does that still count? If you traded your software to another person, and both of you destroyed copies of said software on your respective machines, I would agree with you. Otherwise you've profited by maintaining both copies. Simply because people walk into stores and steal things, doesn't make it right. The stores mark everything up to cover the shrinkage. All of us who don't steal the products end up paying for it. There's no difference other than the one is a store has a physical essence and the other is just bits streaming over the Internet or on a disk. -- Geoff (ex-software developer) |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Dennis Pogson" wrote in
: Bill Kearney wrote: Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. Right, so you're saying just steal them instead of paying. I don't use BSB charts, but they are there if anyone wants them. Also, if my neighbour offers me a copy of some well-known software, and I offer him a copy of another application in return for his generosity, I don't regard myself as having "stolen" anything. Perhaps if you spent some time studying the P&L accounts of the leading software companies, you would see what I mean. BTW I don't use E-Mule, but millions do. DP So just what do the P&L statements of the leading SW companies show? And what if these aren't from the *leading* software companies? Does that still count? If you traded your software to another person, and both of you destroyed copies of said software on your respective machines, I would agree with you. Otherwise you've profited by maintaining both copies. Simply because people walk into stores and steal things, doesn't make it right. The stores mark everything up to cover the shrinkage. All of us who don't steal the products end up paying for it. There's no difference other than the one in a store has a physical essence and the other is just bits streaming over the Internet or on a disk. -- Geoff (ex-software developer) |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Geoff,
Thank you. I guess some people don't think stealing is a problem unless something is stolen from them. (another software developer that went broke by making a good product) Reed Geoff Schultz wrote: "Dennis Pogson" wrote in : Bill Kearney wrote: Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. Right, so you're saying just steal them instead of paying. I don't use BSB charts, but they are there if anyone wants them. Also, if my neighbour offers me a copy of some well-known software, and I offer him a copy of another application in return for his generosity, I don't regard myself as having "stolen" anything. Perhaps if you spent some time studying the P&L accounts of the leading software companies, you would see what I mean. So just what do the P&L statements of the leading SW companies show? And what if these aren't from the *leading* software companies? Does that still count? If you traded your software to another person, and both of you destroyed copies of said software on your respective machines, I would agree with you. Otherwise you've profited by maintaining both copies. Simply because people walk into stores and steal things, doesn't make it right. The stores mark everything up to cover the shrinkage. All of us who don't steal the products end up paying for it. There's no difference other than the one is a store has a physical essence and the other is just bits streaming over the Internet or on a disk. -- Geoff (ex-software developer) |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
With GPS fresh in mind, I am in the market for a new GPS that will
best fit my desire to obtain accurate readings, be user friendly, and have a relatively long battery life. My main objective for a new device is to be able to take my readings while out and then post them to online maps to be able to share my trips with friends. If anyone is in a giving advice mood I would like to know some of your opinions and suggestions on GPS and compatible software that would make this possible without a big headache. Also, where could I post my maps online once I get up and running? I guess that would be a factor in which device and software to use. Thanks! |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Geoff Schultz" geoff"at wrote:
"Dennis Pogson" wrote in : Bill Kearney wrote: Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. Right, so you're saying just steal them instead of paying. I don't use BSB charts, but they are there if anyone wants them. Also, if my neighbour offers me a copy of some well-known software, and I offer him a copy of another application in return for his generosity, I don't regard myself as having "stolen" anything. Perhaps if you spent some time studying the P&L accounts of the leading software companies, you would see what I mean. BTW I don't use E-Mule, but millions do. DP So just what do the P&L statements of the leading SW companies show? And what if these aren't from the *leading* software companies? Does that still count? If you traded your software to another person, and both of you destroyed copies of said software on your respective machines, I would agree with you. Otherwise you've profited by maintaining both copies. Simply because people walk into stores and steal things, doesn't make it right. The stores mark everything up to cover the shrinkage. All of us who don't steal the products end up paying for it. There's no difference other than the one in a store has a physical essence and the other is just bits streaming over the Internet or on a disk. -- Geoff (ex-software developer) Just in case you missed the original post, scanning copyright media is also stealing, as is hitting the Prt Scr key on your keypad in certain circumstances. Perhaps we should all sue the hardware manufacturers who invented and marketed the CD/DVD-copying devices to the consumer public? How about suing NOAA for releasing all these vector and raster charts of the US coastline worldwide, surely they must be somebody's intellectual property? Why should a BSB chart of the Eastern Med be so different? Don't we all pay taxes? DP |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Hello,
It looks like no utility out there can write BSB/KAP files. Many can read. You can use RasterChart2BSB utility : http://www.justmagic.com/RasterChart2BSB.html This webpage is in French but the software is quite simple to understand (see the video). By the way, use the MacOSX version. The Win and Linux versions are adaptations created by a student and are a little buggy. But open source code is available for programmers for these environments... Best regards. -- Peio Elissalde Magic Instinct Software |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Dennis Pogson" wrote in
: Geoff Schultz" geoff"at wrote: "Dennis Pogson" wrote in : Bill Kearney wrote: Most of these BSB charts can be obtained in digital form anyway, by resorting to a file-sharing program such as Emule, therefore saving the time and cost of scanning. Right, so you're saying just steal them instead of paying. I don't use BSB charts, but they are there if anyone wants them. Also, if my neighbour offers me a copy of some well-known software, and I offer him a copy of another application in return for his generosity, I don't regard myself as having "stolen" anything. Perhaps if you spent some time studying the P&L accounts of the leading software companies, you would see what I mean. BTW I don't use E-Mule, but millions do. DP So just what do the P&L statements of the leading SW companies show? And what if these aren't from the *leading* software companies? Does that still count? If you traded your software to another person, and both of you destroyed copies of said software on your respective machines, I would agree with you. Otherwise you've profited by maintaining both copies. Simply because people walk into stores and steal things, doesn't make it right. The stores mark everything up to cover the shrinkage. All of us who don't steal the products end up paying for it. There's no difference other than the one in a store has a physical essence and the other is just bits streaming over the Internet or on a disk. -- Geoff (ex-software developer) Just in case you missed the original post, scanning copyright media is also stealing, as is hitting the Prt Scr key on your keypad in certain circumstances. Perhaps we should all sue the hardware manufacturers who invented and marketed the CD/DVD-copying devices to the consumer public? How about suing NOAA for releasing all these vector and raster charts of the US coastline worldwide, surely they must be somebody's intellectual property? Why should a BSB chart of the Eastern Med be so different? Don't we all pay taxes? DP I think that you're trying to redirect what caused my initial comments: Also, if my neighbour offers me a copy of some well-known software, and I offer him a copy of another application in return for his generosity, I don't regard myself as having "stolen" anything. I, and many other people who make/made a living from writing software, would disagree with you. I understand that coping material can be illegal depending upon what you do with it. I use a simple method to determine if I am steeling by copying something. (1) If I own something, I feel that I should be able to make a copy for myself. I don't "share" these copies with anyone else. (2) If I copy something that someone else owns, to avoid paying for it, then I am steeling it. I'm depriving the author of the money that they should have received from it. The NOAA charts are public domain, so there's no copyright associated with them. Copy them and do what you want with them to your hearts content. However, if a chart isn't public domain, then no, it isn't OK. You need to make the decision on a chart by chart basis, but from what I've read from your previous posts in this thread, you clearly don't care. -- Geoff www.GeoffSchultz.org |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Peio" wrote in message ups.com... Hello, It looks like no utility out there can write BSB/KAP files. Many can read. You can use RasterChart2BSB utility : http://www.justmagic.com/RasterChart2BSB.html This webpage is in French but the software is quite simple to understand (see the video). (CUT) Great Peio!! I had a go with the utility but the "Geodetic Datum" list is missing my current chart set "Rome 1940"..... what can I do? Also I don't know what to set in the "Sounding Datum" Best regards |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Geoff Schultz" schreef in bericht .. . I understand that coping material can be illegal depending upon what you do with it. I use a simple method to determine if I am steeling by copying something. (1) If I own something, I feel that I should be able to make a copy for myself. I don't "share" these copies with anyone else. (2) If I copy something that someone else owns, to avoid paying for it, then I am steeling it. I'm depriving the author of the money that they should have received from it. Ever tried to make a personal copy of the Navionics Gold charts? I did, to find that the Navionics software had destroyed the original chart automatically and without warning. Although there is a warning on the package saying that copying is not allowed, I did not expect it to mean that it is was also if you make a copy for your self as a back-up. After all, these charts cost a fortune ($300) and it seems prudent to make a copy in case you loose the original. So this is my warning to you: never try to make a copy of a Navionics chart. I do not understand this policy of Navionics, after all I own the chart by having payed for it, and I do not understand that they have the right of destroying a thing that you own. I do not know if they have a legal right to do this, but to me it feels like a criminal act. Cole. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Jack Erbes" schreef in bericht ... Cole Maze wrote: snip Ever tried to make a personal copy of the Navionics Gold charts? I did, to find that the Navionics software had destroyed the original chart automatically and without warning. Although there is a warning on the package saying that copying is not allowed, I did not expect it to mean that it is was also if you make a copy for your self as a back-up. After all, these charts cost a fortune ($300) and it seems prudent to make a copy in case you loose the original. What kind of media was that on? And what hardware were you using to try to copy them? Those are available on SD, MMC, NavChart, or Compact Flash. The NavChart is the Navionics proprietary memory cartridge. Media SD or MMC, one of those, don't remember, it's on the boat right now. I was copying it on my Lowrance 7500C plotter that has 2 slots for SD/MMC cards. If there was write protect tab on the memory card, I'd think that may have prevented that from happening. Probably, but I did not check. Stupid, I know, but I did not expect it to be destroyed. Can you normally write anything to the card that was erased? Like waypoints and routes? Have not tried that because I still have hope to recover the chart, some way or the other... Did you ask Navionics if that was a normal behavior? Yes I did ask the Navionics dealer where I bought it and he tells me that there are clear instructions on the cartridge the card comes in. I checked that and indeed it says: 'Do not insert this card in a PC for copying or it may get damaged' or similar words. I remember it explicitely said 'PC' but it did not help in the discussion with the dealer. He insisted it was my own fault and I should know that it is illegal to copy the content of the card. Of course I disagreed but that did not help.I got a discount ($100) however when I bought the same chart to replace the damaged one. I accepted this because I was in a hurry to get the tide and I did not want to sail to France without a chart. Jack |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Cole Maze wrote:
snip Ever tried to make a personal copy of the Navionics Gold charts? I did, to find that the Navionics software had destroyed the original chart automatically and without warning. Although there is a warning on the package saying that copying is not allowed, I did not expect it to mean that it is was also if you make a copy for your self as a back-up. After all, these charts cost a fortune ($300) and it seems prudent to make a copy in case you loose the original. What kind of media was that on? And what hardware were you using to try to copy them? Those are available on SD, MMC, NavChart, or Compact Flash. The NavChart is the Navionics proprietary memory cartridge. If there was write protect tab on the memory card, I'd think that may have prevented that from happening. Can you normally write anything to the card that was erased? Like waypoints and routes? Did you ask Navionics if that was a normal behavior? Jack |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Jack Erbes wrote in
: Cole Maze wrote: snip Ever tried to make a personal copy of the Navionics Gold charts? I did, to find that the Navionics software had destroyed the original chart automatically and without warning. Although there is a warning on the package saying that copying is not allowed, I did not expect it to mean that it is was also if you make a copy for your self as a back-up. After all, these charts cost a fortune ($300) and it seems prudent to make a copy in case you loose the original. What kind of media was that on? And what hardware were you using to try to copy them? Those are available on SD, MMC, NavChart, or Compact Flash. The NavChart is the Navionics proprietary memory cartridge. If there was write protect tab on the memory card, I'd think that may have prevented that from happening. Can you normally write anything to the card that was erased? Like waypoints and routes? Did you ask Navionics if that was a normal behavior? Jack I unfortunately made the mistake of placing a Navionics CF chart into my laptop when I was having problems with my chartplotter. The chartplotter wasn't able to see the chip and I wanted to know if the chip was bad. The problem ended up being with the chart plotter and the chip was OK. Unfortunately that rendered the chip unusable and it now sits on my desk at home instead of being on the boat where it belongs. It cost me $200 to replace it. The CF chips aren't anything special. They're SanDisk 64 MB chips that have a special format applied to them that copy programs can't duplicate. I tried to figure out how to duplicate my chips but was unable to figure out how to do it (and I spent a lot of time trying.) I have dual chartplotters on board for backup, both which use Navionics chips, and I want to have a backup of the charts too. What appears to happen is that when you insert the chip into your computer, it gets "mounted" and that writes a file header. This indicates to the software in the chart plotter that the chip has been loaded into a PC and this disables the use of the chip. Navionics sells a USB device which allows you to utilize the chips on a PC. From what I can tell, this device simply write locks the chip. You can do the exact same thing by write locking the device via software. I have a program that I run on my laptop that write locks the device and I can use the chips without any problems. I fail to understand why Navionics implemented this behavior. I personally feel that they should be forced to abandon this practice. Implementing an anti-copy system is fine, but disabling chips due to someone simply putting them into a PC is just wrong. -- Geoff www.GeoffSchultz.org |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
In article ,
"Cole Maze" wrote: I do not understand this policy of Navionics, after all I own the chart by having payed for it, and I do not understand that they have the right of destroying a thing that you own. I do not know if they have a legal right to do this, but to me it feels like a criminal act. Best you go back and READ the User License that came with your Navionics Software.... You did NOT buy the Charts, or the Software to use them. What you bought is a "License" to use them, and Navionics plainly states that they still OWN all the Rights, but License you as a User to USE their Software, as per the User License. Your Violation of the User License. may constitute a Civil Action that Navionics could bring against you, if they so choose. It is all there in the Fine Print, that you obviously never READ....... |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"You" schreef in bericht ... In article , "Cole Maze" wrote: I do not understand this policy of Navionics, after all I own the chart by having payed for it, and I do not understand that they have the right of destroying a thing that you own. I do not know if they have a legal right to do this, but to me it feels like a criminal act. Best you go back and READ the User License that came with your Navionics Software.... You did NOT buy the Charts, or the Software to use them. What you bought is a "License" to use them, and Navionics plainly states that they still OWN all the Rights, but License you as a User to USE their Software, as per the User License. Your Violation of the User License. may constitute a Civil Action that Navionics could bring against you, if they so choose. It is all there in the Fine Print, that you obviously never READ....... Sure, you have a point here. I indeed never read the fine print. I just bought a chip with a chart on it for $300, expecting to be able to use it on board, like I use to do with paper charts. If Navionics not sold me the _chart_ but just the license to use it, I still believe they have no legal right to destroy it thereby making it impossible to use the license granted. Anyway, I admit, it was stupid to not read the license terms before using it, but then I doubt if there are many people who extensively read the license terms of any software before using it. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
"Geoff Schultz" schreef in bericht .. . Jack Erbes wrote in : Cole Maze wrote: snip Ever tried to make a personal copy of the Navionics Gold charts? I did, to find that the Navionics software had destroyed the original chart automatically and without warning. Although there is a warning on the package saying that copying is not allowed, I did not expect it to mean that it is was also if you make a copy for your self as a back-up. After all, these charts cost a fortune ($300) and it seems prudent to make a copy in case you loose the original. What kind of media was that on? And what hardware were you using to try to copy them? Those are available on SD, MMC, NavChart, or Compact Flash. The NavChart is the Navionics proprietary memory cartridge. If there was write protect tab on the memory card, I'd think that may have prevented that from happening. Can you normally write anything to the card that was erased? Like waypoints and routes? Did you ask Navionics if that was a normal behavior? Jack I unfortunately made the mistake of placing a Navionics CF chart into my laptop when I was having problems with my chartplotter. The chartplotter wasn't able to see the chip and I wanted to know if the chip was bad. The problem ended up being with the chart plotter and the chip was OK. Unfortunately that rendered the chip unusable and it now sits on my desk at home instead of being on the boat where it belongs. It cost me $200 to replace it. The CF chips aren't anything special. They're SanDisk 64 MB chips that have a special format applied to them that copy programs can't duplicate. I tried to figure out how to duplicate my chips but was unable to figure out how to do it (and I spent a lot of time trying.) I have dual chartplotters on board for backup, both which use Navionics chips, and I want to have a backup of the charts too. What appears to happen is that when you insert the chip into your computer, it gets "mounted" and that writes a file header. This indicates to the software in the chart plotter that the chip has been loaded into a PC and this disables the use of the chip. I did never insert the chip in a PC. I just left it in the primary slot of my chart plotter. I inserted a blank SD card in the second slot of the plotter and used the backup function of the plotter to backup the files. After that the original charts turned out to be destroyed. I fail to understand why Navionics implemented this behavior. I personally feel that they should be forced to abandon this practice. Implementing an anti-copy system is fine, but disabling chips due to someone simply putting them into a PC is just wrong. Cannot agree more. Either it should be allowed to make at least one copy or they should develop some kind of policy to replace lost or damaged chips for free or to minimal cost. Cole. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Thank you all for this discussion. It has just caused me to cross
Navionics off my list of potential suppliers. With the event descriptions as discussed, any of with could happen in the course of trying to deal with other issues, can destroy the information that is not acceptable to me and I will let others know also. Matt Colie Yachtsman's Technical Support Cole Maze wrote: "You" schreef in bericht ... In article , "Cole Maze" wrote: I do not understand this policy of Navionics, after all I own the chart by having payed for it, and I do not understand that they have the right of destroying a thing that you own. I do not know if they have a legal right to do this, but to me it feels like a criminal act. Best you go back and READ the User License that came with your Navionics Software.... You did NOT buy the Charts, or the Software to use them. What you bought is a "License" to use them, and Navionics plainly states that they still OWN all the Rights, but License you as a User to USE their Software, as per the User License. Your Violation of the User License. may constitute a Civil Action that Navionics could bring against you, if they so choose. It is all there in the Fine Print, that you obviously never READ....... Sure, you have a point here. I indeed never read the fine print. I just bought a chip with a chart on it for $300, expecting to be able to use it on board, like I use to do with paper charts. If Navionics not sold me the _chart_ but just the license to use it, I still believe they have no legal right to destroy it thereby making it impossible to use the license granted. Anyway, I admit, it was stupid to not read the license terms before using it, but then I doubt if there are many people who extensively read the license terms of any software before using it. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
You wrote in
: In article , "Cole Maze" wrote: I do not understand this policy of Navionics, after all I own the chart by having payed for it, and I do not understand that they have the right of destroying a thing that you own. I do not know if they have a legal right to do this, but to me it feels like a criminal act. Best you go back and READ the User License that came with your Navionics Software.... You did NOT buy the Charts, or the Software to use them. What you bought is a "License" to use them, and Navionics plainly states that they still OWN all the Rights, but License you as a User to USE their Software, as per the User License. Your Violation of the User License. may constitute a Civil Action that Navionics could bring against you, if they so choose. It is all there in the Fine Print, that you obviously never READ....... I have the case that came with the chart chip and it says nothing of the sort. It does have a warning that placing it in a PC will "damage the chart data and render the card useless." That's great, but I didn't have the case on the boat and there's nothing on the chip to warn me about this. I had purchased the chip about 2 years prior and had forgotten about the warning. I was at sea on a 3 day passage when the chart plotter failed and I was attempting to determine where the failure was. I didn't expect that simply placing the chip into the PC would cause it to be rendered useless. No chart data gets destroyed. All that changes is a "last accessed" date in a directory and that changes a checksum. Navionics supplies the software to access their charts to the vendors who utilize their chips. This software see the"bad" checksum and renders the chip unusable. As I've said, by software write-locking the chip reader, I can use this chip in any PC. There's no license that states that I don't own the charts that I purchased on the chip. They sell a reader that allows you to utilize their chips on a PC. The fact that they disable the chip unless you use their device feels very wrong to me. And ", tell me that you read the chart licensing agreements when you were picking a chartplotter. Yeah, sure...And why are hiding who you are? -- Geoff www.GeoffSchultz.org |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Geoff Schultz wrote:
snip I fail to understand why Navionics implemented this behavior. I personally feel that they should be forced to abandon this practice. Implementing an anti-copy system is fine, but disabling chips due to someone simply putting them into a PC is just wrong. I agree with both of you guys, this is a stupid thing for them to do. The Magellan and Garmin marine charting that comes on SD or microSD cards is locked to the serial number of the memory card. And that is Navionics data by the way. Every memory card has an embedded serial number and that number cannot be changed. So if you buy a card with the mapping preloaded there is something in the mapping file(s?) that will let a GPS receiver determine if it is on the right card. I'm using the Garmin BlueChart on a handheld. Navionics has great charting, arguably the best, but what a strange company. They are hard to communicate with and talking to them it sounds like some kind of fly by night operation being run out a garage somewhere. They are rude to talk to and the first answer to any question is to talk to the dealer you bought it from. The Navionics web site has been down or partially down for the last few days or week or so. I've been trying to look at something there and get the home page occasionally but get page not found errors for anything beyond that. Maybe they turn it off on weekends? Jack |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Hello Atlas,
Great Peio!! I had a go with the utility but the "Geodetic Datum" list is missing my current chart set "Rome 1940"..... what can I do? Don't you have any shift indication on your paper map : I mean some offset in minutes between Rome 1940 datum and WGS84. Remember : the map also needs to be in Mercator projection. Maybe a version 2 of RasterChart2BSB in the future with possibilities of converting both original projection and datum in Mercator/WGS84... Also I don't know what to set in the "Sounding Datum" The tidal datum to which soundings and drying heights on a chart are referred. Often shortened to "chart datum" when it is clear that reference is not being made to a horizontal datum. Chart sounding datums are also used as reference for heights (lighthouses, mountains, bridges). To sum up, just an indication set in the header of your .kap file. Best regards. -- Peio Elissalde Magic Instinct Software |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
I don't use BSB charts, but they are there if anyone wants them. Also, if
my neighbour offers me a copy of some well-known software, and I offer him a copy of another application in return for his generosity, I don't regard myself as having "stolen" anything. No, that's the both of you commiting theft. Two wrongs don't make a right. Perhaps if you spent some time studying the P&L accounts of the leading software companies, you would see what I mean. I'm well aquainted with accounting, and copyright law. Apparently you're not. BTW I don't use E-Mule, but millions do. Sure you don't... |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Just in case you missed the original post, scanning copyright media is
also stealing, as is hitting the Prt Scr key on your keypad in certain circumstances. Perhaps we should all sue the hardware manufacturers who invented and marketed the CD/DVD-copying devices to the consumer public? Trying to deflect the argument doesn't justify your position. It's wrong to steal software, no matter how you try to justify it. How about suing NOAA for releasing all these vector and raster charts of the US coastline worldwide, surely they must be somebody's intellectual property? Why should a BSB chart of the Eastern Med be so different? Don't we all pay taxes? Ah, here you reveal your ignorance of geo-data. In the US we're fortunate to have very accessible and largely 'free' geo-data like maps. In other countries that's not the case. They're often still charged QUITE a lot of money for even the most basic of geo-data. Still, even that doesn't justify stealing someone's digital format of them. That's the arrangement the "owners" of that data have made, but that's a matter for the citizens of those countries to rectify. The Europeans seem quite backward in getting a grip on this. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
So this is my warning to you: never try to make a copy of a Navionics
chart. I do not understand this policy of Navionics, after all I own the chart by having payed for it, and I do not understand that they have the right of destroying a thing that you own. I do not know if they have a legal right to do this, but to me it feels like a criminal act. You don't "own" anything. What you bought was a license to use the data on that card. It's a subtle but important difference. As to Navionics policies, I agree they're really idiots. |
Importing raster maps into Maptech....
Bill Kearney wrote:
So this is my warning to you: never try to make a copy of a Navionics chart. I do not understand this policy of Navionics, after all I own the chart by having payed for it, and I do not understand that they have the right of destroying a thing that you own. I do not know if they have a legal right to do this, but to me it feels like a criminal act. You don't "own" anything. What you bought was a license to use the data on that card. It's a subtle but important difference. As to Navionics policies, I agree they're really idiots. Navionics and Garmin Bluecharts are one and the same. The way in which the two market and protect their virtually identical data (charts) is where the difference lies. This leaves one wondering as to exactly where these excellent marine charts originated. Indeed is any graphics software original these days, or are we the victims of one giant marketing scam, with little, if any, original work being produced? If I have a medical condition, I can download countless thousands of articles from the Web which will explain it's causes and effects, and perhaps suggest a cure. All free, gratis, and for nothing. But if I seek to use that same facility to download a marine chart, there are few sites which can oblige. Indeed the NOAA site is the only one I can bring to mind, and it's charts are restricted to the US coastline, (for the moment!). Whether in the interests of safety at sea, or simply the "right-to-know" syndrome. NOAA are doing the US mariner, amateur or professional, a great favour. Digital charts are a by-product of the marine digital hardware industry, no doubt a very lucrative by-product, judging by the extreme lengths the various companies go to to protect their software from copying, etc. It seems to me that Microsoft are constantly being accused of protectionism, but other giant corporations are allowed to get away scot-free. Maybe size really matters these days. Without GPS, electronic charts would be pretty useless, so do we thank the US Airforce for the present situation? Dennis. |
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