Peter Bennett wrote:

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:42:35 -0500, Jack Erbes
wrote:



For the most part, I would not buy hardware from Garmin because it would
mean I could use only Garmin's mapping/charting packages. Further, any
interoperability (automobile, marine, topo, etc.) would be limited to
what they wanted to market or allow and require additional purchases of
more Garmin mapping packages.


Almost all Garmin GPS receivers, like most other makes, will output
NMEA-0183 format data, which can be read by virtually all mapping
programs.

Garmin recievers only use the Garmin protocol for uploading and
downloading waypoints and routes, and for uploading Garmin's
proprietary maps or charts. Many non-Garmin programs can use the
Garmin protocol for waypoint and route transfers.

In my general inexperience with things Garmin, I may have some mistaken
impressions about the effect of the Garmin protocol. I thought data in
the Garmin proprietary format would not be read or used by an
application not specifically written to use it. In other words, if an
application was looking for NMEA data strings, it would not read any of
the Garmin proprietary data strings would it?

And I'm not trying to argue the point, I'm trying to learn more. Just
in case I have not already established my level of expertise here, I'll
say know that I know about enough to be dangerous. :)

Jack

--
Jack Erbes in Ellsworth, Maine, USA - jackerbes at adelphia dot net
(also receiving email at jacker at midmaine.com)

On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:15:12 -0500, Jack Erbes
wrote:

Peter Bennett wrote:

Garmin recievers only use the Garmin protocol for uploading and
downloading waypoints and routes, and for uploading Garmin's
proprietary maps or charts. Many non-Garmin programs can use the
Garmin protocol for waypoint and route transfers.

In my general inexperience with things Garmin, I may have some mistaken
impressions about the effect of the Garmin protocol. I thought data in
the Garmin proprietary format would not be read or used by an
application not specifically written to use it. In other words, if an
application was looking for NMEA data strings, it would not read any of
the Garmin proprietary data strings would it?

That is correct. You have to manually switch the Garmin receiver
between Garmin and

And I'm not trying to argue the point, I'm trying to learn more. Just
in case I have not already established my level of expertise here, I'll
say know that I know about enough to be dangerous. :)

Jack

--
Peter Bennett VE7CEI
email: peterbb4 (at) interchange.ubc.ca
GPS and NMEA info and programs: http://vancouver-webpages.com/peter/index.html
Newsgroup new user info: http://vancouver-webpages.com/nnq

On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:15:12 -0500, Jack Erbes
wrote:

Peter Bennett wrote:
(hit the wrong button on the previous post...)
Garmin recievers only use the Garmin protocol for uploading and
downloading waypoints and routes, and for uploading Garmin's
proprietary maps or charts. Many non-Garmin programs can use the
Garmin protocol for waypoint and route transfers.

In my general inexperience with things Garmin, I may have some mistaken
impressions about the effect of the Garmin protocol. I thought data in
the Garmin proprietary format would not be read or used by an
application not specifically written to use it. In other words, if an
application was looking for NMEA data strings, it would not read any of
the Garmin proprietary data strings would it?

That is correct. You have to manually switch the GPS receiver between
Garmin and NMEA modes. Some programs (like Ozi Explorer) know enough
to switch modes and baud rates (Garmin protocol uses 9600, NMEA uses
4800) when you ask them to transfer waypoints.

One marine charting program is too smart - if you tell it you have a
Garmin receiver, it insists on using Garmin protocol instead of NMEA
to get the real-time navigation data. If you want to feed NMEA data
from the GPS to an autopilot or DSC radio, you have to lie to the
program, telling it you have a Generic NMEA source, so you can leave
the GPS in NMEA mode.

And I'm not trying to argue the point, I'm trying to learn more. Just
in case I have not already established my level of expertise here, I'll
say know that I know about enough to be dangerous. :)

Jack

--
Peter Bennett VE7CEI
email: peterbb4 (at) interchange.ubc.ca
GPS and NMEA info and programs: http://vancouver-webpages.com/peter/index.html
Newsgroup new user info: http://vancouver-webpages.com/nnq

"Jack Erbes" wrote in message
...
In my general inexperience with things Garmin, I may have some mistaken
impressions about the effect of the Garmin protocol. I thought data in
the Garmin proprietary format would not be read or used by an
application not specifically written to use it. In other words, if an
application was looking for NMEA data strings, it would not read any of
the Garmin proprietary data strings would it?

You are mixing up two things here. Firstly, there is the Garmin protocol.
This is a proprietary *protocol* consisting of binary (non human-readable)
data at 9600 baud.

Secondly, there are proprietary *sentences* or data strings, which are human
readable text, at 4800 baud. These sentences are called proprietary because
they are not defined by the NMEA standard. They have the standard NMEA
sentence format, starting with $P to indicate that they are Proprietary and
ending with a Carriage Return/Linefeed combo like any other NMEA sentence,
but the actual contents is entirely up to the manufacturer of the device.

The difference is for instance that proprietary NMEA sentences will be
passed by NMEA equipment like multiplexers and NMEA-linked instruments, but
a proprietary protocol will not.

Meindert

Garmin does not require you to buy any particular software to run it -
it has the capability to output the data in NMEA format - most Nautical
mapping software will be able to use this (well maybe not most but
there are ALOT that can do so)

Chuck,

I use a Garmin GPS with my laptop with Delorme products for highway use and
with the Cap'n Firstmate for nautical use.

I love it.

Ansley Sawyer
SV Pacem

Ansley Sawyer wrote:
Chuck,

I use a Garmin GPS with my laptop with Delorme products for highway use and
with the Cap'n Firstmate for nautical use.

I love it.

Then you must have a Garmin GPS that has an NMEA output. Not every
model of Garmin GPS is able to do that.

Jack

--
Jack Erbes in Ellsworth, Maine, USA - jackerbes at adelphia dot net
(also receiving email at jacker at midmaine.com)

Jack,

You are right. I have set up the Garmin 76 to output NMEA for the Cap'n
Firstmate and the Simrad autopilot.

Ansley Sawyer
SV Pacem

Well, I am no expert, BUT,
NEMA is a protocol for outputting differences between course, turning info,
etc, nothing o do with mapping at all. The Maps actually take a
proportionally lat-lon coordinate, and place this in the place where they
belong on a particular mapping system, BBS, and a bunch of new ones. They
are apples and oranges.

NEMA is just a communication language that identifies certain things such as
errors in course and sends that error out to be plotted in radar, or
autopilot, etc it does not care at all about any maps that were provided to
you for visual ease of use.

Allot of the newer mapping systems are in fact usable among the different
manufacturers, but there are different methods for creating layers which
allow a position to be indicated on a map that translate to a DMS position.

But, maps ARE not all interchangeable, period, I have had 3 GPS receivers
and have had to have 3 different formats of software in order to be able to
properly correlate a position to a map.

You can get a position off of just about any mapping system on a PC, but you
may have to manually upload that info to a GPS.

Now as far as just the GPS receiver attached to a PC, there is probably much
more flexibility as to software compatibility as the PC can handle
translations, but to say all of them are interchangeable is probably a
incorrect and un-safe statement.

Mike
"Gualtier Malde (Chuck)" wrote in message
...
I came across a Garmin 18 WAAS-enhanced GPS for a laptop. That led me to
search for other types and brands, but I didn't get many answers.

These units are sold with road use in mind. What if I wanted to use one
with nautical charts? Does anyone know if the BSB and roadmap formats are
the same?

I'd like to hear from anyone who might be using this equipment.

MikeT wrote:
Well, I am no expert, BUT,
NEMA is a protocol for outputting differences between course, turning
info, etc, nothing o do with mapping at all. The Maps actually take a
proportionally lat-lon coordinate, and place this in the place where
they belong on a particular mapping system, BBS, and a bunch of new
ones. They are apples and oranges.

So these NMEA sentences that I see being downloaded from my Garmin, complete
with lat./long. co-ords, are just a figment of my imagination? My mapping
progarm is pulling them out of thin air?

In reality, your mapping program reads the position co-ords from the GPS and
translates this into a pixel position on the map. The co-relation between
the pixel position and the lat./lon. co-ords is done when you calibrate the
map in that particular program.

NEMA is just a communication language that identifies certain things
such as errors in course and sends that error out to be plotted in
radar, or autopilot, etc it does not care at all about any maps that
were provided to you for visual ease of use.

Allot of the newer mapping systems are in fact usable among the
different manufacturers, but there are different methods for creating
layers which allow a position to be indicated on a map that translate
to a DMS position.

But, maps ARE not all interchangeable, period, I have had 3 GPS
receivers and have had to have 3 different formats of software in
order to be able to properly correlate a position to a map.

You can get a position off of just about any mapping system on a PC,
but you may have to manually upload that info to a GPS.

Now as far as just the GPS receiver attached to a PC, there is
probably much more flexibility as to software compatibility as the PC
can handle translations, but to say all of them are interchangeable
is probably a incorrect and un-safe statement.

Mike
"Gualtier Malde (Chuck)" wrote in message
...
I came across a Garmin 18 WAAS-enhanced GPS for a laptop. That led
me to search for other types and brands, but I didn't get many
answers.

These units are sold with road use in mind. What if I wanted to use
one with nautical charts? Does anyone know if the BSB and roadmap
formats are the same?

I'd like to hear from anyone who might be using this equipment.

--
Satellite photocharts of the UK & Ireland
available, excellent detail and accurate
calibration using Oziexplorer.
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