Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Nov 1, 9:06*pm, Gordon wrote:
However, there's a difference in this election. *The money that Obama is
getting is NOT his own. *It's from contributors. *A lot of contributors.
* He is not using DNC money. *Whereas, McCain is using a lot of money
from the RNC.

Let me be clear: I do not trust either candidate. *

* * Look again! A lot of Baracks money is in the form of prepaid credit
cards which are untraceable! I wonder why.
* Gordon

cause folks like me send them to him. what you cant figure out that
making a donation via check or money order is stupid the cred card is
easy you just put the money on it and send it in then you send the
activation code. also some homeland security ****** cant follow it
home. drives you new age republicans crazy.

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Sun, 2 Nov 2008 02:22:25 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote in alt.atheism:

My claim comes from 25 years of personal experience. I have lived and worked
all over Europe and I am telling you public health IS a failure everywhere.
Your opinion is based on what? Perhaps books, magazines, TV or was it some
idealist talking trash. Please note my previous comment about the American
biased media. You are being sucked in. Come over here and experiece the
failure yourself. Pay the 55% tax, experience the waiting lines or the
denial of treatment or a drug, because it isn't approved. Watch your
neighbor suffer for a year or more because there is no room in your
designated hospital or die because the appropriate treatment is too
expensive for a person of age. Public health is not the solution for
universal health. This lesson has been learned.
Steve

Your claims don't match the docomentation.

"Free Lunch" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 2 Nov 2008 00:59:33 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote in alt.atheism:

June,
I do not dispute your observations, but they are too superficial and
incomplete. First there are no successful government supplied health
systems....anywhere.

You are flat out wrong not only do they work throughout the world but
they even work in the USA. Until the Bush Administration, intent on
proving that government cannot work by destroying the institutions that
did work, gutted the VA and military health systems, they were superior
to most other hospitals in the United States. I have no idea if your
claim came from ignorance or politically motivated dishonesty, though
the rest of your post implies that dishonesty was at work.

...

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On 2008-11-01 19:14:07 -0400, DanielSan said:

Um, what? Would you like a list of legislation authored and passed by Obama?

Oh, I would like to see a list of *any* authored by him.

For good or ill, there is the quite prominent McCain-Feingold act.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

Jere Lull wrote:
On 2008-11-01 19:14:07 -0400, DanielSan said:

Um, what? Would you like a list of legislation authored and passed by
Obama?

Oh, I would like to see a list of *any* authored by him.

Okay, there's an EASY way for you to find out. It's actually VERY simple.

1. Go to http://thomas.loc.gov
2. Choose "Obama, Barack [D-IL]" from the "Select a Senator" dropdown.
3. Click "GO" button.

You're welcome.


--
************************************************** ****
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*----------------------------------------------------*
* It has been said that Jesus died on a Friday and *
* was resurrected on a Sunday. It is not so much *
* that Jesus died for our sins, as he had a very *
* bad weekend for them. *
************************************************** ****

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On 2008-11-01 19:21:31 -0400, Larry said:

clouddreamer wrote in
m:

They're not voting for Obama for any particular reason.

They're voting AGAINST McCain.

I can't buy that because Israel runs the Republican party.

That would be a surprise to my ex-wife and our friends. I doubt any of
them ever voted for a Republican, much less get involved in the party.
They really don't like conservatives, love the liberals.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On 2008-11-02 01:19:22 -0500, DanielSan said:

Jere Lull wrote:
On 2008-11-01 19:14:07 -0400, DanielSan said:

Um, what? Would you like a list of legislation authored and passed by Obama?

Oh, I would like to see a list of *any* authored by him.

Okay, there's an EASY way for you to find out. It's actually VERY simple.

1. Go to http://thomas.loc.gov
2. Choose "Obama, Barack [D-IL]" from the "Select a Senator" dropdown.
3. Click "GO" button.

You're welcome.

Hmmm. Lots of bills to honor people, most of the rest read twice and
referred (buried). Might be a half-dozen of minor substance that didn't
die that natural death (being charitable).

Checking McCain served up fewer, but most were passed, only a couple
were read twice and buried, didn't notice any of the PR "to Honor" or
"x week" fluff ones.

It's a shame the record only goes back a couple of years.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

In article 2008110201201975249-jerelull@maccom, Jere Lull
wrote:

On 2008-11-01 19:21:31 -0400, Larry said:

clouddreamer wrote in
m:

They're not voting for Obama for any particular reason.

They're voting AGAINST McCain.

I can't buy that because Israel runs the Republican party.

That would be a surprise to my ex-wife and our friends. I doubt any of
them ever voted for a Republican, much less get involved in the party.
They really don't like conservatives, love the liberals.

A 2003 overview publisehd by the Jerusalem Center for Public Affairs found
that 23% of American Jews considered themselves conservatives, and 19%
voted for Bush in 2000. When just the Orthodox Jews weere considered the
percentages jumped enormously, 43% leaning toward Bush (the study was a
few months before the 2004 vote). In New York City in 2002/3, 47% of the
city's Jewry said they were considering voting regionally for Republican
candidates and nationally for Bush. In California at the same time, 31%
of Jews supported Schwartzeneger despite that his father was a hardcore
Nazi. Nationally as it turned out Kerry had 76 or 78% of the Jewish vote,
but Bush junior still had 24% support, more than he'd had from Jews when
many couldn't bring themselves to vote for Gore.

Republican voting was at the time of that report regarded as on the
upswing among American Jews. But historically Jews have always swung one
way then another, often supporting Republican candidates. In 1916 45% of
Jews supported Hughes, the losing Republican. In 1920 43% supported the
Republican winner, Harding (38% voted for a Socialist candidate and would
likely otherwise have voted the Democrat). But almost twice as many Jews
voted for the losing Democrat who ran against Calvin Coolidge in 1924, and
almost three times as many voted for the losing Democrat who ran against
Herbert Hoover in 1928. They still hated Hoover in 1932 and went
overwhelmingly for Roosevelt, 82% in 1940, 90% in 1994. Roosevelt was the
one candidate Jews were truly and extremely to cause Jews to favor the
Democratic, and I wish it could be duplicated for Obama but it's not
possible.

Democratic presidential candidates remained the favorites by a big margin
with Jews voting mostly for Democrats Adlai Stevenson, Lyndon Johnson,
Hubert Humphrey, McGovern, and Carter the first time through. But then 39%
voted for Reagan (40% stuck with Carter) so pretty even division.
Regretting that choice on the second run, Jews overwhelming supported
Mondale against Reagan.

Presently the Jewish contingent in Florida overwhelmingly supports McCain
-- perhaps the average age contributes, schfartza is still an easy word
from the mouths of older Jews, which ain't friendly. Outside of Florida,
though, Obama seems to have about 60% of the Jewish vote, McCain 32%, with
25% identifying themselves as conservatives.

Unfortunately supporting McCain makes a lot of sense if the condition of
Israel rates highly in any given family, high enough that they actually
check voting records of senators on issues that effect Israel. Democrats
have a TERRIBLE record in that regard, Republicans have a very good
record. That's something I hate to admit, cuz I think Republicans are for
****, but it's a fact, and McCain has been one of the more vohement of
many vohement Israel supporters among Republicans. By comparison, Obama's
record is too small to figure out what he might do, so his being open
minded toward crazy-ass Ahmadinejad has to stand as a negative signal. It
makes one wonder why not MORE than 25% wouldn't by now identify as
conservatives.

-paghat the ratgirl
--
visit my temperate gardening website:
http://www.paghat.com
visit my film reviews website:
http://www.weirdwildrealm.com

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

Free Lunch wrote:
On Sun, 2 Nov 2008 02:22:25 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote in alt.atheism:

My claim comes from 25 years of personal experience. I have lived and worked
all over Europe and I am telling you public health IS a failure everywhere.
Your opinion is based on what? Perhaps books, magazines, TV or was it some
idealist talking trash. Please note my previous comment about the American
biased media. You are being sucked in. Come over here and experiece the
failure yourself. Pay the 55% tax, experience the waiting lines or the
denial of treatment or a drug, because it isn't approved. Watch your
neighbor suffer for a year or more because there is no room in your
designated hospital or die because the appropriate treatment is too
expensive for a person of age. Public health is not the solution for
universal health. This lesson has been learned.
Steve

Your claims don't match the docomentation.

Doesn't match my experience living my entire life in a country with
universal health care.

Everyone gets the same treatment. No one dies because they don't have
enough money. It may take longer to get elective or non-emergency
surgeries/appointments etc....but if it's an emergency, it gets treated
now. Cancer patients are not waiting months for chemo. They are not sent
home to die because they can't afford the medication or surgeries. My
mother's friend is in her 70s and has survived two bouts of breast
cancer. My father survived prostrate cancer. They still own their homes,
had their medications covered if it exceeded 10% of their income and now
live their lives as they did before they got sick.

A relative with leukemia survived it almost 30 years ago...getting an
"experimental treatment" called a bone marrow transplant. Today, in the
US, insurance companies will fight having to cover "experimental
treatment." If he were American, he'd be dead now.

I may have to wait for some things...six weeks for my knee surgery, for
example. But I knew I was going to get it. No fighting with insurance
companies. No worrying that they'd label anything "pre-existing." No
worry they would deny medications or the surgery itself.

I'll take universal health care over the US system any day!!!

..
--
We must change the way we live
Or the climate will do it for us.

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"Larry" wrote in message
...
Two meter troll wrote in
news:a9b7e418-d399-4919-98f6-
:

try this Larry. they no longer have controll of the republican party,
the fundimental christians do.
you now at this moment have a bible fundimental that thinks the
rapture will come and he and his brethrin will be raised up to heaven
and be rewarded for killing the unbelivers and abortionists at the
button. And you are a heathen unbeliver.

Id rather have the jews at least they wont kill the cash cow.



It is a point, but the Christians don't have their own atomic bombs, which
may limit their "power".....


Put that fundamentalist wackadoodle "Carabou Barbie" in office and you'll
have handed the bombs to them. This is what scares me about the religious
right- if they get one of thier hard corp types in the big chair and they
decide that it's armagedon time.....

Obama as president: The Commander and Chief
 

No, McCain. What has he done for the environment.
What has Palin done for the environment?

"Bill Kearney" wrote in message
t...
What has he done?

You mean Obama? Besides talk himself up? Nothing!

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Sat, 01 Nov 2008 23:04:45 +0000 in
, Larry wrote:

"Mark K. Bilbo" wrote in news:1k2vt5-92i2.ln1
@blaze.blaze.net:

Except there is.

Hint: try to sneak a lot of K-Y into jail with you, you'll need it...

--
Mark K. Bilbo a.a. #1423 EAC Department of Linguistic
Subversion ------------------------------------------------------------
Nine out of ten priests who have tried Camels, prefer young boys.




And not one shred of evidence in a post made by a 12-year-old mind....

QUOTE THE LAW! They are all listed on:

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/

Hundreds of thousands of Americans DON'T pay income taxes, now, many
former IRS employees. The movie introduces you to a few of their worst
offenders.

The "there is no law" is a scam doofus. And people who fall for the scam
end up in jail.

You want to practice civil disobedience, that's fine with me. I think
more of the US public should grow a set and do so. But civil disobedience
also means going to jail when they catch up with you. It's part of the
package.

You don't like the 16th amendment, lobby to get it repealed. But until
then, it's a quite simple, easily understand part of our primary law. To
wit:

"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from
whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several states,
and without regard to any census or enumeration."

End of story.

--
Mark K. Bilbo a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
------------------------------------------------------------
Surgeon General's Warning:
Quitting Religion Now Greatly Increases the Chances of World Peace.

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"paghat" wrote in message
...
This thread was started by a stealth Obama supporter who wants us to
believe anyone who doesn't vote for Obama is too stupid to tie his own
shoes.

-paghat the ratgirl
--
visit my temperate gardening website:
http://www.paghat.com
visit my film reviews website:
http://www.weirdwildrealm.com

Well, I think that anyone that just goes along with either Party (usually
thier parents Party) blindly with no more than a "sound bite" interest in
the issues is incredibly ignorant.
I think the problem is that most Americans vote the party ticket because
it's easy; they can less time figuring out which candidate will do a better
job for America (first) and the world (second) and put that valuabe time
towards IMPORTANT things like foot ball stats, thier golf stroke, which
shoes go better with the new outfit or which celebrity has won biggest idiot
award this week.
Following blindly is a very bad idea, period. It works well for the Leaders,
but not so well for the followers.
People have a right to vote however they want, but I think to not care
enough about the choice to put in a little time studying the candidates
cheapens this gift.

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:17:32 +0000 Larry carved the
following into the hard stone of alt.atheism
"Paul E. Lehmann" wrote in
m:

The progressive tax
system has been the law of the land for a LONG
time now. Get over it.


I'll bite. What's the Title/Code reference or name of the US LAW that says
I have to pay Income Tax on my wages?

Cite SPECIFIC LAW, not the bogus IRS code.

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/26/

Title 26 contains the tax code. Amazingly enough, the very first
section of the Title covers individiual income tax.

--

Douglas Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
Jason Gastrich is praying for me on 8 January 2011

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the
source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a
stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as
good as dead: his eyes are closed." - Albert Einstein

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Sun, 02 Nov 2008 00:01:41 +0000 Larry carved the
following into the hard stone of alt.atheism

Oh, dear.. we have a tax protestor loose! I'll be taking cites from
the best FAQ on the subject, http://evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html

The 16th Amendment was never ratified, rendering it moot. Amendments
must be ratified, according to the constitution, protecting states
rights to NOT become slaves of the central government.

Wrong.

http://evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html#ratification

The Supreme Court also pointed out that the 16th Amendment did NOT grant
the government any NEW taxes, such as the Income Tax on INDIVIDUAL
Americans.

Wrong.

http://evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html#nonewpower

It IS legal to tax income from GAINS of corporations. That's not in
question. What IS and has been since 1913 in question is there is no
law that gives the government the power to make UNAPPORTIONED taxes on
PERSONAL income....and never has been.

Wrong.

http://evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html#wages

The IRS code is NOT US law. The IRS code is REGULATION by BUREAUCRATS
who were told they had this power to unapportioned taxes on individuals.
Because of a lack of enabling legislation, IRS code is null and void.
Bureaucrats cannot and SHOULD NOT have any power to enable anything
outside US CODE. If they can...we're DOOMED!

Wrong.

http://evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html#law

--

Douglas Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
Jason Gastrich is praying for me on 8 January 2011

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the
source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a
stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as
good as dead: his eyes are closed." - Albert Einstein

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Sun, 02 Nov 2008 00:12:25 -0400 Marty carved the
following into the hard stone of alt.atheism
Tom wrote:

It's truly sad so many are afraid of smart people.

Huzzah! I want intellectually elite people to run the country!

John Cleese was on Countdown the other night, and he said that he
didn't want a President he could have a beer with, he wanted a
Pressident so brilliant, so well-informed, that Cleese would be afraid
to open his mouth for fear of showing what an idiot he is.

Watch it yourself, seeing John Cleese doubled over in laughter is
great.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUnGfYvXMwg
--

Douglas Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
Jason Gastrich is praying for me on 8 January 2011

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the
source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a
stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as
good as dead: his eyes are closed." - Albert Einstein

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

Ah yes, the specious 'racist' argument. Anyone daring to criticize their
almighty Obama must be a racist.

Hardly. I'm just not interested in seeing someone with so few creditials
suitable for the job be elected to it. That his ass happens to be black has
nothing to do with it. Shame on you for trying to insinuate otherwise.
Who's the closest racist here, you, more likely.


"Tom" wrote in message
...
On Nov 1, 8:47 pm, "Bill Kearney" wrote:
He even taught
constitutional law for a few years.

Hmmm., those who can't do... teach.


Being a law school professor is hardly something to be ashamed of, let
alone discounted and ridiculed.

He could've practiced law, but then you'd complain about him being a
lawyer.

No matter what he has accomplished in life, you will never give him
credit for them.

Are you a racist or just unwilling to acknowledge one achievements?

Tom

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

Bill Kearney wrote:

Ah yes, the specious 'racist' argument. Anyone daring to criticize
their almighty Obama must be a racist.

It's racist because you say this about Obama without a comment on
Palin's lack of experience outside of her few months as governor...a few
months marked by abuses of power and questionable claims.

And there are Republicans who agree with me.

..


--
We must change the way we live
Or the climate will do it for us.

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Nov 2, 9:15*am, Douglas Berry
wrote:
On *Sun, 02 Nov 2008 00:12:25 -0400 Marty carved the
following into the hard stone of alt.atheism

Tom wrote:

It's truly sad so many are afraid of smart people.

Huzzah! *I want intellectually elite people to run the country!

John Cleese was on Countdown the other night, and he said that he
didn't want a President he could have a beer with, he wanted a
Pressident so brilliant, so well-informed, that Cleese would be afraid
to open his mouth for fear of showing what an idiot he is.

Watch it yourself, seeing John Cleese doubled over in laughter is
great.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUnGfYvXMwg
--

Douglas Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
Jason Gastrich is praying for me on 8 January 2011

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the
source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a
stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as
good as dead: his eyes are closed." - Albert Einstein


I saw that, too.

Cleese is pretty smart himself, so coming from him, I think he lends a
lot of credibility to smartest guy in the room point of view.

Thanks for the link. It was fun watching again.

Tom

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Nov 2, 9:53*am, "Bill Kearney" wrote:
Ah yes, the specious 'racist' argument. *Anyone daring to criticize their
almighty Obama must be a racist.

Hardly. *I'm just not interested in seeing someone with so few creditials
suitable for the job be elected to it. *That his ass happens to be black has
nothing to do with it. *Shame on you for trying to insinuate otherwise.
Who's the closest racist here, you, more likely.

"Tom" wrote in message

...
On Nov 1, 8:47 pm, "Bill Kearney" wrote:

He even taught
constitutional law for a few years.

Hmmm., those who can't do... teach.

Being a law school professor is hardly something to be ashamed of, let
alone discounted and ridiculed.

He could've practiced law, but then you'd complain about him being a
lawyer.

No matter what he has accomplished in life, you will never give him
credit for them.

Are you a racist or just unwilling to acknowledge one achievements?

Tom



I didn't insinuate anything. I asked a question.

Feel free to ask any of the black people I work with if I'm a racist.
I'll be happy to provide contact info via e-mail.

Your refusal to acknowledge his accomplishments make you look like a
doofus. You don't have to agree with him, but you can't logically
dismiss his educational or scholarly achievements.

Tom

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

In article , clouddreamer
wrote:

Bill Kearney wrote:

Ah yes, the specious 'racist' argument. Anyone daring to criticize
their almighty Obama must be a racist.

It's racist because you say this about Obama without a comment on
Palin's lack of experience outside of her few months as governor...a few
months marked by abuses of power and questionable claims.

And there are Republicans who agree with me.

..

While I suspect racism could very well be at least part of the core of
opinions that require such huge blinders to project, fact is, partisan
thinkers always fail to see their own candidates' ignobility while
enlarging every faint hint of fault in the "other," and the "other" is
often cast one step short of human whether on a battlefield or a debate.
Meaning the most idiotically one-sided irrational assertion could be made
against the "foe" even if he weren't, additionally, a ni....

-paghat the ratgirl
--
visit my temperate gardening website:
http://www.paghat.com
visit my film reviews website:
http://www.weirdwildrealm.com

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On 2008-11-02 10:15:00 -0500, Douglas Berry
said:

John Cleese was on Countdown the other night, and he said that he
didn't want a President he could have a beer with, he wanted a
Pressident so brilliant, so well-informed, that Cleese would be afraid
to open his mouth for fear of showing what an idiot he is.

Watch it yourself, seeing John Cleese doubled over in laughter is
great.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUnGfYvXMwg

Olbermann may have given the most truthful assessment: that his salary
is paid by the manufactured controversy.

There is hardly a whit of difference between the two RepubliCrat candidates.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

Douglas Berry wrote:
On Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:17:32 +0000 Larry carved the
following into the hard stone of alt.atheism
"Paul E. Lehmann" wrote in
:

The progressive tax
system has been the law of the land for a LONG
time now. Get over it.

I'll bite. What's the Title/Code reference or name of the US LAW that says
I have to pay Income Tax on my wages?

Cite SPECIFIC LAW, not the bogus IRS code.

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/26/

Title 26 contains the tax code. Amazingly enough, the very first
section of the Title covers individiual income tax.

Douglas, Larry thinks that Title 26 *IS* the "bogus IRS code"... even
though Title 26 is part of the "United States Code"...

--
************************************************** ****
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*----------------------------------------------------*
* It has been said that Jesus died on a Friday and *
* was resurrected on a Sunday. It is not so much *
* that Jesus died for our sins, as he had a very *
* bad weekend for them. *
************************************************** ****

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On 2008-11-02 10:13:54 -0500, Jangchub said:

On Sun, 02 Nov 2008 06:09:00 GMT, Jere Lull wrote:


Oh, I would like to see a list of *any* authored by him.

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/fo...sage509824/pg1

http://you.presscue.com/node/442

http://www.cafemom.com/journals/read..._United_States

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...010303303.html

How

many more would you like?

Well, some substantial ones that didn't get read twice and out. What
you posted above demonstrates that he wasted a lot of time with fluff
-- as did Hillary.

Victoria

"There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There
are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we
don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we
don't know we don't know."

Donald Rumsfeld

I wonder why you use this tag, as I don't *think* you're
pro-Republican, but that is a pretty much a truism.

The path to wisdom starts with knowing that you don't know.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

Hey Tom!
It's not about the man, his education or his experience.....It's about the
issues,his honestyand his position.
Steve

"Tom" wrote in message
...
On Nov 2, 9:53 am, "Bill Kearney" wrote:
Ah yes, the specious 'racist' argument. Anyone daring to criticize their
almighty Obama must be a racist.

Hardly. I'm just not interested in seeing someone with so few creditials
suitable for the job be elected to it. That his ass happens to be black
has
nothing to do with it. Shame on you for trying to insinuate otherwise.
Who's the closest racist here, you, more likely.

"Tom" wrote in message

...
On Nov 1, 8:47 pm, "Bill Kearney" wrote:

He even taught
constitutional law for a few years.

Hmmm., those who can't do... teach.

Being a law school professor is hardly something to be ashamed of, let
alone discounted and ridiculed.

He could've practiced law, but then you'd complain about him being a
lawyer.

No matter what he has accomplished in life, you will never give him
credit for them.

Are you a racist or just unwilling to acknowledge one achievements?

Tom



I didn't insinuate anything. I asked a question.

Feel free to ask any of the black people I work with if I'm a racist.
I'll be happy to provide contact info via e-mail.

Your refusal to acknowledge his accomplishments make you look like a
doofus. You don't have to agree with him, but you can't logically
dismiss his educational or scholarly achievements.

Tom

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Nov 2, 1:21*pm, "Steve Lusardi" wrote:
Hey Tom!
It's not about the man, his education or his experience.....It's about the
issues,his honestyand his position.
Steve

"Tom" wrote in message

...
On Nov 2, 9:53 am, "Bill Kearney" wrote:



Ah yes, the specious 'racist' argument. Anyone daring to criticize their
almighty Obama must be a racist.

Hardly. I'm just not interested in seeing someone with so few creditials
suitable for the job be elected to it. That his ass happens to be black
has
nothing to do with it. Shame on you for trying to insinuate otherwise.
Who's the closest racist here, you, more likely.

"Tom" wrote in message

....
On Nov 1, 8:47 pm, "Bill Kearney" wrote:

He even taught
constitutional law for a few years.

Hmmm., those who can't do... teach.

Being a law school professor is hardly something to be ashamed of, let
alone discounted and ridiculed.

He could've practiced law, but then you'd complain about him being a
lawyer.

No matter what he has accomplished in life, you will never give him
credit for them.

Are you a racist or just unwilling to acknowledge one achievements?

Tom

I didn't insinuate anything. I asked a question.

Feel free to ask any of the black people I work with if I'm a racist.
I'll be happy to provide contact info via e-mail.

Your refusal to acknowledge his accomplishments make you look like a
doofus. You don't have to agree with him, but you can't logically
dismiss his educational or scholarly achievements.

Tom

Isn't honesty about the man... about character?

I have neither read nor heard anything credible to call into question
his character. I doubt many of the posters here can make a claim to
public service or human service as long as Obama's.

I notice you still haven't acknowleged his academic accomplishments.

Tom

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

Larry,

The 16th Amendment was ratified in 1913 and became law. That it was
ratified was certified by Knox, the Secretary of State. Whether you believe
that or not is immaterial to me. I answered your question by citing the
appropriate laws. You sound like a "tax loony".

Dave M.

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"Steve Lusardi" skrev i melding
...
My claim comes from 25 years of personal experience. I have lived and
worked all over Europe and I am telling you public health IS a failure
everywhere. Your opinion is based on what? Perhaps books, magazines, TV or
was it some idealist talking trash. Please note my previous comment about
the American biased media. You are being sucked in. Come over here and
experiece the failure yourself. Pay the 55% tax, experience the waiting
lines or the denial of treatment or a drug, because it isn't approved.
Watch your neighbor suffer for a year or more because there is no room in
your designated hospital or die because the appropriate treatment is too
expensive for a person of age. Public health is not the solution for
universal health. This lesson has been learned.
Steve


I suggest that you never lived in Europe, or that your memory is failing
you.
I live in Norway, my annual income is around $ 100 000.
The tax I pay is around 30%, this is including health insurance and pension.
If I visit my doctor I pay a small fee, as I also do for medicine,
but expences exciding $200 a year are free. Hospital is free, you may have
to wait a few weeks depending on your illness. My mother who is
85 waited 4 weeks for a hip operation, which of course war free, as was 4
weeks in a nursing home after the operation.
When I retire I will get a pension of £35 000 per year, not so much, but as
we have progessiv taxasion the tax will be low.
Of course if you want additional and privat insurance or pension that is up
to you.
I think we are in line with most European countries, I have not heard
anything near to your story. Even former Eastern Europe had a good and free
health care.
And as this also is a cruising NG that I follow, I will mention that i have
a sailboat, Kelt 850.
Jan

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Sun, 02 Nov 2008 18:00:49 GMT, Jere Lull wrote:

On 2008-11-02 10:15:00 -0500, Douglas Berry
said:

John Cleese was on Countdown the other night, and he said that he
didn't want a President he could have a beer with, he wanted a
Pressident so brilliant, so well-informed, that Cleese would be afraid
to open his mouth for fear of showing what an idiot he is.

Watch it yourself, seeing John Cleese doubled over in laughter is
great.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUnGfYvXMwg

Olbermann may have given the most truthful assessment: that his salary
is paid by the manufactured controversy.

There is hardly a whit of difference between the two RepubliCrat candidates.

If you know anything about econcomics you would not say that.

Under one, we have a chance to get out of this credit disaster, under
the other - not a prayer. Kiss your job goodby.

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"David L. Martel" wrote in
:

Larry,

The 16th Amendment was ratified in 1913 and became law. That it was
ratified was certified by Knox, the Secretary of State. Whether you
believe that or not is immaterial to me. I answered your question by
citing the appropriate laws. You sound like a "tax loony".

Dave M.




So, just like in the book "1984", if a bureaucrat says it's so, even if
it's full of holes, it's so, is that it? Knox KNEW the states had
modified the act in a whole range of states, but ignored them and said
it was so, anyways certifying, falsely of course, the original document
the bankers wanted to fund the debt repayment....

I suppose you are correct. It's still being done, even today, as with
the Florida recount Bush wanted stopped and got his Supreme Court
cronies to certify, putting a halt to an embarrassing political antic of
his brother.

I see. So, what's the sense of voting on anything? We just let the
ruling cults and elitists run everything, just like Orwell's "1984",
rewriting history with a pack of lies to make what the elite want as the
truth, the truth, even when it's not.

War is Peace
Freedom is Slavery

Arbeit Macht Frei - Work brings freedom
http://www.travelblog.org/Photos/461096.html

We are simply doomed to repeat it, over and over again.

sign me,
"Tax Loony"

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"Jan" wrote in
:

I suggest that you never lived in Europe, or that your memory is
failing you.
I live in Norway, my annual income is around $ 100 000.
The tax I pay is around 30%, this is including health insurance and
pension. If I visit my doctor I pay a small fee, as I also do for
medicine, but expences exciding $200 a year are free. Hospital is
free, you may have to wait a few weeks depending on your illness. My
mother who is 85 waited 4 weeks for a hip operation, which of course
war free, as was 4 weeks in a nursing home after the operation.
When I retire I will get a pension of œ35 000 per year, not so much,
but as we have progessiv taxasion the tax will be low.
Of course if you want additional and privat insurance or pension that
is up to you.
I think we are in line with most European countries, I have not heard
anything near to your story. Even former Eastern Europe had a good and
free health care.
And as this also is a cruising NG that I follow, I will mention that i
have a sailboat, Kelt 850.
Jan




Jan, my apologies for the Americans' view of socialized medicine
expressed to you. They are under constant, heavy pressure by the
billionaire doctors' union, the American Medical Association, who has a
lot to lose if Americans ever get any kind of socialized medicine that
doesn't leave the poor bleeding in the streets. Many of the posters
here are those very rich American doctors sailing their new yachts as a
result of the American system of massive payments for the most mediocre
medical service, while the other major criminals in the medical
business, the insurance companies between the doctors' riches and the
victims' wallets skim off as much or maybe more than the doctors get...a
double taxation on the working class buying medical insurance. Medical
insurance companies do not become amazingly rich by paying doctor and
hospital bills of sick people. On the contrary, medical insurance
companies want nothing to do with any kind of medical risk patients,
only the medically fit that don't make large claims with the resources
to pay large insurance premiums for no service, thousands per month.
This medical burden also causes EMPLOYERS' to flee under the heavy load
of the American medical profession's love of wealth, the reason
everything that used to be made in America has now moved off to more
socialized countries of Asia and Europe where employers don't have to
pay outrageous medical insurance premiums to enrich the medical and
insurance classes.

Noone in America gives a **** about providing healthcare to the poor,
the unemployed, old retired people....unless they band together and
throw politicians into the street, of course.

You'll never convince any Americans who've never been the beneficiaries
of another country's socialist medical system, like the systems in
civilized European countries, that anything good comes out of them.
They've always been told otherwise by the Ministry of Propaganda known
as American News Media.

The concept of paying doctors bonuses to PREVENT diseases in the first
place is totally foreign to them. Doctors make money here by making
people SICK, heavily dosing them with recurrant drugs at exhorbitant
prices to keep them on the hook, so to speak, just like any drug dealer
on the street.

I have a saying, "Well people don't make payments on waterfront
property." Well people don't have to pay doctors, so are not the big
cash cow. SICK people make doctors billionaires. The country is loaded
up with hypocondriacs (sp??) who are just SO proud of their last $70,000
operation they can't wait to tell you all about it. My parents were two
of them. The day my father died, his pharmacist lost $8000/month in
prescription sales, alone. His doctor lost thousands, too. He was one
of the "science project" patients that keep paying and paying and
paying...for that waterfront mansion they live in and the new Mercedes
in their garages....

ON TOPIC - Not to mention their new Beneteau at the finest marina in the
city....(c;

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

Larry wrote:


Noone in America gives a **** about providing healthcare to the poor,
the unemployed, old retired people....unless they band together and
throw politicians into the street, of course.

Therein lies a big part of the problem. Americans hate poor people. They
think they're all lazy bums who have no ambition.

I think Matthew Fox put it perfectly on "Lost"

Live together or die alone.

Americans have to understand that they would be stronger as a nation, as
a people if they helped those that can't help themselves. Not all the
poor are lazy bums.

..


--

We must change the way we live,
or the climate will do it for us.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2oCYW4ScUnw

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On 2 Nov 2008 18:46:01 -0600, Dave wrote:

On Sat, 01 Nov 2008 08:08:36 -0500, Brian Whatcott
said:

idjits who
don't know that Obama was a professor of Constitutional Law at Chicago
(fer Criss sake!)

....
Obama was never a professor. He was an instructor, but he never wrote
anything of significance....

Google 'Obama professorial posts'. Not all his students raved
about Prof Obama. Perhaps you are unsure of the difference between
an instructor (often a graduate student in the American system), and a
"lecturer", the label for a professor, as titled in e.g the British
system. States with Vo-techs often have academics titled
professor, let alone first tier professional schools.

Brian W

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

According to the United States Government Printing Office, the
following states ratified the amendment:

Alabama (August 10, 1909)
Kentucky (February 8, 1910)
South Carolina (February 19, 1910)
Illinois (March 1, 1910)
Mississippi (March 7, 1910)
Oklahoma (March 10, 1910)
Maryland (April 8, 1910)
Georgia (August 3, 1910)
Texas (August 16, 1910)
Ohio (January 19, 1911)
Idaho (January 20, 1911)
Oregon (January 23, 1911)
Washington (January 26, 1911)
Montana (January 27, 1911)
Indiana (January 30, 1911)
California (January 31, 1911)
Nevada (January 31, 1911)
South Dakota (February 1, 1911)
Nebraska (February 9, 1911)
North Carolina (February 11, 1911)
Colorado (February 15, 1911)
North Dakota (February 17, 1911)
Michigan (February 23, 1911)
Iowa (February 24, 1911)
Kansas (March 2, 1911)
Missouri (March 16, 1911)
Maine (March 31, 1911)
Tennessee (April 7, 1911)
Arkansas (April 22, 1911), after having previously rejected the
amendment
Wisconsin (May 16, 1911)
New York (July 12, 1911)
Arizona (April 3, 1912)
Minnesota (June 11, 1912)
Louisiana (June 28, 1912)
West Virginia (January 31, 1913)
New Mexico (February 3, 1913)
Ratification (by the requisite thirty-six states) was completed on
February 3, 1913 with the ratification by New Mexico. The amendment
was subsequently ratified by the following states, bringing the total
number of ratifying states to forty-two of the forty-eight then
existing:

37. Delaware (February 3, 1913)
38. Wyoming (February 3, 1913)
39. New Jersey (February 4, 1913)
40. Vermont (February 19, 1913)
41. Massachusetts (March 4, 1913)
42. New Hampshire (March 7, 1913), after rejecting the amendment on
March 2, 1911
The following states rejected the amendment without ever subsequently
ratifying it:

Connecticut
Florida (rejected the amendment after it had already been ratified by
three-fourths of the states)
Rhode Island
Utah
The following states never took up the proposed amendment:

Pennsylvania
Virginia

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Nov 2008 08:08:36 -0500, Brian Whatcott
said:

idjits who
don't know that Obama was a professor of Constitutional Law at Chicago
(fer Criss sake!)

Close, but no cigar.

Obama was never a professor. He was an instructor, but he never wrote
anything of significance, and he never did anything else to warrant his
being made a professor.

Another example of his being a chronic underachiever.


Nope. You're wrong as usual:
UC Law School statement: The Law School has received many media requests
about Barack Obama, especially about his status as "Senior Lecturer." From
1992 until his election to the U.S. Senate in 2004, Barack Obama served as a
professor in the Law School. He was a Lecturer from 1992 to 1996. He was a
Senior Lecturer from 1996 to 2004, during which time he taught three courses
per year. Senior Lecturers are considered to be members of the Law School
faculty and are regarded as professors, although not full-time or
tenure-track. The title of Senior Lecturer is distinct from the title of
Lecturer, which signifies adjunct status. Like Obama, each of the Law
School's Senior Lecturers have high-demand careers in politics or public
service, which prevent full-time teaching. Several times during his 12 years
as a professor in the Law School, Obama was invited to join the faculty in a
full-time tenure-track position, but he declined.


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"clouddreamer" wrote in message
m...
Bill Kearney wrote:

Ah yes, the specious 'racist' argument. Anyone daring to criticize their
almighty Obama must be a racist.

It's racist because you say this about Obama without a comment on Palin's
lack of experience

No, you're the one so frantic and foaming at the mouth that you're desperate
to raise such a specious argument.

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 2 Nov 2008 17:47:09 -0800, "Capt. JG"
said:

Senior Lecturers are considered to be members of the Law School
faculty and are regarded as professors, although not full-time or
tenure-track.

How many legs does a sheep have if the University of Chicago Law School
calls its tail a leg?


So, you're contradicting the UofC Law School because *you* know better. Got
it.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

In article ,
"Bill Kearney" said:

Hardly. I'm just not interested in seeing someone with so few
creditials suitable for the job be elected to it. That his ass
happens to be black has nothing to do with it. Shame on you for
trying to insinuate otherwise. Who's the closest racist here,
you, more likely.

What do you think the creditials suitable for the job of President
are?

-- wds

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

William December Starr wrote:

In article

,
"Bill Kearney" said:

Hardly. I'm just not interested in seeing
someone with so few
creditials suitable for the job be elected to
it. That his ass
happens to be black has nothing to do with it.
Shame on you for
trying to insinuate otherwise. Who's the
closest racist here, you, more likely.

What do you think the creditials suitable for
the job of President are?

-- wds

Lets try leadership and selecting superior
advisors and key people around you.

Obama wins on both. Bush and McShame lost/loose
on both. McShame can not even organize his OWN
CAMPAIGN. Do you think he would do any better
leading the entire country???????

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

On Nov 1, 4:28*pm, Douglas Berry
wrote:
On *Sat, 01 Nov 2008 09:49:37 -0500 Jangchub
carved the following into the hard stone of alt.atheism

Wait, Palin went to five colleges to get her degree in what, who
knows.

Jounalism. She wanted to be a sports reporter and ended up a weather
girl.

I think if you look again, you'll see she's "ended up" as Governor
of Alaska, candidate for VP, and possibly future President of
the United States.

--
Walt

Obama as president: The Commander and Thief
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...
Seems pretty obvious from the language you quoted that what the U of C Law
School does is call their part time instructors "Professor" once the
instructor gets elected to public office. Why in the world would they do
that? Duh...

My Lincoln reference seems quite apposite.

Seems pretty obvious to me that their definition of "Professor" is entirely
in keeping with the dictionary:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/professor