On Jul 3, 3:14*pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Bob" wrote in message

Either way, a dead give-a-way is the constant helm corrections.
somthing aint right.
Bob

What ain't right is your absurd assumptions about the constant helm
corrections. There is no modern, high performance sailboat with fin
keel/spade rudder combo that doesn't need constant helm corrections when
running with the seas on or abaft the quarter. It's the nature of the beast.
Duh!

Wilbur Hubbard

two comments Wilbur:
1, I agree the boat type is absurd and simply not a safe designe for
most people. still a helm should not have to drive a boat that much.
It an indacation somthin aint ballanced right. my boat handled a bit
that way too. but i had 300+ pounds of chain and a 45lb anchor in the
bow.......

2., I belive the correct tem is simply "quarter". No other language is
needed to give that area on a vessel meaning.
but your use may be a local dialect. I other words, locate the
"quarters" on a vessel.
But i got your idea. those kind of boats are dangerous in an amature's
hands.
bob

"Bob" wrote in message
...
On Jul 3, 3:14 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Bob" wrote in message

Either way, a dead give-a-way is the constant helm corrections.
somthing aint right.
Bob

What ain't right is your absurd assumptions about the constant helm
corrections. There is no modern, high performance sailboat with fin
keel/spade rudder combo that doesn't need constant helm corrections when
running with the seas on or abaft the quarter. It's the nature of the
beast.
Duh!

Wilbur Hubbard

\ two comments Wilbur:
\ 1, I agree the boat type is absurd and simply not a safe designe for
\ most people. still a helm should not have to drive a boat that much.
\ It an indacation somthin aint ballanced right. my boat handled a bit
\ that way too. but i had 300+ pounds of chain and a 45lb anchor in the
\ bow.......
\
\ 2., I belive the correct tem is simply "quarter". No other language is
\ needed to give that area on a vessel meaning.
\ but your use may be a local dialect. I other words, locate the
\ "quarters" on a vessel.
\ But i got your idea. those kind of boats are dangerous in an amature's
\ hands.
\ bob

If you're suggesting I should have written "on or abaft quarter" then you
need to study your nautical terminology for that is simply incorrect
terminology.

But, the boat may have been trimmed badly as in down by the bows. That would
make it more likely that the stern would slew around in quartering seas as
the bows dug in. But, form factor of these modern hulls with minimal
buoyancy in the bows (even without a shot or two of chain stored there) and
a huge beam astern make them a real handful broad reaching. The best thing
you can do to tame them is strike the mainsail completely and run a storm
jib on the forestay. But you still have to be on the ball steering the
damned things.

--
Gregory Hall

"Gregory Hall" wrote in message
...

"Bob" wrote in message
...
On Jul 3, 3:14 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Bob" wrote in message

Either way, a dead give-a-way is the constant helm corrections.
somthing aint right.
Bob

What ain't right is your absurd assumptions about the constant helm
corrections. There is no modern, high performance sailboat with fin
keel/spade rudder combo that doesn't need constant helm corrections when
running with the seas on or abaft the quarter. It's the nature of the
beast.
Duh!

Wilbur Hubbard

\ two comments Wilbur:
\ 1, I agree the boat type is absurd and simply not a safe designe for
\ most people. still a helm should not have to drive a boat that much.
\ It an indacation somthin aint ballanced right. my boat handled a bit
\ that way too. but i had 300+ pounds of chain and a 45lb anchor in the
\ bow.......
\
\ 2., I belive the correct tem is simply "quarter". No other language is
\ needed to give that area on a vessel meaning.
\ but your use may be a local dialect. I other words, locate the
\ "quarters" on a vessel.
\ But i got your idea. those kind of boats are dangerous in an amature's
\ hands.
\ bob

If you're suggesting I should have written "on or abaft quarter" then you
need to study your nautical terminology for that is simply incorrect
terminology.

But, the boat may have been trimmed badly as in down by the bows. That
would make it more likely that the stern would slew around in quartering
seas as the bows dug in. But, form factor of these modern hulls with
minimal buoyancy in the bows (even without a shot or two of chain stored
there) and a huge beam astern make them a real handful broad reaching. The
best thing you can do to tame them is strike the mainsail completely and
run a storm jib on the forestay. But you still have to be on the ball
steering the damned things.

--
Gregory Hall



Good job, Gregory! Keep it up and you will be able to fill in for me when I
decide to go cruising again in the near future. This group needs my
brilliance and guidance. If you can provide it so much the better.

Do me a favor, though, never let the cowardly skipper of the scuttled "Red
Cloud" forget his folly. Keep after him until he publicly admits his
weakness in the face of a small ration of maritime adversity. Make the
limp-wristed, little, panty-waisted wimp realize that which made him chicken
out is nothing compared to the ocean in her full fury. We wouldn't want him
to underestimate the power of Neptune's play a second time. He can't stand
Neptune's play imagine his fright should he be treated to Neptune's wrath!
Let's hope he doesn't go off half-cocked again. Thank you.

He mentioned he was loading up his boat for a week-end cruise. Leaving from
Miami where he must have procured a replacement for his wimpishly abandoned
"Red Cloud." Let's hope he survives the Gulf Stream. Please pray for him.

Wilbur Hubbard

On Thu, 3 Jul 2008 21:49:03 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Gregory Hall" wrote in message
...

"Bob" wrote in message
...
On Jul 3, 3:14 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Bob" wrote in message

Either way, a dead give-a-way is the constant helm corrections.
somthing aint right.
Bob

What ain't right is your absurd assumptions about the constant helm
corrections. There is no modern, high performance sailboat with fin
keel/spade rudder combo that doesn't need constant helm corrections when
running with the seas on or abaft the quarter. It's the nature of the
beast.
Duh!

Wilbur Hubbard

\ two comments Wilbur:
\ 1, I agree the boat type is absurd and simply not a safe designe for
\ most people. still a helm should not have to drive a boat that much.
\ It an indacation somthin aint ballanced right. my boat handled a bit
\ that way too. but i had 300+ pounds of chain and a 45lb anchor in the
\ bow.......
\
\ 2., I belive the correct tem is simply "quarter". No other language is
\ needed to give that area on a vessel meaning.
\ but your use may be a local dialect. I other words, locate the
\ "quarters" on a vessel.
\ But i got your idea. those kind of boats are dangerous in an amature's
\ hands.
\ bob

If you're suggesting I should have written "on or abaft quarter" then you
need to study your nautical terminology for that is simply incorrect
terminology.

But, the boat may have been trimmed badly as in down by the bows. That
would make it more likely that the stern would slew around in quartering
seas as the bows dug in. But, form factor of these modern hulls with
minimal buoyancy in the bows (even without a shot or two of chain stored
there) and a huge beam astern make them a real handful broad reaching. The
best thing you can do to tame them is strike the mainsail completely and
run a storm jib on the forestay. But you still have to be on the ball
steering the damned things.

--
Gregory Hall



Good job, Gregory! Keep it up and you will be able to fill in for me when I
decide to go cruising again in the near future. This group needs my
brilliance and guidance. If you can provide it so much the better.

Do me a favor, though, never let the cowardly skipper of the scuttled "Red
Cloud" forget his folly. Keep after him until he publicly admits his
weakness in the face of a small ration of maritime adversity. Make the
limp-wristed, little, panty-waisted wimp realize that which made him chicken
out is nothing compared to the ocean in her full fury. We wouldn't want him
to underestimate the power of Neptune's play a second time. He can't stand
Neptune's play imagine his fright should he be treated to Neptune's wrath!
Let's hope he doesn't go off half-cocked again. Thank you.

He mentioned he was loading up his boat for a week-end cruise. Leaving from
Miami where he must have procured a replacement for his wimpishly abandoned
"Red Cloud." Let's hope he survives the Gulf Stream. Please pray for him.

Wilbur Hubbard


Capt. Neil, Wilbur Hubbard and now Gregory Hall. Will the supply of
Sock Puppets never end?



A fool who knows his foolishness is wise
at least to that extent, but a fool who
thinks himself wise is a fool indeed.

On Jul 3, 5:49*pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Gregory Hall" wrote in message

"Bob" wrote in message


Good job, Gregory! Keep it up and you will be able to fill in for me when I
Wilbur Hubbard


Dear Gregory and Willbur:
there is more than one way to get a cat to give up their skin......
Please read the following:
__________________________________________________ _________________
Fastnet Disaster
of
1979

Interview with Bill Burrows, Chief Engineer Royal Navy Lifeboat
Institution. Retrieved three disabled sailboats in a 21 hour rescue
during the fatal 1979 Fastnet Storm.

“… Look, you get 300 Yachats in poor weather and you’re going to have
some trouble, almost certainly. But the majority of the trouble was
hysteria created by the situation and by inexperienced crews. And that
it was. They were blaming rudders and such, but none of those rudders
would have snapped if they had put drogues out and storm jibs and run
before the weather. They were under bare poles, most of them, and they
were getting up on the seas. And the seas were about 45 feet. Not what
we around here call big. (Bob: I love that statment!)

They got up on these seas and they were running. When the boats were
starting to broach, what the helmsmen were doing was hauling on the
rudders to stop them from broaching. They were putting too much bloody
strain on the rudders, and they had to go.

Yes, I know they were racing sailors, not cruising men, but that’s no
excuse. We went out that night and we passed a little old hooker sort
of thing with a family of kids aboard and they were going away to
Ireland with no trouble at all….”
(The Yacht, April 1987)
__________________________________________________ _______________________

Read an learn from the more wise.
Bob

Hey Bob. My favorite boating quote of all time. I even have it on my web
site.

Thanks for posting it.

--
Roger Long

"Bob" wrote in message
...
__________________________________________________ _________________
Fastnet Disaster
of
1979

Interview with Bill Burrows, Chief Engineer Royal Navy Lifeboat
Institution. Retrieved three disabled sailboats in a 21 hour rescue
during the fatal 1979 Fastnet Storm.

“… Look, you get 300 Yachats in poor weather and you’re going to have
some trouble, almost certainly. But the majority of the trouble was
hysteria created by the situation and by inexperienced crews. And that
it was. They were blaming rudders and such, but none of those rudders
would have snapped if they had put drogues out and storm jibs and run
before the weather. They were under bare poles, most of them, and they
were getting up on the seas. And the seas were about 45 feet. Not what
we around here call big. (Bob: I love that statment!)

They got up on these seas and they were running. When the boats were
starting to broach, what the helmsmen were doing was hauling on the
rudders to stop them from broaching. They were putting too much bloody
strain on the rudders, and they had to go.

Yes, I know they were racing sailors, not cruising men, but that’s no
excuse. We went out that night and we passed a little old hooker sort
of thing with a family of kids aboard and they were going away to
Ireland with no trouble at all….”
(The Yacht, April 1987)
__________________________________________________ _______________________

Read an learn from the more wise.
Bob

Bob, I am not arguing with any of that but just want to make it clear that
the RNLI has nothing to do with the Royal Navy. The RNLI is entirely funded
by voluntary collections in pubs and fundraising functions held all over UK
and by legacies from people who know what fine work they do. They get no
money from the Government at all.
All the crews are volunteers, selected by those with whom they will jointly
risk their lives at short notice anytime.
When not at sea they hold down a range of ordinary jobs ashore, not all
water based.. They just have to live near enough to the quay to be afloat
within minutes of being called, formerly by maroons, now usually cellphones.
The only one who gets paid anything is the mechanic, who has to ensure the
boat is constantly ready for service.
Their primary task is to save lives but they almost never have claimed
salvage even when they have saved a vessel as well as its crew, from
disaster.
If someone is in trouble they will go out whatever the weather and thanks to
the generosity of the British public their boats are state-of- the art and
lack nothing that will help them do their work.

In article ,
says...
Bob, I am not arguing with any of that but just want to make it clear that
the RNLI has nothing to do with the Royal Navy. The RNLI is entirely funded
by voluntary collections in pubs and fundraising functions held all over UK
and by legacies from people who know what fine work they do. They get no
money from the Government at all.
All the crews are volunteers, selected by those with whom they will jointly
risk their lives at short notice anytime.
When not at sea they hold down a range of ordinary jobs ashore, not all
water based.. They just have to live near enough to the quay to be afloat
within minutes of being called, formerly by maroons, now usually cellphones.
The only one who gets paid anything is the mechanic, who has to ensure the
boat is constantly ready for service.
Their primary task is to save lives but they almost never have claimed
salvage even when they have saved a vessel as well as its crew, from
disaster.
If someone is in trouble they will go out whatever the weather and thanks to
the generosity of the British public their boats are state-of- the art and
lack nothing that will help them do their work.

Just to add to the above, It's the Royal *National* Lifeboat
Institution. The "Royal" part just means they have a royal patron. Their
web site is http://www.rnli.org.uk/ (try pressing the green button and
answer all the questions :-) ) All their manning volunteers are fully
trained at their college.

They were under Govenment control during WW2 but returned to their
charitable status as a voluntary organization as soon as they could
afterwards... and have remaind so ever since.
--
John W
To mail me replace the obvious with co.uk twice