schlackoff, nice flip-flop.

ROFL (see my other post on steering)
You obviously don't know what I said, and I can guarantee you can't find a
post
of mine which backs up your statement below (unless you take something out of
context)
Sorry Jax, as per usual, you are wrong .... I didn't flip-flop and never said
what you are crediting me with.

Shen


schlackoff, congratulations on your flip-flop. from instant one I have been
saying the boat MUST be moving for the rudder to be effective in reverse,
while
you kept saying No the prop pulls enough water forward to make it work.

at least I am glad you saw the light. interesting how you changed position
and
claimed it as your own all along.

what the depth of the prop has to do with it.

Not sure why this reference to depth of a prop in relation to a hull.

Shen

schlackoff, can you say "end plate effect"?

ubject: Thrust vectoring
From: (JAXAshby)
Date: 03/27/2004 15:53 Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

what the depth of the prop has to do with it.

Not sure why this reference to depth of a prop in relation to a hull.

Shen

schlackoff, can you say "end plate effect"?


Yup, "end plate effect" ...don't mean squat to me.
Now, take a ship in ballast (prop tips at the water surface) put it astern ....
sumbitch will torque to port (RT hand prop) to a fairtheewell.
Take the same ship and load it (prop tips now 30 underwater) put it astern ....
sumbitch will torque to port to a fairtheewell..... some cases more, some cases
less ...gots ta watch them some cases.
This what yer talkin about?

Shen

Subject: Thrust vectoring
From: (JAXAshby)
Date: 03/27/2004 17:49 Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

schlackoff postutlates:

Yup, "end plate effect" ...don't mean squat to me.



.....and you can't comment on what I wrote and whether it relates to the
subject.
Hey, Dotsan, read Jaxass's responses. Do you really think they have anything to
do with "going astern" and steering and in any way enlighten you on the
subject?
Jax writes garbage based on what he's read and heard, not on what he knows from
practical experience ..... HE HAS NONE !!!

Shen

Jax writes garbage based on what he's read and heard, not on what he knows
from
practical experience ..... HE HAS NONE !!!

Shen

schlackoff, I have understood this simple stuff for more than forty years. You
don't understand it even to this day.

Let me help you out here. a rudder has NO effect on which way a boat is going
in reserve because of the prop. None. Nada. Zip. Zero. Nothing.

That's a fact of physics, schlackoff. get used to it.

schlackoff postutlates:

Yup, "end plate effect" ...don't mean squat to me.

Subject: Thrust vectoring
From: (JAXAshby)
Date: 03/27/2004 18:23 Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

Jax writes garbage based on what he's read and heard, not on what he knows
from
practical experience ..... HE HAS NONE !!!

Shen

schlackoff, I have understood this simple stuff for more than forty years.
You
don't understand it even to this day.

Let me help you out here. a rudder has NO effect on which way a boat is
going
in reserve because of the prop. None. Nada. Zip. Zero. Nothing.

That's a fact of physics, schlackoff. get used to it.


Jaxoff, get used to it.... it's one thing to be able to quote a bunch of stuff
you read in a book and say you know what it means. It's another thing, entirely
to be able to apply that information to practical use.
It it more evident with every post you make, that you can quote crap you've
read, all day, but don't have a clue as to what it means or how to use it in a
practical sense.

I've had my fun with you on another one of your stupid attempts at showing us
what you know, and as per usual, you've failed miserably .....see ya.....

Shen

Aww now, come on Shen. Why not ask the dummy to ride with you for a
week for some real world experience .... just be sure he signs the
release form ... dipsquat will probably fall on his ass, the first time
he goes through a watertight door.

Shen44 wrote:
Subject: Thrust vectoring
From: (JAXAshby)
Date: 03/27/2004 18:23 Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

Jax writes garbage based on what he's read and heard, not on what he knows
from
practical experience ..... HE HAS NONE !!!

Shen

schlackoff, I have understood this simple stuff for more than forty years.
You
don't understand it even to this day.

Let me help you out here. a rudder has NO effect on which way a boat is
going
in reserve because of the prop. None. Nada. Zip. Zero. Nothing.

That's a fact of physics, schlackoff. get used to it.



Jaxoff, get used to it.... it's one thing to be able to quote a bunch of stuff
you read in a book and say you know what it means. It's another thing, entirely
to be able to apply that information to practical use.
It it more evident with every post you make, that you can quote crap you've
read, all day, but don't have a clue as to what it means or how to use it in a
practical sense.

I've had my fun with you on another one of your stupid attempts at showing us
what you know, and as per usual, you've failed miserably .....see ya.....

Shen

Let me help you out here. a rudder has NO effect on which way a boat is
going
in reserve because of the prop. None. Nada. Zip. Zero. Nothing.

That's a fact of physics, schlackoff. get used to it.

Your premise is wrong.

As the vessel goes in reverse, water presses against the face of the rudder if
it is turned to port or starboard. The greater the speed, the more the water
force on the rudder. At sufficient speed, the force of the water against the
rudder overcomes the prop walk and the boat will follow the rudder, not the
prop.

When speed is reduced, the vessel will reach a point where the prop walk force
is greater than the rudder force and the rudder will not be useful to steering.

It could be argued that at sternway at all, there is some effect from the
rudder. It may not be enough to overcome the prop walk at the slowest speeds,
but in principle the prop walk is finitely reduced
with even the slightest pressure against an opposing rudder.

The water hitting the rudder is not being pulled over the rudder by the prop,
any more than the bow wake is created by water being pulled against the bow
when going forward. I think everybody agrees on that. But to say a rudder as NO
effect on a boat going in reverse because of prop walk is not correct. The
rudder exerts increasing influence as speed increases.

This may not be true for boats with itsy bitsy rudders, btw. It might not be
possible to get enough water pressure on an 8 1/2 X 11" rudder to offset prop
walk. :-)

go ahead, schlackoff. try to back up a boat using the prop and rudder. do it
around expensive boats, and cops too if you can. Have a beer or two first,
'cuz it is so easy.

schlackoff, yesterday you flip-flopped rather nicely. today, you are back to
saying what you originally said. i.e. that you are a dummy.

Jax writes garbage based on what he's read and heard, not on what he knows
from
practical experience ..... HE HAS NONE !!!

Shen

schlackoff, I have understood this simple stuff for more than forty years.
You
don't understand it even to this day.

Let me help you out here. a rudder has NO effect on which way a boat is
going
in reserve because of the prop. None. Nada. Zip. Zero. Nothing.

That's a fact of physics, schlackoff. get used to it.


Jaxoff, get used to it.... it's one thing to be able to quote a bunch of
stuff
you read in a book and say you know what it means. It's another thing,
entirely
to be able to apply that information to practical use.
It it more evident with every post you make, that you can quote crap you've
read, all day, but don't have a clue as to what it means or how to use it in
a
practical sense.

I've had my fun with you on another one of your stupid attempts at showing us
what you know, and as per usual, you've failed miserably .....see ya.....

Shen