If you have not seen this, it's a eye opener for some.

http://www.shiftingbaselines.org/sli...istine_hi.html

Joe

"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com...
If you have not seen this, it's a eye opener for some.

http://www.shiftingbaselines.org/sli...istine_hi.html

Joe


It's all those recreational boaters destroying the world.

Boaters don't pay enough in taxes.

Joe wrote:
If you have not seen this, it's a eye opener for some.

http://www.shiftingbaselines.org/sli...istine_hi.html

Joe


Pure Al Gore type BS.
Gordon

"Gordon" wrote in message
...
Joe wrote:
If you have not seen this, it's a eye opener for some.

http://www.shiftingbaselines.org/sli...istine_hi.html

Joe


Pure Al Gore type BS.
Gordon

The little presentation defeats its own argument. How? It uses today as a
baseline of how different things were in past years than they are today. It
assumes that today's baseline is abnormal and yesterday's is normal.
Further, it selects images from today vs. images of yesterday selected
specifically to show great differences. Photos of large game fish vs. photos
of smaller fish. Sparse reefs vs. teaming reefs. Were there no pictures of
people holding up smaller fish in years past? No pictures of sparse reefs?
Certainly there were so why didn't they select those photos? It's because
those photos would not further their agenda. It's all about agenda and any
intelligent person should realize that. Pictures lie!

Things change. That's the only true baseline. This is also where human
caused global warming can be shown to be such a sham. It assumes today's
baseline is abnormal because it differs from some pre-selected past
baseline. Duh!

Wilbur Hubbard

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:
"Gordon" wrote in message
...
Joe wrote:
If you have not seen this, it's a eye opener for some.

http://www.shiftingbaselines.org/sli...istine_hi.html

Joe

Pure Al Gore type BS.
Gordon

The little presentation defeats its own argument. How? It uses today as a
baseline of how different things were in past years than they are today. It
assumes that today's baseline is abnormal and yesterday's is normal.
Further, it selects images from today vs. images of yesterday selected
specifically to show great differences. Photos of large game fish vs. photos
of smaller fish. Sparse reefs vs. teaming reefs. Were there no pictures of
people holding up smaller fish in years past? No pictures of sparse reefs?
Certainly there were so why didn't they select those photos? It's because
those photos would not further their agenda. It's all about agenda and any
intelligent person should realize that. Pictures lie!

Hey Neal, get out of that trailer and take a road trip. Journey to
Newfoundland, (you'll have to get on ferry, you'll get more sea time in
one day than you've accumulated in the last twenty years). Stop at few
of the villages on the Atlantic as you drive around the island. While
you're there, ask the folks why there are so few fishing boats about and
why what few are there are tied up in the local harbour. Ask them to
tell you how much cod was available in the Grand Banks during the '30s.

Oh, and don't be as obnoxious there as you are on this group; while the
Newfies are just about the friendliest bunch of folks you're likely to
find on the planet, they don't like bull**** and they don't mind
clocking someone who desperately deserves it.


Cheers
Marty

On Nov 12, 5:25 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Gordon" wrote in message

...

Joe wrote:
If you have not seen this, it's a eye opener for some.

http://www.shiftingbaselines.org/sli...istine_hi.html

Joe

Pure Al Gore type BS.
Gordon

The little presentation defeats its own argument. How? It uses today as a
baseline of how different things were in past years than they are today. It
assumes that today's baseline is abnormal and yesterday's is normal.
Further, it selects images from today vs. images of yesterday selected
specifically to show great differences. Photos of large game fish vs. photos
of smaller fish. Sparse reefs vs. teaming reefs. Were there no pictures of
people holding up smaller fish in years past? No pictures of sparse reefs?
Certainly there were so why didn't they select those photos? It's because
those photos would not further their agenda. It's all about agenda and any
intelligent person should realize that. Pictures lie!

Things change. That's the only true baseline. This is also where human
caused global warming can be shown to be such a sham. It assumes today's
baseline is abnormal because it differs from some pre-selected past
baseline. Duh!

Wilbur Hubbard

Jimminy Crickets Wilbur! I'vs seen in my own lifetime a great
reduction of game and fish due to humans taking them all. Here Stone
Crabs for example, use to see them all the time even as late as the
80's ...now you do not see any here. Same with big Groupers and large
game fish. And my neighbor who lived on Galveston bay way back in 1900
(RIP) use to tell me how Galveston Bay was crystal clear and you could
pick up oysters as big as your hand all day long.

I agree that the only thing that stays the same is change, but we
should focus on change for the better. Or do you just feel you are
here for the ride, and should just go with the flow and consider
exhausting instead of conserving resources as a natural process?

Joe

"Joe" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Nov 12, 5:25 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Gordon" wrote in message

...

Joe wrote:
If you have not seen this, it's a eye opener for some.

http://www.shiftingbaselines.org/sli...istine_hi.html

Joe

Pure Al Gore type BS.
Gordon

The little presentation defeats its own argument. How? It uses today as a
baseline of how different things were in past years than they are today.
It
assumes that today's baseline is abnormal and yesterday's is normal.
Further, it selects images from today vs. images of yesterday selected
specifically to show great differences. Photos of large game fish vs.
photos
of smaller fish. Sparse reefs vs. teaming reefs. Were there no pictures
of
people holding up smaller fish in years past? No pictures of sparse
reefs?
Certainly there were so why didn't they select those photos? It's because
those photos would not further their agenda. It's all about agenda and
any
intelligent person should realize that. Pictures lie!

Things change. That's the only true baseline. This is also where human
caused global warming can be shown to be such a sham. It assumes today's
baseline is abnormal because it differs from some pre-selected past
baseline. Duh!

Wilbur Hubbard

Jimminy Crickets Wilbur! I'vs seen in my own lifetime a great
reduction of game and fish due to humans taking them all. Here Stone
Crabs for example, use to see them all the time even as late as the
80's ...now you do not see any here. Same with big Groupers and large
game fish. And my neighbor who lived on Galveston bay way back in 1900
(RIP) use to tell me how Galveston Bay was crystal clear and you could
pick up oysters as big as your hand all day long.

I agree that the only thing that stays the same is change, but we
should focus on change for the better. Or do you just feel you are
here for the ride, and should just go with the flow and consider
exhausting instead of conserving resources as a natural process?

Joe


Don't forget the dinosuars too! Fred Flinstone and Barney went out and
clubbed them all to death. That's why there are none left.

Joe wrote:

I agree that the only thing that stays the same is change, but we
should focus on change for the better. Or do you just feel you are
here for the ride, and should just go with the flow and consider
exhausting instead of conserving resources as a natural process?

Sounds like Neal to me, "I'm alright Jack, and **** you." A
particularly easy attitude to adopt when one has no children.

Cheers
Marty

"Joe" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Nov 12, 5:25 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"

I agree that the only thing that stays the same is change, but we
should focus on change for the better. Or do you just feel you are
here for the ride, and should just go with the flow and consider
exhausting instead of conserving resources as a natural process?

Joe

Change from when? The whole of evolution has been about competition between
species to survive as the available resources change. We had a carbon
dioxide atmosphere once - but that was consumed by tiny sea living creatures
whose skeletons now form enormous mountain ranges. Later, it was consumed by
plants which formed beds of coal; their waste prodcut was oxygen. That
permitted fish to evolve, consuming oxygen waste.

So, we're going back to an earlier baseline - returning some of that carbon
dioxide to the atmosphere. As the video says, choose your baseline.

I'll agree that change is the permanency (if that makes sense). If that's
the case, it's better to adapt to change, rather than try to prevent it. Is
that what you'd call 'going with the flow'? It's certainly going against the
current popular flow of 'resistance to change'.

And while I'm at it, I don't like his emotive choice of cockroaches and rats
as sole survivors. Nor his emotive use of dolphin pictures (BIG fish eaters)
to illustrate diminishing numbers of fishes. He didn't intend it that way of
course, he was just trying to capture our hearts with pictures of species we
love - even if they're consuming available resources . . .

Lets consider more 'adapting to change', rather than trying to prevent it .
.. .

--
JimB
Google 'jimb sail' or go www.jimbaerselman.f2s.com
Compares Cruise areas of Europe

While
you're there, ask the folks why there are so few fishing boats about and
why what few are there are tied up in the local harbour.

Because they overfished the waters. TANSTAAFL and now they're paying the
price.