dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 22:08:57 -0500, "Leanne" wrote:

Wait until one of these clowns rolls you beam ends and see happy you are.
They know what they are doing when they will not even turn around on the
bridge while I was sounding shorts blasts of the air horns.

Some people roll me, and some get rolled by me. It's part of boating
and being on the water. I am constantly amazed at the hue and cry
raised by large seaworthy sailboats when they encounter a wake. It is
not written in stone anywhere that the water will always be flat.

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

No, seriosly, I think you are misunderestimating the distances and
thus complaining about non-issues.

Here is the test:

If another boater cuts you off close enough to fling some old fish
heads on his bridge, you have the right to do so. Just do it. Fish
heads, anything biodegradable, in case you miss. You will soon see if
they really are that close, it is hard to aim fish heads well over
more than 50 feet, I would guess. Ask me how I know.

Also, if you really were going just half a knot, the kayaker could
have moved out of your way easily. They are capable of accelerating to
about five knots in not time. And trust me, he would have, if you had
been really close. He just didn't think you were too close.

Btw., having no engine does not put you in 'unable to maneuver '
status. It just makes you a sailboat, col-reg-wise, doesn't it?

So, what had happened with the engine? We are all curious to hear.

Captain Jack Sparrow




On Nov 6, 11:44 am, "Capt. JG" wrote:
Taught a class this last weekend through one of the local schools. Saturday,
wind was light, so we practiced a lot of motoring skills aboard a newer
Hunter 32. Typically, the second day is devoted to sailing skills, such as
COBs and the usual tacking/jibing/points of sail, etc.

The wind picked up a bit in mid-afternoon, and we got some good COB
practice. Ate lunch under sail, and since anchoring knowledge is part of the
class, I decided to get us over to the Cone Rock area for a bit of practice.
Sailing there, a big cabin cruiser came up on us from the starboard stern...
must have been going 10+ kts, with a huge wake.

At first I thought he was going to cut us off to the point of us having to
take evasive action, but he weaved around enough to clear our side and bow.
The whole time we're waving and gesturing to slow down, since it was going
to be close and the wake was going to be huge. He kept right on going, and
as he got abeam, had the middle finger flying. What a jerk. Fortunately, we
were all holding on at this point, so no one was hurt or thrown off the
boat, which could easily have been the case.

Ok, so we proceeded to sail, then got to a good spot to turn on the engine
and drop the sails. Did this, motored about 200 meters, when the cooling
water hi temp alarm came on. I was able to kill the engine within 20 seconds
or so. A couple of the students were still up by the mast, so the main came
back up without a hitch. As soon as they scrambled back to the cockpit, I
popped the furling line for the jib, it came out, and we got moving again.

We did a visual inspection of the engine... double checked that the raw
water intake was open, oil level, fresh water level, feel for excessive
heat, sniff test for something burning, belts are on and not slipping. I had
someone turn the engine back on and I put my hand over the raw water exhaust
(it's under the transom, and you can be fooled by air bubbling vs. water
exiting). Water was definitely coming out, the water was luke warm at most,
but the alarm was on. Also, I noticed oil on the absorbant pad underneath
the engine... not a lot, but there was none in the morning... something
happened. Well, we were sailing, so it didn't matter right now, and I shut
down the engine after about a minute. Even though the water was only warm at
most, I was starting to see steam coming out of the exhaust. I started
thinking it might be a blown head gasket, one reason was it seemed overly
rough at low idle.

Since we were headed back to base anyway at this point, I figured I'd give
them a ring (cell phone had great reception) and let the base manager know
what was up and ask if he had any suggestions. He had none beyond what I'd
already done, so I told him we'd be back in about an hour at most, and I
would call him again if I thought we couldn't make it back to either the
slip or an end tie near the base. I think he appreciated me not hailing them
on the VHF... dirty laundry in public and all that.

So, we're sailing down the Sausalito channel. Toward the end of the channel,
where we need to go, it gets rather narrow, and it's quite easy to run
aground if you get outside the markers. As we get to a particularly narrow
spot (still under sail, which was good practice for the students), three
kayakers come out of a marina and are slowly paddling ahead of us on our
port side just outside the channel. I can see that they're totally unaware
of us and edging closer and closer to the channel, obviously going to head
across it.

When I got within earshot, I called over to them, saying, please stay out of
the channel... we're having engine trouble and can't maneauver. One asked me
where he should be, and I said, anywhere except in front of me is fine.
Another one stopped paddling, waiting for us to go by. The third guy kept
going! Slowly! Unbelievable. So, I said, Sir, if you keep going, we're going
to run you over. Please get out of the channel. He said ok, but kept going!
So, I turned on the engine again, figuring I could use it for 30 seconds
without damage, since it had been off for over 30 minutes. We got around
him, barely. I thanked him for getting out of our way, and I think he
thought I was serious. Jeez... Then, I turned off the engine.

Well, the final leg was sailing down the fairway, very light wind at this
point... under 2kts, but we made a beautiful docking, and all ended well.

--
"j" ganz

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

On Nov 6, 3:21 pm, "Capt. JG" wrote:
... I don't think that many rights are available if you cut off another boat,
which was what was about to happen, which in fact did happen in a limited
way. In the small amount of time at this point in the channel, there was no
opportunity to display day shapes....

Probably not, and I didn't mean to criticize your actions. It sounds
to me like you managed to get through a difficult situation with no
people injured and no property harmed. Everything else is details. I
was just making some points about the COLREGS.

-- Tom.

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 22:08:57 -0500, "Leanne" wrote:

Wait until one of these clowns rolls you beam ends and see happy you are.
They know what they are doing when they will not even turn around on the
bridge while I was sounding shorts blasts of the air horns.

Some people roll me, and some get rolled by me. It's part of boating
and being on the water. I am constantly amazed at the hue and cry
raised by large seaworthy sailboats when they encounter a wake. It is
not written in stone anywhere that the water will always be flat.


You're certainly correct, and most of the time a simple wake from a boat is
no big deal. However, boaters are responsible for their wakes, so if they
cause damage or injury, they would be responsible for it (even if they don't
know that).

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

wrote in message
oups.com...

No, seriosly, I think you are misunderestimating the distances and
thus complaining about non-issues.

No seriously, I didn't. I have a fair amount of experience in the North Bay
of SF especially, and wakes are not a big deal.


Here is the test:

If another boater cuts you off close enough to fling some old fish
heads on his bridge, you have the right to do so. Just do it. Fish
heads, anything biodegradable, in case you miss. You will soon see if
they really are that close, it is hard to aim fish heads well over
more than 50 feet, I would guess. Ask me how I know.

Gross. No thanks.

Also, if you really were going just half a knot, the kayaker could
have moved out of your way easily. They are capable of accelerating to
about five knots in not time. And trust me, he would have, if you had
been really close. He just didn't think you were too close.

You're right in that he didn't think, but we were too close. As I said
previously, it was my impression after thinking about it that he couldn't
control his kayak. I think he was a total novice.

Btw., having no engine does not put you in 'unable to maneuver '
status. It just makes you a sailboat, col-reg-wise, doesn't it?

I did have an engine, and I told him that we were having engine trouble. So,
I'm not sure what you're asking.

So, what had happened with the engine? We are all curious to hear.

I'm waiting to hear...

Captain Jack Sparrow

Right.


On Nov 6, 11:44 am, "Capt. JG" wrote:
Taught a class this last weekend through one of the local schools.
Saturday,
wind was light, so we practiced a lot of motoring skills aboard a newer
Hunter 32. Typically, the second day is devoted to sailing skills, such
as
COBs and the usual tacking/jibing/points of sail, etc.

The wind picked up a bit in mid-afternoon, and we got some good COB
practice. Ate lunch under sail, and since anchoring knowledge is part of
the
class, I decided to get us over to the Cone Rock area for a bit of
practice.
Sailing there, a big cabin cruiser came up on us from the starboard
stern...
must have been going 10+ kts, with a huge wake.

At first I thought he was going to cut us off to the point of us having
to
take evasive action, but he weaved around enough to clear our side and
bow.
The whole time we're waving and gesturing to slow down, since it was
going
to be close and the wake was going to be huge. He kept right on going,
and
as he got abeam, had the middle finger flying. What a jerk. Fortunately,
we
were all holding on at this point, so no one was hurt or thrown off the
boat, which could easily have been the case.

Ok, so we proceeded to sail, then got to a good spot to turn on the
engine
and drop the sails. Did this, motored about 200 meters, when the cooling
water hi temp alarm came on. I was able to kill the engine within 20
seconds
or so. A couple of the students were still up by the mast, so the main
came
back up without a hitch. As soon as they scrambled back to the cockpit, I
popped the furling line for the jib, it came out, and we got moving
again.

We did a visual inspection of the engine... double checked that the raw
water intake was open, oil level, fresh water level, feel for excessive
heat, sniff test for something burning, belts are on and not slipping. I
had
someone turn the engine back on and I put my hand over the raw water
exhaust
(it's under the transom, and you can be fooled by air bubbling vs. water
exiting). Water was definitely coming out, the water was luke warm at
most,
but the alarm was on. Also, I noticed oil on the absorbant pad underneath
the engine... not a lot, but there was none in the morning... something
happened. Well, we were sailing, so it didn't matter right now, and I
shut
down the engine after about a minute. Even though the water was only warm
at
most, I was starting to see steam coming out of the exhaust. I started
thinking it might be a blown head gasket, one reason was it seemed overly
rough at low idle.

Since we were headed back to base anyway at this point, I figured I'd
give
them a ring (cell phone had great reception) and let the base manager
know
what was up and ask if he had any suggestions. He had none beyond what
I'd
already done, so I told him we'd be back in about an hour at most, and I
would call him again if I thought we couldn't make it back to either the
slip or an end tie near the base. I think he appreciated me not hailing
them
on the VHF... dirty laundry in public and all that.

So, we're sailing down the Sausalito channel. Toward the end of the
channel,
where we need to go, it gets rather narrow, and it's quite easy to run
aground if you get outside the markers. As we get to a particularly
narrow
spot (still under sail, which was good practice for the students), three
kayakers come out of a marina and are slowly paddling ahead of us on our
port side just outside the channel. I can see that they're totally
unaware
of us and edging closer and closer to the channel, obviously going to
head
across it.

When I got within earshot, I called over to them, saying, please stay out
of
the channel... we're having engine trouble and can't maneauver. One asked
me
where he should be, and I said, anywhere except in front of me is fine.
Another one stopped paddling, waiting for us to go by. The third guy kept
going! Slowly! Unbelievable. So, I said, Sir, if you keep going, we're
going
to run you over. Please get out of the channel. He said ok, but kept
going!
So, I turned on the engine again, figuring I could use it for 30 seconds
without damage, since it had been off for over 30 minutes. We got around
him, barely. I thanked him for getting out of our way, and I think he
thought I was serious. Jeez... Then, I turned off the engine.

Well, the final leg was sailing down the fairway, very light wind at this
point... under 2kts, but we made a beautiful docking, and all ended well.

--
"j" ganz





--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

wrote in message
oups.com...
On Nov 6, 3:21 pm, "Capt. JG" wrote:
... I don't think that many rights are available if you cut off another
boat,
which was what was about to happen, which in fact did happen in a limited
way. In the small amount of time at this point in the channel, there was
no
opportunity to display day shapes....

Probably not, and I didn't mean to criticize your actions. It sounds
to me like you managed to get through a difficult situation with no
people injured and no property harmed. Everything else is details. I
was just making some points about the COLREGS.

-- Tom.



Certainly... I didn't think that at all. (And, you're welcome to
criticize... heh) I think your comments were fine. I'm just glad this
happened during the day. This particular spot can be nightmarish at night.
I've followed the red right returning only to discover the red light turned
green... stupid traffic light.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 17:08:06 -0800, "Capt. JG"
wrote this crap:


Capt JG was in a 32 ft, seaworthy, ocean going sailboat, in open


Who said it was seaworthy? :-) Certainly it isn't ocean capable.


Are you nuts? A 32 ft. Hunter is certainly ocean capable.

I used to take my 25 ft. Hunter out in storm warnings, where you would
**** your pants. I was once out in 60 mph winds. The boat loved it,
even if the crew didn't.




I'm Horvath and I approve of this post.

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 19:32:37 -0800, "Capt. JG"
wrote this crap:


You claimed to be inoperable yet managed to start the engine?

Never claimed that. I said engine trouble.

Didn't you claim you had steam coming from the exhaust?

(You shoulda hit it with your purse.)




I'm Horvath and I approve of this post.

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

On Nov 6, 11:56 am, "Roger Long" wrote:
"Robert Musgine" wrote

He should have run up the day shapes.

No, the boat was under 12 meters.

--
Roger Long

No, if he were "restricted in his ability to maneuver" he'd need the
shapes. However, it seems unlikely that he'd qualify under the
meaning of the rule.

-- Tom.

dead engines, kayaks, and powerboaters
 

On Nov 6, 4:56 pm, "Robert Musgine" wrote:
... http://www.auxetrain.org/navhelp.html

"Man-powered boats (e.g. canoes, rowboats, etc.) have the right of way over
sailboats, powerboats, and seaplanes.."

The kayakers had the right of way.

This _may_ be the case in _some_ state's water's but it is not for
federal or international waters. COLREGS has no mention of "man-
powered-boats". See Rule 3.

-- Tom.