BoatBanter.com - Need direction - sailing/boat handling instruction

BoatBanter.com (https://www.boatbanter.com/)

- Cruising (https://www.boatbanter.com/cruising/)

- - Need direction - sailing/boat handling instruction (https://www.boatbanter.com/cruising/84566-need-direction-sailing-boat-handling-instruction.html)

Need direction - sailing/boat handling instruction

"Brian Whatcott" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 09:59:30 -0700, "Capt. JG"
wrote:

.... I don't want to be in the business of putting down your husband, but
he certainly has no business doing what you say he did. If he's as
experienced as you claim, then he should know better.
...
Jonathan

This may be a key point: the 'experienced' folks who are full of
bluster may possibly have an exaggerated view of their
competence. In training horses, I know that patience trumps
almost any other virtue. It may possibly be similar with instructors?

:-)

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

For sure... those who yell or bully usually don't know as much as they claim
to know.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Need direction - sailing/boat handling instruction

I'm "Tom" and I'm a recovering yeller. I've been soft spoken for 2
decades, six weeks, 3 days, two hours and... Or something like that.
Anyway, speaking from experience I can attest that getting your
husband to stop shouting will make everyone including him much, much
happier. I don't know what will work for him but I remember what
worked for me. I moved from the mainland where I had been involved in
some serious small boat racing to Hawaii where the racing and crewing
were very much more casual than I was used to and I became very
frustrated and started yelling at folks without even realizing it. A
couple of weeks into the season one of the long term crew took me
aside and said "listen, I know you're a good sailor and I'm not but I
get yelled at at work and I will not come out sailing if you're going
to yell at me, too." I was appalled at my behavior which I really had
been incompletely aware of (I thought I was just giving instructions)
and I truly have been soft spoken since then. Perhaps your husband
isn't aware of just how offensive his behavior is. I'd suggest being
very direct about telling him.

Leaning to sail is a long term project. A sailing school can give you
a nice start on it, but unless you have an unusual aptitude for
sailing it will be years before you are competent and it takes a
lifetime to get good. Nevertheless, it is easy for learning sailors
and more experienced sailors to have a good time together while out
sailing. I've sailed very extensively around the Pacific with my girl
friend who was a total non-sailor when we stated and is still working
the left side of the leaning curve. She is a fantastic partner and
knows how to stand watch. I don't ask for anything more. I often
take non-sailors out sailing (I just took a couple out this afternoon,
in fact) and since they keep on asking to come back I'm guessing they
enjoy it. The trick is that the person in charge has to be able to
work the boat himself and then allow or perhaps encourage his guests
to do the jobs they are competent to do. Requests made to the guests
are just that. They should be made in a speaking voice and followed
by a question mark. eg. "would you like to hold the tiller while I
set the mainsail?" A "no" shouldn't phase the skipper. Or at least
that's how it works on my boats and I've enjoyed the results.

-- Tom.

Need direction - sailing/boat handling instruction

On 2007-08-01 13:19:23 -0400, "Roger Long" said:

By all means, go out and learn everything you can and become a completely
competent sailor. Have your daughters do it with you. Just keep it in your
mind that you are doing it for yourselves as one of the most worthwhile and
bonding things you could do with the girls and that it has NOTHING to do
with changing your husband's behavior. Then go out and go sailing without
him.

That is great advice. I suspect you and your daughters will have a far
better time sailing without your spouse than with him!

Ruby

Need direction - sailing/boat handling instruction

Wanted to restate bits of Rogers Long's advice, to highlight my belief
he nailed this one right on the head.

=======
PART 1
=======

On Aug 1, 1:19 pm, "Roger Long" wrote:
This is a 26 foot boat. Your husband should be able to get it in and out of
the slip and do everything required to take it anywhere it has any business
going with no one else on board. I do it all the time on my 32 footer and
others do it with larger boats. Generally, when "captains" are yelling, it
is because they don't feel in control. I'm quite sure your husband doesn't
feel nearly as competent as you describe him. Even if he does, then the
boat has become a venue where he feels it is legitimate for him to berate
and belittle you and your daughters. The fact that he is taking such great
advantage of that illusion is something that smoother line handling is not
going to fix.

Your husband should go
out and sail alone, a lot, until he is so smooth and comfortable handling
the boat without help that he can integrate teaching you into the process.

Absolutely Roger !!! - The whole problem here is with him, and Sailing
alone is
just the right medicine. If he feels he cannot, get him the instructor
first, not you!!

Perhaps you can talk him into custom instruction for the skill of
"single handing"
the boat. If he thinks of this as a "new" skill he dosn't have,
perhaps the thought
that his experience somehow exempts him from the need for a teacher
won't occur.
Once he can confidently sail this boat alone, he can as roger wrote,
"integrate
you and your daughters into the process"

For me, it only took a single 4 hour on the water lesson from an
instructor to learn how
to singlehand a 23 foot Sonar that had all the necessary cleats in
place to sail the
boat that way.

There are some single handed sailing web sites that also give useful
advise on how
to sail alone too.

=======
PART 2
=======

A week long intensive course should make you and your daughters sufficiently
competent to cruise in this boat if you exercise good judgement and respect
the limitations of your experience. You would, at least, be more competent
than 85% of the other people out there in 26 foot sailboats.

I would add to this, once you take the class, without delay get you
and your daughters into a situation where you are
taking the boat out yourselves once a week, and even better, get into
an informal racing group. An informal racing group
, beer can racing we call it, are welcoming to new crew all the time,
most can laugh at mistakes rather then feel put
crew in the position of feeling they lost a critical race, and really
helps cement the class instruction to the inside of your scull.
You might also end up with different captain each week, or take turns
being the captain yourself.

The big benefit of racing, and the purpose it gives to good rather
then just ok sail handling, is that you will find yourself
anticipating what has to happen next before it does. Once your at that
level, you will find it more enjoyable to
be with your husband. Imagine if you know what he might ask you to do
next, and what around you might
prevent you from doing it correct that you should fix ahead of time,
becomes much easier to be a crew member.
My best crew members figure out what I forgot to ask them to do, and
either drop suggestions or just mention that they are doing
it. As a captain ... it's much more fun when your crew is covering
for your ommisions of commands. It feels less like your giving
commands and more like your all working together to get the boat
moving.

Best Wishes for succesful Family Sailing !

Need direction - sailing/boat handling instruction

On 2007-08-01 21:33:40 -0400, Brian Whatcott said:

On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 09:59:30 -0700, "Capt. JG"
wrote:

.... I don't want to be in the business of putting down your husband,
but he certainly has no business doing what you say he did. If he's as
experienced as you claim, then he should know better.
...
Jonathan

This may be a key point: the 'experienced' folks who are full of
bluster may possibly have an exaggerated view of their competence.

I agree with this and the one I can't find now about he should be able
to comfortably single-hand the boat if he's competent. We essentially
single-hand Xan (below) most of time, the off-helm person is on
stand-by in case things go south.

Thought: Why not have "Girls" and "Guys" days?

Another thought to make docking easier: Tie or splice loops into the
dock lines right where they need to be. The dock crew merely drops the
line on the cleats, no adjusting. One of those lines should be a spring
line from the "inside" outer piling that the helm can drop on a winch.
That keeps the bow off of the dock and by turning the tiller or
outboard in slow forward gear, the bow can be swung from side to side
to ease the dock crew's job. When that one line is on, the boat's
safely in the slip.

--
Jere Lull
Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's new pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI pages: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/