Larry,
I am rewiring my boat and have a question on wiring for the HF radio.
Best engineering practices would be to wire to power leads directly to
the battery (about 6-7'). I want to wire it to the DC distribution panel
with a CB (also about 6-7' from the radio) so that both battery banks
could be used. If I use ferrite on each end of the wire, would this be
sufficient to prevent RFI being radiated at the panel? Do they make
ferrite's for 6AWG wire?

Kelton
s/v Isle Escape

The RFI in the boat is caused not by RF backing up the HF DC leads,
which are VERY filtered inside the radio, but by the wiring in the
boat acting like an antenna in the RF field of the HF transmitting
antenna, itself. There's always been lots of RF from your HF radio in
the wiring. If it's not causing any problem, don't worry about it.

Seeing as how you are rewiring, let me suggest what I did aboard
Lionheart that everyone has enjoyed so much......a master relay.......

Lionheart has a #2 primary coming from the master switch through a 60A
fuse block to a continuous duty power relay, rated at 100A. It looks
like a car starter solenoid used in a Ford but has a continuous duty
coil so you can leave it on, not just bump it intermittently. I found
a nice marine push-pull power switch in a bargain bin and use that to
ground the low side of the coil (it has two terminals) to energize the
relay. The relay energizes a power panel all the electronics in the
boat is connected to. It also energizes a red LED next to the switch
so you can look up on your way ashore to see that the electronics is
on or off. Dock the boat, push in the switch, and every piece of
electronics except the stereo we might want to run while docked is
shut down all at once. No more going off forgetting you left the
breaker to the sonar on. Some equipment refuses to come on
automatically when you power up its DC lead, so you have to turn them
on separately, but pull that knob and the whole extensive electronics
suite comes alive with ONE BUTTON.

Think about it...(c; My forgetful captain loves it. He no longer has
to figure out which switches to leave on and which to turn off while
his guests are pressing him to get the bar in operation....(c;



On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:55:46 -0500, Kelton Joyner
wrote:

Larry,
I am rewiring my boat and have a question on wiring for the HF radio.
Best engineering practices would be to wire to power leads directly to
the battery (about 6-7'). I want to wire it to the DC distribution panel
with a CB (also about 6-7' from the radio) so that both battery banks
could be used. If I use ferrite on each end of the wire, would this be
sufficient to prevent RFI being radiated at the panel? Do they make
ferrite's for 6AWG wire?

Kelton
s/v Isle Escape



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

The RFI in the boat is caused not by RF backing up the HF DC leads,
which are VERY filtered inside the radio, but by the wiring in the
boat acting like an antenna in the RF field of the HF transmitting
antenna, itself. There's always been lots of RF from your HF radio in
the wiring. If it's not causing any problem, don't worry about it.

Seeing as how you are rewiring, let me suggest what I did aboard
Lionheart that everyone has enjoyed so much......a master relay.......

Lionheart has a #2 primary coming from the master switch through a 60A
fuse block to a continuous duty power relay, rated at 100A. It looks
like a car starter solenoid used in a Ford but has a continuous duty
coil so you can leave it on, not just bump it intermittently. I found
a nice marine push-pull power switch in a bargain bin and use that to
ground the low side of the coil (it has two terminals) to energize the
relay. The relay energizes a power panel all the electronics in the
boat is connected to. It also energizes a red LED next to the switch
so you can look up on your way ashore to see that the electronics is
on or off. Dock the boat, push in the switch, and every piece of
electronics except the stereo we might want to run while docked is
shut down all at once. No more going off forgetting you left the
breaker to the sonar on. Some equipment refuses to come on
automatically when you power up its DC lead, so you have to turn them
on separately, but pull that knob and the whole extensive electronics
suite comes alive with ONE BUTTON.

Think about it...(c; My forgetful captain loves it. He no longer has
to figure out which switches to leave on and which to turn off while
his guests are pressing him to get the bar in operation....(c;



On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:55:46 -0500, Kelton Joyner
wrote:

Larry,
I am rewiring my boat and have a question on wiring for the HF radio.
Best engineering practices would be to wire to power leads directly to
the battery (about 6-7'). I want to wire it to the DC distribution panel
with a CB (also about 6-7' from the radio) so that both battery banks
could be used. If I use ferrite on each end of the wire, would this be
sufficient to prevent RFI being radiated at the panel? Do they make
ferrite's for 6AWG wire?

Kelton
s/v Isle Escape



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

H'mm. Convenient, but it violates KISS. Where (electrically) do you put
the radios -- you may use both VHF and SSB while not at sea? What does the
relay coil draw -- 5 or 10 watts?

On Swee****er, all the "at sea" equipment was in one column on the panel,
next to the nav station. Convenient. Simple.

On Fintry we'll probably have color codes on the switches and maybe a master
"at sea" breaker (breakers are cheap). All the electronics will be on a DC
subpanel in the wheelhouse. Simple.


--
Jim Woodward
www.mvFintry.com


..
"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
...
The RFI in the boat is caused not by RF backing up the HF DC leads,
which are VERY filtered inside the radio, but by the wiring in the
boat acting like an antenna in the RF field of the HF transmitting
antenna, itself. There's always been lots of RF from your HF radio in
the wiring. If it's not causing any problem, don't worry about it.

Seeing as how you are rewiring, let me suggest what I did aboard
Lionheart that everyone has enjoyed so much......a master relay.......

Lionheart has a #2 primary coming from the master switch through a 60A
fuse block to a continuous duty power relay, rated at 100A. It looks
like a car starter solenoid used in a Ford but has a continuous duty
coil so you can leave it on, not just bump it intermittently. I found
a nice marine push-pull power switch in a bargain bin and use that to
ground the low side of the coil (it has two terminals) to energize the
relay. The relay energizes a power panel all the electronics in the
boat is connected to. It also energizes a red LED next to the switch
so you can look up on your way ashore to see that the electronics is
on or off. Dock the boat, push in the switch, and every piece of
electronics except the stereo we might want to run while docked is
shut down all at once. No more going off forgetting you left the
breaker to the sonar on. Some equipment refuses to come on
automatically when you power up its DC lead, so you have to turn them
on separately, but pull that knob and the whole extensive electronics
suite comes alive with ONE BUTTON.

Think about it...(c; My forgetful captain loves it. He no longer has
to figure out which switches to leave on and which to turn off while
his guests are pressing him to get the bar in operation....(c;



On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:55:46 -0500, Kelton Joyner
wrote:

Larry,
I am rewiring my boat and have a question on wiring for the HF radio.
Best engineering practices would be to wire to power leads directly to
the battery (about 6-7'). I want to wire it to the DC distribution panel
with a CB (also about 6-7' from the radio) so that both battery banks
could be used. If I use ferrite on each end of the wire, would this be
sufficient to prevent RFI being radiated at the panel? Do they make
ferrite's for 6AWG wire?

Kelton
s/v Isle Escape



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

H'mm. Convenient, but it violates KISS. Where (electrically) do you put
the radios -- you may use both VHF and SSB while not at sea? What does the
relay coil draw -- 5 or 10 watts?

On Swee****er, all the "at sea" equipment was in one column on the panel,
next to the nav station. Convenient. Simple.

On Fintry we'll probably have color codes on the switches and maybe a master
"at sea" breaker (breakers are cheap). All the electronics will be on a DC
subpanel in the wheelhouse. Simple.


--
Jim Woodward
www.mvFintry.com


..
"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
...
The RFI in the boat is caused not by RF backing up the HF DC leads,
which are VERY filtered inside the radio, but by the wiring in the
boat acting like an antenna in the RF field of the HF transmitting
antenna, itself. There's always been lots of RF from your HF radio in
the wiring. If it's not causing any problem, don't worry about it.

Seeing as how you are rewiring, let me suggest what I did aboard
Lionheart that everyone has enjoyed so much......a master relay.......

Lionheart has a #2 primary coming from the master switch through a 60A
fuse block to a continuous duty power relay, rated at 100A. It looks
like a car starter solenoid used in a Ford but has a continuous duty
coil so you can leave it on, not just bump it intermittently. I found
a nice marine push-pull power switch in a bargain bin and use that to
ground the low side of the coil (it has two terminals) to energize the
relay. The relay energizes a power panel all the electronics in the
boat is connected to. It also energizes a red LED next to the switch
so you can look up on your way ashore to see that the electronics is
on or off. Dock the boat, push in the switch, and every piece of
electronics except the stereo we might want to run while docked is
shut down all at once. No more going off forgetting you left the
breaker to the sonar on. Some equipment refuses to come on
automatically when you power up its DC lead, so you have to turn them
on separately, but pull that knob and the whole extensive electronics
suite comes alive with ONE BUTTON.

Think about it...(c; My forgetful captain loves it. He no longer has
to figure out which switches to leave on and which to turn off while
his guests are pressing him to get the bar in operation....(c;



On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:55:46 -0500, Kelton Joyner
wrote:

Larry,
I am rewiring my boat and have a question on wiring for the HF radio.
Best engineering practices would be to wire to power leads directly to
the battery (about 6-7'). I want to wire it to the DC distribution panel
with a CB (also about 6-7' from the radio) so that both battery banks
could be used. If I use ferrite on each end of the wire, would this be
sufficient to prevent RFI being radiated at the panel? Do they make
ferrite's for 6AWG wire?

Kelton
s/v Isle Escape



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 10:18:38 -0500, "Jim Woodward" jameslwoodward at
attbi dot com wrote:

H'mm. Convenient, but it violates KISS. Where (electrically) do you put
the radios -- you may use both VHF and SSB while not at sea? What does the
relay coil draw -- 5 or 10 watts?

Radios run off the switched power panel. Question 2, yes. You're
free to turn off any of the controlled breakers if you just want to
use one piece, say for 20 meter SSB. Relay coil draws about 1/2A.
That draw is nothing compared to the dead batteries of leaving
something on this system simply secures.

On Swee****er, all the "at sea" equipment was in one column on the panel,
next to the nav station. Convenient. Simple.

On Fintry we'll probably have color codes on the switches and maybe a master
"at sea" breaker (breakers are cheap). All the electronics will be on a DC
subpanel in the wheelhouse. Simple.

The relay allowed me to split up the load. There are actually two
small panels tied to the relay by the batteries, one at the nav
station below and the other at the helm. This "remote control" makes
it simpler to wire as the wireways between helm and nav are just
jammed. It also reduces wire length and "amps/feet" by splitting the
load right near the batteries. The nav load goes one way, the helm
load the other. Better "housepower"...



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 10:18:38 -0500, "Jim Woodward" jameslwoodward at
attbi dot com wrote:

H'mm. Convenient, but it violates KISS. Where (electrically) do you put
the radios -- you may use both VHF and SSB while not at sea? What does the
relay coil draw -- 5 or 10 watts?

Radios run off the switched power panel. Question 2, yes. You're
free to turn off any of the controlled breakers if you just want to
use one piece, say for 20 meter SSB. Relay coil draws about 1/2A.
That draw is nothing compared to the dead batteries of leaving
something on this system simply secures.

On Swee****er, all the "at sea" equipment was in one column on the panel,
next to the nav station. Convenient. Simple.

On Fintry we'll probably have color codes on the switches and maybe a master
"at sea" breaker (breakers are cheap). All the electronics will be on a DC
subpanel in the wheelhouse. Simple.

The relay allowed me to split up the load. There are actually two
small panels tied to the relay by the batteries, one at the nav
station below and the other at the helm. This "remote control" makes
it simpler to wire as the wireways between helm and nav are just
jammed. It also reduces wire length and "amps/feet" by splitting the
load right near the batteries. The nav load goes one way, the helm
load the other. Better "housepower"...



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

I took a similar approach. Breakers that are normally left on all the
time have green pilot LEDs. Things that should not be left on all the
time (running lights, heater, radios, etc are amber, and things that
should only be on when actually used (emergency fuel pump, etc)
have red LEDs. Just a glance at the panel gives me the story.

1/2 amp for a relay for convenience only seems like
a waste to me. I'd use a latching relay that only draws current when
actually switching or to keep it simple, I'd just use a switch.

Doug


"Jim Woodward" jameslwoodward at attbi dot com wrote in message
...
H'mm. Convenient, but it violates KISS. Where (electrically) do you put
the radios -- you may use both VHF and SSB while not at sea? What does the
relay coil draw -- 5 or 10 watts?

On Swee****er, all the "at sea" equipment was in one column on the panel,
next to the nav station. Convenient. Simple.

On Fintry we'll probably have color codes on the switches and maybe a
master
"at sea" breaker (breakers are cheap). All the electronics will be on a DC
subpanel in the wheelhouse. Simple.


--
Jim Woodward
www.mvFintry.com


.
"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
...
The RFI in the boat is caused not by RF backing up the HF DC leads,
which are VERY filtered inside the radio, but by the wiring in the
boat acting like an antenna in the RF field of the HF transmitting
antenna, itself. There's always been lots of RF from your HF radio in
the wiring. If it's not causing any problem, don't worry about it.

Seeing as how you are rewiring, let me suggest what I did aboard
Lionheart that everyone has enjoyed so much......a master relay.......

Lionheart has a #2 primary coming from the master switch through a 60A
fuse block to a continuous duty power relay, rated at 100A. It looks
like a car starter solenoid used in a Ford but has a continuous duty
coil so you can leave it on, not just bump it intermittently. I found
a nice marine push-pull power switch in a bargain bin and use that to
ground the low side of the coil (it has two terminals) to energize the
relay. The relay energizes a power panel all the electronics in the
boat is connected to. It also energizes a red LED next to the switch
so you can look up on your way ashore to see that the electronics is
on or off. Dock the boat, push in the switch, and every piece of
electronics except the stereo we might want to run while docked is
shut down all at once. No more going off forgetting you left the
breaker to the sonar on. Some equipment refuses to come on
automatically when you power up its DC lead, so you have to turn them
on separately, but pull that knob and the whole extensive electronics
suite comes alive with ONE BUTTON.

Think about it...(c; My forgetful captain loves it. He no longer has
to figure out which switches to leave on and which to turn off while
his guests are pressing him to get the bar in operation....(c;



On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:55:46 -0500, Kelton Joyner
wrote:

Larry,
I am rewiring my boat and have a question on wiring for the HF radio.
Best engineering practices would be to wire to power leads directly to
the battery (about 6-7'). I want to wire it to the DC distribution
panel
with a CB (also about 6-7' from the radio) so that both battery banks
could be used. If I use ferrite on each end of the wire, would this be
sufficient to prevent RFI being radiated at the panel? Do they make
ferrite's for 6AWG wire?

Kelton
s/v Isle Escape



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

I took a similar approach. Breakers that are normally left on all the
time have green pilot LEDs. Things that should not be left on all the
time (running lights, heater, radios, etc are amber, and things that
should only be on when actually used (emergency fuel pump, etc)
have red LEDs. Just a glance at the panel gives me the story.

1/2 amp for a relay for convenience only seems like
a waste to me. I'd use a latching relay that only draws current when
actually switching or to keep it simple, I'd just use a switch.

Doug


"Jim Woodward" jameslwoodward at attbi dot com wrote in message
...
H'mm. Convenient, but it violates KISS. Where (electrically) do you put
the radios -- you may use both VHF and SSB while not at sea? What does the
relay coil draw -- 5 or 10 watts?

On Swee****er, all the "at sea" equipment was in one column on the panel,
next to the nav station. Convenient. Simple.

On Fintry we'll probably have color codes on the switches and maybe a
master
"at sea" breaker (breakers are cheap). All the electronics will be on a DC
subpanel in the wheelhouse. Simple.


--
Jim Woodward
www.mvFintry.com


.
"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
...
The RFI in the boat is caused not by RF backing up the HF DC leads,
which are VERY filtered inside the radio, but by the wiring in the
boat acting like an antenna in the RF field of the HF transmitting
antenna, itself. There's always been lots of RF from your HF radio in
the wiring. If it's not causing any problem, don't worry about it.

Seeing as how you are rewiring, let me suggest what I did aboard
Lionheart that everyone has enjoyed so much......a master relay.......

Lionheart has a #2 primary coming from the master switch through a 60A
fuse block to a continuous duty power relay, rated at 100A. It looks
like a car starter solenoid used in a Ford but has a continuous duty
coil so you can leave it on, not just bump it intermittently. I found
a nice marine push-pull power switch in a bargain bin and use that to
ground the low side of the coil (it has two terminals) to energize the
relay. The relay energizes a power panel all the electronics in the
boat is connected to. It also energizes a red LED next to the switch
so you can look up on your way ashore to see that the electronics is
on or off. Dock the boat, push in the switch, and every piece of
electronics except the stereo we might want to run while docked is
shut down all at once. No more going off forgetting you left the
breaker to the sonar on. Some equipment refuses to come on
automatically when you power up its DC lead, so you have to turn them
on separately, but pull that knob and the whole extensive electronics
suite comes alive with ONE BUTTON.

Think about it...(c; My forgetful captain loves it. He no longer has
to figure out which switches to leave on and which to turn off while
his guests are pressing him to get the bar in operation....(c;



On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:55:46 -0500, Kelton Joyner
wrote:

Larry,
I am rewiring my boat and have a question on wiring for the HF radio.
Best engineering practices would be to wire to power leads directly to
the battery (about 6-7'). I want to wire it to the DC distribution
panel
with a CB (also about 6-7' from the radio) so that both battery banks
could be used. If I use ferrite on each end of the wire, would this be
sufficient to prevent RFI being radiated at the panel? Do they make
ferrite's for 6AWG wire?

Kelton
s/v Isle Escape



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 14:07:14 -0500, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

I took a similar approach. Breakers that are normally left on all the
time have green pilot LEDs. Things that should not be left on all the
time (running lights, heater, radios, etc are amber, and things that
should only be on when actually used (emergency fuel pump, etc)
have red LEDs. Just a glance at the panel gives me the story.

1/2 amp for a relay for convenience only seems like
a waste to me. I'd use a latching relay that only draws current when
actually switching or to keep it simple, I'd just use a switch.

Doug

The only "capacity" issue aboard Lionheart is we don't have near
enough CHARGER off the AC line, at the moment. That's being
rectified. There's plenty of DC power, mostly over concerns about the
12A drain from the B&G Pilot's hydraulic pump when it's running. But
the twin 700AH battery banks have plenty of reserve for running it
until someone wants a shower or other hot water, giving us an excuse
to start the Perkins and the 120 amp house alternator for some serious
charging power. The engine change has been pushed back to the first
week in December, so the big alternator will have TWO drive belts that
won't squeal under the strain like it has one now.... To charge the
700AH beasts from dead would still require hours at 120A, 60A per
bank. The other power sources like shaft alternator, solar panel,
wind charger are just fluff. They'd take forever to charge the
beasts....and the 10A charger currently on the boat has never caught
up...(c;



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"