Anybody out there using a combination rope/chain rode with a horizontal
windlass? Is it manual or electric ?
I'm curious how much of a hastle it is shifting the rode from rope drum to
gypsy. Do you retrieve a bit of chain on the rope drum to get enough tail
and/or use a chain stopper ?

Many horizontal windlasses have combination rope/chain gypsies. I use
an S&L Horizon 1500 with a combination gypsy. I attach my rope to my
chain with a back splice. Because this makes the rode thicker it
tends to skip at the splice and I sometimes bend a whip onto the chain
with a rolling hitch to take the load off when going over the splice.
However, in most conditions just pushing down a bit on the splice as
it rolls over the gypsy is enough. Some folks recommend using a
splice that removes one part of the rope to keep the diameter of the
splice small. Even done perfectly this makes the splice 33% weaker
and more prone to chafe than the simple back splice so I strongly
advise against it.

-- Tom.

* Garland Gray II wrote, On 4/23/2007 9:09 PM:
Anybody out there using a combination rope/chain rode with a horizontal
windlass? Is it manual or electric ?
I'm curious how much of a hastle it is shifting the rode from rope drum to
gypsy. Do you retrieve a bit of chain on the rope drum to get enough tail
and/or use a chain stopper ?


I used to have the old basic Simpson Lawrence manual windlass and
hated it. The real problem was that each stroke hauled about a foot
of chain, so it was easier to hand-over-hand both the rope and the
chain as far as I could before putting it on the gypsy. The only time
I used the drum was when the rode was fouled - actually under someone
else's rode.

My current boat has an electric vertical windlass, without the drum.
Although the drum would have been only another few hundred, I haven't
missed it. The rope/chain gypsy works almost perfectly - perhaps once
a year there's a minor problem, usually just a twist in the chain.
The rope splice is not a problem, I used the variation of the eye
splice the S/L (now Lewmar) recommended.

The amount of chain I use in the rode is influenced by the depth of
water I anchor in. I like to be able hook the gypsy with the chain
before lifting the anchor. For me, that means 50 feet of chain, which
is good for almost any location I'm in, and is a reasonable amount to
aid the anchor in setting.

And I almost always power up to the anchor with the engine, not with
the windlass. When I do use the windlass, I try to do short bursts to
straighten the chain off the bottom, and then the weight of the chain
pulls the boat forward. Using the windlass to pull the boat against
the wind or current will, I believe, shorten its life.

Jeff wrote:

* Garland Gray II wrote, On 4/23/2007 9:09 PM:
Anybody out there using a combination rope/chain rode with a horizontal
windlass? Is it manual or electric ?
I'm curious how much of a hastle it is shifting the rode from rope drum to
gypsy. Do you retrieve a bit of chain on the rope drum to get enough tail
and/or use a chain stopper ?

We have an all chain rode so I can't answer the question about the
combination rode, but we have the old S-L manual windlass and it works
just fine for us. We got it second hand at Bacons

After he wakes up, Bob goes up on deck and pulls the slack out of the
rode, and then goes and shaves and then comes up and pulls out some
more slack, and then cooks his bacon and gets some more slack out and
then eats his bacon, and by that time I'm up too, and we start the
engine and motor up to the anchor and pull it the rest of the way. He
washes off the chain as he pulls it, and when it is clear of the
bottom, I motor off while he finishes stowing the anchor.

I used to have the old basic Simpson Lawrence manual windlass and
hated it. The real problem was that each stroke hauled about a foot
of chain, so it was easier to hand-over-hand both the rope and the
chain as far as I could before putting it on the gypsy. The only time
I used the drum was when the rode was fouled - actually under someone
else's rode.

My current boat has an electric vertical windlass, without the drum.
Although the drum would have been only another few hundred, I haven't
missed it. The rope/chain gypsy works almost perfectly - perhaps once
a year there's a minor problem, usually just a twist in the chain.
The rope splice is not a problem, I used the variation of the eye
splice the S/L (now Lewmar) recommended.

The amount of chain I use in the rode is influenced by the depth of
water I anchor in. I like to be able hook the gypsy with the chain
before lifting the anchor. For me, that means 50 feet of chain, which
is good for almost any location I'm in, and is a reasonable amount to
aid the anchor in setting.

And I almost always power up to the anchor with the engine, not with
the windlass. When I do use the windlass, I try to do short bursts to
straighten the chain off the bottom, and then the weight of the chain
pulls the boat forward. Using the windlass to pull the boat against
the wind or current will, I believe, shorten its life.

* Rosalie B. wrote, On 4/24/2007 11:00 AM:
Jeff wrote:
....
We have an all chain rode so I can't answer the question about the
combination rode, but we have the old S-L manual windlass and it works
just fine for us. We got it second hand at Bacons

After he wakes up, Bob goes up on deck and pulls the slack out of the
rode, and then goes and shaves and then comes up and pulls out some
more slack, and then cooks his bacon and gets some more slack out and
then eats his bacon, and by that time I'm up too, and we start the
engine and motor up to the anchor and pull it the rest of the way. He
washes off the chain as he pulls it, and when it is clear of the
bottom, I motor off while he finishes stowing the anchor.



I think you just proved my point about how tedious the S/L manual
windlass can be!

Jeff wrote:

* Rosalie B. wrote, On 4/24/2007 11:00 AM:
Jeff wrote:
...
We have an all chain rode so I can't answer the question about the
combination rode, but we have the old S-L manual windlass and it works
just fine for us. We got it second hand at Bacons

After he wakes up, Bob goes up on deck and pulls the slack out of the
rode, and then goes and shaves and then comes up and pulls out some
more slack, and then cooks his bacon and gets some more slack out and
then eats his bacon, and by that time I'm up too, and we start the
engine and motor up to the anchor and pull it the rest of the way. He
washes off the chain as he pulls it, and when it is clear of the
bottom, I motor off while he finishes stowing the anchor.



I think you just proved my point about how tedious the S/L manual
windlass can be!

You may think of it as tedious. We think of it as relaxing. We are
not in a hurry. We don't have to be anywhere. If the weather is bad,
we can just stay there.

The advantages to a manual windlass are -- you don't have to have a
battery set up to run it with either long cables to the engine and
main battery setup, or long cables from the main battery bank to the
bow.

There's less chance of trying to use the windlass motor to pull the
anchor up and burning it out.

We've been on a boat like ours with an electric windlass and thought
it was a little dangerous.

We do NEED a windlass with all chain and a fairly big anchor.

* Rosalie B. wrote, On 4/24/2007 8:43 PM:
Jeff wrote:

* Rosalie B. wrote, On 4/24/2007 11:00 AM:
Jeff wrote:
...
We have an all chain rode so I can't answer the question about the
combination rode, but we have the old S-L manual windlass and it works
just fine for us. We got it second hand at Bacons

After he wakes up, Bob goes up on deck and pulls the slack out of the
rode, and then goes and shaves and then comes up and pulls out some
more slack, and then cooks his bacon and gets some more slack out and
then eats his bacon, and by that time I'm up too, and we start the
engine and motor up to the anchor and pull it the rest of the way. He
washes off the chain as he pulls it, and when it is clear of the
bottom, I motor off while he finishes stowing the anchor.


I think you just proved my point about how tedious the S/L manual
windlass can be!

You may think of it as tedious. We think of it as relaxing. We are
not in a hurry. We don't have to be anywhere. If the weather is bad,
we can just stay there.

When I had an all chain/manual windlass setup I was frustrated when I
found I wasn't happy with the location. Perhaps the conditions
changed, or a newcomer arrived, or perhaps I just missed or
miscalculated my intended spot. The hassles of raising the anchor
meant that I generally didn't bother and thus ended up being unhappy
about the spot. Now, with lighter gear plus the electric windlass, I
reset the anchor about a third of the time, and I'm always happy.


The advantages to a manual windlass are -- you don't have to have a
battery set up to run it with either long cables to the engine and
main battery setup, or long cables from the main battery bank to the
bow.

Well yes, an electric windlass means electricity. I always thought
the extra battery was a bit silly, but running the wire is no big deal.

But you have a point that the electric windlass is one more
complication to worry about. Of course, most have manual backup.



There's less chance of trying to use the windlass motor to pull the
anchor up and burning it out.

This is a weird reason. I would think that after cooking four or five
you might figure it out.


We've been on a boat like ours with an electric windlass and thought
it was a little dangerous.

I admit I came close to having a finger sucked up a gypsy once. That
was a harsh lesson that fortunately only cost a bandaid! But I also
through my back out on a manual once, so I'd guess they're about even.

We do NEED a windlass with all chain and a fairly big anchor.

There's certainly no doubt about that. I've come to the conclusion
that I can anchor just as reliably with lighter gear - a mixed
rope/chain rode plus lighter Delta (or maybe Spade) rather than a
heavy CQR or Bruce. But that's a different discussion.

Hi Garland. I have a manual windlass that has both rope and chain gypsies. My chain gypsy has a slot that holds the line and/or rope (whichever is needed.) No need to switch anything.

I have a vertical maxwell with drum and usually pull the boat forward
on the catenary of the chain. As I see the splice approach, I use the
slack in the catenary to get a foot or so of chain placed around the
gypsy, then often need to twist the end of the rode and splice into
the hawse pipe, then power up the chain. In strong conditions I use
the engine to create the slack I need to get over the splice.

Thanks for all the comments. It is always good to hear from those who have
tried what works and what doesn't.


"Garland Gray II" wrote in message
...
Anybody out there using a combination rope/chain rode with a horizontal
windlass? Is it manual or electric ?
I'm curious how much of a hastle it is shifting the rode from rope drum to
gypsy. Do you retrieve a bit of chain on the rope drum to get enough tail
and/or use a chain stopper ?