I am still trying to decide on a windlass for our boat. Perhaps some the
experienced cruisers can help?

Our alternator output, is nominally 55A, but likely actually quite a bit
less. Max size alternator recommended for Yanmar 2QM15 engine is about 80A)

Some suitable horizontal windlasses for a 32 ft boat draw as much as 90A
(e.g. Quick Eagle 500/700)

If we have the engine running at say 1500rpm while pulling up the anchor, we
may be putting about 35A into the 200AH house bank, if we are lucky. At the
same time, the windlass is drawing up to 90A and other items like the refrig
unit are still drawing current. We could have a shortfall of 60A for 5-10
minutes.

Question: Would I be better to buy a somewhat undersized windlass that might
only draw 35A? (e.g Lofrans Dorado with gypsy on wrong side ) or buy the
larger unit and draw a bigger current?

GBM

(PS: I have 6 Ga wiring already installed, but will change if need be)

They will not draw full amperage if used properly. use your engine NOT
your windlass to move the boat over the anchor. The most stress your
windlass should ever have is lifting the anchor, chain and rode. it
should not be used to free an anchor (Except min mud etc)

I have the Lofrans 1000 Watt (1000/12 = 83 Amps... 2 group 31s in parr
can handle that + 50 amp DC charger + alternator) (Marlin maybe... not
sure of the model). I only have an issue if I disobey my own rule...

Size the windlass to about 2x the weight of the anchor, chain and rode
and you should be fine. mine is supposed to be for a boat up to 40' and
I have run a 48' 50K LB boat with it for 5 years including LOTS of
diving on 130' deep spots (300'Rode, 40' BBB chain, Steel danforth)
BTW... I love the combo lofrans.... chain/rode gypsy + a capstan you can
disconnect and use for the second anchor or dock lines.




GBM wrote:

I am still trying to decide on a windlass for our boat. Perhaps some the
experienced cruisers can help?

Our alternator output, is nominally 55A, but likely actually quite a bit
less. Max size alternator recommended for Yanmar 2QM15 engine is about 80A)

Some suitable horizontal windlasses for a 32 ft boat draw as much as 90A
(e.g. Quick Eagle 500/700)

If we have the engine running at say 1500rpm while pulling up the anchor, we
may be putting about 35A into the 200AH house bank, if we are lucky. At the
same time, the windlass is drawing up to 90A and other items like the refrig
unit are still drawing current. We could have a shortfall of 60A for 5-10
minutes.

Question: Would I be better to buy a somewhat undersized windlass that might
only draw 35A? (e.g Lofrans Dorado with gypsy on wrong side ) or buy the
larger unit and draw a bigger current?

GBM

(PS: I have 6 Ga wiring already installed, but will change if need be)

GBM wrote:
I am still trying to decide on a windlass for our boat. Perhaps
some the
experienced cruisers can help?

Our alternator output, is nominally 55A, but likely actually quite
a bit
less. Max size alternator recommended for Yanmar 2QM15 engine is
about 80A)

Some suitable horizontal windlasses for a 32 ft boat draw as much
as 90A
(e.g. Quick Eagle 500/700)

If we have the engine running at say 1500rpm while pulling up the
anchor, we
may be putting about 35A into the 200AH house bank, if we are
lucky. At the
same time, the windlass is drawing up to 90A and other items like
the refrig
unit are still drawing current. We could have a shortfall of 60A
for 5-10
minutes.

Question: Would I be better to buy a somewhat undersized windlass
that might
only draw 35A? (e.g Lofrans Dorado with gypsy on wrong side )
or buy the
larger unit and draw a bigger current?


NO. This is one time when more is better

(PS: I have 6 Ga wiring already installed, but will change if need be)

Save the #6AWG for something else.

#2AWG is cutting it close. I'd probably use 1/0.

Add as much house battery capacity as you can afford and can find
space to keep it.

Personally, I don't like adding battery capacity in the bow near the
windlass.

Lew

In article ,
"GBM" wrote:

If we have the engine running at say 1500rpm while pulling up the
anchor, we may be putting about 35A into the 200AH house bank, if we
are lucky. At the same time, the windlass is drawing up to 90A and
other items like the refrig unit are still drawing current. We could
have a shortfall of 60A for 5-10 minutes.

Question: Would I be better to buy a somewhat undersized windlass
that might only draw 35A? (e.g Lofrans Dorado with gypsy on wrong
side ) or buy the larger unit and draw a bigger current?


Go with the larger one as the momentary *maximum* draw will be absorbed
by the batteries, and replaced soon after.

Truth be told, if you don't have an auxiliary battery real close to the
windlass, you lose a lot in long cables. A battery fed by smallish
cables from the charger(s) may weigh and cost less than proper cables
the whole distance.

You'll minimize required draw by using the windlass properly: solely to
raise the rode and anchor, letting the prop move the boat forward.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Would you really use the windlass for 5-10 minutes? Probably more
like 2 minutes usually. And the current won't be 90 Amps just lifting
the anchor (unless its huge and you're in 500 feet of water), the max
draw would only be if you straining, something that almost always
unnecessary. In wind you should drive the boat up over the anchor,
but in light air you can pull the chain tight, then let the weight of
the chain pull the boat up - repeat a few time until you're over the
hook and wait for the bobbing of the boat to work it loose. The net
result may be more charge in the bank than when you started

And the shortfall isn't really that bad, since running the engine for
a few more minutes is going to recover it. This is what batteries
are for. You're talking about 10 Amp-hours even in your worst case
reckoning. If you have a large DC fridge, you could consider turning
it off - we do that on occasion if we need to run the engine at top
RPM to make a bridge opening, etc. But more often than not, I've set
my regulator down to 30 amps if I'm expecting to use the engine long
enough to charge the bank.

I wouldn't worry about this at all. As for the wire, the WM catalog
has the chart - that should tell you if the size is right, but it
seems a bit small. Some people add an extra battery at the windlass
that can be charged with low current, but that seems complicated. If
you want to add, enlarge your house bank - that's always a good thing.

GBM wrote:
I am still trying to decide on a windlass for our boat. Perhaps some the
experienced cruisers can help?

Our alternator output, is nominally 55A, but likely actually quite a bit
less. Max size alternator recommended for Yanmar 2QM15 engine is about 80A)

Some suitable horizontal windlasses for a 32 ft boat draw as much as 90A
(e.g. Quick Eagle 500/700)

If we have the engine running at say 1500rpm while pulling up the anchor, we
may be putting about 35A into the 200AH house bank, if we are lucky. At the
same time, the windlass is drawing up to 90A and other items like the refrig
unit are still drawing current. We could have a shortfall of 60A for 5-10
minutes.

Question: Would I be better to buy a somewhat undersized windlass that might
only draw 35A? (e.g Lofrans Dorado with gypsy on wrong side ) or buy the
larger unit and draw a bigger current?

GBM

(PS: I have 6 Ga wiring already installed, but will change if need be)

The windlass runs off the battery, not the alternator. Any winch worth
its salt will draw far more current than the alternator can replace in
real time.

Having well (over) sized cables (up and back) to the winch will give
better results but this can be expensive. Sometimes it is cheaper and
more effective to put a dedicated battery at the winch with a light
gauge charging line to replenish the battery.

See the article at http://www.yandina.com/Bank3.htm

GBM wrote:
I am still trying to decide on a windlass for our boat. Perhaps some the
experienced cruisers can help?

Our alternator output, is nominally 55A, but likely actually quite a bit
less.

As others have pointed out, this shouldn't matter. The
windlass' power comes from the battery bank, and the draw is
only going to be 2 minutes or less anyway.



Question: Would I be better to buy a somewhat undersized windlass that might
only draw 35A?

No! You want a windlass of a size to be of practical use...
which means a windlass that will move heavy objects you
can't move with your back muscles.


(PS: I have 6 Ga wiring already installed, but will change if need be)


For a windlass? Not big enough by at least a couple of
sizes, unless your battery is less than 1' away from the
windlass terminals (which would make a cable run of 2'
remember).

The issue of whether to add a battery up forward for the
windlass is one that can only be decided by an individual,
based on his preferences. Heavy cable is expensive, it may
be cheaper to put a battery up front; but then the battery
will need charging & maintenance, and adds to weight up
forward where you don't want it for sailing.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Heavy duty tinned cable is not all that expensive. I bought sixty feet (30'
out, 30' back) of 1/0 tinned cable from Cobra for about $2 a foot. I did not
have to buy another battery to install in the bow and add even more weight
up forward along with the windlass, anchor and 150' of chain. The cables
distribute their weight along the length of their run to an already installed
battery. A 100 amp breaker within a foot of the battery ensures we don't have
live cables running all over the boat. And it is the battery, not the
alternator, that drives the windlass. As it happens, we have a high output
charging system but that only means you put the juice back in the battery
faster, not raise the anchor faster. As others have mentioned, use the engine
to pull the boat over the anchor and break it out, not the windlass to lift
the sea floor.

Don't know about others but ours is a Lewmar Concept 1 gypsy and captstan with
dual station/dual direction switches. The switch wiring is abominable. It is
very small guage and not tinned and handles very low current to a solenoid
that does the heavy-duty switching. The low-current wiring rapidly turns to
red dust and the switches regularly fail. Put in decent wiring, you say. The
existing wiring is integral into the switch. All I can do is keep peeling back
to bright copper and splice yet again. But I am running out of space. I'll
think of something.

The motor on this unit also failed. I had it rebuilt at a local automotive
elctrical shop. Lewmar has been less than helpful.

Gogarty wrote:

Don't know about others but ours is a Lewmar Concept 1 gypsy and captstan with
dual station/dual direction switches. The switch wiring is abominable. It is
very small guage and not tinned and handles very low current to a solenoid
that does the heavy-duty switching. The low-current wiring rapidly turns to
red dust and the switches regularly fail. Put in decent wiring, you say. The
existing wiring is integral into the switch. All I can do is keep peeling back
to bright copper and splice yet again. But I am running out of space. I'll
think of something.

Sorry to hear about your experience with the Lewmar. I have a Concept
(forget the #) windlass on my boat and have had good service from it
for 7+ years. Lewmar foot switches on the deck forward and the supplied
Lewmar 'remote' toggle switch in the cockpit.

Regarding your corrosion problem: On my boat, the connections (soldered
as I recall) for the deck switches are belowdecks (nominally dry) and
are protected with sealant (coax seal or 3M splicing compound and heat
shrink). The cockpit toggle switch is still going strong in spite of
being exposed to the inside of a locker which is usually piled with
damp and salty lines- corrosion heaven. Again, the connections (push-on
spades) are properly protected with sealant and heat shrink. The toggle
switch is a simple on-off-on momentary SPDT switch which can be
replaced with an off-the-shelf unit from any good electronics supplier.
As you say, it carries little current, so it's not a critical item. The
rubber switch covers in the foot switches seem to be holding up, but
are an obvious leak threat.

So far, using tinned (marine-grade) wiring and proper sealing of inline
connections seems to be doing the trick for me. Most of my belowdecks
branch connections (tapping into the light circuit, etc) are made via
terminal blocks, so it's easy to keep an eye on what's happening, and
troubleshoot as well.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed about the motor after your experience.
So far, the windlass has been the only Lewmar product on the boat that
hasn't turned to rubbish. Traveller and 'racing' blocks are a witches'
brew of aluminum and various tiny stainless setscrews which are totally
unsuited to marine use. No more Lewmar junk for me...except for that
great windlass!

John

GBM wrote:
I am still trying to decide on a windlass for our boat. Perhaps some the
experienced cruisers can help?

Our alternator output, is nominally 55A, but likely actually quite a bit
less. Max size alternator recommended for Yanmar 2QM15 engine is about 80A)

I would echo the comments made by others here- get a decent sized
windlass and put in heavy-duty wiring. It's expensive, but just part of
the 'hidden cost' of windlass installations.
I've got a Lewmar Concept windass with an 80A breaker, but I'm sure it
never draws anything like that current in practice. Usual anchor is a
35#CQR with 5/16 chain for the first 175 ft, then rope. Alternator is
55A Hitachi, battery banks supply about 300Ah or so. When using the
windlass, we run the engine and parallel the battery banks- probably
overkill.
Wiring (this is important) is 1/0 tinned marine cable with swaged-on
lugs. My marine electrical advisor (Paul Thornton of Oakville, ON)
insisted on this over my objections, and he was right. Boat is 30ft
sloop, batteries aft.

Incidentally- in calm conditions, using chain rode, there's nothing
wrong with moving the boat up to the anchor by jogging the windlass and
letting the weight of the chain pull the boat forward. Once the chain
is close to vertical you can drive ahead with the motor to break out
the anchor and hoist the anchor with the windlass. It's handy having a
cockpit switch for the windlass if you are single-handing.

You will love your electric windlass if you do it right- no more
cranking for me (until it breaks).
Cheers
John