"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
Dammit, as if gronicles weren't enough! What the hell is a kimbo?

It's the thing you need a lert for in order to avoid having to use it.

--

Roger Long


I thought it was something left over from WWII....

In article ,
"Capt. JG" wrote:

My only quibble is that making a practice of jumping can lead to
nasty consequences.

I second that opinion. Crew member on our friend's boat jumped to the
dock and broke both ankles. Put a serious damper on that BVI trip for
two crews, he and his wife spent quite a bit of time in hospitals, and
he was walking with canes a year or two later.

The only crew member that steps (not leaps) to the dock is me, and only
after I've stopped the boat where I want it to be. I "scolded" my wife
the other day for stretching too far to reach the fuel dock line. If she
can't stand upright and reach the line with the boat hook, I'm doing
something wrong (or she's being impatient).


--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

In article ,
"Roger Long" wrote:

How large is your boat? Ours is fairly heavy for a 32 footer and,
even at the minimum speed for rudder authority, it would be quite a
jerk coming up against a hard loop like that with the current behind
us. Cushioning with reverse would draw the stern out assisted by the
springing effect. Big recovery with lots of forward power then to get
the stern back in.

Have you tried a short, hard reverse and noticed the effect on prop
walk? We're 7,000+ pounds, swinging a 16" 3-blade and that stops or
starts us straight with a quick burst. At minimum reverse and a
hard-over rudder, I can flip the boat in about its length with prop walk.

All boats differ, of course.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

"Jere Lull" wrote in message news:jerelull- Have
you tried a short, hard reverse and noticed the effect on prop walk?

Yes, we can do that. However, with the current behind us, stopping
relative to the dock means reversing direction and establishing a half
to three quarter knots of stern speed relative to the water. Getting
that flow reversed over the hull with a period of being motionless in
the water while still moving forward fast enough to bump the main dock
hard lets the stern start swinging. The current also runs at an angle
away from the dock. The dock slows the cross current for the front
part of the boat while the stern is still sticking out.

You've really got to get that stern line on.

--

Roger Long

In article ,
"Roger Long" wrote:

"Jere Lull" wrote in message news:jerelull- Have
you tried a short, hard reverse and noticed the effect on prop walk?

Yes, we can do that. However, with the current behind us, stopping
relative to the dock means reversing direction and establishing a half
to three quarter knots of stern speed relative to the water. Getting
that flow reversed over the hull with a period of being motionless in
the water while still moving forward fast enough to bump the main dock
hard lets the stern start swinging. The current also runs at an angle
away from the dock. The dock slows the cross current for the front
part of the boat while the stern is still sticking out.

You've really got to get that stern line on.

Oh! THOSE conditions change the equation considerably.

I'm even more impressed by you and your crew's performance the other day.

That spring line is your best friend...

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 02:14:22 GMT, Rosalie B.
wrote:

I don't jump. Ever. I may step off if the boat is close enough to do
that and if the dock isn't too different in level from the deck, but
that's really rare. [..]

I try to give the midships line to a dock person if there is one. We
rarely come into a dock where there is no dock person. (I am not too
proud to make it clear when I call that we need assistance) In that
case, Bob has to get the boat up close enough to some piling or other
attachment point so that I can put the line around it and secure it.

Does that pose significant limitations on where you can go? I am
afraid of jumping to a dock, and even things that most people would
consider a step feel like a jump to me. I have particular problems
with
- narrow floating docks which are going to lurch when I land
- anything that looks like bad footing
- any situation where my skipper has no room to abort and come around
again if I lose my nerve or don't like the look of it the first time
around
- wind, current, or approach at speed

and when we're doublehanding, that does limit where we can go.

What I can manage to do, sometimes, is to stand outside the lifelines
at the shrouds, holding a midships line and/or a bowline, and step off
backwards so that I'm using my arms to lower me as close as possible
to the dock before I have to let go. I wonder if there are any other
tricks, given that I'm a short woman with short legs and not a lot of
upper body strength. I can also practice stepping or jumping as a
backup to a more reliable person who is holding one of the lines, so
that I can get a sense of how it feels even if I'm not quick enough
yet.

Any other suggestions?

Louise

Louise wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 02:14:22 GMT, Rosalie B.
wrote:


I don't jump. Ever. I may step off if the boat is close enough to do
that and if the dock isn't too different in level from the deck, but
that's really rare. [..]


I try to give the midships line to a dock person if there is one. We
rarely come into a dock where there is no dock person. (I am not too
proud to make it clear when I call that we need assistance) In that
case, Bob has to get the boat up close enough to some piling or other
attachment point so that I can put the line around it and secure it.


Does that pose significant limitations on where you can go? I am
afraid of jumping to a dock, and even things that most people would
consider a step feel like a jump to me. I have particular problems
with
- narrow floating docks which are going to lurch when I land
- anything that looks like bad footing
- any situation where my skipper has no room to abort and come around
again if I lose my nerve or don't like the look of it the first time
around
- wind, current, or approach at speed

and when we're doublehanding, that does limit where we can go.

What I can manage to do, sometimes, is to stand outside the lifelines
at the shrouds, holding a midships line and/or a bowline, and step off
backwards so that I'm using my arms to lower me as close as possible
to the dock before I have to let go. I wonder if there are any other
tricks, given that I'm a short woman with short legs and not a lot of
upper body strength. I can also practice stepping or jumping as a
backup to a more reliable person who is holding one of the lines, so
that I can get a sense of how it feels even if I'm not quick enough
yet.

Any other suggestions?

Louise

The boat I crewed on for 3 or 4 summers was a 33'' sailboat with fairly
high freeboard. One of our female crew made a wild jump when coming back
into our slip and broke her ankle. Our skipper had a rubbermaid plastic
two step unit nailed to his slip to help people getting on & off.
I would go forward , hold onto a shroud and step off on the 'stepping
device just at the right time and quickly pick up the stern spring line
left right there by me when we had departed. I could get the line on the
midship cleat and stop forward motion before the boat drifted the last
ten feet (before the bow hit the main floating walkway)

Louise wrote:

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 02:14:22 GMT, Rosalie B.
wrote:

I don't jump. Ever. I may step off if the boat is close enough to do
that and if the dock isn't too different in level from the deck, but
that's really rare. [..]

I try to give the midships line to a dock person if there is one. We
rarely come into a dock where there is no dock person. (I am not too
proud to make it clear when I call that we need assistance) In that
case, Bob has to get the boat up close enough to some piling or other
attachment point so that I can put the line around it and secure it.

Does that pose significant limitations on where you can go? I am

We've been to many marinas in the Chesapeake and have been up and down
the ICW for three winters. I would not say that it poses significant
limitations. Many many different marinas. (I'll count sometime)

afraid of jumping to a dock, and even things that most people would
consider a step feel like a jump to me. I have particular problems
with
- narrow floating docks which are going to lurch when I land

I can't jump down onto floating docks at all because I have really bad
knees, and going down a step means that I have to have all my weight
on a bending knee. Going up is much easier. But most floating docks
have some kind of piling that I can lasso if necessary. Bob is very
good at getting our boat in close to the dock and 'stopped'. If
necessary I can lasso some kind of structure and HE will get off.

After we get tied up, we have a two step plastic stool that we put on
the dock so I can get on and off.

- anything that looks like bad footing

I don't jump regardless of how the footing looks.

- any situation where my skipper has no room to abort and come around
again if I lose my nerve or don't like the look of it the first time
around

Bob may have difficulty, but he is quite a good skipper and this
rarely happens. The biggest problem is if there is a big boat
blocking his view of the slip - sometimes he may have to back up in
the fairway which isn't easy. This happened coming into Miamarina
when there was a gale blowing, but he turned around to go into the
correct slip so well that a guy on a boat on the end thought we had
bow thrusters.

- wind, current, or approach at speed

Wind and current are impossible to control. We just don't approach at
speed. We have been approaching a face dock where we were supposed to
go in between two other boats, and Bob lined the boat up parallel to
the dock, and the wind blew us sideways into the dock. Hit it pretty
hard, so fortunately we were exactly in the right place.

and when we're doublehanding, that does limit where we can go.

What I can manage to do, sometimes, is to stand outside the lifelines
at the shrouds, holding a midships line and/or a bowline, and step off
backwards so that I'm using my arms to lower me as close as possible
to the dock before I have to let go. I wonder if there are any other
tricks, given that I'm a short woman with short legs and not a lot of
upper body strength. I can also practice stepping or jumping as a
backup to a more reliable person who is holding one of the lines, so
that I can get a sense of how it feels even if I'm not quick enough
yet.

Any other suggestions?

Louise

I stay on the deck. I always have a boat hook or two. Bob also has
one at the stern.

Come in to the gas dock first and reconnoiter.

Have the skipper practice coming in close enough and slow enough that
you don't have to do gymnastics to get off.

But my best suggestion is - if you are a transient ask the marina for
help.

There has only been two times where I have failed to get help. In one
case the dock was a fixed concrete dock which was above our deck, and
Bob put us right up beside it and I crawled up onto it. In the other
case it was a fixed wooden dock about level with our deck, and I
managed to lasso a post even though the wind was blowing us off the
dock. Then Bob could power into the line to get the stern in.

Leaving the dock is more of a challenge in some cases, but we have
more time to think about it.



grandma Rosalie