I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

"MMC" wrote in message
m...
I agree with advocates of the bowline for the following reasons: 1) it
will
not come untied until you want it to, 2) when you want it to- you can
untie
it, and 3) it devalues the breaking strain of the line less than other
knots. In this I mean that if a line is put under heavy strain, it will
break at the knot before it reaches it's stated breaking point because of
the bends required to form the knot will break first.
I'm a firm believer that a boater only needs 3 knots; bowline, clove
hitch,
and square; along with a good idea of when to use each and the ability to
do
so quickly.
MMC (Navy coxswain, Navy and commercial diver, sailor, and all around
nosey
*******)

"Steven Shelikoff" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:36:43 -0700, "Gordon" wrote:

What's the best knot for attaching the sheets to the jib? Gotta be
something better than the "pesky wabbit around the tree and down the
hole"
knot.

Are you really having trouble making a bowline? Sure, you can use other
knots to tie sheets to the jib. But they're going to be just as "pesky"
and if you're a sailor, you should know how to make a bowline quickly
anyway.

Steve

Two half hitches is an almost useless knot. There are variants that
are vastly superior, but two half hitches by itself is about as useful
as a granny.

Garland Gray II wrote:
I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

"MMC" wrote in message
m...

I agree with advocates of the bowline for the following reasons: 1) it

will

not come untied until you want it to, 2) when you want it to- you can

untie

it, and 3) it devalues the breaking strain of the line less than other
knots. In this I mean that if a line is put under heavy strain, it will
break at the knot before it reaches it's stated breaking point because of
the bends required to form the knot will break first.
I'm a firm believer that a boater only needs 3 knots; bowline, clove

hitch,

and square; along with a good idea of when to use each and the ability to

do

so quickly.
MMC (Navy coxswain, Navy and commercial diver, sailor, and all around

nosey

*******)

"Steven Shelikoff" wrote in message
. ..

On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:36:43 -0700, "Gordon" wrote:


What's the best knot for attaching the sheets to the jib? Gotta be
something better than the "pesky wabbit around the tree and down the

hole"

knot.

Are you really having trouble making a bowline? Sure, you can use other
knots to tie sheets to the jib. But they're going to be just as "pesky"
and if you're a sailor, you should know how to make a bowline quickly
anyway.

Steve

You are welcome to your opinion, but I think that is a rediculous statement.
A granny knot is clearly a knot done in error, but two half hitches can be a
very handy knot if a line needs to be tied or released while under a load.
I usually tie the half hitches after two or three turns around the piling.

"Jeff" wrote in message
...
Two half hitches is an almost useless knot. There are variants that
are vastly superior, but two half hitches by itself is about as useful
as a granny.

Garland Gray II wrote:
I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

"MMC" wrote in message
m...

I agree with advocates of the bowline for the following reasons: 1) it

will

not come untied until you want it to, 2) when you want it to- you can

untie

it, and 3) it devalues the breaking strain of the line less than other
knots. In this I mean that if a line is put under heavy strain, it will
break at the knot before it reaches it's stated breaking point because
of
the bends required to form the knot will break first.
I'm a firm believer that a boater only needs 3 knots; bowline, clove

hitch,

and square; along with a good idea of when to use each and the ability
to

do

so quickly.
MMC (Navy coxswain, Navy and commercial diver, sailor, and all around

nosey

*******)

"Steven Shelikoff" wrote in message
. ..

On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:36:43 -0700, "Gordon"
wrote:


What's the best knot for attaching the sheets to the jib? Gotta be
something better than the "pesky wabbit around the tree and down the

hole"

knot.

Are you really having trouble making a bowline? Sure, you can use
other
knots to tie sheets to the jib. But they're going to be just as
"pesky"
and if you're a sailor, you should know how to make a bowline quickly
anyway.

Steve

You're correct that the two half hitches is handy if you need to
release it under load, but there are a limited number of times you
need that. Traditionally, when two half hitches is used in
"permanent" rigging aloft it is seized to insure it won't come loose.

When you say you take "two or three turns" before tying you are
actually describing two different knots - either the "round turn and
two half hitches" or the "rolling hitch." As I said, there are
variants that are superior. I think you agree with me, but didn't
realize these are considered different knots.


Garland Gray II wrote:
You are welcome to your opinion, but I think that is a rediculous statement.
A granny knot is clearly a knot done in error, but two half hitches can be a
very handy knot if a line needs to be tied or released while under a load.
I usually tie the half hitches after two or three turns around the piling.

"Jeff" wrote in message
...

Two half hitches is an almost useless knot. There are variants that
are vastly superior, but two half hitches by itself is about as useful
as a granny.

Garland Gray II wrote:

I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

"MMC" wrote in message
.com...


I agree with advocates of the bowline for the following reasons: 1) it

will


not come untied until you want it to, 2) when you want it to- you can

untie


it, and 3) it devalues the breaking strain of the line less than other
knots. In this I mean that if a line is put under heavy strain, it will
break at the knot before it reaches it's stated breaking point because

of

the bends required to form the knot will break first.
I'm a firm believer that a boater only needs 3 knots; bowline, clove

hitch,


and square; along with a good idea of when to use each and the ability

to

do


so quickly.
MMC (Navy coxswain, Navy and commercial diver, sailor, and all around

nosey


*******)

"Steven Shelikoff" wrote in message
m...


On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:36:43 -0700, "Gordon"

wrote:


What's the best knot for attaching the sheets to the jib? Gotta be
something better than the "pesky wabbit around the tree and down the

hole"


knot.

Are you really having trouble making a bowline? Sure, you can use

other

knots to tie sheets to the jib. But they're going to be just as

"pesky"

and if you're a sailor, you should know how to make a bowline quickly
anyway.

Steve

Garland Gray II wrote:

I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

Would you call that a reef knot, or a granny?

Terry K

"MMC" wrote in message
m...

I agree with advocates of the bowline for the following reasons: 1) it

will

not come untied until you want it to, 2) when you want it to- you can

untie

it, and 3) it devalues the breaking strain of the line less than other
knots. In this I mean that if a line is put under heavy strain, it will
break at the knot before it reaches it's stated breaking point because of
the bends required to form the knot will break first.
I'm a firm believer that a boater only needs 3 knots; bowline, clove

hitch,

and square; along with a good idea of when to use each and the ability to

do

so quickly.
MMC (Navy coxswain, Navy and commercial diver, sailor, and all around

nosey

*******)

"Steven Shelikoff" wrote in message
. ..

On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:36:43 -0700, "Gordon" wrote:


What's the best knot for attaching the sheets to the jib? Gotta be
something better than the "pesky wabbit around the tree and down the

hole"

knot.

Are you really having trouble making a bowline? Sure, you can use other
knots to tie sheets to the jib. But they're going to be just as "pesky"
and if you're a sailor, you should know how to make a bowline quickly
anyway.

Steve

In article ,
Terry Spragg wrote:

Garland Gray II wrote:

I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

Would you call that a reef knot, or a granny?

Two half hitches are neither reef knot nor a granny. Nor are the reef
and granny the same.

Now, one knot that I use all the time that I don't know the name of is a
relative of the first: a half hitch with a loop taken through the hitch
instead of the bitter end. I use it to gasket the main and temporarily
set the fenders. Releases by simply pulling on the free end. Can be
locked by taking the loop through a second hitch. Very handy and very
fast to undo, even under fairly high strain.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Jere Lull wrote:
In article ,
Terry Spragg wrote:


Garland Gray II wrote:


I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

Would you call that a reef knot, or a granny?


Two half hitches are neither reef knot nor a granny. Nor are the reef
and granny the same.

Actually, two half hitches and the granny are the same knot,
topologically speaking. (Tie a granny and pull one line tight to
collapse the other ...)

In Jeff writes:

Jere Lull wrote:
In article ,
Terry Spragg wrote:


Garland Gray II wrote:


I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

Would you call that a reef knot, or a granny?


Two half hitches are neither reef knot nor a granny. Nor are the reef
and granny the same.

Actually, two half hitches and the granny are the same knot,
topologically speaking. (Tie a granny and pull one line tight to
collapse the other ...)

Then one should notice that a reef knot and the cow hitch or lark's head
are the same knots. :-). (By the same argument.)

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Jere Lull wrote:
In article ,
Terry Spragg wrote:


Garland Gray II wrote:


I'd put two half hitches on that list, right behind the bowline

Would you call that a reef knot, or a granny?


Two half hitches are neither reef knot nor a granny. Nor are the reef
and granny the same.

Sorry, I think I can convince you otherwise.

Try this: Untie your sneaker. Step by step, retie it. Tie the
first overhand "knot", and look carefully. It's a half hitch, you
can hold one end taut (this becomes the bitter end of the standing
part, since you can't mess with it, it gets very bitter if you twist
the free end on it, and it's the other end or the working part, the
free or moving end) and look at what happens when you move the other
end around, left to right, above or below the standing part. You
get a half hitch. Tie another.

I depends on the orientation (left or right) of the exit of the
(knot bitter, nor taught bound, end, but the the working, free,
end), as to wether you will end up with a reef or a granny. Two half
hitches is an inverted reef, if you orient the underside rotation of
the top half hitch in the "correct" way, depending on whether you
start on the left end or the right end. Relativism is involved.
You know, tie a reef. Pull one line tight, slide the two half
hitches off. Tie the second half hitch the other way, and you got a
granny, if you stretch the "used to be the free end" taut, and look
at the result. It's a mathematical relationship expressible in the
languge of knots, much of which I do not know. There is an
intermediate stage to this transformation, and it is called a clove
hitch, all from various combinations and views of two half hitches.
Turn the clove hitch (tied around the other shoelace) inside out, so
to speak, and you get a granny, all because you pulled one or the
other end straight.

Convinced?

Terry K



Now, one knot that I use all the time that I don't know the name of is a
relative of the first: a half hitch with a loop taken through the hitch
instead of the bitter end. I use it to gasket the main and temporarily
set the fenders. Releases by simply pulling on the free end. Can be
locked by taking the loop through a second hitch. Very handy and very
fast to undo, even under fairly high strain.