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#1
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A marina with no water
Seeing the paucity of marina space in South FL and the extreme cost
makes me wonder what will happen as prices for slips continue to rise. Most of you do not seem to consider $300/month for a slip to be extreme but I consider it to be absurd. Most boats I see in marinas seem to leave their slips no more than once a month. For power boats, there is always storage available on land but this is rarely done with sailboats but it might make sense. Consider that it no longer makse economic sense to operate a marina on the water as the property is simply to valuable to be used that way. Even here in N. FL. we see old marinas being bought and condos being built on the land eliminating marina space. Property values drop exponentially with distance from the water with that only a block from the water often being a tenth the cost of waterfront. My suggestion probably reflects my lack of experience with marinas as I have normally kept my boat at a private dock and rarely deal with marinas. However, why not buy cheaper property near the water retaining just enough to drive a forklift to the water and store the sailboats out of the water. Of course the cost of putting in and taking out would have to be small but perhaps this could be offset by the safety of having the sailboats on higher land during hurricanes. I'd anticipate that boats would be put in or taken out "on demand" and that there may be times of high useage where there could be a backlog but perhaps there could be a temporary mooring buoy for several waiting boats. I wonder what the cost of slips would have to be before such a thing became common? |
#3
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wrote in message ups.com... Seeing the paucity of marina space in South FL and the extreme cost makes me wonder what will happen as prices for slips continue to rise. Most of you do not seem to consider $300/month for a slip to be extreme but I consider it to be absurd. Most boats I see in marinas seem to leave their slips no more than once a month. For power boats, there is always storage available on land but this is rarely done with sailboats but it might make sense. Consider that it no longer makse economic sense to operate a marina on the water as the property is simply to valuable to be used that way. Even here in N. FL. we see old marinas being bought and condos being built on the land eliminating marina space. Property values drop exponentially with distance from the water with that only a block from the water often being a tenth the cost of waterfront. The problem is that the environmental lobby won't allow any new docks/marinas. They have such idiotic regulations as to make a mockery of government. For instance, in turbid waters they have restrictions on docks because the dock shades the water and seagrass can't grow. Turbid means dark water, it occludes the light and seagrass can't grow anyway!! Environmentalists like the very left in politics assumes that people are the problem and do anything they can to eliminate them from the water. No new docks, marinas...idle speed in almost all waterways, discurage development in all areas. This raises the cost of existing waterfront property. |
#4
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Jeff Rigby wrote:
The problem is that the environmental lobby won't allow any new docks/marinas. yeah man, those fscking fscktards! They have such idiotic regulations as to make a mockery of government. For instance, in turbid waters they have restrictions on docks because the dock shades the water and seagrass can't grow. Turbid means dark water, it occludes the light and seagrass can't grow anyway!! like duh eh!? Environmentalists like the very left in politics assumes that people are the problem and do anything they can to eliminate them from the water. yeah those fscking manatee huggers, let's kill 'em all!! No new docks, marinas...idle speed in almost all waterways, discurage development in all areas. This raises the cost of existing waterfront property. yeah like that's so bogus man eh...like I should be able to do whatever the fsck I want, whenever the fsck I want, cos like I'm me and fsck everyone else *plonk* |
#5
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wrote in
ups.com: Seeing the paucity of marina space in South FL and the extreme cost makes me wonder what will happen as prices for slips continue to rise. One of the best marinas in Charleston has gone "condo"....not condo in the sense of tearing up the marina and replacing it with apartment- condos, that's next door...no, the "condo" here is a LOCKER for $120,000! Now THAT's stupid! They can't sell you a dockspace they don't own. The Corp of Engineers always gets upset when some slick developer sells the public's waterways. So, they sell you this tiny locker in the main building with the PROMISE that you'll be able to use "some" dock space for your boat....where is not promised. The fun part comes with the "regime fees". There's an "owner's association", which, of course, is SUBORDINATE to the developer and at his whim. Inside the condo docs is a little clause that says if we run out of money from the regime fees, we'll just come assess you for more moolah at any time and there's nothing you can do about it. Regime fees have dropped a lot on the webpage since they started it..(c; What a deal! Take a look: http://theharborageatashleymarina.com/ Most all of the old gang simply moved out....to the City Marina. |
#6
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That reminds me of an incident in Hilton Head a few years back. I was
installing a system for a real estate company which shall remain un-named. We were proofing the system by printing out various reports and auditing them. There was a list of one development on the marsh side with prices in the $650K-$850K range that suddenly dropped to the $175K to $200K range. A red flag to me so I asked " Are these houses and those vacant lots?" The answer "No. These are vacant lots and those are boat slips." That was 10 years ago so $120K for a dock box doesn't sound all that unreasonable to me. :-) Actually that is becoming quite a problem lately in the time share business and to some degree in the condo-marina business. If you don't have clear title to some interest in real property the deal is worth only the assets of the company that sold it to you which is usually zero. Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com "Larry W4CSC" wrote in message ... wrote in ups.com: Seeing the paucity of marina space in South FL and the extreme cost makes me wonder what will happen as prices for slips continue to rise. One of the best marinas in Charleston has gone "condo"....not condo in the sense of tearing up the marina and replacing it with apartment- condos, that's next door...no, the "condo" here is a LOCKER for $120,000! Now THAT's stupid! They can't sell you a dockspace they don't own. The Corp of Engineers always gets upset when some slick developer sells the public's waterways. So, they sell you this tiny locker in the main building with the PROMISE that you'll be able to use "some" dock space for your boat....where is not promised. The fun part comes with the "regime fees". There's an "owner's association", which, of course, is SUBORDINATE to the developer and at his whim. Inside the condo docs is a little clause that says if we run out of money from the regime fees, we'll just come assess you for more moolah at any time and there's nothing you can do about it. Regime fees have dropped a lot on the webpage since they started it..(c; What a deal! Take a look: http://theharborageatashleymarina.com/ Most all of the old gang simply moved out....to the City Marina. |
#7
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"Glenn Ashmore" wrote in
news:sfffe.2668$sy6.1304@lakeread04: Actually that is becoming quite a problem lately in the time share business and to some degree in the condo-marina business. If you don't have clear title to some interest in real property the deal is worth only the assets of the company that sold it to you which is usually zero. The "company" is retaining all title to the real property, the marina building, land, parking lot that can only park 20% of the boaters' cars. Oh, no, you get nothing of real value for $120K, just a locker and a promise. What I find incredible is that people-of-money actually buy into this scheme that could simply vanish overnight. I always pictured the rich as much smarter and more money savvy than this. It must not be true. Notice that the "company" is a South Carolina LLC...limited liability... After the money runs out from the initial loans, and the bank repos the real property used as collateral, how are the locker owners going to get to the dock through the bank's new waterfront condo property? |
#8
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wrote in message ups.com... Seeing the paucity of marina space in South FL and the extreme cost makes me wonder what will happen as prices for slips continue to rise. Most of you do not seem to consider $300/month for a slip to be extreme but I consider it to be absurd. Most boats I see in marinas seem to leave their slips no more than once a month. For power boats, there is always storage available on land but this is rarely done with sailboats but it might make sense. Consider that it no longer makse economic sense to operate a marina on the water as the property is simply to valuable to be used that way. Even here in N. FL. we see old marinas being bought and condos being built on the land eliminating marina space. Property values drop exponentially with distance from the water with that only a block from the water often being a tenth the cost of waterfront. My suggestion probably reflects my lack of experience with marinas as I have normally kept my boat at a private dock and rarely deal with marinas. However, why not buy cheaper property near the water retaining just enough to drive a forklift to the water and store the sailboats out of the water. Of course the cost of putting in and taking out would have to be small but perhaps this could be offset by the safety of having the sailboats on higher land during hurricanes. I'd anticipate that boats would be put in or taken out "on demand" and that there may be times of high useage where there could be a backlog but perhaps there could be a temporary mooring buoy for several waiting boats. I wonder what the cost of slips would have to be before such a thing became common? Such a thing has been around for years. It's called a Boatel. We have dozens of them around here. Some are even inside. They stack boat up to 5 or 6 high. Launch on demand. I was involved in designing an automated one several years ago. $300/mo might seem expensive if you are used to private docks, but that the rate for the less expensive slip around here (Baltimore/Annapolis). Doug |
#9
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Doug Dotson wrote:
snip.... $300/mo might seem expensive if you are used to private docks, but that the rate for the less expensive slip around here (Baltimore/Annapolis). Doug This is why some of us...me included, own a smaller sailboat that can be launched from a trailer. Since the larger ocean swells tend to bother me, I mostly do coastal sailing in reasonably protected bays, harbours etc. Another bonus...it's very easy to explore new waters without sailing for a day or two just to get there. |
#10
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"Don White" wrote in message ... Doug Dotson wrote: snip.... $300/mo might seem expensive if you are used to private docks, but that the rate for the less expensive slip around here (Baltimore/Annapolis). Doug This is why some of us...me included, own a smaller sailboat that can be launched from a trailer. Since the larger ocean swells tend to bother me, I mostly do coastal sailing in reasonably protected bays, harbours etc. Another bonus...it's very easy to explore new waters without sailing for a day or two just to get there. And other of us..me included, own a larger boat so we are not confined to the shallow end of the kiddie pool |
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