|
Probably wouldn't be too wise for any Canadians to admit carrying firearms
on their boat. |
A - TYPE
1. hand gun 2. shot gun 3. rifle 4. line-throwing gun (safety equipment) 5. assault 6. cruiser grip, short barrel, large bore, home security weapons 7. other Somehow I think a flare gun should have been explicitly listed. Granted, it's safety equipment, but it'd be more likely to be present than a line-throwing gun. [HUMOR] I also note that Light Anti-Tank Weapons are also not listed. And what about Stinger missiles? [/HUMOR] Comment: I don't see much point to dealing with this kind of questioning; after all, what's the point? Question: Don't most countries consider a cruiser carrying weapons a *bad* thing? -- John R. Campbell Speaker to Machines soup at tampabay dot rr dot com "Grace is sufficient so Joy was let go." - Heather L. Campbell "Faith manages ... even though she didn't get promoted" - me Why OS X? Because making Unix user-friendly was easier than debugging Windows |
Spam Fighter wrote:
We are working on a Power Squadron study of the "cruising lifestyle". We need estimates of the absolute number and percentages of cruising boats carrying weapons. ... We suspect the numbers are very low but have been asked to find some data to support this conclusion. Thanks. Bob This is an interesting post. Why does Bob Ranglin, working for Power Squadron, mail under the ID Spam fighter )? And why should anybody volunteer their personal information to this dubious signature? Especially as carrying personal firearms are prohibited in most countries one would visit as a sailor. Dag Stenberg (far enough away to feel safe from prying) |
On 17 Feb 2005 20:03:41 GMT, "Dag Stenberg"
wrote: Spam Fighter wrote: We are working on a Power Squadron study of the "cruising lifestyle". We need estimates of the absolute number and percentages of cruising boats carrying weapons. ... We suspect the numbers are very low but have been asked to find some data to support this conclusion. Thanks. Bob This is an interesting post. Why does Bob Ranglin, working for Power Squadron, mail under the ID Spam fighter )? And why should anybody volunteer their personal information to this dubious signature? Especially as carrying personal firearms are prohibited in most countries one would visit as a sailor. Dag Stenberg (far enough away to feel safe from prying) Don't know about the userid, but if you are carrying firearms outside US waters and plan to reply, PLEASE LIE! The last thing we need is to have an "official auxiliary" (I speak of foreign perceptions) of the US Gov't producing a study telling customs officials worldwide that they should shake down every US flag yacht looking for guns. Granted they may believe we're all armed to the teeth anyway, buy no need to reinforce any suspicions. There is no 2nd Amendment issue of preserving rights here. The 2nd Amendment ends at the border. I'm neither advocating carrying guns nor frowning on it. Just being practical. My opinion and worth what you paid for it. __________________________________________________ __________ Glen "Wiley" Wilson usenet1 SPAMNIX at world wide wiley dot com To reply, lose the capitals and do the obvious. Take a look at cpRepeater, my NMEA data integrator, repeater, and logger at http://www.worldwidewiley.com/ |
On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:34:31 GMT, "Glen \"Wiley\" Wilson"
wrote: Don't know about the userid, but if you are carrying firearms outside US waters and plan to reply, PLEASE LIE! The last thing we need is to have an "official auxiliary" (I speak of foreign perceptions) of the US Gov't producing a study telling customs officials worldwide that they should shake down every US flag yacht looking for guns. Granted they may believe we're all armed to the teeth anyway, buy no need to reinforce any suspicions. There is no 2nd Amendment issue of preserving rights here. The 2nd Amendment ends at the border. I'm neither advocating carrying guns nor frowning on it. Just being practical. My opinion and worth what you paid for it. When faced with questions like this, it is best to follow the advice of confucious: It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubts. Questions like this benefit nobody. Weebles Wobble (but they don't fall down) |
Your'e kidding! You want law abiding citizens to tell a government group
what firearms they have on their boat? Gimme a break!!!! Doug "Spam Fighter" wrote in message .. . Hi, We are working on a Power Squadron study of the "cruising lifestyle". We need estimates of the absolute number and percentages of cruising boats carrying weapons. That is firearms, not flare pistols, starter pistols, sling shots or spear guns. We are not interested in the debate of whether or not to carry weapons, or why cruisers carry. We wish to estimate the numbers that have chosen to and actually possess and carry while cruising, what they carry and where they go. We would like to break it down by: A - TYPE 1. hand gun 2. shot gun 3. rifle 4. line-throwing gun (safety equipment) 5. assault 6. cruiser grip, short barrel, large bore, home security weapons 7. other B - MARINIZED (special finish, stainless steel) 1. yes 2. no B - QUANTITY + CALIBER OF EACH WEAPON C - TYPE AND AMOUNT OF AMMUNITION CARRIED (mushroom, hollow point, slug, buck shot) D - HOW STORED E - CRUISING GROUNDS 1. America 2. Bahamas 3. Mexico 4. Canada 5. Central America 6. South America 7. Pacific Countries 8. Australia 9. Indian Ocean 10. Africa 11. Northern Europe 12. Mediterranean Is anyone aware of any similar studies? Any thoughts on how to collect this data? We suspect the numbers are very low but have been asked to find some data to support this conclusion. Thanks. Bob |
spam fighter...i will let you know if you
try and rob me or my my boat...... richard colorado |
You know, it's funny. This question comes up all the time on the net,
but rarely, if ever, out here where people are actually doing it (we are about to leave La Paz for points south). I can't remember the last time the guns topic came up while talking with other cruisers. The sense I get is that very few are actually carrying guns. - Dan Spam Fighter wrote: Hi, We are working on a Power Squadron study of the "cruising lifestyle". We need estimates of the absolute number and percentages of cruising boats carrying weapons. That is firearms, not flare pistols, starter pistols, sling shots or spear guns. We are not interested in the debate of whether or not to carry weapons, or why cruisers carry. We wish to estimate the numbers that have chosen to and actually possess and carry while cruising, what they carry and where they go. We would like to break it down by: A - TYPE 1. hand gun 2. shot gun 3. rifle 4. line-throwing gun (safety equipment) 5. assault 6. cruiser grip, short barrel, large bore, home security weapons 7. other B - MARINIZED (special finish, stainless steel) 1. yes 2. no B - QUANTITY + CALIBER OF EACH WEAPON C - TYPE AND AMOUNT OF AMMUNITION CARRIED (mushroom, hollow point, slug, buck shot) D - HOW STORED E - CRUISING GROUNDS 1. America 2. Bahamas 3. Mexico 4. Canada 5. Central America 6. South America 7. Pacific Countries 8. Australia 9. Indian Ocean 10. Africa 11. Northern Europe 12. Mediterranean Is anyone aware of any similar studies? Any thoughts on how to collect this data? We suspect the numbers are very low but have been asked to find some data to support this conclusion. Thanks. Bob |
I just remembered. Spam Fighter is one of JAXes aliases.
"~^ beancounter ~^" wrote in message ups.com... spam fighter...i will let you know if you try and rob me or my my boat...... richard colorado |
|
May I carry a sword? Saber? Scimitar? Or better, a cutlass?
There's a great button I saw in a catalog: "When guns are outlawed... Can we use swords?" You know, the difference between citizen and subject often pivots on the question of weapon possession. -- John R. Campbell Speaker to Machines soup at tampabay dot rr dot com "Grace is sufficient so Joy was let go." - Heather L. Campbell "Faith manages ... even though she didn't get promoted" - me Why OS X? Because making Unix user-friendly was easier than debugging Windows |
When faced with questions like this, it is best to follow the advice
of confucious: It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubts. I believe that this quote came from Samuel Johnson. But as Confucious actually said: " To know is to know that you know nothing. That is the meaning of true knowledge." |
"Dan Best" wrote in message
... You know, it's funny. This question comes up all the time on the net, but rarely, if ever, out here where people are actually doing it (we are about to leave La Paz for points south). I can't remember the last time the guns topic came up while talking with other cruisers. The sense I get is that very few are actually carrying guns. - Dan Very few admit it. While cruising a couple of years ago, I was amazed how many carried guns aboard. Probably better than 50% of the folks I talked to about such things. Doug s/v Callista Spam Fighter wrote: Hi, We are working on a Power Squadron study of the "cruising lifestyle". We need estimates of the absolute number and percentages of cruising boats carrying weapons. That is firearms, not flare pistols, starter pistols, sling shots or spear guns. We are not interested in the debate of whether or not to carry weapons, or why cruisers carry. We wish to estimate the numbers that have chosen to and actually possess and carry while cruising, what they carry and where they go. We would like to break it down by: A - TYPE 1. hand gun 2. shot gun 3. rifle 4. line-throwing gun (safety equipment) 5. assault 6. cruiser grip, short barrel, large bore, home security weapons 7. other B - MARINIZED (special finish, stainless steel) 1. yes 2. no B - QUANTITY + CALIBER OF EACH WEAPON C - TYPE AND AMOUNT OF AMMUNITION CARRIED (mushroom, hollow point, slug, buck shot) D - HOW STORED E - CRUISING GROUNDS 1. America 2. Bahamas 3. Mexico 4. Canada 5. Central America 6. South America 7. Pacific Countries 8. Australia 9. Indian Ocean 10. Africa 11. Northern Europe 12. Mediterranean Is anyone aware of any similar studies? Any thoughts on how to collect this data? We suspect the numbers are very low but have been asked to find some data to support this conclusion. Thanks. Bob |
On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:49:39 -0500, "Doug Dotson"
dougdotson@NOSPAMcablespeedNOSPAMcom wrote: When faced with questions like this, it is best to follow the advice of confucious: It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubts. I believe that this quote came from Samuel Johnson. But as Confucious actually said: " To know is to know that you know nothing. That is the meaning of true knowledge." I bow to your wisdom. Where I read the quote it was attributed to Confucious Weebles Wobble (but they don't fall down) |
On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 11:38:03 -0500, Spam Fighter
wrote: Hi, We are working on a Power Squadron study of the "cruising lifestyle". We need estimates of the absolute number and percentages of cruising boats carrying weapons. That is firearms, not flare pistols, starter pistols, sling shots or spear guns. We are not interested in the debate of whether or not to carry weapons, or why cruisers carry. We wish to estimate the numbers that have chosen to and actually possess and carry while cruising, what they carry and where they go. We would like to break it down by: A - TYPE 1. hand gun 2. shot gun 3. rifle 4. line-throwing gun (safety equipment) 5. assault 6. cruiser grip, short barrel, large bore, home security weapons 7. other B - MARINIZED (special finish, stainless steel) 1. yes 2. no B - QUANTITY + CALIBER OF EACH WEAPON C - TYPE AND AMOUNT OF AMMUNITION CARRIED (mushroom, hollow point, slug, buck shot) D - HOW STORED E - CRUISING GROUNDS 1. America 2. Bahamas 3. Mexico 4. Canada 5. Central America 6. South America 7. Pacific Countries 8. Australia 9. Indian Ocean 10. Africa 11. Northern Europe 12. Mediterranean Is anyone aware of any similar studies? Any thoughts on how to collect this data? We suspect the numbers are very low but have been asked to find some data to support this conclusion. Thanks. Bob You ARE joking? Right? |
How about 4 lb swivel guns fore and aft and 6 pounders at the rail?
"Gogarty" wrote in message ... In article , says... When faced with questions like this, it is best to follow the advice of confucious: It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubts. Questions like this benefit nobody. How right! May I carry a sword? Saber? Scimitar? Or better, a cutlass? |
wrote in message ... On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:49:39 -0500, "Doug Dotson" dougdotson@NOSPAMcablespeedNOSPAMcom wrote: When faced with questions like this, it is best to follow the advice of confucious: It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubts. I believe that this quote came from Samuel Johnson. But as Confucious actually said: " To know is to know that you know nothing. That is the meaning of true knowledge." I bow to your wisdom. Where I read the quote it was attributed to Confucious Weebles Wobble (but they don't fall down) As Confucious also said: A man who has committed a mistake and doesn't correct it, is committing another mistake. :) |
Spam Fighter wrote:
Hi, We are working on a Power Squadron study of the "cruising lifestyle". We need estimates of the absolute number and percentages of cruising boats carrying weapons. That is firearms, not flare pistols, starter pistols, sling shots or spear guns. Dunno about you, but if someone points a flare pistol at me, they have my _undivided_ attention. regards, CrazyCam |
"WaIIy" wrote in message ... On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:52:47 -0500, "Doug Dotson" dougdotson@NOSPAMcablespeedNOSPAMcom wrote: "Dan Best" wrote in message ... You know, it's funny. This question comes up all the time on the net, but rarely, if ever, out here where people are actually doing it (we are about to leave La Paz for points south). I can't remember the last time the guns topic came up while talking with other cruisers. The sense I get is that very few are actually carrying guns. - Dan Very few admit it. While cruising a couple of years ago, I was amazed how many carried guns aboard. Probably better than 50% of the folks I talked to about such things. Doug s/v Callista idiot To borrow a comment from another thread: It is better to be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. --Samuel Johnson. Thank you for oping your mouth and contributing nothing. Doug s/v Callista |
"Doug Dotson" wrote ...
"Dan Best" wrote ... You know, it's funny. This question comes up all the time on the net, but rarely, if ever, out here where people are actually doing it (we are about to leave La Paz for points south). I can't remember the last time the guns topic came up while talking with other cruisers. The sense I get is that very few are actually carrying guns. - Dan Very few admit it. While cruising a couple of years ago, I was amazed how many carried guns aboard. Probably better than 50% of the folks I talked to about such things. And those who don't admit it (to foreign govts) can get in trouble. See the recent case in Indonesia (http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems...2/s1306001.htm): "A Bali court has sentenced Western Australian millionaire yachtsman Christopher Packer to three months jail for firearms offences. "However, the 52-year-old expects to be released in the next few days as he has already served the sentence while awaiting trial on charges of not declaring the presence of weapons on his boat. "Marine police stopped Packer last November as he attempted to leave Indonesian waters on a round-the-world cruise. "They arrested him after finding six firearms on his ship, including a semi-automatic rifle, two pump-action shotguns and a revolver. "On his way into court today, Packer said he was not feeling confident. But there was good news waiting for him inside the courtroom. "The judges found him guilty of the non-criminal offence of failing to report the presence of firearms on his ship and sentenced him to three months in prison, including time already served." Cheers Bil |
Doug Dotson wrote:
"WaIIy" wrote in message idiot To borrow a comment from another thread: It is better to be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. --Samuel Johnson. Thank you for oping your mouth and contributing nothing. Doug s/v Callista he's just mad you opened your mouth and told! Now Wally's worried the Canadian CG is going to board and search for his .44Magnum when he goes to Leamington this summer. |
On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:49:26 +0000, Dan Best wrote:
You know, it's funny. This question comes up all the time on the net, but rarely, if ever, out here where people are actually doing it (we are about to leave La Paz for points south). I can't remember the last time the guns topic came up while talking with other cruisers. The sense I get is that very few are actually carrying guns. - Dan That is exactly what we wanted to write. Our review committee rejected it. They said "FIND" some supporting data. The questions posed in the news group post we 1. Is anyone aware of any similar studies? 2. Any thoughts on how to collect this data? We were not conducting a survey nor were we asking anyone to participate in a survey. Who would consider a news group survey valid? A private email suggested we contact the customs authorities in Bermuda. Bermuda holds weapons for you while in their country. It was suggested they may have some data such as number of boats cleared in, number of boats with weapons. Bob |
"Bil Hansen" wrote in message ... "Doug Dotson" wrote ... "Dan Best" wrote ... You know, it's funny. This question comes up all the time on the net, but rarely, if ever, out here where people are actually doing it (we are about to leave La Paz for points south). I can't remember the last time the guns topic came up while talking with other cruisers. The sense I get is that very few are actually carrying guns. - Dan Very few admit it. While cruising a couple of years ago, I was amazed how many carried guns aboard. Probably better than 50% of the folks I talked to about such things. And those who don't admit it (to foreign govts) can get in trouble. See the recent case in Indonesia (http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems...2/s1306001.htm): "A Bali court has sentenced Western Australian millionaire yachtsman Christopher Packer to three months jail for firearms offences. "However, the 52-year-old expects to be released in the next few days as he has already served the sentence while awaiting trial on charges of not declaring the presence of weapons on his boat. "Marine police stopped Packer last November as he attempted to leave Indonesian waters on a round-the-world cruise. "They arrested him after finding six firearms on his ship, including a semi-automatic rifle, two pump-action shotguns and a revolver. "On his way into court today, Packer said he was not feeling confident. But there was good news waiting for him inside the courtroom. "The judges found him guilty of the non-criminal offence of failing to report the presence of firearms on his ship and sentenced him to three months in prison, including time already served." Choosing to carry firearms in coutries where they are illagal is another matter. Anyone that gets caught deserves what they get. Cheers Bil |
I don't carry a gun on me or my boat, but guns on boats discussions should be made with a bit of discretion. We just went through this discussion a bit ago on alt.rv. Should we or should we not carry firearms in our RV. I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Leanne |
On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 12:24:55 -0500, "Leanne" wrote:
I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Leanne For several years, I worked where I had to carry cash to make night deposits after closing in a bad area. I carried a gun on me. On three occasions I had people attempt to rob me. I never found out if I would have pulled the trigger. On all three occasions when I pulled out the weapon the encounter ended abruptly without the gun even being fully pointed at the robbers. Had they been armed I would have left the gun where it was and handed over the cash as I am not good enough for a quick draw contest with anyone. My point is, most of the time, presence of a gun stops most threats. For this same reason, I keep a pump shotgun in the bedroom. Even in the dark, bad guys know the sound of a 12 gauge being racked. Shooting someone with it is not required in order for the gun to prevent bad things happening. Personally, I much prefer for the kind of outcome I had. It is much better for punks to run away than to spend the next three days talking to the police after you legitimately shoot them. And talking to the police for three days is much superior to being killed myself or having my family harmed. Weebles Wobble (but they don't fall down) |
In article , "Leanne"
wrote: We just went through this discussion a bit ago on alt.rv. Should we or should we not carry firearms in our RV. I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Leanne I NEVER travel without a firearm, period. I put up with all the tagging and airport security BS, and follow all the Laws that are in place, where I travel, but I ALWAYS have a firearm with me when I travel. This is a holdout from when I traveled all year long, for my employer in the bush of alaska. It isn't a giant problem if you keep up on the Law where your going and what it takes to comply. It does take extra time at security checkpoints, but if your prepared, it isn't prohibitive. I also hold an US FFL (Federal Firearms License) and compliance with those Laws are a whole lot harder to deal with. When I had a boat, it had a Customs Security Safe built in to the Stateroom that had both a Combination Lock and Customs Security Seal Hasp Attachment, so that any Customs Official could seal the Safe, while in Port, the same as any big ship has. Worked fine whereever I went. Kept a semiauto rifle in 308 Nato, a Stainless 12Ga Shotgun, and my Browning HiPower 9mm semiauto pistol in there along with all the "required" Tax Free Booze. Canadians Customs used to pitch a fit whenever I came thru, but since they could seal the Safe, it just caused them to have to do a lot more "Paperwork", which they didn't like. Bruce in alaska -- add a 2 before @ |
"Leanne" wrote.......
.. I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Depends. I knew a man who ran a gas station in D.C. He got robbed several times. He said that once they had your money the crooks always just turned and walked away. He could have shot any or all of them but the $50 or $100 wasn't worth the hassle. OTOH,when trespassers threatened his livestock, he couldn't shoot them soon enough! Didn't kill any because he started shooting too soon but it wasn't from lack of effort and he gave them some birdshot to take home. |
Bruce in Alaska wrote:
In article , "Leanne" wrote: We just went through this discussion a bit ago on alt.rv. Should we or should we not carry firearms in our RV. I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Leanne I NEVER travel without a firearm, period. I put up with all the tagging and airport security BS, and follow all the Laws that are in place, where I travel, but I ALWAYS have a firearm with me when I travel. This is a holdout from when I traveled all year long, for my employer in the bush of alaska. ... This could explain why the murder rate in Alaska is higher than in New York City. |
|
Bruce in Alaska wrote:
I NEVER travel without a firearm, period. ... Stay away from Sweden then. Dag Stenberg |
Leanne wrote:
I don't carry a gun on me or my boat, but guns on boats discussions should be made with a bit of discretion. We just went through this discussion a bit ago on alt.rv. Should we or should we not carry firearms in our RV. I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Leanne Of the 30,000 gun deaths in the in 2002, only 300 were "legal interventions." I would guess most of these were professionals (police, etc.). Over 750 were accidental. About 12000 were homicides and more than half were suicide. Over 600 were 14 years of age or under. Its pretty clear that if a gun is fired and kills someone, its far more likely that the victim will be a family member, friend, or child, than than a criminal. Of course, these stats don't tell us how many crimes were prevented by the threat of a gun. In some neighborhoods, and for some businesses, this is clearly a factor, but for the average family, I think a gun is a liability. http://webapp.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/mortrate10_sy.html |
On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:43:51 -0500, Jeff Morris
wrote: Leanne wrote: I don't carry a gun on me or my boat, but guns on boats discussions should be made with a bit of discretion. We just went through this discussion a bit ago on alt.rv. Should we or should we not carry firearms in our RV. I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Leanne Of the 30,000 gun deaths in the in 2002, only 300 were "legal interventions." I would guess most of these were professionals (police, etc.). Over 750 were accidental. About 12000 were homicides and more than half were suicide. Over 600 were 14 years of age or under. Its pretty clear that if a gun is fired and kills someone, its far more likely that the victim will be a family member, friend, or child, than than a criminal. Of course, these stats don't tell us how many crimes were prevented by the threat of a gun. In some neighborhoods, and for some businesses, this is clearly a factor, but for the average family, I think a gun is a liability. http://webapp.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/mortrate10_sy.html back in the 80's, a suburb of Chicago, Morton Grove, outlawed handgun ownership. In response to this, a suburb of Atlanta, Kennesaw, passed a law requiring gun ownership. In the 2 decades since this happened, Morton Grove has maintained the rate of increase in violent crime of any Chicago suburbs. At the same time, Kennesaw has had the lowest rate of property and personal crime and violence. The only 2 handgun murders in Kennesaw were at hotels there, not in homes in the community. Think about it. If you are a criminal, are you going to go to the one community where everyone is required to have a gun or the one where nobody is allowed to have one. The problem with gun control is that its only obeyed by the law abiding. Criminals are generally unaffected. Weebles Wobble (but they don't fall down) |
On 18 Feb 2005 20:31:53 GMT, "Dag Stenberg"
wrote: wrote: My point is, most of the time, presence of a gun stops most threats. For this same reason, I keep a pump shotgun in the bedroom. Even in the dark, bad guys know the sound of a 12 gauge being racked. As I have heard, this usually results in a family member getting shot. Like your daughter who has had a bad dream and tries to get comfort from her parents. Dag Stenberg No daughters sleeping in my house. If you are moving in my house at night, you are a legitimate target. Weebles Wobble (but they don't fall down) |
"Doug Dotson" wrote...
"Bil Hansen" wrote ... "Doug Dotson" wrote ... "Dan Best" wrote ... You know, it's funny. This question comes up all the time on the net, but rarely, if ever, out here where people are actually doing it (we are about to leave La Paz for points south). I can't remember the last time the guns topic came up while talking with other cruisers. The sense I get is that very few are actually carrying guns. - Dan Very few admit it. While cruising a couple of years ago, I was amazed how many carried guns aboard. Probably better than 50% of the folks I talked to about such things. And those who don't admit it (to foreign govts) can get in trouble. See the recent case in Indonesia (http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems...2/s1306001.htm): "A Bali court has sentenced Western Australian millionaire yachtsman Christopher Packer to three months jail for firearms offences. snip "The judges found him guilty of the non-criminal offence of failing to report the presence of firearms on his ship and sentenced him to three months in prison, including time already served." Choosing to carry firearms in coutries where they are illagal is another matter. Anyone that gets caught deserves what they get. The point of the Packer case is that Packer failed to report the presence of firearms (ie the case was not about the legality of firearms in Indonesia). And two of his crew, disgruntled during the voyage, dobbed him into the Indonesian authorities. So ... no disgruntled crew and the authorities would likely not have known that Packer had his several weapons aboard. Cheers Bil |
wrote:
On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:43:51 -0500, Jeff Morris wrote: Leanne wrote: I don't carry a gun on me or my boat, but guns on boats discussions should be made with a bit of discretion. We just went through this discussion a bit ago on alt.rv. Should we or should we not carry firearms in our RV. I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Leanne Of the 30,000 gun deaths in the in 2002, only 300 were "legal interventions." I would guess most of these were professionals (police, etc.). Over 750 were accidental. About 12000 were homicides and more than half were suicide. Over 600 were 14 years of age or under. Its pretty clear that if a gun is fired and kills someone, its far more likely that the victim will be a family member, friend, or child, than than a criminal. Of course, these stats don't tell us how many crimes were prevented by the threat of a gun. In some neighborhoods, and for some businesses, this is clearly a factor, but for the average family, I think a gun is a liability. http://webapp.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/mortrate10_sy.html back in the 80's, a suburb of Chicago, Morton Grove, outlawed handgun ownership. In response to this, a suburb of Atlanta, Kennesaw, passed a law requiring gun ownership. In the 2 decades since this happened, Morton Grove has maintained the rate of increase in violent crime of any Chicago suburbs. At the same time, Kennesaw has had the lowest rate of property and personal crime and violence. The only 2 handgun murders in Kennesaw were at hotels there, not in homes in the community. You should get your fact straight before you parrot the arguments of others. Kennesaw has a low crime rate, but not lower than many other "bedroom suburbs" around Atlanta. If you compare to Massachusetts, which gun advocates decry as a failed experiment in ultra liberal gun control (we require a license for ownership), the Kennesaw crime rate is rather high - double that of many towns in the state. Burglaries, for instance, are much more common than in the city I live in. |
On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:14:19 -0500, Jeff Morris
wrote: wrote: On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:43:51 -0500, Jeff Morris wrote: Leanne wrote: I don't carry a gun on me or my boat, but guns on boats discussions should be made with a bit of discretion. We just went through this discussion a bit ago on alt.rv. Should we or should we not carry firearms in our RV. I wonder how many gun owners have killed with their weapon. It takes a lot of nerve to actually do it. Talking is easy. Leanne Of the 30,000 gun deaths in the in 2002, only 300 were "legal interventions." I would guess most of these were professionals (police, etc.). Over 750 were accidental. About 12000 were homicides and more than half were suicide. Over 600 were 14 years of age or under. Its pretty clear that if a gun is fired and kills someone, its far more likely that the victim will be a family member, friend, or child, than than a criminal. Of course, these stats don't tell us how many crimes were prevented by the threat of a gun. In some neighborhoods, and for some businesses, this is clearly a factor, but for the average family, I think a gun is a liability. http://webapp.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/mortrate10_sy.html back in the 80's, a suburb of Chicago, Morton Grove, outlawed handgun ownership. In response to this, a suburb of Atlanta, Kennesaw, passed a law requiring gun ownership. In the 2 decades since this happened, Morton Grove has maintained the rate of increase in violent crime of any Chicago suburbs. At the same time, Kennesaw has had the lowest rate of property and personal crime and violence. The only 2 handgun murders in Kennesaw were at hotels there, not in homes in the community. You should get your fact straight before you parrot the arguments of others. Kennesaw has a low crime rate, but not lower than many other "bedroom suburbs" around Atlanta. If you compare to Massachusetts, which gun advocates decry as a failed experiment in ultra liberal gun control (we require a license for ownership), the Kennesaw crime rate is rather high - double that of many towns in the state. Burglaries, for instance, are much more common than in the city I live in. Not sure where you are getting your stats (I live in the Atlanta area and worked for many years in Kennesaw and am well aware of the local crime stats, esp. burglary and violent crime rates) Weebles Wobble (but they don't fall down) |
On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:49:39 -0500, "Doug Dotson"
dougdotson@NOSPAMcablespeedNOSPAMcom wrote: When faced with questions like this, it is best to follow the advice of confucious: It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubts. I believe that this quote came from Samuel Johnson. But as Confucious actually said: " To know is to know that you know nothing. That is the meaning of true knowledge." K'ung-fu-tzu or Kongfuzi is usually rendered in English as Confucius Brian W |
On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 21:26:46 GMT, WaIIy
wrote: On 18 Feb 2005 20:31:53 GMT, "Dag Stenberg" wrote: wrote: My point is, most of the time, presence of a gun stops most threats. For this same reason, I keep a pump shotgun in the bedroom. Even in the dark, bad guys know the sound of a 12 gauge being racked. As I have heard, this usually results in a family member getting shot. Like your daughter who has had a bad dream and tries to get comfort from her parents. Dag Stenberg "As I have heard" "this usually" Gimme a break Folks who won't learn from others' experience are destined to learn another way. Brian W |
What about 12 ga flare pistols fitted with a metal insert for .410 ga
shotgun shells? "manson" wrote in message ... Spam Fighter wrote: Hi, We are working on a Power Squadron study of the "cruising lifestyle". We need estimates of the absolute number and percentages of cruising boats carrying weapons. That is firearms, not flare pistols, starter pistols, sling shots or spear guns. Dunno about you, but if someone points a flare pistol at me, they have my _undivided_ attention. regards, CrazyCam ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
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