Curiouser and curiouser...

I'm on the trail of doing an arch, and I learned that many first make
mockups with plastic PVC conduit before getting into cutting the tubing to
actually make them. I went to check it out and found that the conduit is
actually Schedule 40 grey pipe. I can't imagine why something just to
contain electrical wire would have to be S40, but it was.

It's got lovely sweep elbows, with nipple-type (wide end to glue up to pipe
end) Street El fittings, and it's very inexpensive.

So, my question is, would this work for the Schedule 40 pipe installations
in sanitary service, as specified by the SeaLand folks (who make the
fittings to match up to them so you can get the hose on the non-pipe
section)?

Is the conduit the same size as the PVC pipe, or, perhaps, is one of them an
ID and the other an OD measurement?

Just thinking of how I might maximize my purchase and minimize my travels
:{))

L8R

Skip and Lydia, off to work on the boat next week...

--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig
http://tinyurl.com/384p2

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore.
Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain

From: "Skip Gundlach"


I'm on the trail of doing an arch, and I learned that many first make
mockups with plastic PVC conduit before getting into cutting the tubing to
actually make them. I went to check it out and found that the conduit is
actually Schedule 40 grey pipe. I can't imagine why something just to
contain electrical wire would have to be S40, but it was.

It's got lovely sweep elbows, with nipple-type (wide end to glue up to pipe
end) Street El fittings, and it's very inexpensive.

So, my question is, would this work for the Schedule 40 pipe installations
in sanitary service, as specified by the SeaLand folks (who make the
fittings to match up to them so you can get the hose on the non-pipe
section)?

Is the conduit the same size as the PVC pipe, or, perhaps, is one of them an
ID and the other an OD measurement?

Just thinking of how I might maximize my purchase and minimize my travels
:{))

Did I miss the part where he's planning to plumb his toilet to go
through the arch...??? I can't think of any other reason anyone would
need my input in this topic.
--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://69.20.93.241/store/customer/p...40&cat=&page=1

Subject: Head trip - paging Ms. Peggie Hall, Ms. Peggie Hall.......
From: Peggie Hall

Did I miss the part where he's planning to plumb his toilet to go
through the arch...???

Close, it's this part I thought you could help him with:

I went to check it out and found that the conduit is
actually Schedule 40 grey pipe.
So, my question is, would this work for the Schedule 40 pipe installations
in sanitary service,


Capt. Bill

LaBomba182 wrote:
Did I miss the part where he's planning to plumb his toilet to go
through the arch...???


Close, it's this part I thought you could help him with:

I went to check it out and found that the conduit is

actually Schedule 40 grey pipe.

So, my question is, would this work for the Schedule 40 pipe installations

in sanitary service,


Ah...I did miss that part. Yes, it can be used in sanitation systems,
but is only recommended for long straight runs. And it must be
"soft-coupled" to anything fixed in the system--toilet, tank, thru-hull,
y-valve, overboard discharge pump--with enough hose to provide shock
absorption and protection from cracking due to hull flexing...so unless
you have a long straight run of 10' of more (unlikely in any properly
designed system on a boat under about 60') you'd have so many unions in
the plumbing (potential leaks) that it's not worth doing.

Plumb your system with AVS96 sanitation hose (the mfr's original name
for the same hose SeaLand sold as the "OdorSafe" brand for a number of
years, now sold direct for $5/ft cut to any length), PVC fittings are ok.


--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://69.20.93.241/store/customer/p...40&cat=&page=1

From: "Skip Gundlach"
To: "Peggie Hall"
Subject: Head trip - paging Ms. Peggie Hall, Ms. Peggie Hall.......
Date: Monday, October 18, 2004 8:30 PM

OK, now having returned from my first plumbing expedition, I see that there
are some responses. Peggie, my apologies for the paging - it wasn't I :{))
My title was "- Pipe down, you'se guys! he said Archly" - a Swiftie which
was lost in the translation...


I went to check it out and found that the conduit is

actually Schedule 40 grey pipe.

So, my question is, would this work for the Schedule 40 pipe
installations

in sanitary service,


Ah...I did miss that part. Yes, it can be used in sanitation systems, but
is only recommended for long straight runs. And it must be "soft-coupled"
to anything fixed in the system--toilet, tank, thru-hull, y-valve,
overboard discharge pump--with enough hose to provide shock absorption and
protection from cracking due to hull flexing...so unless you have a long
straight run of 10' of more (unlikely in any properly designed system on a
boat under about 60') you'd have so many unions in the plumbing (potential
leaks) that it's not worth doing.

Plumb your system with AVS96 sanitation hose (the mfr's original name for
the same hose SeaLand sold as the "OdorSafe" brand for a number of years,
now sold direct for $5/ft cut to any length), PVC fittings are ok.

I'm glad to see that it's available inexpensively (relatively speaking).
Since our last exchange on the subject, what's happened about the SLOSafe
replacement made in Italy? And, I was unable to find info about fittings.
Do you know if aussiegroup handles that, as well?

Back to the subject at hand, if getting them in is as easy as getting them
out, I'm all for not doing it again. Granted, I had to take out something
on the order of double, in that I removed the aft Lectra-San, with its
attendant very long runs of hose, *plus* the very tall vented loop runs
(seems just *asking* for trouble to have to pump it that high in order to
get it out of the boat at the bottom! - you can see it in the /engine
room/electrical panels of the boatpix from the below URL), but the wrestling
match I had to go through isn't something I'm looking forward to
duplicating! On the subject of the vented loop, it's *right* on the
centerline, and, based on the lavatory in the aft head, considerably above
the water line. On the center line, how far above the water line does it
have to be for safety? Above any level of conceivable heel's waterline?
Given that it's full of water and other crap (pardon the expression), all
the time, against the duckbill, it makes me wonder.

On the subject of joints, I'm of distinctly curious mind. While my current
home isn't this way, my prior home had hundreds of feet of PVC pipe run,
with all the necessary ells, Ts and other fittings, all successfully
carrying high pressure hot and cold water. With the hot, there was notable
deformation of the pipe as it expanded and contracted due to hot vs
room-temp water, over long runs. No leaks, no falures, in 25 years.
Properly supported, I am clueless as to how a no-pressure (well, aside from
the 2.5' head) 1.5" line would be at risk of failure

If I keep the existing height of the vented loop, that's about 2.5 feet each
way, plus the elbows to and from. The "supply" is about 1.5 or so feet, and
the waste out is another 3 feet or so (currently - I may have a thru-hull
available closer when I'm through ripping out stuff in there). If it won't
make the corners readily, I'd have to use ells, anyway, doubling my joints.

The current vented loop has a screw-in couple of SeaLand connectors or the
like. I'd see using a screw-in PVC with Teflon tape, and a coupler joint to
the pipe (no corroding clamps - or, better, a nippe/joint, saving me one
more glue-up on each side). If I had to redo it, I could just saw it off
and start over (unscrew and insert new after sawing). I'd have two
terminations of SeaLand PVC, and 8 clamps (two each at both ends of both
terminations), and very little hose, and only two elbows plus the joints at
the vented loop. So, I'd have the same number of clamps, and the same
number of hose connections, but only a foot or two of hose, and the rest
solid installation.

Am I missing something?

The forward head isn't as convenient in straight runs, so that one likely
will have mostly hose. I'm glad for the savings with the lower prices...

The stuff I took out of the aft head was either exhaust hose or very brittle
and fully saturated white pipe. I rather suspect it was not the SeaLand
OdorSafe :{/)

L8R

Skip (and Lydia, by proxy), champing at the bit to cast off, now that refit
is actually under way!

Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig
http://tinyurl.com/384p2

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore.
Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain

On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 13:36:26 -0400, "Skip Gundlach" skip sez make this
all one word with my last name next to my first gundlach@adelphia dot
fish catcher net (sorry bout the spamtrap!) wrote:

Curiouser and curiouser...

I'm on the trail of doing an arch, and I learned that many first make
mockups with plastic PVC conduit before getting into cutting the tubing to
actually make them. I went to check it out and found that the conduit is
actually Schedule 40 grey pipe.
//
It's got lovely sweep elbows, with nipple-type (wide end to glue up to pipe
end) Street El fittings, and it's very inexpensive.

So, my question is, would this work for the Schedule 40 pipe installations
in sanitary service,
//
Is the conduit the same size as the PVC pipe, or, perhaps, is one of them an
ID and the other an OD measurement?
//
L8R

Skip and Lydia, off to work on the boat next week...

Walking around the local ACE hardware, I picked up a water elbow in 2
inch and fitted it snugly to a two inch grey electrical sch 40
conduit.

I deduce that the electrical conduit is intended for above ground use
and is sunlight resistant.
I am not sure that the plastic plumbing has much UV resistance at all.

That seems like the principal difference that jumped out at me.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

"Skip Gundlach" writes:

I went to check it out and found that the conduit is
actually Schedule 40 grey pipe.

As far as the pipe size is concerned, correct.

Fittings are a different matter.

So, my question is, would this work for the Schedule 40 pipe installations
in sanitary service,

Negative.

Sch 40 pipe (white PVC), ABS (Black) and sch 80 pipe (gray PVC), are rated
for sanitation service, but who in their right mind would put it on a boat?

White PVC has no UV inhibitors and if left in the sun, will probably
fracture in less than 1 year in a place like SoCal or Fla.

Conduit and Sch 80 pipe both have UV inhibitors.

HTH

Lew

Actually the engineers at Sealand and Raritan have no objection to Sched 40
PVC. In fact Sealand recommends it over hose. Much less subject to odor
permeation. Just use short lengths of hose between the pipe and the
fixtures and tanks to handle movement.

Being located down in the bilge and behind cabinet work, if sunlight gets to
the pipe UV degradation is the least of your worries. :-)


"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Skip Gundlach" writes:

I went to check it out and found that the conduit is
actually Schedule 40 grey pipe.

As far as the pipe size is concerned, correct.

Fittings are a different matter.

So, my question is, would this work for the Schedule 40 pipe
installations
in sanitary service,

Negative.

Sch 40 pipe (white PVC), ABS (Black) and sch 80 pipe (gray PVC), are rated
for sanitation service, but who in their right mind would put it on a
boat?

White PVC has no UV inhibitors and if left in the sun, will probably
fracture in less than 1 year in a place like SoCal or Fla.

Conduit and Sch 80 pipe both have UV inhibitors.

HTH

Lew

"Glenn Ashmore" writes:
Actually the engineers at Sealand and Raritan have no objection to Sched
40
PVC. In fact Sealand recommends it over hose. Much less subject to odor
permeation. Just use short lengths of hose between the pipe and the
fixtures and tanks to handle movement.
snip

The potential for leaks increases geometrically with the number of
connections.

A simple of hose has two (2) process connections.

Replace with a piece of PVC pipe and a short length of have on each end, you
have 4 process connections.

Maybe on a stink boat, but never on mine.

I'll stay /w/ hose and replace as needed.

Lew