Both of my power boats have developed severe engine hesitation
problems. They run okay at idle but sputter and stall when revved. My
mechanics have complained that they are seeing this problem left and
right - and are blaming it on the gasoline, which around here (Long
Island, NY) now contains 10% ethanol. I know ethanol is not good for
rubberized fuel lines, but did not know it caused running problems
(unless the fuel lines are deteriorating and clogging). The gas in each
boat was purchased at a different fuel dock.

If my mechanics are correct, this is a serious regional (national?)
problem. Anyone else experiencing difficulty? Any comments or
suggestions? How can we get gasoline without ethanol in it? How is the
marine industry addressing this?

Larry Weiss
"...Ever After!"
"a little after..."

Larry Weiss wrote in message ...
Both of my power boats have developed severe engine hesitation
problems. They run okay at idle but sputter and stall when revved. My
mechanics have complained that they are seeing this problem left and
right - and are blaming it on the gasoline, which around here (Long
Island, NY) now contains 10% ethanol. I know ethanol is not good for
rubberized fuel lines, but did not know it caused running problems
(unless the fuel lines are deteriorating and clogging). The gas in each
boat was purchased at a different fuel dock.

If my mechanics are correct, this is a serious regional (national?)
problem. Anyone else experiencing difficulty? Any comments or
suggestions? How can we get gasoline without ethanol in it? How is the
marine industry addressing this?


I have experienced some cars also not runnig with ethanol blend ... I
dont know the technical reason, but may speculate its different
properties dont lead to proper air mix.

Aside from that you should never use ethanol fuel in 2 strokes.

Matt

Aside from that you should never use ethanol fuel in 2 strokes.


we used to mix ethanol into the gas in our outboards when I was kid to increase
hp (local law limited hp to kids under 12 to 10) and it made our boats go
faster. why can't you use ethanol in 2 strokes?

You can use straight ethanol if you want ..... but you have to change
the jets in a carb or change the 'open' interval in a TBI or Injection
system. Ethanol burns hotter and more completely but requires a much
richer (fuel/air ratio) mixture. For simple injection systems all that
needed is to increase the fuel 'rail' pressure a bit to affect MORE
fuel pressure to the injector(s). For a carburated engine the old
'rule of thumb' when rejetting was to double the orfice diameter when
running on straight ETOH .... thats 180 proof, hic, ..... *;‹s
Depending on the coloric value of the fuel, 90% ETOH required 4 times
the volumetric flow in comparison to 100 Octane gasoline.

For the original poster who was complaing of hesitation, etc. with ETOH
10% ... you need to change the injector 'open' interval value or
consider changing jets to affect a richer mixture.


In article , JAXAshby
wrote:

Aside from that you should never use ethanol fuel in 2 strokes.


we used to mix ethanol into the gas in our outboards when I was kid to
increase
hp (local law limited hp to kids under 12 to 10) and it made our boats go
faster. why can't you use ethanol in 2 strokes?

does anyone remember "green bug juice" racing fuel? Sometimes known as "canned
horsepower"?



You can use straight ethanol if you want ..... but you have to change
the jets in a carb or change the 'open' interval in a TBI or Injection
system. Ethanol burns hotter and more completely but requires a much
richer (fuel/air ratio) mixture. For simple injection systems all that
needed is to increase the fuel 'rail' pressure a bit to affect MORE
fuel pressure to the injector(s). For a carburated engine the old
'rule of thumb' when rejetting was to double the orfice diameter when
running on straight ETOH .... thats 180 proof, hic, ..... *;‹s
Depending on the coloric value of the fuel, 90% ETOH required 4 times
the volumetric flow in comparison to 100 Octane gasoline.

For the original poster who was complaing of hesitation, etc. with ETOH
10% ... you need to change the injector 'open' interval value or
consider changing jets to affect a richer mixture.


In article , JAXAshby
wrote:

Aside from that you should never use ethanol fuel in 2 strokes.


we used to mix ethanol into the gas in our outboards when I was kid to
increase
hp (local law limited hp to kids under 12 to 10) and it made our boats go
faster. why can't you use ethanol in 2 strokes?

Ethanol, or alcohol, mixes with any water. It's used up here by some in the
winter (auto engines) to pick up any condensation and so on to prevent gas
line freeze. So, if the alcohol in the mix becomes saturated (with water), a
drop in temperature will cause that water to be dumped, leaving the water in
the fuel system ... especially not good in injected engines. If that's
what's happening, maybe a water separator mounted close to the engine might
be an idea? The dumping of water by saturated ethanol fuel caused by a drop
in temperature is a fact ... but a 10% mix ... ???

"Larry Weiss" wrote in message
...
Both of my power boats have developed severe engine hesitation
problems. They run okay at idle but sputter and stall when revved. My
mechanics have complained that they are seeing this problem left and
right - and are blaming it on the gasoline, which around here (Long
Island, NY) now contains 10% ethanol. I know ethanol is not good for
rubberized fuel lines, but did not know it caused running problems
(unless the fuel lines are deteriorating and clogging). The gas in each
boat was purchased at a different fuel dock.

If my mechanics are correct, this is a serious regional (national?)
problem. Anyone else experiencing difficulty? Any comments or
suggestions? How can we get gasoline without ethanol in it? How is the
marine industry addressing this?

Larry Weiss
"...Ever After!"
"a little after..."

alcohol and water are 100% missible (sp?) with each other, meaning there is no
such thing as a water saturated alcohol solution.

Ethanol, or alcohol, mixes with any water. It's used up here by some in the
winter (auto engines) to pick up any condensation and so on to prevent gas
line freeze. So, if the alcohol in the mix becomes saturated (with water), a
drop in temperature will cause that water to be dumped, leaving the water in
the fuel system ... especially not good in injected engines. If that's
what's happening, maybe a water separator mounted close to the engine might
be an idea? The dumping of water by saturated ethanol fuel caused by a drop
in temperature is a fact ... but a 10% mix ... ???

"Larry Weiss" wrote in message
...
Both of my power boats have developed severe engine hesitation
problems. They run okay at idle but sputter and stall when revved. My
mechanics have complained that they are seeing this problem left and
right - and are blaming it on the gasoline, which around here (Long
Island, NY) now contains 10% ethanol. I know ethanol is not good for
rubberized fuel lines, but did not know it caused running problems
(unless the fuel lines are deteriorating and clogging). The gas in each
boat was purchased at a different fuel dock.

If my mechanics are correct, this is a serious regional (national?)
problem. Anyone else experiencing difficulty? Any comments or
suggestions? How can we get gasoline without ethanol in it? How is the
marine industry addressing this?

Larry Weiss
"...Ever After!"
"a little after..."

Wrong.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
alcohol and water are 100% missible (sp?) with each other, meaning there
is no
such thing as a water saturated alcohol solution.

Ethanol, or alcohol, mixes with any water. It's used up here by some in
the
winter (auto engines) to pick up any condensation and so on to prevent
gas
line freeze. So, if the alcohol in the mix becomes saturated (with
water), a
drop in temperature will cause that water to be dumped, leaving the water
in
the fuel system ... especially not good in injected engines. If that's
what's happening, maybe a water separator mounted close to the engine
might
be an idea? The dumping of water by saturated ethanol fuel caused by a
drop
in temperature is a fact ... but a 10% mix ... ???

"Larry Weiss" wrote in message
...
Both of my power boats have developed severe engine hesitation
problems. They run okay at idle but sputter and stall when revved. My
mechanics have complained that they are seeing this problem left and
right - and are blaming it on the gasoline, which around here (Long
Island, NY) now contains 10% ethanol. I know ethanol is not good for
rubberized fuel lines, but did not know it caused running problems
(unless the fuel lines are deteriorating and clogging). The gas in
each
boat was purchased at a different fuel dock.

If my mechanics are correct, this is a serious regional (national?)
problem. Anyone else experiencing difficulty? Any comments or
suggestions? How can we get gasoline without ethanol in it? How is
the
marine industry addressing this?

Larry Weiss
"...Ever After!"
"a little after..."

don't tell it to me, tell to those with PhD's in chemistry.

Wrong.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
alcohol and water are 100% missible (sp?) with each other, meaning there
is no
such thing as a water saturated alcohol solution.

Ethanol, or alcohol, mixes with any water. It's used up here by some in
the
winter (auto engines) to pick up any condensation and so on to prevent
gas
line freeze. So, if the alcohol in the mix becomes saturated (with
water), a
drop in temperature will cause that water to be dumped, leaving the water
in
the fuel system ... especially not good in injected engines. If that's
what's happening, maybe a water separator mounted close to the engine
might
be an idea? The dumping of water by saturated ethanol fuel caused by a
drop
in temperature is a fact ... but a 10% mix ... ???

"Larry Weiss" wrote in message
...
Both of my power boats have developed severe engine hesitation
problems. They run okay at idle but sputter and stall when revved. My
mechanics have complained that they are seeing this problem left and
right - and are blaming it on the gasoline, which around here (Long
Island, NY) now contains 10% ethanol. I know ethanol is not good for
rubberized fuel lines, but did not know it caused running problems
(unless the fuel lines are deteriorating and clogging). The gas in
each
boat was purchased at a different fuel dock.

If my mechanics are correct, this is a serious regional (national?)
problem. Anyone else experiencing difficulty? Any comments or
suggestions? How can we get gasoline without ethanol in it? How is
the
marine industry addressing this?

Larry Weiss
"...Ever After!"
"a little after..."

Immiscible liquids are liquids that do not dissolve in one another. Some
combinations of liquids mix in all proportions, e.g. alcohol and water, mix
at some compositions but not at others, or hardly mix at all, e.g. gasoline
and water.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
don't tell it to me, tell to those with PhD's in chemistry.

Wrong.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
alcohol and water are 100% missible (sp?) with each other, meaning
there
is no
such thing as a water saturated alcohol solution.

Ethanol, or alcohol, mixes with any water. It's used up here by some
in
the
winter (auto engines) to pick up any condensation and so on to prevent
gas
line freeze. So, if the alcohol in the mix becomes saturated (with
water), a
drop in temperature will cause that water to be dumped, leaving the
water
in
the fuel system ... especially not good in injected engines. If that's
what's happening, maybe a water separator mounted close to the engine
might
be an idea? The dumping of water by saturated ethanol fuel caused by a
drop
in temperature is a fact ... but a 10% mix ... ???

"Larry Weiss" wrote in message
...
Both of my power boats have developed severe engine hesitation
problems. They run okay at idle but sputter and stall when revved.
My
mechanics have complained that they are seeing this problem left and
right - and are blaming it on the gasoline, which around here (Long
Island, NY) now contains 10% ethanol. I know ethanol is not good
for
rubberized fuel lines, but did not know it caused running problems
(unless the fuel lines are deteriorating and clogging). The gas in
each
boat was purchased at a different fuel dock.

If my mechanics are correct, this is a serious regional (national?)
problem. Anyone else experiencing difficulty? Any comments or
suggestions? How can we get gasoline without ethanol in it? How is
the
marine industry addressing this?

Larry Weiss
"...Ever After!"
"a little after..."