Comments below.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
...
Doug,

I don't see a chain grabber in the current W.Marine catalog buy do see a
chain grabber for $20 in Hamilton Marine's.

West Marine catalog page 723 lower right corner.

The add says the shackle holes are 1/2", which apparently requires a
shackle to use.

Two shackles, one for each side to connect to a eye in the
line.

How exactly does the manufacturer intend that it be used, assuming it's
like yours ?

It is a bridle. A short line from each side of the Grabber (maybe 6-8')
goes to each bow cleat. Chain is grabbed in the slot. It distributes the
load across both bow cleats. Also helps to reduce swinging on
anchor.


Thanks,
Courtney


Doug Dotson wrote:

West Marine sells something called a Chain Grabber for $20.
We have used one for years and love it. Not sure if this is
what you are after. Ours is just galvanized.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
...

I've seen chromed ones that are quite high but would prefer to buy a
sturdy plain one.

Same for Samson post, etc..

BTW, what's a devil's claw ?

Gratefully,
Courtney
--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619






--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619

On Sat, 11 Sep 2004 09:15:55 -0500, Courtney Thomas
wrote:

Wouldn't a fixed stopper be better in that... [it conceptually seems to
me]... the chain could "fall out" of the grabber [I realize it's under
tension] in that it has no restraining "lock", as do the fixed ones [in
effect] ?

==========================================

What we are talking about here is a "chain hook" not a "chain
stopper".

I have both on my trawler. THe chain stopper came as standard
equipment and is deck mounted just forward of the windlass. It is of
heavy duty bronze construction, with a pivoting pawl which flips down
and grabs a chain link. I believe it may have been made by Galley
Maid in FL but I'm not sure. Their phone number is 561-848-8696. Ask
for Jimmy, he is alledged to know everything.

The chain hooks were purchased at W-M. Mine are shackled to 3/4 inch
nylon line via an eye splice and thimble. The slot in the hook is
barely larger than a 3/8 chain link and tends to grab on fairly
snuggly. I've never had one shake loose accidently and it would be
virtually impossible unless the hook line were totally slack.

Doug,

One final query....

Please don't regard my enquiry as being argumentative, rather a grasping
by an inexperienced chain stopper user :-)

Wouldn't a fixed stopper be better in that... [it conceptually seems to
me]... the chain could "fall out" of the grabber [I realize it's under
tension] in that it has no restraining "lock", as do the fixed ones [in
effect] ?

I guess you use it with the "slot" up ?

Appreciatively,
Courtney



Doug Dotson wrote:

Comments below.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
...

Doug,

I don't see a chain grabber in the current W.Marine catalog buy do see a
chain grabber for $20 in Hamilton Marine's.


West Marine catalog page 723 lower right corner.


The add says the shackle holes are 1/2", which apparently requires a
shackle to use.


Two shackles, one for each side to connect to a eye in the
line.


How exactly does the manufacturer intend that it be used, assuming it's
like yours ?


It is a bridle. A short line from each side of the Grabber (maybe 6-8')
goes to each bow cleat. Chain is grabbed in the slot. It distributes the
load across both bow cleats. Also helps to reduce swinging on
anchor.



Thanks,
Courtney


Doug Dotson wrote:


West Marine sells something called a Chain Grabber for $20.
We have used one for years and love it. Not sure if this is
what you are after. Ours is just galvanized.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
...


I've seen chromed ones that are quite high but would prefer to buy a
sturdy plain one.

Same for Samson post, etc..

BTW, what's a devil's claw ?

Gratefully,
Courtney
--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619





--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619






--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619

"Horace Brownbag" wrote in message
news
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 17:49:48 -0500, Courtney Thomas
wrote:

I finally found it on WM. It's the same as the one at Hamilton Marine.

Since you already have a chain hook, why not use 2 shackles attached to
the hook's shackle to balance it out port&starboard, and then you might
not need the chain grabber at all.

Courtney


Couple of reasons we don't do the two-shackles bit...

The first is that there's a line through the eye which more than takes up
the space allotted. It must have been put in as new, cuz it surely doesn't
want to move, now (inferred age, salt, UV caused expansion somewhat).

The other is that the eye isn't big enough to accommodate two shackles, in
any event - or, at least, not big enough that I'd want to trust them to
heavy loads such as anchor yanks.

The pull of the eye is not inline with the slot of the hook...so it
will always pull the link of the chain to one side.

Pragmatically I don't know if this cant of the link would be
significant unless one puts it to the test will some heavy and or
prolonged load.

I don't expect the couple-inch-off-center pull, particularly 20 or so feet
out, would make any difference that could be measured. However, being
somewhat of a pragmatist but more of a neatnik (elegant solutions rather
than Rube Goldberg), I'm resistant to three shackles just to be able to
attach two lines to a device not designed for the task.

In other words, if you just don't like that little, occasional, jerk,
and are not going to leave for extended periods, I can't imagine it
being a problem.

...but then, I'm not a metallurgical engineer. I just play one on
TV....I just haven't found any work.

:{)) I wouldn't expect a problem, either - however, using this rig (one
sided pull) I lost the snubber, once (just fell off, that is - it was still
attached to the rode when I pulled it in. I expect the Chain Grabber, being
designed to the purpose, would be far less likely to accidentally dislodge.

Back to our rode/hook, however:

While we didn't think (well, technically, we hadn't been exposed to the
concept yet) of it in time, we surely would have wanted to use that line and
hook to offset to the waves on our last night offshore during our
delivery/shakedown cruise. I've forgotten the name of the technique, but it
amounts to attaching a second line to the anchor chain and running it to the
stern, making a bridle. Adjust the length of the anchor line to point the
bow as desired. It would have allowed our entirely beam-to, very rolly
anchorage, to be head-on with the wind about 60* to starboard.

Otherwise, we'd want to center the anchor, and the Chain Grabber looks to do
that admirably, along with sharing the momentary loads with two lines rather
than just one - which might allow lighter line, too. (Our current snubber
line is 5/8 or 3/4 by eye, not having measured it.)

L8R

Skip and Lydia, watching Ivan move west and keeping our fingers crossed

--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig
http://tinyurl.com/384p2

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore.
Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain

It seems from other migrations of this thread that what's wanted in the
original wasn't a stopper...

We have two hawse pipes with all chain on the two primary anchors, a
vertical windlass for rope and chain, and no stoppers.

Our prior owners made up a short airline cable Y with thimbles and nicopress
(wish they'd shrink-wrapped them!!). Three caribiners connect to a pad eye
and the two anchor chains. Not a tensioner, but certainly insurance against
failure or moving out in lumpy water.

That's pretty inexpensive :{))

L8R

Skip and Lydia

--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig
http://tinyurl.com/384p2

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore.
Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain

So, to install a proper chain stopper if you don't have one, the
windlass would need to be removed, and repositioned allowing for the
stopper ?

Do you use the chain hook for the second anchor or what ?

Appreciatively,
Courtney



Wayne.B wrote:

On Sat, 11 Sep 2004 09:15:55 -0500, Courtney Thomas
wrote:


Wouldn't a fixed stopper be better in that... [it conceptually seems to
me]... the chain could "fall out" of the grabber [I realize it's under
tension] in that it has no restraining "lock", as do the fixed ones [in
effect] ?


==========================================

What we are talking about here is a "chain hook" not a "chain
stopper".

I have both on my trawler. THe chain stopper came as standard
equipment and is deck mounted just forward of the windlass. It is of
heavy duty bronze construction, with a pivoting pawl which flips down
and grabs a chain link. I believe it may have been made by Galley
Maid in FL but I'm not sure. Their phone number is 561-848-8696. Ask
for Jimmy, he is alledged to know everything.

The chain hooks were purchased at W-M. Mine are shackled to 3/4 inch
nylon line via an eye splice and thimble. The slot in the hook is
barely larger than a 3/8 chain link and tends to grab on fairly
snuggly. I've never had one shake loose accidently and it would be
virtually impossible unless the hook line were totally slack.




--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619

Hi, Courtney,

"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
...
So, to install a proper chain stopper if you don't have one, the
windlass would need to be removed, and repositioned allowing for the
stopper ?

Do you use the chain hook for the second anchor or what ?

Appreciatively,
Courtney

I've not (yet) had occasion to double anchor other than to throw out the
Fortress with mostly-rope rode when I was concerned about dragging once on
the trip.

I use the line-and-hook snubber, backed up with the cable-to-chain, further
backed up with the chain in the gypsy. If I were using the secondary
all-chain anchor, I'd also have the line-and-hook snubber (we have two) but
only the cable-to-chain as backup. I'd probably go around the third cleat
(a PO addition) with the chain as a final snubber insurance.

In the case of the snubber rode, I leave a pretty fair amount of slack in
the chain so as to make the rope rode/snubber have to stretch *a lot* before
it would make the chain tug. I confess to using just the catenary in calm
conditions. Having dragged a lot in the Virgins on the trash anchors the
charter companies provide, I overdo my scope, usually aiming for 7-1. With
a heavy chain, that provides a lot of yank resistance, anyway.

If you were looking for a "serious" stopper/snubber, there are a variety of
over-center tensioned ones listed in other responses. I see no reason one
would remove the windlass, as an off-center pull would be more trouble in
raising and lowering than in keeping it in place, at least IMO.

If I were concerned to the level of wanting that sort of snubber, I'd put
them aside the windlass just far enough out to avoid fouling the chain(s) on
their way in and out.

HTH...

L8R

Skip (and Lydia, who, today, is ready to shoot herself it she can't get on
the boat pretty soon!)

--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig
http://tinyurl.com/384p2

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore.
Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain

On Sat, 11 Sep 2004 11:04:28 -0400, "Skip Gundlach" skip make this
all one word with my last name next to my first gundlach@adelphia dot
fish catcher net (sorry bout the spamtrap!) wrote:

"Horace Brownbag" wrote in message
news
snip
The pull of the eye is not inline with the slot of the hook...so it
will always pull the link of the chain to one side.

Pragmatically I don't know if this cant of the link would be
significant unless one puts it to the test will some heavy and or
prolonged load.

I don't expect the couple-inch-off-center pull, particularly 20 or so feet
out, would make any difference that could be measured. However, being
somewhat of a pragmatist but more of a neatnik (elegant solutions rather
than Rube Goldberg), I'm resistant to three shackles just to be able to
attach two lines to a device not designed for the task.
snip

It's my understanding that it's the distance from the eye to hook, and
the offset twixt the two. Under heavy load it will bend the link.

Skip and Lydia, watching Ivan move west and keeping our fingers crossed

Yeah....two is enough for one year.

On Sat, 11 Sep 2004 11:49:45 -0500, Courtney Thomas
wrote:
So, to install a proper chain stopper if you don't have one, the
windlass would need to be removed, and repositioned allowing for the
stopper ?

If you have a strong point forward of the windlass there would be no
need to move anything, otherwise probably yes, or more definitively,
"it depends". :-)


Do you use the chain hook for the second anchor or what ?

Mostly I use it to relieve the load on the windlass before backing
down hard on the anchor, and also for the duration of being anchored.
(the chain stopper can also serve the same purpose). The advantage of
the chain hook is two fold, the nylon line introduces some stretch and
shock absorption, and also allows the load to be transferred to a
hawse pipe which is at a lower angle that the pulpit roller.

The bearings and shaft seals of a windlass do not like being under
high load for any extended period of time, and will fail prematurely
unless precautions are taken with either a chain stopper or chain hook
line.

Wayne,

I fail to see how to utilize a mounted stopper unless it's forward of
the windlass,.....

which in my case would require dismounting the windlass, installing a
stopper, remounting the windlass; which means.... a bridled chain hook
is looking, relatively, most appealing :-)

Also, more stuff's got to break before the anchor chain's loose.

What am I missing
?

Thanks,
Courtney



Wayne.B wrote:

On Sat, 11 Sep 2004 11:49:45 -0500, Courtney Thomas
wrote:

So, to install a proper chain stopper if you don't have one, the
windlass would need to be removed, and repositioned allowing for the
stopper ?


If you have a strong point forward of the windlass there would be no
need to move anything, otherwise probably yes, or more definitively,
"it depends". :-)


Do you use the chain hook for the second anchor or what ?


Mostly I use it to relieve the load on the windlass before backing
down hard on the anchor, and also for the duration of being anchored.
(the chain stopper can also serve the same purpose). The advantage of
the chain hook is two fold, the nylon line introduces some stretch and
shock absorption, and also allows the load to be transferred to a
hawse pipe which is at a lower angle that the pulpit roller.

The bearings and shaft seals of a windlass do not like being under
high load for any extended period of time, and will fail prematurely
unless precautions are taken with either a chain stopper or chain hook
line.




--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619