On Mon, 2 Sep 2013 18:47:00 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 02 Sep 2013 07:36:12 -0600, slide wrote:

An iPhone or Galaxy can display GPS data when out of range of a
cell tower?

===

Absolutely, right in mid-ocean.

Most smart phones have a built in GPS receiver these days, and there
are some very decent charting packages available. For about $25 to
Navionics I have a full set of US and Caribbean charts on my Galaxy
along with a fairly decent little plotting application. You don't
even need a cell phone account to do all that, a WiFi connection will
suffice.



I got ripped off, then. I just bought a Navionics Gold US and N Bahamas
(no Caribbean charts) on a little SD/microSD card for my Lowrance
iFinder H20 hand-held chart plotter and it cost over a hundred bucks.

But, I'm sure the Navionics Gold SD charts are way more detailed
than what Navionics offers for that Samsung cell phone. Not to
mention the plotting function on the Lowrance is probably way
superior to some cheapo cell phone plotter.

I often marvel at how some people operate fifty-foot motor yachts worth
a million bucks and hanging off the bow is a 30 pound SS Danforth -
in other words, all show and no function. So why does somebody
with half a million dollars worth of motor yacht justify using a cell
phone for navigation??

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

--
Cheers,

Bruce in Bangkok

On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 07:26:09 +0700, Bruce in bangkok
wrote:

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

===

We have used a 30 lb Danforth as a day anchor in some pretty severe
conditions. With enough scope and a good bottom it holds our 70,000
pound trawler just fine (30 kt winds, exposed anchorage with 3 to 5 ft
seas).

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 07:26:09 +0700, Bruce in bangkok
wrote:

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

===

We have used a 30 lb Danforth as a day anchor in some pretty severe
conditions. With enough scope and a good bottom it holds our 70,000
pound trawler just fine (30 kt winds, exposed anchorage with 3 to 5 ft
seas).



LOL! There's a man confident in his luck!

Myself, I'd rather rely on using an anchor that is appropriate for the
heft and windage of the vessel. For a 70,000 pound trawler, a 45-pounder
would be the absolute minimum. Even so, I'd be sure to use two of them
Bahamian-style so I could feel secure through most any normal weather.
(Not talking tropical storms here!)

Tell me, please, do you set an anchor alarm on your GPS?

I bet you do? If so, then that pretty much negates your feigned
confidence in your undersized day anchor. And, besides, a
so-called day anchor is a rude operation. You said yourself that
you put out lots of length (scope). If the water is 20 feet deep
that means you put out at least 7:1 scope or close to 150
feet. That means you swing a very large circle and might get
too close to those who use a larger anchor and more conservative
scope. Unless it's all chain, that also means possible chaffing
snagging and abrasion on coral heads and sharp rocks.

And you stink-potters wonder why we sailing seaman don't want
much of anything to do with you?

I wonder why?

--
Sir Gregory



--
Sir Gregory

On Tue, 3 Sep 2013 16:32:57 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

===

We have used a 30 lb Danforth as a day anchor in some pretty severe
conditions. With enough scope and a good bottom it holds our 70,000
pound trawler just fine (30 kt winds, exposed anchorage with 3 to 5 ft
seas).



LOL! There's a man confident in his luck!

Myself, I'd rather rely on using an anchor that is appropriate for the
heft and windage of the vessel.

We would also but were doing race committee duty at Key West Race Week
at the time and rapid anchor retrieval was a requirement. I was
surprised at how well the Danforth held out there in Hawk Channel on a
*very* windy day.


For a 70,000 pound trawler, a 45-pounder
would be the absolute minimum. Even so, I'd be sure to use two of them
Bahamian-style so I could feel secure through most any normal weather.
(Not talking tropical storms here!)

Tell me, please, do you set an anchor alarm on your GPS?

Absolutely not. We back down hard with a pair of 30 inch, 4 bladed
props. If the anchor holds with that, it will hold in up to a full
gale.


I bet you do? If so, then that pretty much negates your feigned
confidence in your undersized day anchor. And, besides, a
so-called day anchor is a rude operation.

You'd bet wrong.

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Sep 2013 16:32:57 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

===

We have used a 30 lb Danforth as a day anchor in some pretty severe
conditions. With enough scope and a good bottom it holds our 70,000
pound trawler just fine (30 kt winds, exposed anchorage with 3 to 5 ft
seas).



LOL! There's a man confident in his luck!

Myself, I'd rather rely on using an anchor that is appropriate for the
heft and windage of the vessel.

We would also but were doing race committee duty at Key West Race Week
at the time and rapid anchor retrieval was a requirement. I was
surprised at how well the Danforth held out there in Hawk Channel on a
*very* windy day.

Hawk Channel has varied bottoms. Some sandy patches and some
hard, rocky areas. If you drop anchor in a sandy patch it will hold
well until you get a thunderstory with an 180 degree wind shift ---
then you have to HOPE the Danforth will reset. Danforth's aren't
noted for reliably resetting themselves as I'm sure you know.

That's why I prefer two anchor laid out Bahamian Style. That way
no matter what the wind does the anchors keep pulling against
each other and don't have to trip over and reset.

But, two anchors would never do when fast anchor retrieval was
the requirement.

For a 70,000 pound trawler, a 45-pounder
would be the absolute minimum. Even so, I'd be sure to use two of them
Bahamian-style so I could feel secure through most any normal weather.
(Not talking tropical storms here!)

Tell me, please, do you set an anchor alarm on your GPS?

Absolutely not. We back down hard with a pair of 30 inch, 4 bladed
props. If the anchor holds with that, it will hold in up to a full
gale.

Unless there is that aforementioned strong windshift . . .


I bet you do? If so, then that pretty much negates your feigned
confidence in your undersized day anchor. And, besides, a
so-called day anchor is a rude operation.

You'd bet wrong.

C'mon? Not even at night? I find that difficult to believe.

--
Sir Gregory

rOn Tue, 3 Sep 2013 16:32:57 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 07:26:09 +0700, Bruce in bangkok
wrote:

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

===

We have used a 30 lb Danforth as a day anchor in some pretty severe
conditions. With enough scope and a good bottom it holds our 70,000
pound trawler just fine (30 kt winds, exposed anchorage with 3 to 5 ft
seas).



LOL! There's a man confident in his luck!

Myself, I'd rather rely on using an anchor that is appropriate for the
heft and windage of the vessel. For a 70,000 pound trawler, a 45-pounder
would be the absolute minimum. Even so, I'd be sure to use two of them
Bahamian-style so I could feel secure through most any normal weather.
(Not talking tropical storms here!)


Interesting. Wrong, but interesting.

The Mont, later renamed several times and last named the Seawise
Giant, claimed to be the largest ship to ever sail the seas, had a
gross weight of 825,614 tons and used a 86 ton anchor. i.e. the ship
was 22,937.7 times the weight of the anchor.

The Trawler you describe is 1,555.5 times the weight of the anchor
that you mention.

Or perhaps a better way to describe it is the trawler gross weight to
anchor ratio is far higher then that of what is said to have been the
largest ship in the world.

Using your criteria of gross weight to anchor weight the trawler
should be using an anchor of 3.05 pounds.

Or, to put it another way... you have proven, yet again, that you
don't know what you are talking about.


Tell me, please, do you set an anchor alarm on your GPS?

I bet you do? If so, then that pretty much negates your feigned
confidence in your undersized day anchor. And, besides, a
so-called day anchor is a rude operation. You said yourself that
you put out lots of length (scope). If the water is 20 feet deep
that means you put out at least 7:1 scope or close to 150
feet. That means you swing a very large circle and might get
too close to those who use a larger anchor and more conservative
scope. Unless it's all chain, that also means possible chaffing
snagging and abrasion on coral heads and sharp rocks.

And you stink-potters wonder why we sailing seaman don't want
much of anything to do with you?

I wonder why?

--
Sir Gregory
--
Cheers,

Bruce in Bangkok

"Bruce in bangkok" wrote in message
...
rOn Tue, 3 Sep 2013 16:32:57 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 07:26:09 +0700, Bruce in bangkok
wrote:

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

===

We have used a 30 lb Danforth as a day anchor in some pretty severe
conditions. With enough scope and a good bottom it holds our 70,000
pound trawler just fine (30 kt winds, exposed anchorage with 3 to 5 ft
seas).



LOL! There's a man confident in his luck!

Myself, I'd rather rely on using an anchor that is appropriate for the
heft and windage of the vessel. For a 70,000 pound trawler, a 45-pounder
would be the absolute minimum. Even so, I'd be sure to use two of them
Bahamian-style so I could feel secure through most any normal weather.
(Not talking tropical storms here!)


Interesting. Wrong, but interesting.

The Mont, later renamed several times and last named the Seawise
Giant, claimed to be the largest ship to ever sail the seas, had a
gross weight of 825,614 tons and used a 86 ton anchor. i.e. the ship
was 22,937.7 times the weight of the anchor.

The Trawler you describe is 1,555.5 times the weight of the anchor
that you mention.

Or perhaps a better way to describe it is the trawler gross weight to
anchor ratio is far higher then that of what is said to have been the
largest ship in the world.

Using your criteria of gross weight to anchor weight the trawler
should be using an anchor of 3.05 pounds.

Or, to put it another way... you have proven, yet again, that you
don't know what you are talking about.

Did I not also mention windage? Weight is of less consequence
in smaller private yachts than is windage. So your diatribe has
little actual meaning when it comes to smaller recreational craft
as it's not the weight that breaks them loose but the force of
the wind acting upon their surface area exposed to the wind.

Get a clue, dock boy! If you had a BILLION pound ship but
no wind or current you could anchor it with a ten-pound rock
and it would stay put.

--
Sir Gregory

On Wed, 4 Sep 2013 11:38:47 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

"Bruce in bangkok" wrote in message
.. .
rOn Tue, 3 Sep 2013 16:32:57 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 07:26:09 +0700, Bruce in bangkok
wrote:

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

===

We have used a 30 lb Danforth as a day anchor in some pretty severe
conditions. With enough scope and a good bottom it holds our 70,000
pound trawler just fine (30 kt winds, exposed anchorage with 3 to 5 ft
seas).



LOL! There's a man confident in his luck!

Myself, I'd rather rely on using an anchor that is appropriate for the
heft and windage of the vessel. For a 70,000 pound trawler, a 45-pounder
would be the absolute minimum. Even so, I'd be sure to use two of them
Bahamian-style so I could feel secure through most any normal weather.
(Not talking tropical storms here!)


Interesting. Wrong, but interesting.

The Mont, later renamed several times and last named the Seawise
Giant, claimed to be the largest ship to ever sail the seas, had a
gross weight of 825,614 tons and used a 86 ton anchor. i.e. the ship
was 22,937.7 times the weight of the anchor.

The Trawler you describe is 1,555.5 times the weight of the anchor
that you mention.

Or perhaps a better way to describe it is the trawler gross weight to
anchor ratio is far higher then that of what is said to have been the
largest ship in the world.

Using your criteria of gross weight to anchor weight the trawler
should be using an anchor of 3.05 pounds.

Or, to put it another way... you have proven, yet again, that you
don't know what you are talking about.

Did I not also mention windage? Weight is of less consequence
in smaller private yachts than is windage. So your diatribe has
little actual meaning when it comes to smaller recreational craft
as it's not the weight that breaks them loose but the force of
the wind acting upon their surface area exposed to the wind.

Ah, windage... I can only assume that you somehow believe that a
70,000 pound trawler has more windage then a 1,651,228,000 pound
tanker.

As was previously mentioned, you have proven, yet again, that you
don't know what you are talking about.


Get a clue, dock boy! If you had a BILLION pound ship but
no wind or current you could anchor it with a ten-pound rock
and it would stay put.

And you prove your brilliance yet again. "If you had a BILLION pound
ship but no wind or current". Would you care to elaborate on these
conditions and where one might encounter them..... other in your
fevered dreams.

--
Cheers,

Bruce in Bangkok

"Bruce in bangkok" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 4 Sep 2013 11:38:47 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

"Bruce in bangkok" wrote in message
. ..
rOn Tue, 3 Sep 2013 16:32:57 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq·"
åke wrote:

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
m...
On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 07:26:09 +0700, Bruce in bangkok
wrote:

But Gregory, a 30 lb. danforth will hold a boat perfectly well. It
depends on the anchorage and the weather and water.

===

We have used a 30 lb Danforth as a day anchor in some pretty severe
conditions. With enough scope and a good bottom it holds our 70,000
pound trawler just fine (30 kt winds, exposed anchorage with 3 to 5 ft
seas).



LOL! There's a man confident in his luck!

Myself, I'd rather rely on using an anchor that is appropriate for the
heft and windage of the vessel. For a 70,000 pound trawler, a 45-pounder
would be the absolute minimum. Even so, I'd be sure to use two of them
Bahamian-style so I could feel secure through most any normal weather.
(Not talking tropical storms here!)


Interesting. Wrong, but interesting.

The Mont, later renamed several times and last named the Seawise
Giant, claimed to be the largest ship to ever sail the seas, had a
gross weight of 825,614 tons and used a 86 ton anchor. i.e. the ship
was 22,937.7 times the weight of the anchor.

The Trawler you describe is 1,555.5 times the weight of the anchor
that you mention.

Or perhaps a better way to describe it is the trawler gross weight to
anchor ratio is far higher then that of what is said to have been the
largest ship in the world.

Using your criteria of gross weight to anchor weight the trawler
should be using an anchor of 3.05 pounds.

Or, to put it another way... you have proven, yet again, that you
don't know what you are talking about.

Did I not also mention windage? Weight is of less consequence
in smaller private yachts than is windage. So your diatribe has
little actual meaning when it comes to smaller recreational craft
as it's not the weight that breaks them loose but the force of
the wind acting upon their surface area exposed to the wind.

Ah, windage... I can only assume that you somehow believe that a
70,000 pound trawler has more windage then a 1,651,228,000 pound
tanker.

As was previously mentioned, you have proven, yet again, that you
don't know what you are talking about.


Get a clue, dock boy! If you had a BILLION pound ship but
no wind or current you could anchor it with a ten-pound rock
and it would stay put.

And you prove your brilliance yet again. "If you had a BILLION pound
ship but no wind or current". Would you care to elaborate on these
conditions and where one might encounter them..... other in your
fevered dreams.


Bruce, how come you often argue like a girl? Like a girl,
you don't seem capable of embracing an absolute that
demonstrates a point and demonstrates it well.

A billion pound ship that can be anchored by a ten-pound
rock is an absolute that proves it's not the tonnage that
drags anchors but the force of the wind and current acting
upon that tonnage, which is represented by surface area
upon which the wind can act, that causes anchors to drag.

This all goes to prove that your assertion that one requires
X pounds of anchor to properly anchor XY pounds of vessel
is deeply flawed.

It's a flawed formula because as I have proven, using an
absolute, that it's the windage that matters as much or more,
in real life conditions than the weight and your dumb formula
complete ignores the wind and windage. In other words, you
tried to sound like an expert but you failed.

--
Sir Gregory