(JAXAshby) wrote in
:

As far as prelubing the engine before start up goes, do you
really care that much?

I do. Race mechanics do. Aircraft mechanics do. The US Navy does.

Listen to an engine upon startup with heavy oil in it (even at
summertime temps) and hear all the grinding and banging and clattering
going on inside the engine for the first ten or fifteen seconds, let
the engine warm up a couple of minutes, shut it off, restart and
listen again.

If you can't hear the difference, replace the battery in the hearing
aid.


You guys are too funny....(c;

The grinding, clattering and banging is because it's a D-I-E-S-E-L!!....The
blue smoke, too!

Cold cylinder walls condense the fuel spray as the piston exposes it. Fuel
left in the cylinder explodes on the next power stroke before the injection
takes place, especially if it doesn't start right away.

It's not a high-performance, electronic engine in a goddamn Cadillac
Escalade or Lamborghini, you know. It's an old, slow compression engine
running on home heating oil!.....even if it's got a new jacket to make it
pretty with a big row of model numbers to impress someone who just paid a
lot for it.....

If you ever get a chance, stand in the engine room of a big diesel-powered
ship when the compressed air injection start goes off....hee hee. Your
little Yanmar or Faschetti or MTU is the same engine....(c;

KNOCK-KNOCK-KNOck-KNock-Knock-knock-knock-knock......................clank!

What a beautiful sound!.....

Larry W4CSC

On Fri, 18 Jun 2004 00:18:42 -0000, Larry W4CSC
wrote:

(JAXAshby) wrote in
:

As far as prelubing the engine before start up goes, do you
really care that much?

I do. Race mechanics do. Aircraft mechanics do. The US Navy does.

Listen to an engine upon startup with heavy oil in it (even at
summertime temps) and hear all the grinding and banging and clattering
going on inside the engine for the first ten or fifteen seconds, let
the engine warm up a couple of minutes, shut it off, restart and
listen again.

If you can't hear the difference, replace the battery in the hearing
aid.


You guys are too funny....(c;

The grinding, clattering and banging is because it's a D-I-E-S-E-L!!....The
blue smoke, too!

I hate to tell ya'; but if the oil is slow to come up on the first
startup; there is a difference in the sound.

But what if your or BSA or Triumph or Atomic-4 don't
have a full flow filter? Well then get nondetergent multigrades from Morris
in England.

I use Castrol 5W-50 synthetic in my A/4. It makes for much less cranking temp
until oil pressure comes up plus ten seconds more (I set the throttle so the
engine won't start to prelube), and change the oil frequently.

Synthetic oil flows at 300*+ plus while mineral oil does not. This means my
exhaust valves last loooooooooooooots longer. (The A/4, like most engines
designed prior to about 1970, used the lead in the fuel to lube the valves and
valve stems.)

Continental. Lycoming.

Tell us all about those airplane engines that get prelubed before
starting ... care to name a couple?

rickie, an alleged ATP such as you would know that IF he actually were an ATP.

I suggest you change the battery in your hearing aid, for the sounds of
grinding banging unlubed metal are plainly there.

Listen to an engine upon startup with heavy oil in it (even at
summertime temps) and hear all the grinding and banging and clattering
going on inside the engine for the first ten or fifteen seconds, let
the engine warm up a couple of minutes, shut it off, restart and
listen again.

If you can't hear the difference, replace the battery in the hearing
aid.


You guys are too funny....(c;

The grinding, clattering and banging is because it's a D-I-E-S-E-L!!....The
blue smoke, too!

Cold cylinder walls condense the fuel spray as the piston exposes it. Fuel
left in the cylinder explodes on the next power stroke before the injection
takes place, especially if it doesn't start right away.

It's not a high-performance, electronic engine in a goddamn Cadillac
Escalade or Lamborghini, you know. It's an old, slow compression engine
running on home heating oil!.....even if it's got a new jacket to make it
pretty with a big row of model numbers to impress someone who just paid a
lot for it.....

If you ever get a chance, stand in the engine room of a big diesel-powered
ship when the compressed air injection start goes off....hee hee. Your
little Yanmar or Faschetti or MTU is the same engine....(c;

KNOCK-KNOCK-KNOck-KNock-Knock-knock-knock-knock......................clank!

What a beautiful sound!.....

Larry W4CSC

I hate to tell ya'; but if the oil is slow to come up on the first
startup; there is a difference in the sound.

you betcha.

Horace Brownbag wrote in
:


I hate to tell ya'; but if the oil is slow to come up on the first
startup; there is a difference in the sound.


Probably because all the slime on all the parts is COLD.

You don't REALLY think it all drains down into the bilge during the night,
do you, leaving just bare metal?

Tell ya what.....a little test. Take some plain old Rotella and dip your
screwdriver down into it. Lay the screwdriver out on something you don't
care about. Feel it, say, tomorrow and see if it cleaned itself off. Next
time you pump out the crankcase, dip something you love in crankcase used
oil. Lay it out and see if it cleans itself off.

That engine isn't bare metal when you crank it up. It's covered in slimy,
greasy, carbony gook from the bottom of the crank to that leaky valve cover
gasket.

Speaking of that, did the engine clean itself off when that gasket leaked
last? Did you ever GET it cleaned off with those exotic cleaners? Live
steam will clean the parts. Engines don't have live steam, inside, we
hope...(c;

Larry
It runs on gook!

larry, please don't make sophormoric comments on engine oil again. any engine
owner worth his salt can hear the difference at engine startup between a
prelubed engine and one that wasn't. don't try to out guess reality while you
are sitting in an armchair.

Horace Brownbag wrote in
:


I hate to tell ya'; but if the oil is slow to come up on the first
startup; there is a difference in the sound.


Probably because all the slime on all the parts is COLD.

You don't REALLY think it all drains down into the bilge during the night,
do you, leaving just bare metal?

Tell ya what.....a little test. Take some plain old Rotella and dip your
screwdriver down into it. Lay the screwdriver out on something you don't
care about. Feel it, say, tomorrow and see if it cleaned itself off. Next
time you pump out the crankcase, dip something you love in crankcase used
oil. Lay it out and see if it cleans itself off.

That engine isn't bare metal when you crank it up. It's covered in slimy,
greasy, carbony gook from the bottom of the crank to that leaky valve cover
gasket.

Speaking of that, did the engine clean itself off when that gasket leaked
last? Did you ever GET it cleaned off with those exotic cleaners? Live
steam will clean the parts. Engines don't have live steam, inside, we
hope...(c;

Larry
It runs on gook!

Some automotive engines use oil as light as 5W20 in 100 degree F heat and yet
go 100,000+ miles without any oil related problem. Many of todays aluminum
engines have done away with camshaft bearings and are using the lighter oils.
But the weight or viscosity is not the total picture. Much of this depends on
oil pressure. The theroy on light oils is that it is able to flow faster and
since there is no, or very little oil pressure at start up, pressurized oil is
able to reach component pasts faster. Since 97% of engine wear occurs at start
up you can see where this is critical. Lighter oils also disapate heat faster
thusly the engine runs cooler.

As long as oil pressure is maintained in order to provide sufficient flow there
will be no discernable wear with using 30wt in an engine perscribed to use 40wt
oil. Heavy weighted oils are used primarily in engines with lower oil
pressures or in extreme operating temps. In using a lighter weight oil you
should see a small drop in pressure, but as long as the engine maintains oil
pressure specs you will be fine.

Dennis
ASE Certified Master Auto Tech
and Marine Engineer in training

OK, so I'm sitting around with the captain and his engineer friend on the new
boat I'm project managing/co-captaining and we are trying to work out how to
run the same weight oil in the engines, gensets and trannys so we only have
to
fill the clean oil tank with one weight oil and not carry any extra buckets
of
different weight oils with us.
The CAT engines and ZF trannys can use 40W oil as per their specs but the
Northern Lights gensets only recommend up to 30W oil. The CATs could run 30W
but only at 86 deg. ambient air temps. We will certainly be seeing higher
temps
than that.
I tell the capt. and eng. that based on the ambient air temps we will be
seeing
even with the Delta-T fans that if it weren't for a warranty issue I wouldn't
hesitate to use 40W oil in the gensets.
The capt. and eng. disagree. They start saying that running a heavier weight
oil could cause wear problems and make the engine work harder over time. And
as
an example they compare it to what can happen if you use a heavy weight oil
in
a high revving street/race car. I point out that this is a diesel not a high
revving street/race engine. They back off that point a bit but we still go
round and round in a civil fashion.
In the end we will end up putting 15-40W oil in the tank for the engines and
gensets (as per specs) and keeping some 40W in bottles for the trannys.

But other than the warranty concerns, I'm I missing something here?
Would using 40W over 30W in the gensets with of course changing it at the
proper number of hours and making sure that the ambient temps never get low
really cause any long term problems?



Capt. Bill

I don't know where you get your info but I hope you didn't have to give
anything for it. Six years employed by Kerr's Racing in Houston and more times
than I dare attempt to count did I put 80wt oil in a $60,000 motor. If you
have doubts I can email you an engineering spec sheet. Stick to something you
know!

Dennis
ASE Certified Master Auto Tech and Marine Engineer in training


From: (JAXAshby)
Date: 6/13/04 11:02 AM Central Daylight Time
Message-id:

Frequently race cars *do* use heavy weight engine oils

no they don't.