Stephen ,, I don't worry about threats from the outside of America. We, us,
can take care of them.

We are declining from within. The inequity of rich to poor, of government
to private sector ( take a look at pensions ), of those who can afford the
best schools and those who must accept schools that are totally useless.
Don't you find it crazy that the politicians who are making decisions about
public education never send their own kids to public school? Ted Kennedy
comes to mind here.

In 1975 we faced nuclear power such as Russia and the cold war. Today we
destroying ourselfs. We are crumbling from the inside.

Those that have don't care about the folks at the bottom. Take a look at
Walmart. The auto makers are going out of business in the USA, they are
building cars in China though.

And as the taxes go up and up and the middle class disappears, government
continues to give out huge pensions, and keep on spending.

Stephen ,, we are killing ourselves.



================================
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
NE Sailboat wrote:

Stephen,, we are in a whole lot worse off shape than 1975.

Never in our history has the difference in wealth between the rich and
the poor ( all of the rest of America ) but so great.

We have millions of illegals running around and the federal government
won't even protect the border and enforce the immigration laws.

Then there is the mess in the middle east.

Oh, I forgot... check out what the government is spending and the debt it
is amassing.


Do you think a bank in the USA would get away with giving illegals who
have entered our county by sneaking in a credit card ..

Do you think that would happen in 1975? It is happening now! Bank of
America.

I sorry to say it,, but I really don't give us much of a chance to
continue.

Well, there was massive doom and gloom in the seventies. Plenty of
"experts" would go on and on about how the level of inflation definitely
would result in a massive collapse in less than five years, guaranteed. My
family left Hawaii where we lived to get to a place where we could live
off the land and survive during a collapse. And of course anyone who was
around then can remember how inevitable nuclear annhilation was,
considering the massive buildup and how we had enough armament to blow up
the world "300 times over."

As we can all see now, there has been drastic improvement in these areas
since then. Since then I've been much more aware of the ways our society
is improving and much more aware of how all the supposed "decline" that is
occuring is actually more of a temporary blip in history, because mankind
has an overwhelming desire and ability to improve their lot.

Stephen

"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...

I remember in '75 when the country was coming apart. Plenty of people
said the country couldn't last five years the way things were going. The
ecomomy was supposed to collapse if nuclear war didn't get us first.

Stephen

NE Sailboat wrote:

Don ,,, I may be going over to the other side ,, but... in my opinion,
our country is on the brink of coming apart. Everything is broken, the
whole system. Health care, the government spending, the war in Iraq,
our industys, ....

Great speech by Bill Moyers recently.. read it ,, you can find it on
the net.

Powerful stuff.

=================
"Don White" wrote in message
...


"Larry" wrote in message
53...


"Skip Gundlach" wrote in
glegroups.com:



effectively $500 a week

Isn't this the same reason, insurance paying, that a hospital bed to
just
lay there and die is $400/day and every doctor in the building comes
by
to "say hi" and charges $250 every time he pokes his head in the door
and
smiles at you. (Every doctor in Orangeburg, SC, pulled this crap on my
father who was dying at Orangeburg Regional Medical Center, a profit
center for the medical profession to be sure.

It's how doctors afford yachts, waterfront mansions, fancy cars,
cruises
to exotic places....

I call it "victimization". You're in a position of helplessness and
"they", be they doctors or lawyers or boatyards or tradesmen you are
forced by circumstances to hire quickly to fix something threatening
your
home....feeding at the insurance and victims' tits, sucking as hard as
they can for as long as they can milk it.

CEOs do the same thing to the stockholders....sucking as hard as they
can
on the company's tit, milking it for all they can get, until they
either
get fired and move on to the next board meeting or drive the company,
like Enron, into bankruptcy.

It's the American way! This boatyard is sucking on it just as hard as
any of the rest of the milksuckers.....like bankers.

Larry
--

It's almost as if everyone expects the gravy train to end soon and they
have to grab as much for themselves as possible.
Where's the long term planning? If the Big 3 American car
manufacturers are doing do badly, why are their CEOs hauling in so much
money?
The whole system is rotten and our children will pay for it.

"NE Sailboat" wrote in
news:Sf6Bh.4960$H77.944@trndny08:

And as the taxes go up and up and the middle class disappears,
government continues to give out huge pensions, and keep on spending.



Here's how bad it is:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/
8.724 Trillion dollars

"The National Debt has continued to increase an average of
$1.57 billion per day since September 29, 2006!"

Noone will listen when I say the root cause of American collapse is the
Federal Reserve Bankers! They have consumed the country and stolen the
gold. It's gone and cannot be recovered without bloody revolution...just
like every other time in history.

Here. Watch the problem screwing up another TRILLION+ since October 1,
2006...just since then!
http://www.toptips.com/debtclock.html

Interest now consumes more than income from ALL of Federal Income Taxes.
How long can this go on without massive extinction? Can we just keep
printing those checks and wishing for the future with our heads up our
asses?

The 1930 dollar is worth 4 cents in 2007. The bankers did it, stupids!
The Federal Reserve Bank Corporation, owned by the elite of the elite.



Larry
--
Vista has been out a week.
Is Service Pack 1 ready yet?

I dunno. I think Congress did most of it.
Check out Robt. Samuelson's column in this week's Newsweek and some
newspapers. Better than 60% of the budget goes to "untouchable"
"entitlements".

"Larry" wrote in message
...
"NE Sailboat" wrote in
news:Sf6Bh.4960$H77.944@trndny08:

And as the taxes go up and up and the middle class disappears,
government continues to give out huge pensions, and keep on spending.



Here's how bad it is:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/
8.724 Trillion dollars

"The National Debt has continued to increase an average of
$1.57 billion per day since September 29, 2006!"

Noone will listen when I say the root cause of American collapse is the
Federal Reserve Bankers! They have consumed the country and stolen the
gold. It's gone and cannot be recovered without bloody revolution...just
like every other time in history.

Here. Watch the problem screwing up another TRILLION+ since October 1,
2006...just since then!
http://www.toptips.com/debtclock.html

Interest now consumes more than income from ALL of Federal Income Taxes.
How long can this go on without massive extinction? Can we just keep
printing those checks and wishing for the future with our heads up our
asses?

The 1930 dollar is worth 4 cents in 2007. The bankers did it, stupids!
The Federal Reserve Bank Corporation, owned by the elite of the elite.



Larry
--
Vista has been out a week.
Is Service Pack 1 ready yet?

In article ,
Larry wrote:

"NE Sailboat" wrote in
news:Sf6Bh.4960$H77.944@trndny08:

And as the taxes go up and up and the middle class disappears,
government continues to give out huge pensions, and keep on
spending.



Here's how bad it is: http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/ 8.724
Trillion dollars

"The National Debt has continued to increase an average of $1.57
billion per day since September 29, 2006!"

No one will listen when I say the root cause of American collapse is
the Federal Reserve Bankers! They have consumed the country and
stolen the gold. It's gone and cannot be recovered without bloody
revolution...just like every other time in history.

Guys and gals, I won't debate this subject, but offer that many of us
carry primary mortgages well in excess of our annual income, and that's
not generally considered a bad thing. (I admit that rec.boats.cruising
is atypical.)

The total national debt is a much smaller fraction of the US gross
income (GNP) than most of us carry personally. A slight difference of
dollar value would wipe that debt out, as occurred in the Clinton years.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's NEW Pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Jere ,, funny .. I just read in the paper that foreclosers were going up up
up...

In fact, in some areas the real estate market is heading for the toilet.

Doesn't seem to bother the federal government. They just keep giving out
raises, big old pensions, etc.


We are doomed.


ps.. full discloser.. I don't owe a penny to anyone. No mortgage, no boat
loan, no car loan ,,, nothing.


========
"Jere Lull" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Larry wrote:

"NE Sailboat" wrote in
news:Sf6Bh.4960$H77.944@trndny08:

And as the taxes go up and up and the middle class disappears,
government continues to give out huge pensions, and keep on
spending.



Here's how bad it is: http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/ 8.724
Trillion dollars

"The National Debt has continued to increase an average of $1.57
billion per day since September 29, 2006!"

No one will listen when I say the root cause of American collapse is
the Federal Reserve Bankers! They have consumed the country and
stolen the gold. It's gone and cannot be recovered without bloody
revolution...just like every other time in history.

Guys and gals, I won't debate this subject, but offer that many of us
carry primary mortgages well in excess of our annual income, and that's
not generally considered a bad thing. (I admit that rec.boats.cruising
is atypical.)

The total national debt is a much smaller fraction of the US gross
income (GNP) than most of us carry personally. A slight difference of
dollar value would wipe that debt out, as occurred in the Clinton years.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's NEW Pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

NE Sailboat wrote:
Jere ,, funny .. I just read in the paper that foreclosers were going up up
up...

In fact, in some areas the real estate market is heading for the toilet.

Doesn't seem to bother the federal government. They just keep giving out
raises, big old pensions, etc.


We are doomed.


ps.. full discloser.. I don't owe a penny to anyone. No mortgage, no boat
loan, no car loan ,,, nothing.


And therein lies the problem! If you would run out and buy a new
house, new car, new boat, hdtv, etc, you would be putting a whole bunch
of people to work! Solves all the problems, ;) Well, except YOUR new ones!
Gordon

On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 02:00:59 GMT, "NE Sailboat"
wrote:

ps.. full discloser.. I don't owe a penny to anyone. No mortgage, no boat
loan, no car loan ,,, nothing.

No wonder you are always complaining about money or the lack there of.

You're not enjoying the power of leverage.

That is really funny .. the power of leverage! hahaha ,, this is killing
me.

If I guy goes to a bank and borrows $100,000 the bank owns him.

But if a guy goes to the bank and borrows $1,000,000,000 then he owns the
bank.

That is the power of leverage.



=======================

Try living debt free. It is an incredible feeling. I know, I had a
mortgage, car loan, personal loan, the you name it loan..

Then I started to just pay them off. One day; no more loans.

I took the money that was going to the loan and paid myself in investment
savings. Every month, just like the mortgage.

The next thing you know ... wow. Look at all that savings.

It really isn't hard. Just takes some discipline.


====================================
"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 02:00:59 GMT, "NE Sailboat"
wrote:

ps.. full discloser.. I don't owe a penny to anyone. No mortgage, no boat
loan, no car loan ,,, nothing.

No wonder you are always complaining about money or the lack there of.

You're not enjoying the power of leverage.

NE Sailboat wrote:
That is really funny .. the power of leverage! hahaha ,, this is killing
me.

If I guy goes to a bank and borrows $100,000 the bank owns him.

But if a guy goes to the bank and borrows $1,000,000,000 then he owns the
bank.

That is the power of leverage.



=======================

Try living debt free. It is an incredible feeling. I know, I had a
mortgage, car loan, personal loan, the you name it loan..

Then I started to just pay them off. One day; no more loans.

I took the money that was going to the loan and paid myself in investment
savings. Every month, just like the mortgage.

The next thing you know ... wow. Look at all that savings.

It really isn't hard. Just takes some discipline.


====================================
"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...

On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 02:00:59 GMT, "NE Sailboat"
wrote:


ps.. full discloser.. I don't owe a penny to anyone. No mortgage, no boat
loan, no car loan ,,, nothing.

No wonder you are always complaining about money or the lack there of.

You're not enjoying the power of leverage.




It takes more than a million for you to own the bank.

Don't ask me how i know....

--
“TAANSTAFL”

__________________________________________________ __________________________
Something to think about, from a wise man now long dead….:

“In the first place, we should insist that if the immigrant who comes
here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he
shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an
outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or
birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the person’s becoming
in every facet an American, and nothing but an American.
“There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an
American, but something else also, isn’t an American at all.
“We have room for but one flag, the American flag. We have room for but
one language here, and that is the English language and we have room for
but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people.”
--Theodore Roosevelt...1907

__________________________________________________ __________________________

"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences." - Proverbs 22:3
__________________________________________________ __________________________

Consumer debt becomes slavery, yes. But that is not "leverage." "Leverage"
is borrowing money and earning more from that money than the interest you'll
have to pay back. That is the source of true monetary wealth. And yes, it
most certainly does work. You just have to be smart about it.


"NE Sailboat" wrote in message
news:Ej9Bh.5873$5M1.2110@trndny01...
That is really funny .. the power of leverage! hahaha ,, this is killing
me.

If I guy goes to a bank and borrows $100,000 the bank owns him.

But if a guy goes to the bank and borrows $1,000,000,000 then he owns
the bank.

That is the power of leverage.



=======================

Try living debt free. It is an incredible feeling. I know, I had a
mortgage, car loan, personal loan, the you name it loan..

Then I started to just pay them off. One day; no more loans.

I took the money that was going to the loan and paid myself in investment
savings. Every month, just like the mortgage.

The next thing you know ... wow. Look at all that savings.

It really isn't hard. Just takes some discipline.


====================================
"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 02:00:59 GMT, "NE Sailboat"
wrote:

ps.. full discloser.. I don't owe a penny to anyone. No mortgage, no
boat
loan, no car loan ,,, nothing.

No wonder you are always complaining about money or the lack there of.

You're not enjoying the power of leverage.