Am wondering if anyone has set up a small air compressor rig, 110V,
similar to the ones used by divers for hull cleaning services. I assume
just a small oil-less compressor and couple it directly to a stock dive
regulator? I only need it dockside in a marina with 30A seervice.
THANKS for any input

NO!!! You can not use a standard compressor for breathable air. At the very
least you must filter the air and run an oil separator. There is a reason a
dive compressor such as a Hooka cost as much as they do. The air that is
delivered is going into your lungs! If your marina has enough call for a
diver why not hire one. A properly equipped diver will have greater
versatility than a Hooka diver. Even for the very occasional need a local
diver would probably love an excuse to go diving while earning a buck or
two.

John


"BajaJim" wrote in message
oups.com...
Am wondering if anyone has set up a small air compressor rig, 110V,
similar to the ones used by divers for hull cleaning services. I assume
just a small oil-less compressor and couple it directly to a stock dive
regulator? I only need it dockside in a marina with 30A seervice.
THANKS for any input

I once had a diaphragm compressor which produced air that was oil free. I
don't remember the CFM (it ran an air brush), but why would such a device be
harmful?

Roger

http://home.insightbb.com/~derbyrm

"John Cassara" wrote in message
...
NO!!! You can not use a standard compressor for breathable air. At the
very least you must filter the air and run an oil separator. There is a
reason a dive compressor such as a Hooka cost as much as they do. The air
that is delivered is going into your lungs! If your marina has enough call
for a diver why not hire one. A properly equipped diver will have greater
versatility than a Hooka diver. Even for the very occasional need a local
diver would probably love an excuse to go diving while earning a buck or
two.

John


"BajaJim" wrote in message
oups.com...
Am wondering if anyone has set up a small air compressor rig, 110V,
similar to the ones used by divers for hull cleaning services. I assume
just a small oil-less compressor and couple it directly to a stock dive
regulator? I only need it dockside in a marina with 30A seervice.
THANKS for any input

The air delivered must be oil free to USP standards. Even the slightest
trace of oil can cause respiratory problems. The other problem is with the
regulators. A scuba regulators 1st stage will cut the tank pressure down to
about 115 psi to 500 psi depending upon brand. the 2nd stage the reduces the
pressure to a few psi over ambient pressure. With each 33 feet of depth the
ambient pressure increases by 1 atmosphere. The typical craftsman air
compressor will be marginal in its ability to deliver air to a surface diver
and inadequate in delivery to a diver at any depth. If you eliminate the
first stage and just deliver air to the second stage you will overcome the
high pressure problem but will have a poor performing regulator from an
inconsistent delivery pressure.

A scuba set-up the best way to go. It's simpler and more reliable. You will
need all the other equipment any way, Wet Suit, Buoyancy device, Weight
belt, Mask and maybe fins or rock boots. You will have an easier time
working un-tethered and will be safer, less likely to become entangled.

John

"derbyrm" wrote in message
news:I5T1g.935391$xm3.618358@attbi_s21...
I once had a diaphragm compressor which produced air that was oil free. I
don't remember the CFM (it ran an air brush), but why would such a device
be harmful?

Roger

http://home.insightbb.com/~derbyrm

"John Cassara" wrote in message
...
NO!!! You can not use a standard compressor for breathable air. At the
very least you must filter the air and run an oil separator. There is a
reason a dive compressor such as a Hooka cost as much as they do. The air
that is delivered is going into your lungs! If your marina has enough
call for a diver why not hire one. A properly equipped diver will have
greater versatility than a Hooka diver. Even for the very occasional need
a local diver would probably love an excuse to go diving while earning a
buck or two.

John


"BajaJim" wrote in message
oups.com...
Am wondering if anyone has set up a small air compressor rig, 110V,
similar to the ones used by divers for hull cleaning services. I assume
just a small oil-less compressor and couple it directly to a stock dive
regulator? I only need it dockside in a marina with 30A seervice.
THANKS for any input

John Cassara wrote:
A scuba set-up the best way to go. It's simpler and more reliable. You will
need all the other equipment any way, Wet Suit, Buoyancy device, Weight
belt, Mask and maybe fins or rock boots. You will have an easier time
working un-tethered and will be safer, less likely to become entangled.

John



A real diver don't need all that Mickey Mouse stuff!

"Bob" wrote in message
oups.com...

John Cassara wrote:
A scuba set-up the best way to go. It's simpler and more reliable. You
will
need all the other equipment any way, Wet Suit, Buoyancy device, Weight
belt, Mask and maybe fins or rock boots. You will have an easier time
working un-tethered and will be safer, less likely to become entangled.

John



A real diver don't need all that Mickey Mouse stuff!


Mickey Mouse ?

BajaJim writes:

Am wondering if anyone has set up a small air compressor rig, 110V,
similar to the ones used by divers for hull cleaning services. I assume
just a small oil-less compressor and couple it directly to a stock dive
regulator?

Yes, we do this in our swimming pool. I run an old ScubaPro regulator 2nd
stage ($25 on eBay) off 90 psig shop air from a standard piston/oil type
compressor. Despite all the dire warnings (from people just reciting
paranoia they've heard, who've never tested for oil or tried it), the air
should be OK if your compressor doesn't consume oil such as from bad piston
rings. And the pressure is fine for feeding a 2nd stage.

The fear of "any oil in air will harm you" is silly. First, it is mineral
oil, which is non-toxic. Second, if were that bad, a whiff of 2-cycle
exhaust would kill you. I run this compressor for hours and hours,
thousands of cubic feet, and it loses only tiny amounts of oil, most of
which condenses in the tank.

I suppose an oilless compressor would eliminate even the possibility of
entrained oil. Although they're hideously noisy. You would want at least
a 2 cfm compressor rating, since you typically breathe about 1 cfm. But 2
cfm at 90 psi is only about a 1/2 (true) horsepower unit.
But see my essay http://www.truetex.com/aircompressors.htm on horsepower
ratings.

You need an adapter from the SAE scuba fitting to NPT pipe thread and
thence to a shop air quick-connect, which all then goes on your regulator
second stage hose where it would have connected to a first stage. You now
have a scuba regulator that terminates in an air tool quick-connect. I
made my own threaded adapter on my machine shop lathe. The only source for
such a part otherwise that I can think of is the adapters made for buoyancy
compensator connectors to shop air for filling tires or running tools from
scuba tanks (although this is the opposite direction of adaptation, it
might have the critical SAE-fitting-thread to NPT-pipe-thread conversion).
You could do it by simply splicing hoses with a hose barb if you were
willing to cut up the regulator feed hose.

Here is my drawing of the adapter essentials:

http://www.truetex.com/scuba_lp.pdf

Shallow water hookah diving is easier than most open water scuba diving.
The dive gear industry makes everything but this year's model sound like
it's going to kill you. The old 2nd stage regulators were very simple and
easy to repair yourself. They too were once the thing you had to have and
all the old models would kill you.

If anyone wonders if this is unreliable and therefore hazardous, I would
only use it for shallow diving, like working or practicing diving in a
swimming pool, or working on a boat hull, and I would insist on having a
trustworthy person for a topside tender. Being suddenly out of air is not
a problem with some simple training; we as tenders routinely disconnect the
air unexpectedly to our diving family members to help them practice the
drill (a habit I got from my first scuba instructor in the 1970s, who liked
to turn off your main valve when you weren't expecting it).

To anyone suggesting you just go full scuba instead of improvising a
topside compressor, I would say that full scuba is absurdly cumbersome and
expensive compared to hookah for shallow diving on a fixed location, and in
my opinion, no improvement in risk.

Of course this is diving, which takes training and recent diving experience
to minimize risks.

Most marina divers I've known just use a dive tank with a long hose. Chock
the tank securely on the dock so you don't pull it down on yourself, and
away you go.

Tom Dacon

"BajaJim" wrote in message
oups.com...
Am wondering if anyone has set up a small air compressor rig, 110V,
similar to the ones used by divers for hull cleaning services. I assume
just a small oil-less compressor and couple it directly to a stock dive
regulator? I only need it dockside in a marina with 30A seervice.
THANKS for any input

Being a compressed air addict in the shop I have installed a 12V oilless
compressor that will deliver 4CFM @90 PSI in Rutu's lazerrett. Intake is
through the cockpit coaming and fiber filtered and muffled. After passing
through a moisture trap at the compressor the output goes to an outlet in
the cockpit so I can run some air tools or inflate dinghies or water toys.
If I want to use it for breathable air I have a charcoal filter and oil
coalescing filter that plug into the outlet. That is the same type
arrangement I have used for years on my big shop compressor for my MSA
air-line respirator when spraying LPU. The big shop compressor is an oil
type so there is an additional moisture separator and coalescing filter and
an extra 40 gallon settling tank in the line.

--
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com
Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com

"Richard J Kinch" wrote in message
. ..
BajaJim writes:

Am wondering if anyone has set up a small air compressor rig, 110V,
similar to the ones used by divers for hull cleaning services. I assume
just a small oil-less compressor and couple it directly to a stock dive
regulator?

Yes, we do this in our swimming pool. I run an old ScubaPro regulator 2nd
stage ($25 on eBay) off 90 psig shop air from a standard piston/oil type
compressor. Despite all the dire warnings (from people just reciting
paranoia they've heard, who've never tested for oil or tried it), the air
should be OK if your compressor doesn't consume oil such as from bad
piston
rings. And the pressure is fine for feeding a 2nd stage.

The fear of "any oil in air will harm you" is silly. First, it is mineral
oil, which is non-toxic. Second, if were that bad, a whiff of 2-cycle
exhaust would kill you. I run this compressor for hours and hours,
thousands of cubic feet, and it loses only tiny amounts of oil, most of
which condenses in the tank.

I suppose an oilless compressor would eliminate even the possibility of
entrained oil. Although they're hideously noisy. You would want at least
a 2 cfm compressor rating, since you typically breathe about 1 cfm. But 2
cfm at 90 psi is only about a 1/2 (true) horsepower unit.
But see my essay http://www.truetex.com/aircompressors.htm on horsepower
ratings.

You need an adapter from the SAE scuba fitting to NPT pipe thread and
thence to a shop air quick-connect, which all then goes on your regulator
second stage hose where it would have connected to a first stage. You now
have a scuba regulator that terminates in an air tool quick-connect. I
made my own threaded adapter on my machine shop lathe. The only source
for
such a part otherwise that I can think of is the adapters made for
buoyancy
compensator connectors to shop air for filling tires or running tools from
scuba tanks (although this is the opposite direction of adaptation, it
might have the critical SAE-fitting-thread to NPT-pipe-thread conversion).
You could do it by simply splicing hoses with a hose barb if you were
willing to cut up the regulator feed hose.

Here is my drawing of the adapter essentials:

http://www.truetex.com/scuba_lp.pdf

Shallow water hookah diving is easier than most open water scuba diving.
The dive gear industry makes everything but this year's model sound like
it's going to kill you. The old 2nd stage regulators were very simple and
easy to repair yourself. They too were once the thing you had to have and
all the old models would kill you.

If anyone wonders if this is unreliable and therefore hazardous, I would
only use it for shallow diving, like working or practicing diving in a
swimming pool, or working on a boat hull, and I would insist on having a
trustworthy person for a topside tender. Being suddenly out of air is not
a problem with some simple training; we as tenders routinely disconnect
the
air unexpectedly to our diving family members to help them practice the
drill (a habit I got from my first scuba instructor in the 1970s, who
liked
to turn off your main valve when you weren't expecting it).

To anyone suggesting you just go full scuba instead of improvising a
topside compressor, I would say that full scuba is absurdly cumbersome and
expensive compared to hookah for shallow diving on a fixed location, and
in
my opinion, no improvement in risk.

Of course this is diving, which takes training and recent diving
experience
to minimize risks.

Glenn Ashmore writes:

If I want to use it for breathable air I have a charcoal filter and
oil coalescing filter that plug into the outlet. That is the same
type arrangement I have used for years on my big shop compressor for
my MSA air-line respirator when spraying LPU. The big shop compressor
is an oil type so there is an additional moisture separator and
coalescing filter and an extra 40 gallon settling tank in the line.

All that filtering and coalescing is just wishful thinking without (1) a
refrigerated dryer ahead of the filters, and (2) a way to monitor filter
condition. A "moisture separator" is kind of a lie, because raw compressed
air is saturated and condensing as it moves down the line, including after
the so-called "separator".

The typical charcoal filter application is worse than no filter at all,
because it is left in long after it is spent, being difficult to monifor
and expensive to replace. False security in breathing air.