"Popeye" wrote in message

Obviously Oz thinks for himself and tests his moral standards against a
real, external world. If you believe that morals come from God and are
absolute then you are applying no standard to judge if they are correct or
true. You simply accept them on faith. Since you are a doctor, where do
you draw your distinctions between science and religious dogma? Who wrote
the version of the Bible you cling to? Who were the religious leaders that
set the doctrine you have such faith in? How can you have faith in the
words and writings of middlemen in the business of religion? Did God
speak directly to them or to you? One does not need religion or government
to have a consistent set of morals in which all live together in peace and
harmony. If all the Muslims and Right wing religious wackos were atheists
instead the world would be a better place.

That was a nice speech, Popeye, but completely irrelevant. You have no idea
about my beliefs w/r/t religion. I've never discussed them and don't intend
to do so. My point was only that the morality that you and Oz attribute to
'enlightenment' is the result of Judeo-Christian morality which was imposed
upon Europe and much of Asia. Take a look at the history of pre-Christian
Europe as evidence. Not much morality in evidence prior to the Christian
movements, unless you happen to believe that raping, pillaging, and homicide
are moral activities. Religion is not without value.

Max