Blood on my mast
 

What a morning, I step off the boat to walk Skipper and get the evil
eye and a long line of screeching from a Bald Eagle. He's on the tip
top of my main mast with a huge speckled trout. He made a mess, now I
have blood from the tip top running down to the top spreadders and bits
of gills and guts spread about the deck.

I see it as a good omen.

Joe

Blood on my mast
 

Joe wrote:
What a morning, I step off the boat to walk Skipper and get the evil
eye and a long line of screeching from a Bald Eagle. He's on the tip
top of my main mast with a huge speckled trout. He made a mess, now I
have blood from the tip top running down to the top spreadders and bits
of gills and guts spread about the deck.

I see it as a good omen.


I see it as time to clean it up.

We have ospreys all over the place. They are not afraid of
man but at least have the decency to not spread fish guts
all over our boats.

It's a good sign that eagles are making a comeback. Maybe in
a few years, we can start using DDT again.

DSK

Blood on my mast
 

DSK wrote:
Joe wrote:
What a morning, I step off the boat to walk Skipper and get the evil
eye and a long line of screeching from a Bald Eagle. He's on the tip
top of my main mast with a huge speckled trout. He made a mess, now I
have blood from the tip top running down to the top spreadders and bits
of gills and guts spread about the deck.

I see it as a good omen.


I see it as time to clean it up.

I'm leaving the blood on the mast.

This afternoon I will deal with the mess on the cabin top... been
needing to scrub the decks anyway. The crows and blackbirds might eat
the eagles scraps.


We have ospreys all over the place.

Same here and many types of hawks, mostly RedTailed.

Joe

They are not afraid of
man but at least have the decency to not spread fish guts
all over our boats.

It's a good sign that eagles are making a comeback. Maybe in
a few years, we can start using DDT again.

DSK

Blood on my mast
 

Maybe in
a few years, we can start using DDT again.



Dave wrote:
Heresy to the enviros.


That was a joke. It would probably be healthier in the long
run to use powdered plutonium as an insecticide.

You know, some people are actually saying countries should start using DDT
to save the many of the lives lost to malaria each year as a result of
banning its use..

Why is a malaria the "result" of banning DDT? What did they
blame it on, before DDT was invented?

There are a number of much better answers. One of my sailing
partners is a malaria researcher, currently working for the
Army (they have a HUGE interest in malaria prevention & cure).

DSK

Blood on my mast
 

DSK wrote:
Dave wrote:

Maybe in a few years, we can start using DDT again.
Heresy to the enviros.

That was a joke. It would probably be healthier in the long run to use
powdered plutonium as an insecticide.

Is plutonium an effective insecticide? If so, do the cockroaches know that?

You know, some people are actually saying countries should start using
DDT
to save the many of the lives lost to malaria each year as a result of
banning its use..

Why is a malaria the "result" of banning DDT? What did they blame it on,
before DDT was invented?

Whatever local deity was in charge of inflicting misery on the local
population. Didn't you pay attention in religion class?


There are a number of much better answers. One of my sailing partners is
a malaria researcher, currently working for the Army (they have a HUGE
interest in malaria prevention & cure).

I would hope so. But, speaking as one of those dreaded enviros, I could
be persuaded that a limited application in situations where malaria is
particularly bad would pass the cost-benefit analysis test. In North
America, there is clearly no need to lift the ban.

The comeback of bald eagles is one of the great success stories of the
enviro movement - I didn't see one in the wild until I was in my late
30s, now I see several dozen a year. Think about it - several
generations of kids grew up without ever seeing our national symbol, and
we came together as a nation and changed that.

//Walt

Blood on my mast
 

Joe wrote:

What a morning, I step off the boat to walk Skipper and get the evil
eye and a long line of screeching from a Bald Eagle. He's on the tip
top of my main mast with a huge speckled trout. He made a mess, now I
have blood from the tip top running down to the top spreadders and bits
of gills and guts spread about the deck.

We've got eagles and ospreys, but they seem to stay off the boat. The
annoying *******s are the Great Blue Herons, they **** crayfish
skeletons all over the deck and dock!

Cheers
Marty

Blood on my mast
 

Must be Nancy Pelosi.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 09:21:22 -0500, DSK said:

Maybe in
a few years, we can start using DDT again.

Heresy to the enviros.

You know, some people are actually saying countries should start using DDT
to save the many of the lives lost to malaria each year as a result of
banning its use..

Blood on my mast
 

Joe, you are truly blessed.

It is time!

Scotty


"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com..
..
What a morning, I step off the boat to walk Skipper and
get the evil
eye and a long line of screeching from a Bald Eagle. He's
on the tip
top of my main mast with a huge speckled trout. He made a
mess, now I
have blood from the tip top running down to the top
spreadders and bits
of gills and guts spread about the deck.

I see it as a good omen.

Joe

Blood on my mast
 

DDT sprayed on the interior walls and ceiling of a house will kill
mosquetos without polluting the environment, and will save many lives.
Indescriminate spraying out of doors is environmentally harmful and
should continue to be banned.


"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 09:21:22 -0500, DSK said:

Maybe in
a few years, we can start using DDT again.

Heresy to the enviros.

You know, some people are actually saying countries should start using
DDT
to save the many of the lives lost to malaria each year as a result of
banning its use..

Blood on my mast
 

"Walt" wrote ...

Is plutonium an effective insecticide? If so, do the
cockroaches know that?


Ask Bob or Charlie.

Blood on my mast
 

Dave wrote:
I think you need to dig out that old grammar book.

I think you need to dig out some sort of lesson plan on
basic common sense.

.... So malaria is not the result of
banning DDT. The lives are being lost as a result of banning DDT.


No, the lives are being lost as a result of malaria.

An increase in malaria since the ban on DDT could be
considered the result of a ban. It could even be possible
that due to higher population density in the malaria zone,
that there is more malaria than ever.

But it is muddled logic (ie the usual kind employed by
humans) to say that it is caused by, or should be blamed on,
the lack of DDT.

DSK

Blood on my mast
 

Dave wrote:
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 11:36:19 -0500, Walt said:

But, speaking as one of those dreaded enviros, I could
be persuaded that a limited application in situations where malaria is
particularly bad would pass the cost-benefit analysis test. In North
America, there is clearly no need to lift the ban.


I'm inclined to agree with that. Now you just have to persuade the folks to
whom environmentalism is a religion, and a rather absolutist one at that.

Ok. I'll go out and try to convert your straw men, assuming I can find any.

//Walt

Blood on my mast
 

Walt wrote:
DSK wrote:

Dave wrote:


Maybe in a few years, we can start using DDT again.

Heresy to the enviros.


That was a joke. It would probably be healthier in the long run to use
powdered plutonium as an insecticide.


Is plutonium an effective insecticide? If so, do the cockroaches know
that?

You know, some people are actually saying countries should start
using DDT
to save the many of the lives lost to malaria each year as a result of
banning its use..


Why is a malaria the "result" of banning DDT? What did they blame it
on, before DDT was invented?


Whatever local deity was in charge of inflicting misery on the local
population. Didn't you pay attention in religion class?


There are a number of much better answers. One of my sailing partners
is a malaria researcher, currently working for the Army (they have a
HUGE interest in malaria prevention & cure).


I would hope so. But, speaking as one of those dreaded enviros, I could
be persuaded that a limited application in situations where malaria is
particularly bad would pass the cost-benefit analysis test. In North
America, there is clearly no need to lift the ban.

The comeback of bald eagles is one of the great success stories of the
enviro movement - I didn't see one in the wild until I was in my late
30s, now I see several dozen a year. Think about it - several
generations of kids grew up without ever seeing our national symbol, and
we came together as a nation and changed that.

//Walt


Not only eagles but peregrine falcons and condors. Now if they could
just clone passenger picgeions from some stuffed artifact...

Blood on my mast
 

katysails wrote:
Not only eagles but peregrine falcons and condors. Now if they could
just clone passenger picgeions from some stuffed artifact...

A couple of the condor species didn't make it.

Among coastal birds, ospreys & pelicans & the Great Blue
Heron were also very hard hit by DDT. When young, I was told
to take a good look at the few Great Blues around because
they would soon be extinct. Fortunately, that was wrong.
There certainly are a lot more pelicans around nowadays than
back then, too.

While I agree with Walt that there are a few special cases
where the benefits outweigh the costs, in general the
reasons for banning it are still most persuasive.

DSK

Blood on my mast
 

He didn't exclude that... you did.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 12:18:26 -0500, "Beauregard"
said:

DDT sprayed on the interior walls and ceiling of a house will kill
mosquetos without polluting the environment, and will save many lives.
Indescriminate spraying out of doors is environmentally harmful and
should continue to be banned.

Your first sentence is right on. Too bad you blew it in the second
sentence.
What about discriminating spraying out of doors?

Blood on my mast
 

DSK wrote:
katysails wrote:

Not only eagles but peregrine falcons and condors. Now if they could
just clone passenger picgeions from some stuffed artifact...


A couple of the condor species didn't make it.

Among coastal birds, ospreys & pelicans & the Great Blue Heron were also
very hard hit by DDT. When young, I was told to take a good look at the
few Great Blues around because they would soon be extinct. Fortunately,
that was wrong. There certainly are a lot more pelicans around nowadays
than back then, too.

While I agree with Walt that there are a few special cases where the
benefits outweigh the costs, in general the reasons for banning it are
still most persuasive.

DSK


In remember the mosquito planes flying over when we were kids dumping
DDT around the lakes...I wonder how much cancer in out age group that is
responsible for and how many birth defects,,,

Blood on my mast
 

Dave wrote:
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:03:07 -0500, DSK said:


While I agree with Walt that there are a few special cases
where the benefits outweigh the costs, in general the
reasons for banning it are still most persuasive.


And would you agree that spraying the inside of huts in sub-Sahara Africa
(there aren't likely to be many eagles, hawk or herons in there) to kill the
mosquitoes that spread malaria, and using DDT on mosquito nets in those
countries, would be one of those special cases?

Or do you figure the lives there are worth so little that bending your
environmental principles to save those lives can't be justified?

How is it going to be cotrolled so it's not used on crops, etc when
someone gets the bright idea that it wo;; work outdooesa too? In most
of these places education ahsn't made a snip of difference in regards to
hygiene or birth control so how are they going to be responsible for a
controlled substance? Wouldn't it be better to find some ecologically
safe way to combat the problem? There are plants, the pyrethrums, thatt
can be planted. Get the stagnant water problems under control. Plant
plants that deter misquitos (mosquito plant, citronella, eucalyptus..)...

Blood on my mast
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 18:00:33 -0500, katy
said:

In remember the mosquito planes flying over when we were
kids dumping
DDT around the lakes...I wonder how much cancer in out
age group that is
responsible for and how many birth defects,,,

How big a plane do you suppose it would take to spray the
walls and ceiling
inside a hut?

How big is the hut?

Blood on my mast
 

Dave wrote:
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 18:04:16 -0500, katy said:


How is it going to be cotrolled so it's not used on crops, etc when
someone gets the bright idea that it wo;; work outdooesa too? In most
of these places education ahsn't made a snip of difference in regards to
hygiene or birth control so how are they going to be responsible for a
controlled substance? Wouldn't it be better to find some ecologically
safe way to combat the problem? There are plants, the pyrethrums, thatt
can be planted. Get the stagnant water problems under control. Plant
plants that deter misquitos (mosquito plant, citronella, eucalyptus..)...


Yes, Katy, I guess those black Africans in charge of health in their
countries are just too dumb to trust.

My sister0in0kaw has been to Kenya, ine if the mire civilized countries
in Africa, twice with Operation Smile. On one of the trips a nurse died
of a heart attack becasue the ambulance never came to the hotel and they
could not get the police to clear traffic. Malaria medication,
antibiotics, etc. are on the black market and are used as trade items
rather than being distribbuted to where they're supposed to go. Has
nothing to do with black. I am not racially prefudiced. Why foist on
poor people the same ills we foisted on ourselves? Why poison them?
When I still worked at the retirement complex, I had 4 African students
working at the nursing home. 2 were studying to be nurese, one a
hospital administrator, and one a social worker. They are all going back
to their respective countries when they graduate to help their country.
We sat often and discussed the problems in Kenya, Ghana, and South
Afica. Believbe me, they would not accept your soluition for their people.

Pick up the white man's burden and
make sure it's done in a politically correct fashion, and never mind the
black bodies piling up in the meantime.

So kill them with pesticides instead. How civil of you. My personal
opinion about the majority of Africa is that the world has ignored it
and shame on the world. Great Britain, France and Italy all had colonies
and when they left they left for good. Shame on them. They assumed
stewardship, gave it up, and left a mess.

Blood on my mast
 

Dave wrote:
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 18:00:33 -0500, katy said:


In remember the mosquito planes flying over when we were kids dumping
DDT around the lakes...I wonder how much cancer in out age group that is
responsible for and how many birth defects,,,


How big a plane do you suppose it would take to spray the walls and ceiling
inside a hut?

You want to spray DDT in hits where people for the most part already
have compromised lung conditions from TB....brilliant....and compromised
immune systems...more btilliant...pyrethrums, allethreums, and pyrithens
also work on mosquitos and are not toxic to the central nervous syste,
And they're cheap and plant-based or can be synthetically made.
Bringing DDT back would be a dosaster.

Blood on my mast
 

Dave wrote:
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 20:02:05 -0500, katy said:


We sat often and discussed the problems in Kenya, Ghana, and South
Afica. Believbe me, they would not accept your soluition for their people.


Here's some recommended reading (note particularly that it's about South
Africa).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4264374.stm

I am not disputing that DDT would be eddicacious used in households
however, like I said, who is going to regulate that in countries where
regulations are set by blackmailers, terrorists, and military
governments? If the UN would step in and do what it is supposed to do,
that would be one way. Are they involved? They should be. If DDT is
rteleased to the masses, Africa will suffer the same problems with it as
what happened here. Only through careful control and regulation should
it be used and all efforts should be made to use alternate, more safe
methods.

Blood on my mast
 

Bring back Agent Orange!



"katy" wrote in message
...
Dave wrote:
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 20:02:05 -0500, katy
said:


We sat often and discussed the problems in Kenya, Ghana,
and South
Afica. Believbe me, they would not accept your soluition
for their people.


Here's some recommended reading (note particularly that
it's about South
Africa).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4264374.stm

I am not disputing that DDT would be eddicacious used in
households
however, like I said, who is going to regulate that in
countries where
regulations are set by blackmailers, terrorists, and
military
governments? If the UN would step in and do what it is
supposed to do,
that would be one way. Are they involved? They should be.
If DDT is
rteleased to the masses, Africa will suffer the same
problems with it as
what happened here. Only through careful control and
regulation should
it be used and all efforts should be made to use
alternate, more safe
methods.

Blood on my mast
 

katy wrote:

[snip]

So kill them with pesticides instead. How civil of you. My personal
opinion about the majority of Africa is that the world has ignored it
and shame on the world. Great Britain, France and Italy all had colonies
and when they left they left for good. Shame on them. They assumed
stewardship, gave it up, and left a mess.

That isn't even close to correct. When Great Britain left what was then
Rhodesia, it had a sound economy, was a nett food exporter and had a
reasonable health, education and civic infrastructure. That is
established fact. Ditto Kenya.

Also, the European powers didn't just up & leave those colonies. They
were thrown out by the original inhabitants who knew they could do a
better job of running things for themselves. Aided & abetted by the USA
& the USSR, both of whom wanted to reduce the power & influence of the
European powers for their own ends.

After 30 years of one party rule in now Zimbabwe, they have none of
civil infrastructure, adequate food, security, medical treatment or
education. Kenya? Pffft. The ONLY remaining country in Africa that
comes even *close* to First World standards in *anything* is South
Africa and I'm not betting any money on them either.

It isn't the fault of Great Britain. Really Katy, if you want to argue
this one, you'd better bring some facts to the discussion, not just
your inner feelings, because you're going to get demolished. The major
problems bedevilling the peope in Africa are directly their own fault.

PDW

Blood on my mast
 

One of my model airplanes would work fine and we could use a predator drone
for bigger huts.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Scotty" wrote in message
. ..

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 18:00:33 -0500, katy
said:

In remember the mosquito planes flying over when we were
kids dumping
DDT around the lakes...I wonder how much cancer in out
age group that is
responsible for and how many birth defects,,,

How big a plane do you suppose it would take to spray the
walls and ceiling
inside a hut?

How big is the hut?

Blood on my mast
 

You said, "you blew it." We all assumed that you were talking about the
sentence, not an untenable strawman.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 14:50:54 -0800, "Capt. JG"
said:

He didn't exclude that... you did.

No, Jon. I didn't exclude anything. I simply pointed out for those bright
enough to follow the logic that he was setting up a straw man and knocking
it down.


"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Dave" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 12:18:26 -0500, "Beauregard"
said:

DDT sprayed on the interior walls and ceiling of a house will kill
mosquetos without polluting the environment, and will save many lives.
Indescriminate spraying out of doors is environmentally harmful and
should continue to be banned.

Your first sentence is right on. Too bad you blew it in the second
sentence.
What about discriminating spraying out of doors?

Blood on my mast
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
One of my model airplanes would work fine and we could use a predator
drone for bigger huts.

Are you into RC, Jon?

Max

Blood on my mast
 

On 21 Nov 2006 05:55:04 -0800, "Joe" wrote:

What a morning, I step off the boat to walk Skipper and get the evil
eye and a long line of screeching from a Bald Eagle. He's on the tip
top of my main mast with a huge speckled trout. He made a mess, now I
have blood from the tip top running down to the top spreadders and bits
of gills and guts spread about the deck.

I see it as a good omen.

Joe


On several occasions I've had mullet jump in my boat while it was
unattended in its slip. How bad that got depended on when I next
arrived at the boat and the time of year.

I never saw that as a good omen.

Frank

Blood on my mast
 

Frank Boettcher wrote:
On 21 Nov 2006 05:55:04 -0800, "Joe" wrote:

What a morning, I step off the boat to walk Skipper and get the evil
eye and a long line of screeching from a Bald Eagle. He's on the tip
top of my main mast with a huge speckled trout. He made a mess, now I
have blood from the tip top running down to the top spreadders and bits
of gills and guts spread about the deck.

I see it as a good omen.

Joe


On several occasions I've had mullet jump in my boat while it was
unattended in its slip. How bad that got depended on when I next
arrived at the boat and the time of year.

I never saw that as a good omen.

Big difference Frank, I've had a few mullets in the dink myself, it's
the mid summer ones that turn into gooey yellow liquid that are the
worst.

The top of my mast will now be offically known as the Eagles perch.
And all crew members will be required to visit that perch.

Joe

Joe





Frank

Blood on my mast
 

Not any more.. too expensive and not enough time. Started with rockets when
I was in grade school... we took out a window in an apartment building in
Chicago once... :-)

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
One of my model airplanes would work fine and we could use a predator
drone for bigger huts.

Are you into RC, Jon?

Max

Blood on my mast
 

Capt. JG wrote:
Not any more.. too expensive and not enough time. Started with rockets when
I was in grade school... we took out a window in an apartment building in
Chicago once... :-)

From San Francisco??? That's impressive!

Blood on my mast
 

Dave wrote:
Here's some recommended reading (note particularly that it's about South
Africa).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4264374.stm


Great, now you're citing such seriously left-wing biased
"news" sources like the BBC.


katy wrote:
I am not disputing that DDT would be eddicacious used in households

Actually, if the article Dave points to above is right, it's
pretty impressive.

However, I noticed that other effects from the DDT spraying
aren't mentioned. Gee, that must because there aren't any!


however, like I said, who is going to regulate that in countries where
regulations are set by blackmailers, terrorists, and military
governments? If the UN would step in and do what it is supposed to do,
that would be one way. Are they involved? They should be.

Frankly, I wouldn't trust the UN with DDT.


... If DDT is
rteleased to the masses, Africa will suffer the same problems with it as
what happened here. Only through careful control and regulation should
it be used and all efforts should be made to use alternate, more safe
methods.


"Regulation" isn't the answer. The problem with DDT is that
it last just about forever, and it ends up in places where
you don't want it. Remember, water runs downhill... and if
it's carrying even just a few molecules of DDT then
something in the ecological chain is going to die out. The
*very* careful spraying on indoor surfaces seems like one
way to keep the environmental impact to a minimum, but I
would expect that if this program goes on for very long,
then we'll see repercussions... and of course, officials
saying "Gee, we tried to prevent this, we didn't know how
bad it was."

DSK

Blood on my mast
 

katysails wrote:
So kill them with pesticides instead. How civil of you. My personal
opinion about the majority of Africa is that the world has ignored it
and shame on the world.

I think somewhat worse than that, the better to exploit
Africa's resources, the rest of the world has encouraged
criminally stupid & short-sighted & corrupt gov'ts.

Great Britain, France and Italy all had colonies
and when they left they left for good. Shame on them. They assumed
stewardship, gave it up, and left a mess.


Oh I dunno, it was a mess when they got there too.

Peter wrote:
That isn't even close to correct. When Great Britain left what was then
Rhodesia, it had a sound economy, was a nett food exporter and had a
reasonable health, education and civic infrastructure. That is
established fact. Ditto Kenya.


I'd say that of the colonial powers, the British had about
the best (and most consistent, more to their credit)record
of building infrastructure, encouraging local economic
autonomy & development, and leaving the least mess behind
them. Certainly better than say Belgium.

It's an interesting contrast to think what the African
countries would be like today if there had never been any
colonization.


Also, the European powers didn't just up & leave those colonies. They
were thrown out by the original inhabitants who knew they could do a
better job of running things for themselves. Aided & abetted by the USA
& the USSR, both of whom wanted to reduce the power & influence of the
European powers for their own ends.


The U.S. interest was/is mostly for profit. Remember, the
reason those European countries went into the empire busines
was... well, business. To make money. Which they did, often
by means that were not entirely kinder & gentler to the locals.


After 30 years of one party rule in now Zimbabwe, they have none of
civil infrastructure, adequate food, security, medical treatment or
education. Kenya? Pffft.

A very interesting book, which BTW is mostly about sailing,
that talks a good bit about polititcal & social events at
the beginning of this downslide is "The Walkabouts."
http://www.goodoldboat.com/bookrevie...tml#walkabouts


The ONLY remaining country in Africa that
comes even *close* to First World standards in *anything* is South
Africa and I'm not betting any money on them either.


The funny thing is that it's not a question of overall
wealth. These countries are fabulously wealthy in resources
and often in cash flow. The problem (those of you who like
to use this as a libby-rull bashing catch-phrase take
notice) is the distribution of wealth.

South Africa tilted things in the somewhat-right direction
and of course is suffering a lot of unintended consequences,
while many parties are trying to tilt things other ways.


It isn't the fault of Great Britain.

Agreed. None of the colonial powers ever seriously undertook
to build a stable & sef-sustaining social & economic
infrastructure to leave behind. And how can you blame them,
when that wasn't even close to what they were there for in
the first place?

DSK

Blood on my mast
 

Heh.. that would be impressive...

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Jeff" wrote in message
...
Capt. JG wrote:
Not any more.. too expensive and not enough time. Started with rockets
when I was in grade school... we took out a window in an apartment
building in Chicago once... :-)

From San Francisco??? That's impressive!

Blood on my mast
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
One of my model airplanes would work fine and we could use a predator
drone for bigger huts.

Are you into RC, Jon?

Not any more.. too expensive and not enough time. Started with rockets
when I was in grade school... we took out a window in an apartment
building in Chicago once... :-)

Kewl. I set a warehouse on fire with a free-flight model airplane when I
was 12.

Max

Blood on my mast
 

"Jeff" wrote in message
...
Capt. JG wrote:
Not any more.. too expensive and not enough time. Started with rockets
when I was in grade school... we took out a window in an apartment
building in Chicago once... :-)

From San Francisco??? That's impressive!

It was an ICBM.

Max

Blood on my mast
 

I had a camera that fit in one of the rockets, and we used to take pictures
but that got boring. So, we started our own astronaut program... crickets
and bugs and stuff, then we convinced one of the girls in the neighborhood
to donate a gerbil or hamster... the smaller one... attached a parachute to
it, which worked fine, but the damn thing wiggled out of the harness about
50 feet off the ground... not a pretty sight, and the girl was PO'd.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
One of my model airplanes would work fine and we could use a predator
drone for bigger huts.

Are you into RC, Jon?

Not any more.. too expensive and not enough time. Started with rockets
when I was in grade school... we took out a window in an apartment
building in Chicago once... :-)

Kewl. I set a warehouse on fire with a free-flight model airplane when I
was 12.

Max

Blood on my mast
 

What a morning, I step off the boat to walk Skipper and get the evil
eye and a long line of screeching from a Bald Eagle. He's on the tip
top of my main mast with a huge speckled trout..

AR15 and a 30rd mag. He won't be back.

Blood on my mast
 

DSK wrote:
katysails wrote:
So kill them with pesticides instead. How civil of you. My personal
opinion about the majority of Africa is that the world has ignored it
and shame on the world.

I think somewhat worse than that, the better to exploit
Africa's resources, the rest of the world has encouraged
criminally stupid & short-sighted & corrupt gov'ts.

Great Britain, France and Italy all had colonies
and when they left they left for good. Shame on them. They assumed
stewardship, gave it up, and left a mess.


Oh I dunno, it was a mess when they got there too.

Peter wrote:
That isn't even close to correct. When Great Britain left what was then
Rhodesia, it had a sound economy, was a nett food exporter and had a
reasonable health, education and civic infrastructure. That is
established fact. Ditto Kenya.


I'd say that of the colonial powers, the British had about
the best (and most consistent, more to their credit)record
of building infrastructure, encouraging local economic
autonomy & development, and leaving the least mess behind
them. Certainly better than say Belgium.

Belgium was undoubtedly the worst. Have you read Stanley's biography?
Well worth a read. I'll dig up the ISBN if you like.

It's an interesting contrast to think what the African
countries would be like today if there had never been any
colonization.

Eggs - scrambled. What would the USA be like today without
colonisation? Australia?

Also, the European powers didn't just up & leave those colonies. They
were thrown out by the original inhabitants who knew they could do a
better job of running things for themselves. Aided & abetted by the USA
& the USSR, both of whom wanted to reduce the power & influence of the
European powers for their own ends.


The U.S. interest was/is mostly for profit. Remember, the
reason those European countries went into the empire busines
was... well, business. To make money. Which they did, often
by means that were not entirely kinder & gentler to the locals.

Quite true. It's fascinating reading the accounts of people who were
out & about during the period between WW1 and WW2, then up to the late
50's.


After 30 years of one party rule in now Zimbabwe, they have none of
civil infrastructure, adequate food, security, medical treatment or
education. Kenya? Pffft.

A very interesting book, which BTW is mostly about sailing,
that talks a good bit about polititcal & social events at
the beginning of this downslide is "The Walkabouts."
http://www.goodoldboat.com/bookrevie...tml#walkabouts

Funnily enough, I own a copy of that book. First edition :-)

The ONLY remaining country in Africa that
comes even *close* to First World standards in *anything* is South
Africa and I'm not betting any money on them either.


The funny thing is that it's not a question of overall
wealth. These countries are fabulously wealthy in resources
and often in cash flow. The problem (those of you who like
to use this as a libby-rull bashing catch-phrase take
notice) is the distribution of wealth.

The problem is outright corruption and theft by the leadership, coupled
with gross incompetence.

South Africa tilted things in the somewhat-right direction
and of course is suffering a lot of unintended consequences,
while many parties are trying to tilt things other ways.


It isn't the fault of Great Britain.

Agreed. None of the colonial powers ever seriously undertook
to build a stable & sef-sustaining social & economic
infrastructure to leave behind.

I disagree. They didn't set out to do it, but in fact they did. OK you
can argue that in fact they didn't because history shows the result. I
look at it in terms of infrastructure and economics. Taking Zimbabwe as
a classic example of a failed state. At independence they were nett
food exporters, raw materials exporters, had a good balance of trade,
fed the population, had a competent civil service, a good military, a
functional education system, medical system, legal system, roads and
rail services. They had all the material things needed to succeed as an
independent country. All they had to do was keep running things as they
had been, with a bias over time to better education funded by
affordable tax increases. Wouldn't have been a real problem as the then
Rhodesia had sky high taxes and suffered heavily from sanctions on both
imports and exports. Their economy should have *surged* and the std of
living gone up.

They're a basket case due to gross mismanagement, incompetence, triumph
of ideology over common sense and good management. That's their OWN
fault. They had everything necessary to succeed, and they ****ed it all
away. If there is a hell, Robert Mugabe will have a long stay in the
9th ring.

And how can you blame them,
when that wasn't even close to what they were there for in
the first place?

I blame the people in charge of those countries since independence for
their state in the world today. If they ran predictable regimes and
looked after their people, they would be modern rich countries. Instead
they're ********s. Until they get their act together, I don't spend
much time thinking about their plight and I certainly never give a
single cent to charities helping them stay as they are.

PDW

Blood on my mast
 

Dave wrote:
On 22 Nov 2006 15:26:50 -0800, "Peter" said:

I disagree. They didn't set out to do it, but in fact they did. OK you
can argue that in fact they didn't because history shows the result. I
look at it in terms of infrastructure and economics. Taking Zimbabwe as
a classic example of a failed state. At independence they were nett
food exporters, raw materials exporters, had a good balance of trade,
fed the population, had a competent civil service, a good military, a
functional education system, medical system, legal system, roads and
rail services. They had all the material things needed to succeed as an
independent country. All they had to do was keep running things as they
had been, with a bias over time to better education funded by
affordable tax increases. Wouldn't have been a real problem as the then
Rhodesia had sky high taxes and suffered heavily from sanctions on both
imports and exports. Their economy should have *surged* and the std of
living gone up.

The situation in South Africa was similar. I had a client with operations
there, and I was there in 1976, about 2 weeks after the Soweto riots. The
country was much as you described Rhodesia, and was also becoming
energy-independent through the use of advanced coal gasification and nuclear
power.

Of course Doug and others will jump up and say "Ah, but it wasn't
sustainable, because you had privileged classes of English and Afrikaans
whites sitting on top of a pyramid of black have-nots."

And while that may be true, the institutions and government structure were
certainly in place, wanting only to be run honestly and well.

It's certainly true that the economic structure was very, very heavily
weighted to the colonial aristocracy - generally the whites. It's also
true that South Africa's apartheid system was offensive, stupid and
untimately self-defeating. They ALL would have been a lot better off
trying to grow the middle class as fast as possible by whoever could do
it rather than having a pyramid with the 'whites' at the top and the
natives at the bottom as labourers. The British attitude towards
breeding/marrying the locals was also offensive & stupid. The French in
the Pacific were a lot better colonial masters as a whole than the
British - and lets not even mention the Germans & later the Japanese.

However. The moral of the goose that laid the golden eggs applies.
Destroying productive enterprises in the name of justice seems to have
resulted in none of justice, efficiency or productive enterprises. Yes,
people are a lot more equal. In poverty. Reminds me of a time I defined
communism as the philosophy that stated that all would starve equally.
When challenged, I modified it to all starving equally, except the
nomenklatura. Upon which I was labelled a cynic, but the observation
was indisputably correct.

Marie Rhydwyn's book 'Slow Travel' is an interesting read, esp the way
a left wing Aussie academic had to confront some of her cherished
beliefs when living/working in Tanzania. Sailing content - she & her
husband sailed there from Perth WA via Indonesia, Malaysia, Sri Lanka,
Maldives, Chagos * the Seychelles.

I've seen the results of ex-colonies' economic management first hand in
places where I've worked. Australia has troops in the Solomon Islands
at the moment and we're likely to have them in a number of other places
as well. These are colonies that can't cut it on their own. Back to the
original thread - sort of - they're also places with malaria.

PDW

Blood on my mast
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
I had a camera that fit in one of the rockets, and we used to take pictures
but that got boring. So, we started our own astronaut program... crickets
and bugs and stuff, then we convinced one of the girls in the neighborhood
to donate a gerbil or hamster... the smaller one... attached a parachute to
it, which worked fine, but the damn thing wiggled out of the harness about
50 feet off the ground... not a pretty sight, and the girl was PO'd.

How funny. We put a mouse in one of those Estes rockets once--we made a
'capsule' with rolled construction paper and padded both ends with foam
rubber and cotton. Of course this one time the parachute failed to open.
What we *poured* out of the 'capsule' wasn't particularly appetizing either.

Max