My buddy with the 35.5 Benny would do the same with his main. He'd put

enough twist until the Main was just about luffing at the head. The
Racing Fraternity would ask why he didn't reef, He'd say if it get any

worst he would. He'd watch the heel meter.


Nutsy, my sailing information for today, take or ****can it. Up to you.



Good info, Thom. On a very close reach, twist the main to spill the top
3rd...pretty much what we were doing with just the main up as we made
our way towards the bridges. We stayed heeled to about 10 degrees and
made good progress at about 5.5-6 knots. It's really bad trim after a
fashion, but my racing buddies call any depowering bad trim!
Later on we popped the 110% which was close to a dead run home. I
didn't like it so I went for a series of broad reaches instead. Dead
downwind "feels" like the weekspot for this boat, especially without a
chute or poled out 150%. The wing just works against us at that point.


RB
35s5
NY

"Capt" Rob wrote:
.... my racing buddies call any depowering bad trim!

1- very strongly doubt there is any truth to this statement

2- if there is, then Bubbles' "racing buddies" are almost as
stupid & incompetent as he is.

Any sailor who is awake during a race... or at least, a race
with good wind... realizes that overpowered is slow.

Depowering a boat while inducing as little drag as possible
is one of the key skills of racing... I'd say, of sailing
well at all, regardless of racing or daysailing or cruising.



..... Dead
downwind "feels" like the weekspot for this boat, especially without a
chute or poled out 150%.

Says the man who has never flown a spinnaker.

.... The wing just works against us at that point.


Could you explain what this means, technically?

Bubbles, you're nuts.

DSK

.... my racing buddies call any depowering bad trim!


1- very strongly doubt there is any truth to this statement

2- if there is, then Bubbles' "racing buddies" are almost as
stupid & incompetent as he is.



Poor Doug. My racing buddies with their 1st Series Beneteau's,
Catalinas, J-Boats and C&Cs have something he'll never have.
A sense of humor. Anyone else would have known that a comment like that
is humorous, but NOT Doug!
Bravo...now kill the light, Hymie!



.... The wing just works against us at that point.


Could you explain what this means, technically?


Our wing has 19% more wetted surface than the standard 6 foot keel.
It's also less hydrodynamic dead downwind. Some 35s5's owners have
fared the wing to improve this weakness with good results. I can give
you a link to one owner who's done that and is winning some big races.
He's also listed on the North Sails website.
Why don't YOU explain to everyone why a wing can cause problems
downwind...there are 3 major reasons. Let's see you list them.


RB
35s5
NY

.... My racing buddies with their 1st Series Beneteau's,
Catalinas, J-Boats and C&Cs have something he'll never have.

An imaginary friend?
Lots of huge shiny trophies in the Matrix?
Blowhard bragging rights on the internet?



.... The wing just works against us at that point.

Could you explain what this means, technically?


"Capt" Rob wrote:
Our wing has 19% more wetted surface than the standard 6 foot keel.

According to who?

It's also less hydrodynamic dead downwind.

Really? What hydrodynamic purpose does the keel serve when
running DDW?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Oh and I'd like to hear about your champion racing buddy
with the bulb keel frac rig J-29. Got that hull# yet? It's
really really hard to find.

DSK

Blowhard bragging rights on the internet?


.... The wing just works against us at that point.


Could you explain what this means, technically?


"Capt" Rob wrote:
Our wing has 19% more wetted surface than the standard 6 foot keel.



According to who?

BeneteauUSA, Doug. The keel is not only winged but also LONGER. See!
http://www.beneteauusa.com/sail/prev...ages/f35s5.gif
YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU"RE TALKING ABOUT!!!


Really? What hydrodynamic purpose does the keel serve when
running DDW?

Gee wiz, Doug, what does a centerboard boat do with the dagger DDW?
That answers your question in part, but a standard keel on a
displacement hull can benefit from some tracking via a fin. Wings can
offer lift, but for a boat like mine, it's a slower run than a regular
fin. YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT!!!!


Oh and I'd like to hear about your champion racing buddy

Show everyone that you're not a liar and POST where I wrote he was
champion racer!!! GO AHEAD!!! YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING
ABOUT!!!!


with the bulb keel frac rig J-29. Got that hull# yet? It's
really really hard to find.

Doug, tomorrow evening I'll post pics of the boat and hull #, thereby
proving YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT!!!
Why don't we bet something? I'll bet 100 dollars that I post pics of
the J boat by tomorrow evening and that you'll also look dumber than
toast!

RB
35s5
NY

Nutsy,
Our wing has 19% more wetted surface than the standard 6 foot keel. It's
also less hydrodynamic dead downwind. Some 35s5's owners have fared the
wing to improve this weakness with good results. I can give you
a-----------

That wetted surface can be made to work for you. I had my wing set to
point slightly downward, so the when she heeled the pitch of the wing
would counter-act any leeway.

With the Sails set as I explained. I would the crew in the cockpit to
get a parallel set of the wing with water surface. This with the airflow
shape of the wing would give me enough (or more) lift, depending on the
flow to over-come the wetted area.

Next time you have her on the hard check that alignment. I'm sure other
have thought of this as well as me. In the mean time check speed and
crew placement. Your wing keel will match a deep fin without a problem.

Remember that the Aussies passed O'Connor on the down wind leg in the
Am. Cup.

Just learn to sail it. It's a great keel. At least mine was.




http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomPage

Ok Nutsy,

Some more from the Old Man;

Heading downwind; if you have the 150% poled out (Ah yes) Take the Lazy
Sheet forward to the Bow mooring cleat and then back to the off side
winch and haul (Barbar haul) the pole down. Just hand tight. Gybe the
Main over to wing-on-wing and barbar haul the Boom, if you don't have a
preventer. Now you have both sails under control for downwind, Ease the
helm gently to force the jib to windward (maybe as much as 20 degrees or
until the jib starts to back) then drop back just until the jib starts
to draw again. You'll get your boat down wind almost as fast a a chute.
You'll be amassed at the speed you'll pick up.

You can travel like that until you can come back to your course on a
fast broad reach. Give it a try. It will satisfy that big Main and be a
lot faster and easier going down wind.

If you like it you can mount a Cunningham hook on the deck, forward of
the main but back where you can easily hook the Lazy sheet, like I did

My female crew call it it "Cookie Tack" They're set it up and I'd pass
them the bag bag of cookies I'd buy for them on sailing nite. It was
time for them to sit still ans gab.

P/S It was also the tack I'd like to cut loose a healthy Fart and let
it sail with us down wind :^)

My tip for the first of Aug. Take it or leave it




http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomPage

"Capt" Rob wrote:
Our wing has 19% more wetted surface than the standard 6 foot keel.



According to who?



BeneteauUSA. E-mail them if you like. Or simply use your head and look
at the two keels. The wing is a foot shorter, but it carries the wings,
side surface + flat keel bottom.



RB
35s5
NY