wrote:
However, yesterday we went sailing on the S2 with another family. I
asked them to sail with us because this friend had remarked that his
small son wanted to try sailing. They arrived at the dock with a 12 yr
old daughter, a 9 year old son, and a 18 month old and the two of them.

Was this a surprise or did you know you were going to get
such a crowd?


I thought, "OK, we sail back and forth under main alone and finally one
of em gets seasick so we come in". It was slightly choppyand about 14
kts and I got the main up in spite of the crowd.

Now here is your first mistake. You have mistaken the goal
of getting sail set & the boat into a certain mode (possibly
to a certain area). Wrong approach, the goal is to have fun.

Start out at the dock by taking them on a tour of the boat.
Show them the ropes, quite literally! And as much of the
other stuff as their patience seems likely to take in...
don't bore them silly before setting out. This is a good
time to set some safety rules too, and to make the point to
the parents that *they* will have to keep an eye on the ones
too little to take care of themselves. It will also give the
older ones a chance to feel grown up and be responsible for
themselves.


.... The kids mostly
stayed down below at first and out of the way. My own family makes me
crazy when we sail so I was nervous about somebody elses. Sure enough,
the kids finally all wanted to sit on the bow. This was all I needed,
trying to sail while I watched a bunch of other kids. I insisted they
all wear life jackets when out of the cabin

That's a very sensible precaution.

... AND that they all tie in
when outside the cockpit.

In the absence of proper harnesses & jacklines, I don't know
if this is such a good idea.

But if you are so paranoid about one going over the side, do
a man-overboard drill with a volunteer... one of the bigger
kids, or one of the parents (kids LOVE this).


.... Of course, my wife couldnt figger out how to
tie em in so I had to leave the tiller to her while I did it and she
gets so busy talking the boat wanders all ovetr the bay. With the main
flapping like crazy I finally regained the tiller. At least the dad
decided to stay on the bow with em. Still, I was nervous as i could
possibly be.

Sounds to me like you don't really have control of yourself,
which makes it difficult to be in control of the situation.

One way to get a grip on this is to think two jumps ahead,
and do everything slowly, explaining what is happening and
what everybody should do, as it happens. This gets people
involved in sailing the boat. I bet you were leaping around
the boat like a jackrabbit, and to the others your behavior
was unpredictable and unpleasant even if you were not
cussing at them.


My wife realizing we were really going slow decided we had to unroll
the RF jib so I insisted the kids leave the bow cuz I just knew someone
would get hit by the clips on the jibsheets.

So why the heck do you have clips on the jibsheets?


.... So this meant they could
play in the V-berth and stand in the forward hatch.

This was one of the favorite things for our nieces and
nephews to do when they were small.

... Unfortunately, it
meant three adults and a baby in the cockpit, waaaaaaaay crowded. I
can almost not sail under such conditions. Every time I tacked I had
to ask the wife holding the baby to move and was constantly stepping
over someone. My cockpit is large but seems very crowded with just
three adults. How do other people handle this?

Can't you steer from the low side? Why neurotically demand
that everybody move all the time, if all you have to do is
steer? Better yet, why don't you park yourself elsewhere and
let somebody else steer?


Next. they all wanted the bimini up. Sure, its sunny, being June in
Florida, but I really want to be able to see my sail and hate the
bimini for this reason but up it went. Do other people dislike their
bimini for this reason?

Yes and I always feel the windage is dragging the boat
backwards. However when the sun is blazing, that takes
priority. Why not furl the main and sail with just the jib,
which is a lot less critical... also it helps develop the
ability to sail by feel.


Finally, the mom goes below to nurse the little one so I can finally
really sail. I get on a good point of sail and even with only a
partially unfurled jib she digs in, heels over and starts charging
across the bay. It feels wonderful. The Clino says 20 degrees and I
ease off to get a little more speed and she heels more. Crash, slide,
uh-oh, their baby stuff slides across the cabin and mom on the downhill
settee looks concerned so I ease off.

Did you explain to her (or anyone) what was going to happen?
One of the things that landlubbers find the most scary about
boats is that ALL OF A SUDDEN the sail comes crashing over,
the boat leans, water surges up over the rail, etc etc. They
can't tell if it is supposed to be part of the fun, or if
the boat is sinking.

Another thing, when you tell the crew exactly what is going
to happen, and it does, then they have a great deal more
confidence in your ability.


The wind picks up a little more, the beginnings of Alberto hundresds of
miles away and the chop is a little more. The 9 year old son sits in
the cockpit corner with that look that says SEASICK, a perfect
opportunity to go in.
So, you'd think a 28' boat would be large enough for company but three
adults and a baby int he cockpit is simply waaaaaaay overcrowded. I
cannot imagine that larger boats really have much larger cockpits, it'd
be unsarfe. So, what do people do? Do I decide to not have company
and go back to sailing alone or just with one of my kids?


Yes.
And bigger boats often do have bigger cockpits.
It sounds to me like your boat isn't really set up for
company, that you dislike it yourself, and you are
deliberately (or perhaps subconsciously) driving everybody
to hate sailing so you can go back to doing it alone. A
fairly common scenario, actually.


katysails wrote:
We use extra people for ballast but when it's little bitties, not much
you can do...
the 12 and 9 year old are certainly within the age of reason to be able
to understand directions...you should have involved them in sailing the
boat...

Exactly.

... next time someone approached you wanting to sail, be direct.
Make sure you ask "It will be you and your son" If more show up, just
be honest nad say, "Sorry, folks, neither me nor my boat is up to this.
There must have been a misunderstanding..."

Exactly. That is how the skipper should take control of the
situation right from the start. Not to be a raging Capt
Bligh about it though



wrote:
It was really my mistake, I knew he had kids and rarely does anything
without them.
About your cockpit, seating is not a problem but somebody is always in
front of the winch, etc. You always have to reach over someone to
adjust the mainsheet (it is in the companionway). You dont find
reaching around people to tend sheets to be a hassle?


No, I make them do it. Or else get everybody sitting up on
the cabin top or on the rail.


The kids on the bow probably was a mistake but otherwise they woulda
been in the cockpit or on cabin top, etc.

What's wrong with them sitting up there?

.... Inside for long meant quick
seasickness.. They were tied in with lifejackets on.


Lifejackets are good. We have some excellent vest types in
several sizes, when we have kids aboard who have to wear
life jackets, I wear one too. Makes it seem less like
punishment to them.

We have had non-sailing company for short trips many times,
including storms.... one time some friends from work who
were surprisingly clumsy and paranoid about the water, don't
know why they said they wanted to go sailing. I spent a
great deal of time showing them that the boat was well
ballasted and would not tip over, how to control the sails
with the various lines, where was a good place to sit, etc
etc. For example, I told them in advance that the sailing of
the boat took precedence over conversation and that I would
have to interrupt them. I told them when we were going to
tack that the boat was going to lean over the other way. Etc
etc etc. It was rather tiring for me.

We didn't spend much time sailing and of course we got hit
with a real bad thunderstorm. I sent everybody below to play
cards while I sailed the boat under a small corner of the
jib so that we'd be closer to the home dock when the storm
was over.

The main advice I can give you is to be more flexible in the
way you go about things, consider the goal. Most importantly
don't let circumstances drive you, you must think ahead, be
in control, and drive the situation.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King