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Capt. Rob May 5th 06 01:11 AM

Sailing and Cars
 
There's plenty of crude in the Earth to power our vehicles for the rest
of
our lives.


It's easy to dismiss the current Hybrids, Max, just like almost all
forms of recycling (except for cans) is not really helping. But the
only way these technologies eventually become benificial is when we
invest in them.
My comment about a comfortable car refers to the suggestion of a
Corolla, a car I can't even drive as I'm too tall. Most of those midget
econoboxes won't work for someone over 6'1 tall.
Your comment about the Camry hybrid is dead wrong. Read the specs and
European tests that were done.
Oil may get my money, but they'll get less of it.
Oh, and the Lincoln Navigator is not even in the same high-class of
comfort as my Tribeca. I strongly suggest you drive the awful
Navigator. It's a clear lesson as to why US car companies can't compete
at all.

RB
35s5
NY


Maxprop May 6th 06 01:39 AM

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
There's plenty of crude in the Earth to power our vehicles for the rest
of
our lives.


It's easy to dismiss the current Hybrids, Max, just like almost all
forms of recycling (except for cans) is not really helping. But the
only way these technologies eventually become benificial is when we
invest in them.


Hybrids rely on petroleum for all their energy. Are you saying we shouldn't
bother with alternative fuels?

My comment about a comfortable car refers to the suggestion of a
Corolla, a car I can't even drive as I'm too tall. Most of those midget
econoboxes won't work for someone over 6'1 tall.


Ergo my suggestion of a Lincoln Navigator for you. 12mpg, Bubbles.

Your comment about the Camry hybrid is dead wrong. Read the specs and
European tests that were done.


It's not wrong. The Camry hybrid's goal was to allow a more powerful engine
with no more fuel expenditure than a smaller V6. If the project had been
intended as an ultra fuel-efficient. green car, they would have used the
same engine/motor combination as the Prius.

Oil may get my money, but they'll get less of it.


Right, but Toyota will get a lot more of it--more than it needs to. Buy a
Yaris and the bottom line will be less money out of your pocket over the
long run than with a Prius or especially with the Camry or a Honda Accord
hybrid.

Oh, and the Lincoln Navigator is not even in the same high-class of
comfort as my Tribeca. I strongly suggest you drive the awful
Navigator. It's a clear lesson as to why US car companies can't compete
at all.


I wouldn't drive either, thanks.

Max



Capt. Rob May 6th 06 01:20 PM

Sailing and Cars
 
Right, but Toyota will get a lot more of it--more than it needs to.
Buy a
Yaris and the bottom line will be less money out of your pocket over
the
long run than with a Prius or especially with the Camry or a Honda
Accord
hybrid.

You keep chanting this and avoiding facts. Taller people can't drive
those econoboxes. I like Toyota...great cars and they earn their money
by making them better every few months.


The Camry hybrid's goal was to allow a more powerful engine
with no more fuel expenditure than a smaller V6.

And if you read read the results they got high 30's making it a great
car for MPG. And it's large enough for tall people, luggage and crash
safety. End of story.

Hybrids rely on petroleum for all their energy. Are you saying we
shouldn't
bother with alternative fuels?

Alternative fuel powered cars are not practical or really available for
most people, Max. Are you saying that this is good reason to drive a
Lincoln, burn more fuel and polute more than is required. That's some
argument.


RB
35s5
NY


Capt. Rob May 6th 06 01:21 PM

Sailing and Cars
 
Navigator. It's a clear lesson as to why US car companies can't compete
at all.


I wouldn't drive either, thanks.


It helps to drive these cars to have real world understanding of them,
Max.
Which you don't.


RB
35s5
NY


Capt.Mooron May 6th 06 04:52 PM

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message

It helps to drive these cars to have real world understanding of them,
Max.
Which you don't.



Which in Bobsprit Speak means that vehicles the size of the Navigator... are
the only ones he doesn't have to order the optional extra large shoehorn to
ladle his bulk behind the wheel.

Bobsprit's weight alone would negate the fuel efficiency of any vehicle...
due to the mass it is required to transport with him inside.

CM-



Thom Stewart May 7th 06 11:13 PM

Sailing and Cars
 
Hey Nutsy,

Have you even looked at the Ford Explore Hybred? It sure looks like it
could make a 6'5" body comfortable. Milage is good and it sure as hell
has more power; Enough for a real SUV, not a make believe.

Have you looked`or not?

http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomPage


Maxprop May 8th 06 03:08 AM

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
Right, but Toyota will get a lot more of it--more than it needs to.
Buy a
Yaris and the bottom line will be less money out of your pocket over
the
long run than with a Prius or especially with the Camry or a Honda
Accord
hybrid.

You keep chanting this and avoiding facts. Taller people can't drive
those econoboxes.


How tall are you? I'm 6' and can sit in a Yaris with at least two or three
inches to spare overhead.

The Camry hybrid's goal was to allow a more powerful engine
with no more fuel expenditure than a smaller V6.

And if you read read the results they got high 30's making it a great
car for MPG. And it's large enough for tall people, luggage and crash
safety. End of story.


Was that 30mpg an all-around average, or just highway. Actually, IIRC,
hybrids get slightly better mileage in city driving, mostly because their
engines shut down at stoplights and restart automatically when the
accelerator is pressed. AND they use more electric motor power for starts,
etc. But my BMW 323Ci gets around 32 on the highway, but averages about 26
overall. A four-cylinder Camry will do even better than that. My
contention is that Toyota wanted to make a car with the power of a big V6
but with the fuel economy of a 4. And they did. If they'd really wanted to
make the Camry hybrid a green ultra-econocar they'd have put a 4cyl with the
electric motor. That wasn't their purpose, however. Same is true with the
Highland hybrid.

Hybrids rely on petroleum for all their energy. Are you saying we
shouldn't
bother with alternative fuels?

Alternative fuel powered cars are not practical or really available for
most people, Max. Are you saying that this is good reason to drive a
Lincoln, burn more fuel and polute more than is required. That's some
argument.


How in Hell did you draw that conclusion?? To the contrary, I think the US
vehicle fleet should be comprised of at least 50% E85-compatible vehicles by
2012. And I think hydrogen fuel cells can be practical for commuter
vehicles. In the meantime, turbocharging can give decent power curves to
smaller engines with acceptable fuel economy without all the complexity and
expense of hybrid systems, to say nothing of avoiding the disposal problem
of megatons of sulfated lead from all those giant batteries the hybrids use.
THAT is a real ecological disaster waiting to happen, if hybrids catch on
more than the few percentage points they now occupy.

Max



Maxprop May 8th 06 03:08 AM

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...

And one more thing, Bubbles--that Prius is futt bucking ugly.

Max



Maxprop May 8th 06 03:13 AM

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
ups.com...
Navigator. It's a clear lesson as to why US car companies can't compete
at all.


I wouldn't drive either, thanks.


It helps to drive these cars to have real world understanding of them,
Max.
Which you don't.


I've never even sat in a Lincoln Navigator, but I've driven both the current
iteration of the Prius as well as the earlier version. Also driven a Honda
Civic hybrid, a Toyota Highlander hybrid, and a Ford Escape hybrid. I've
also read much of the automotive press' (Road and Track, Motor Trend, Car
and Driver, Consumer Reports) take on hybrids.

The problem, Bubbles, is that you are a typical gullible consumer, grasping
at the first thing that comes along, fully believing you are being 1)
ecologically responsible, and 2) cost efficient.

One outta two ain't bad.

Max



Capt. Rob May 8th 06 01:17 PM

Sailing and Cars
 
How tall are you? I'm 6' and can sit in a Yaris with at least two or
three
inches to spare overhead.

I'm 6'3 and I'm too tall for most compacts. But if you knew something
about driving, you'd also know that even shorter people can have
trouble if their legs are long.


Was that 30mpg an all-around average, or just highway. Actually, IIRC,

hybrids get slightly better mileage in city driving, mostly because
their
engines

Actually, you have no clue. I drove the Prius for several days and we
got MUCH better MPG locally off highway. Owners know it's more than
slightly better.

My
contention is that Toyota wanted to make a car with the power of a big
V6


Your contention is hardly a factor. The FACTS are that the Camry does
great MPG, have lower emmisions and is part of a improving curve of
higher MPG cars that don't sacrifice drivability and comfort.


To the contrary, I think the US

vehicle fleet should be comprised of at least 50% E85-compatible
vehicles by
2012.

And I think warp drive should also be installed. But here on planet
Earth we won't have any such thing. Meanwhile, at least some of us can
opt to spend less on fuel today.


RB
35s5
NY



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