The French built Beneteau simply trounced most of the American boats we
looked at. This was all about DESIGN. From a quality standpoint the
Tartan, Sabre, Caliber, Catalina, Pearson, C&C, Beneteau and other
makes we examined were really quite close. All had handled the 10-15
years of use well. J-Boats, C&Cs and Beneteau's that were raced hard
showed it below and on gear.
Then came design. The American boats displayed ZERO innovation. Aft
cabins, all the rage in Europe, were hard to find. Swim platforms were
also rare. Cabin layouts were of the cookie cutter variety, dull and
with no effort to improve living spaces. BUT, when we looked at
European models there was a lot of imagination at work. Not all designs
were a good idea. Some poor materials were chosen, but not any more so
than on US built boats.

So in the end we chose a Beneteau 35s5 because...........

It had better performance than most other boats from good builders such
as Catalina, Sabre, C&C, pearson and so on!
It had a better cabin by far. Fit and finish and usage of space led the
pack. Only was more livable though not as nice!
It looked different. With her sleek hull, sugar scoop and large ports,
the 35s5 had some personality compared to the US built boats!
It was a builder who was capable of staying in business so there is
actual support for the boat!

And this is exactly why US cars can't compete with Japanese cars. They
lack performance, appointments and most importantly....they are
generally devoid of any personality. In the end that might suit some US
owners, but some folks quite clearly want more.


RB
35s5
NY

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...

The French built Beneteau simply trounced most of the American boats we
looked at. This was all about DESIGN. From a quality standpoint the
Tartan, Sabre, Caliber, Catalina, Pearson, C&C, Beneteau and other
makes we examined were really quite close. All had handled the 10-15
years of use well. J-Boats, C&Cs and Beneteau's that were raced hard
showed it below and on gear.
Then came design. The American boats displayed ZERO innovation. Aft
cabins, all the rage in Europe, were hard to find. Swim platforms were
also rare. Cabin layouts were of the cookie cutter variety, dull and
with no effort to improve living spaces. BUT, when we looked at
European models there was a lot of imagination at work. Not all designs
were a good idea. Some poor materials were chosen, but not any more so
than on US built boats.

So in the end we chose a Beneteau 35s5 because...........

It had better performance than most other boats from good builders such
as Catalina, Sabre, C&C, pearson and so on!
It had a better cabin by far. Fit and finish and usage of space led the
pack. Only was more livable though not as nice!
It looked different. With her sleek hull, sugar scoop and large ports,
the 35s5 had some personality compared to the US built boats!
It was a builder who was capable of staying in business so there is
actual support for the boat!

And this is exactly why US cars can't compete with Japanese cars. They
lack performance, appointments and most importantly....they are
generally devoid of any personality. In the end that might suit some US
owners, but some folks quite clearly want more.


RB
35s5
NY


What's the headroom in the aft cabin between the bunk surface and the
ceiling?

Glory!

What's the headroom in the aft cabin between the bunk surface and the
ceiling?

I don't know exactly, but with my wife on top there's enough room for
spirited fun. I'd say it's perfect. There's also standing room just as
you step inside. It's not as nice as the aft cabin on a Catalina 34 for
room, but on a boat that really performs, it's unexpectedly nice.
There's also a single opening port and 12V vent keyed into the second
zone air conditioning and heat. We'll probably just leave the door open
on most nights.

RB
35s5
NY

The french can kiss my ass. Can't built a car and cant build a boat!!!
"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...

The French built Beneteau simply trounced most of the American boats we
looked at. This was all about DESIGN. From a quality standpoint the
Tartan, Sabre, Caliber, Catalina, Pearson, C&C, Beneteau and other
makes we examined were really quite close. All had handled the 10-15
years of use well. J-Boats, C&Cs and Beneteau's that were raced hard
showed it below and on gear.
Then came design. The American boats displayed ZERO innovation. Aft
cabins, all the rage in Europe, were hard to find. Swim platforms were
also rare. Cabin layouts were of the cookie cutter variety, dull and
with no effort to improve living spaces. BUT, when we looked at
European models there was a lot of imagination at work. Not all designs
were a good idea. Some poor materials were chosen, but not any more so
than on US built boats.

So in the end we chose a Beneteau 35s5 because...........

It had better performance than most other boats from good builders such
as Catalina, Sabre, C&C, pearson and so on!
It had a better cabin by far. Fit and finish and usage of space led the
pack. Only was more livable though not as nice!
It looked different. With her sleek hull, sugar scoop and large ports,
the 35s5 had some personality compared to the US built boats!
It was a builder who was capable of staying in business so there is
actual support for the boat!

And this is exactly why US cars can't compete with Japanese cars. They
lack performance, appointments and most importantly....they are
generally devoid of any personality. In the end that might suit some US
owners, but some folks quite clearly want more.


RB
35s5
NY

In article ,
J Beck wrote:
The french can kiss my ass. Can't built a car and cant build a boat!!!

You might not want to advertise this too much, as you may get a few
offers you don't want.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

What about Canadian boats?
S.

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
:
: The French built Beneteau simply trounced most
of the American boats we
: looked at. This was all about DESIGN. From a
quality standpoint the
: Tartan, Sabre, Caliber, Catalina, Pearson, C&C,
Beneteau and other
: makes we examined were really quite close. All
had handled the 10-15
: years of use well. J-Boats, C&Cs and Beneteau's
that were raced hard
: showed it below and on gear.
: Then came design. The American boats displayed
ZERO innovation. Aft
: cabins, all the rage in Europe, were hard to
find. Swim platforms were
: also rare. Cabin layouts were of the cookie
cutter variety, dull and
: with no effort to improve living spaces. BUT,
when we looked at
: European models there was a lot of imagination
at work. Not all designs
: were a good idea. Some poor materials were
chosen, but not any more so
: than on US built boats.
:
: So in the end we chose a Beneteau 35s5
because...........
:
: It had better performance than most other boats
from good builders such
: as Catalina, Sabre, C&C, pearson and so on!
: It had a better cabin by far. Fit and finish and
usage of space led the
: pack. Only was more livable though not as nice!
: It looked different. With her sleek hull, sugar
scoop and large ports,
: the 35s5 had some personality compared to the US
built boats!
: It was a builder who was capable of staying in
business so there is
: actual support for the boat!
:
: And this is exactly why US cars can't compete
with Japanese cars. They
: lack performance, appointments and most
importantly....they are
: generally devoid of any personality. In the end
that might suit some US
: owners, but some folks quite clearly want more.
:
:
: RB
: 35s5
: NY
:

NotPony wrote:
What about Canadian boats?
S.


Nothing short of terrific.

"Capt" Rob" wrote
: The French built Beneteau simply trounced most
of the American boats we
: looked at. This was all about DESIGN.

No, it's all about how you don't know what you're looking at.

..... From a
quality standpoint the
: Tartan, Sabre, Caliber, Catalina, Pearson, C&C,
Beneteau and other
: makes we examined were really quite close.

Only if you have no clue about how boats are built. I
suggest going to the library and checking out Ian
Nicholson's classic "Surveying Small Craft" then reading it.

Furthermore there is a large price difference between
Beneteaus and Pearsons, much less Tartans, Calibers, and
Sabres, so of course that leaves out the bottom-feeders like
you.

NotPony wrote:
What about Canadian boats?

S-sh! You'll confuse him!

DSK

Only if you have no clue about how boats are built. I
suggest going to the library and checking out Ian
Nicholson's classic "Surveying Small Craft" then reading it.

Furthermore there is a large price difference between
Beneteaus and Pearsons, much less Tartans, Calibers, and
Sabres, so of course that leaves out the bottom-feeders like
you.


Doug, rather than make a fool of you again, please look into how the
hull-deck joint is formed on a 35s5 vs a Tartan 34. While you're at it
also compare it to Sabre and Caliber. And since I have a copy of Ian
Nicholson's book, please refer us all to the section you feel is
relavent to this discussion. Give us a page #. I have the 3rd edition.

Only if you have no clue about how boats are built.

Nonsense. This what builders love to sell idiots like Doug. For
anything short of major full time cruising, a Sabre isn't going to
weather any better than a Catalina of the same age. In fact, after
looking at so many Sabres and Tartans, I'm certain that they're rep is
overstated. All production boats are very close in quality unless you
are spending BIG. I understand the need for the Sabre owner to believe
otherwise. After interviewing many surveyors for my book, I'm certain
of one thing: There are boats like Swan and Baltics....and then there
are all the rest. The differences are quite small on the lower end of
the food chain where Sabres, Pearsons, Beneteau's, Catalina's, Island
Packets and the rest exist.
The saddest part is that most sailors buy a boat like a Sabre for
quality they've little knowledge of....just like Doug. They "heard
about it." When my book is released, losers like Doug are gonna have a
flipping heart attack...because dopes like him are "featured."


RB
35s5
NY

: looked at. This was all about DESIGN.


No, it's all about how you don't know what you're looking at.


Right, we wanted an aft cabin and swim platform, but we were just
looking at boats wrong when they didn't have them. I guess you'd have a
point if we'd given up something with the 35s5, but last time I checked
you and everyone here first liked the boat then started tripping all
over eachother trying to flip-flop on it.
Too late. It's the nicest sailboat here and one of the fastest. Period.
Enjoy your trawler, Doug. I know I do!!!

(See, BC, got all the key players. Sloco should be stumbling in any
second!)

RB
35s5
NY