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Capt. Rob December 8th 05 12:23 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Mid-Boom Sheeting 1/05/2003

While many racers prefer the load advantages from end-boom sheeting
relative to the mainsheet, end boom sheeting offers no real performance
advantages. Some racers advocate mid-boom sheeting on more modern
designs because vang adjustment, while still required, is less
critical. A boat snapping off a tack may find a proper set sooner than
a boat with end boom sheeting that also requires more dramatic vang
implementation. This may sound trivial, but serious races are all about
the 1/2 second advantages afforded by better designed gear. On the
other hand, a greater number of blocks may also slow sheeting times.
Thus far, the vast majority of hardcore race boats are fitted with
end-boom sheeting.
For the cruiser racer, the mid-boom sheeting is the clear winner. It
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children.

RB
35s5
NY


Vito December 8th 05 01:08 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
"Capt. Rob" wrote
While many racers prefer ....
...... This may sound trivial, but serious races are all about
the 1/2 second advantages .....


Two important things happened back in the 1960's. Roe vs Wade legalized
abortion and birth control and intellegent people began limiting the number
of children they produced. This meant that relatively fewer intellegent
children were born. Simultaniously, LBJ's Aid to Dependent Children (ADC)
program began paying stupid folk, village idiots, and others with defective
genes, to have as many offspring like themselves as possible. The two
quickly produced a big "hump" on the low side of the IQ bell curve with the
effect that the whole US population has been "dumbing down" for almost 50
years. The results are plain to see - the resurgence of fundamental
religion, the triumphs of faith over reason and logic, the election and
reelection of politicians like Bush, and the popularity of racing things
like lawn mowers, stock cars and sail boats.



Capt. Rob December 8th 05 01:34 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 


Oh dear.....!


Bad news, Ozzy. I didn't reveal the source of that text for a reason.
You don't agree with it? Please outline for everyone what aspect of the
comments on mid-boom sheeting are not accurate.
This is your big chance!

RB
35s5
NY


Capt.Mooron December 8th 05 02:22 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
For the cruiser racer, the mid-boom sheeting is the clear winner. It
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children.


That's a design shortfall... not a safety feature.

CM



DSK December 8th 05 02:50 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
"Capt" Rob" wrote-
For the cruiser racer, the mid-boom sheeting is the clear winner.


No it isn't. It puts more strain on the rig and gives less
leverage to the trimmer.

Mid-boom sheeting is a holdover from the bad old days of the
IOR rule when racers all had tiny mainsails with very short,
downward-sloping (negative stive) booms. The mainsheet could
be over the companionway and still be at (or close to) the
end of the boom for good leverage.

.... It
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children.



Capt.Mooron wrote:
That's a design shortfall... not a safety feature.


Oh yes, it *is* a safety feature if you assume that the
sailor in question will always be too clumsy to keep clear
of the mainsheet and too stupid to learn to handle it properly.

DSK


Capt.Mooron December 8th 05 02:59 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 

"DSK" wrote in message

Oh yes, it *is* a safety feature if you assume that the sailor in question
will always be too clumsy to keep clear of the mainsheet and too stupid to
learn to handle it properly.


I'll refer you to the "Boom Gallows".....

CM



Gary December 8th 05 03:08 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
DSK wrote:
"Capt" Rob" wrote-

For the cruiser racer, the mid-boom sheeting is the clear winner.



No it isn't. It puts more strain on the rig and gives less leverage to
the trimmer.

Mid-boom sheeting is a holdover from the bad old days of the IOR rule
when racers all had tiny mainsails with very short, downward-sloping
(negative stive) booms. The mainsheet could be over the companionway and
still be at (or close to) the end of the boom for good leverage.

.... It
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children.




Capt.Mooron wrote:

That's a design shortfall... not a safety feature.


Oh yes, it *is* a safety feature if you assume that the sailor in
question will always be too clumsy to keep clear of the mainsheet and
too stupid to learn to handle it properly.

DSK

Of course we could just Hunterize the main sheet and have end boom to
over cockpit arch to get the best of everything?

DSK December 8th 05 03:10 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Capt.Mooron wrote:
I'll refer you to the "Boom Gallows".....


Does that make this Boom Gallows Humor?

DSK


DSK December 8th 05 03:11 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Gary wrote:
Of course we could just Hunterize the main sheet and have end boom to
over cockpit arch to get the best of everything?


Actually, I like that idea and have seen a couple of boats
(not Hunters) where the idea was well implemented.

DSK


Capt.Mooron December 8th 05 03:17 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 

"Gary" wrote in message

Of course we could just Hunterize the main sheet and have end boom to over
cockpit arch to get the best of everything?


Shame when design flaws delegate what should be a boom gallows to nothing
more than a flimsy, rakish, equipment arch. It's the "look fast - go
nowhere" theme of modern sailboat design.

CM

CM



DSK December 8th 05 03:36 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
The two
quickly produced a big "hump" on the low side of the IQ bell curve with the
effect that the whole US population has been "dumbing down" for almost 50
years. The results are plain to see - the resurgence of fundamental
religion, the triumphs of faith over reason and logic, the election and
reelection of politicians like Bush, and the popularity of racing things
like lawn mowers, stock cars and sail boats



Nah, racing sailboats was a lot more popular back in the old
days... not as much going on. I'm serious. News reports of
the day indicate that sailboat races used to draw big crowds
along the shore and in spectator boats... I guess a
comparison to modern times would be if there was a "Grass
Growing" cable channel...

Dave wrote:
One major problem with your analysis, Vito. The folks in that hump on the
low side of the IQ curve vote overwhelmingly Democrat.


You mean like the ones who were persuaded to vote for
President Bush because of his church-distributed pamphlets
explaining that Kerry was going to outlaw the Bible and make
teaching homosexuality mandatory in public schools?

DSK


Bob Crantz December 8th 05 03:47 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 

"Capt.Mooron" wrote in message
news:R7Ylf.235612$ir4.194782@edtnps90...

"Gary" wrote in message

Of course we could just Hunterize the main sheet and have end boom to

over
cockpit arch to get the best of everything?


Shame when design flaws delegate what should be a boom gallows to nothing
more than a flimsy, rakish, equipment arch. It's the "look fast - go
nowhere" theme of modern sailboat design.

CM

CM


No, it's a spoiler! Hundreds of pounds of downward force to level out the
boat as it goes into semi-plane mode.

Amen!






Bob Crantz December 8th 05 03:52 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 8 Dec 2005 08:08:57 -0500, "Vito" said:

The two
quickly produced a big "hump" on the low side of the IQ bell curve with

the
effect that the whole US population has been "dumbing down" for almost 50
years. The results are plain to see - the resurgence of fundamental
religion, the triumphs of faith over reason and logic, the election and
reelection of politicians like Bush, and the popularity of racing things
like lawn mowers, stock cars and sail boats


One major problem with your analysis, Vito. The folks in that hump on the
low side of the IQ curve vote overwhelmingly Democrat.


Why shouldn't they vote Democrat? It's the party of handouts and when the
government has the power to rob Peter to pay Paul you can always count on
Paul's vote.

Enforce the Constitution. Get the Federal Government out of schools,
healthcare, housing, the workplace, the bedroom, the library, etc.

"I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more
efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote
welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to
repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones
that do violence to the Constitution, or that have failed in their purpose
or that impose on the people an unwarranted financial burden. I will not
attempt to discover whether legislation is "needed" before I have first
determined whether it is constitutionally permissible. And if I should later
be attacked for neglecting my constituents' "interests", I shall reply that
I was informed their main interest is liberty and that in that cause I am
doing the very best I can. "

Amen!




Jeff December 8th 05 03:56 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Gary wrote:
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children.




Capt.Mooron wrote:

That's a design shortfall... not a safety feature.


Oh yes, it *is* a safety feature if you assume that the sailor in
question will always be too clumsy to keep clear of the mainsheet and
too stupid to learn to handle it properly.

DSK

Of course we could just Hunterize the main sheet and have end boom to
over cockpit arch to get the best of everything?


Or a hardtop or pilothouse.

Capt. Rob December 8th 05 04:01 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
No it isn't. It puts more strain on the rig and gives less
leverage to the trimmer.

Leverage problem is easily solved with more purchase. Swan seems to
think it works! So did C&C, Sweden...would like to see a list of pricey
boats you wish you could own with mid-boom sheeting?

How about a Shannon 43?
How about a Swan 48?
How about a nice new C&C 121?

Good work Doug! And just to make things "clear" for you (cuz you truly
are dumber than rock salt), I'm in now way suggesting that mid
boom/coach roof sheeting is "best" only that it's a perfectly fine
alternative employed on many fine yachts. Perhaps you'll own one
someday and follow in my footsteps!

RB
35s5
NY


Capt. Rob December 8th 05 04:03 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
sailor in question will always be too clumsy to keep clear
of the mainsheet and too stupid to learn to handle it properly.


Yeah! Damn those 18 month old toddlers! A finger crushed in the
traveler will learn 'em! Best put 'em in a straightjacket and keep them
safe!
Doug, you are truly stupid...I mean...TRULY stupid.

RB
35s5
NY


Vito December 8th 05 04:11 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 8 Dec 2005 08:08:57 -0500, "Vito" said:

The two
quickly produced a big "hump" on the low side of the IQ bell curve with

the
effect that the whole US population has been "dumbing down" for almost 50
years. The results are plain to see - the resurgence of fundamental
religion, the triumphs of faith over reason and logic, the election and
reelection of politicians like Bush, and the popularity of racing things
like lawn mowers, stock cars and sail boats


One major problem with your analysis, Vito. The folks in that hump on the
low side of the IQ curve vote overwhelmingly Democrat.


Sure, and watch NASCAR and race their sail boats and ....



DSK December 8th 05 04:37 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
No it isn't. It puts more strain on the rig and gives less
leverage to the trimmer.


"Capt" Rob wrote:
Leverage problem is easily solved with more purchase.


Except that then you need more blocks & longer line

... Swan seems to
think it works! So did C&C, Sweden...


Like I said... it was a common arrangement back in the days
of boats that were driven primarily by genoa and had small
main sails with short booms.

... would like to see a list of pricey
boats you wish you could own with mid-boom sheeting?

How about a Shannon 43?
How about a Swan 48?
How about a nice new C&C 121?


Actually, the Swan and the C&C 121 have mid-boom sheeting as
an option, and it's not one that would be chosen by a
serious sailor for the reasons I've already given.

I don't know about the Shannon 43 but it's not a performance
boat by any stretch of the imagination.

.... Perhaps you'll own one
someday and follow in my footsteps!


I don't think so. Sailing is a lot more fun. try it some time.

DSK


Capt. Rob December 8th 05 05:16 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Except that then you need more blocks & longer line


So? For a family boat this doesn't make sense to you? Hey, I see it on
the new Tartan boats! They're all junk!
Doug, you are truly a dope! I notice you had no comment about the
toddler safety issue and the original comment is from The Handbook of
Sailing. Buh bye!

RB
35s5
NY


Capt.Mooron December 8th 05 05:38 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message

the original comment is from The Handbook of
Sailing. Buh bye!


The Hand Book of Sailing???.... sounds like they stole the title from your
book ..... "The Hand-Job of Sailing"

CM



Capt. Rob December 8th 05 05:42 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
sounds like they stole the title from your
book ..... "The Hand-Job of Sailing"


Did it just get cold in here??? Brrrrr!


RB
35s5
NY


Capt.Mooron December 8th 05 05:48 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
sounds like they stole the title from your
book ..... "The Hand-Job of Sailing"


Did it just get cold in here??? Brrrrr!


Oh Great!... I hope this doesn't mean you'll be quoting "Chilly Willy" now!

CM



Gary December 9th 05 12:14 AM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Bob Crantz wrote:
"Capt.Mooron" wrote in message
news:R7Ylf.235612$ir4.194782@edtnps90...

"Gary" wrote in message


Of course we could just Hunterize the main sheet and have end boom to


over

cockpit arch to get the best of everything?


Shame when design flaws delegate what should be a boom gallows to nothing
more than a flimsy, rakish, equipment arch. It's the "look fast - go
nowhere" theme of modern sailboat design.

CM

CM



No, it's a spoiler! Hundreds of pounds of downward force to level out the
boat as it goes into semi-plane mode.

Amen!

It would have to be upward force

katysails December 9th 05 03:25 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Only if your traveler system is mounted on top of your deck house...

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
Mid-Boom Sheeting 1/05/2003

While many racers prefer the load advantages from end-boom sheeting
relative to the mainsheet, end boom sheeting offers no real performance
advantages. Some racers advocate mid-boom sheeting on more modern
designs because vang adjustment, while still required, is less
critical. A boat snapping off a tack may find a proper set sooner than
a boat with end boom sheeting that also requires more dramatic vang
implementation. This may sound trivial, but serious races are all about
the 1/2 second advantages afforded by better designed gear. On the
other hand, a greater number of blocks may also slow sheeting times.
Thus far, the vast majority of hardcore race boats are fitted with
end-boom sheeting.
For the cruiser racer, the mid-boom sheeting is the clear winner. It
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children.

RB
35s5
NY




rgnmstr December 10th 05 04:29 AM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Some racers advocate mid-boom sheeting on more modern
designs because vang adjustment, while still required, is less
critical. A boat snapping off a tack may find a proper set sooner than
a boat with end boom sheeting that also requires more dramatic vang
implementation. .


Utter bull****. I haven't seen any new race boats with coach roof
travelers. Secondly, any boat that's "snapping off a tack" (never
heard the phrase) is sailing upwind I assume and wouldn't be using the
vang anyway. What a dope!

No wonder the 35s5 is always at the back of the pack.


Capt. Rob December 10th 05 11:05 AM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Secondly, any boat that's "snapping off a tack" (never
heard the phrase) is sailing upwind I assume and wouldn't be using the
vang anyway.


I no longer believe that Sloco even races. How far off the wind do you
have to be before it's NOT a tack and is a vang ever used on that point
of sail? Of course you never heard the term as it's used by
professional racers.
Something tells me I'd beat Sloco in a race with just my main up!

RB
35s5
NY


Capt. Scumbalino December 10th 05 09:28 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Capt. Rob wrote:

I no longer believe that Sloco even races. How far off the wind do you
have to be before it's NOT a tack and is a vang ever used on that
point of sail? Of course you never heard the term as it's used by
professional racers.


So, what does "snap off a tack" mean? In what way is it different from "a
tack"?


--
Capt Scumbalino



Capt. Rob December 10th 05 09:55 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
So, what does "snap off a tack" mean? In what way is it different from
"a
tack"?


Snap off a tack as in "as fast as possible" so as not to lose boat
speed. Not just a racing term. It's certainly used here and when I was
sailing in FL last month.

RB
35s5
NY


Capt. Scumbalino December 10th 05 10:07 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Capt. Rob wrote:

Snap off a tack as in "as fast as possible" so as not to lose boat
speed. Not just a racing term. It's certainly used here and when I was
sailing in FL last month.


But only by professional sailors, right?


--
Capt Scumbalino



Jonathan Ganz December 10th 05 10:44 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
In article .com,
Capt. Rob wrote:
So, what does "snap off a tack" mean? In what way is it different from
"a
tack"?


Snap off a tack as in "as fast as possible" so as not to lose boat
speed. Not just a racing term. It's certainly used here and when I was
sailing in FL last month.


I've heard "snap tack" but not "snap off a tack," unless you're
talking about some strange attempt to convey the desire to do an
efficient tack or American English isn't your native language.

I might say, "let's do a snap tack." I might say, "let's do a snappy
tack." I would never say say, "let's snap off a tack."
--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



katysails December 10th 05 11:19 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Which means one other yokrl said it, BS thought it sounded cook, so he
adopted it...

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
So, what does "snap off a tack" mean? In what way is it different from
"a
tack"?


Snap off a tack as in "as fast as possible" so as not to lose boat
speed. Not just a racing term. It's certainly used here and when I was
sailing in FL last month.

RB
35s5
NY




rgnmstr December 11th 05 02:22 AM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
The Boob looks like a ****** on every thread.


dog December 11th 05 02:00 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Only a few important points you forgot to mention.
1) Mid-boom sheeting requires larger main sheet gear as you have less
leverage compared to end-boom sheeting.
2) The forces on the main sheet are generally higher and the boom is
far more susceptible to breakage, as the outer end of the boom is
essentially unsupported and the mid-sheet mounting weakens the boom
where it is attached.
3) Prevents the use of boom roller furling gear for the mainsail.

On 2005-12-08 07:23:02 -0500, "Capt. Rob" said:

.
For the cruiser racer, the mid-boom sheeting is the clear winner. It
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children




Capt. Rob December 11th 05 02:07 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Only a few important points you forgot to mention.
1) Mid-boom sheeting requires larger main sheet gear as you have less

leverage compared to end-boom sheeting.

Yeah, so? You add more main sheet gear.

2) The forces on the main sheet are generally higher and the boom is
far more susceptible to breakage, as the outer end of the boom is
essentially unsupported and the mid-sheet mounting weakens the boom
where it is attached.

I can't find a single instance of a boom breaking (outside of really
old boats like Neal's) from this arrangement. Like a deck stepped mast,
cable based steering system or RF sails, it can all work well when
designed properly.

3) Prevents the use of boom roller furling gear for the mainsail.

I've seen mid boom sheeting on in boom reefing mains. That said, after
sailing three boats over the last two seasons with in boom and in mast
reefing, I wouldn't want it.


RB
35s5...the greatest boat here!
NY


Scotty December 11th 05 03:04 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 

"Swab Rob" wrote

That said, after
sailing three miles over the last two seasons....


RB
Tribecky...built for lesbians, bi lesbians
NY




Bart Senior December 11th 05 05:01 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
My thoughts exactly!

OzOne wrote
"Swabbie Robbie"
scribbled thusly:

Mid-Boom Sheeting 1/05/2003

While many racers prefer the load advantages from end-boom sheeting
relative to the mainsheet, end boom sheeting offers no real performance
advantages. Some racers advocate mid-boom sheeting on more modern
designs because vang adjustment, while still required, is less
critical. A boat snapping off a tack may find a proper set sooner than
a boat with end boom sheeting that also requires more dramatic vang
implementation. This may sound trivial, but serious races are all about
the 1/2 second advantages afforded by better designed gear. On the
other hand, a greater number of blocks may also slow sheeting times.
Thus far, the vast majority of hardcore race boats are fitted with
end-boom sheeting.
For the cruiser racer, the mid-boom sheeting is the clear winner. It
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children.

RB


Oh dear.....!

Oz1...of the 3 twins.




Bart Senior December 11th 05 05:02 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
I would definately want a boom brake with
end boom sheeting--in fact I'd want one anyway.

"Capt.Mooron" wrote

"DSK" wrote in message

Oh yes, it *is* a safety feature if you assume that the sailor in
question will always be too clumsy to keep clear of the mainsheet and too
stupid to learn to handle it properly.


I'll refer you to the "Boom Gallows".....

CM




Bart Senior December 11th 05 05:05 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
Jeff, What is the length of your traveller?

"Jeff" wrote

Or a hardtop or pilothouse.




Bart Senior December 11th 05 05:07 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
That is why the liberals don't need a platform, logic,
or common sense, and have to resort to sniping..

"Dave" wrote

One major problem with your analysis, Vito. The folks in that hump on the
low side of the IQ curve vote overwhelmingly Democrat.




Gary December 11th 05 05:11 PM

Mid-Boom Sheeting
 
dog wrote:
Only a few important points you forgot to mention.
1) Mid-boom sheeting requires larger main sheet gear as you have less
leverage compared to end-boom sheeting.
2) The forces on the main sheet are generally higher and the boom is
far more susceptible to breakage, as the outer end of the boom is
essentially unsupported and the mid-sheet mounting weakens the boom
where it is attached.

Not normally a problem as the points where the sheeting system connects
to the boom are normally spread out ( on my boat over 2 feet)
3) Prevents the use of boom roller furling gear for the mainsail.

Lots of boat with mid boom sheeting have inside boom furling as for the
old roller reefing, who has that anymore?
On 2005-12-08 07:23:02 -0500, "Capt. Rob" said:

.
For the cruiser racer, the mid-boom sheeting is the clear winner. It
clears the cockpit and is far more friendly to guests and young
children


It seems to me that whatever system you have, provided it is properly
designed should be fine. I prefer to have mid boom because it keeps the
sheet up high at the forward end of the cockpit and out of the way of
the way. On a big boat it makes dodgers and biminis etc less
complicated. In a small boat it makes ducking the boom less traumatic.




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