CM,

Sometimes it is important to remind ourselves that the herd mentality is
still very strong in the humans. The "Alpha Male & female still holds
sway. King, Queen, President. Leader are simple variations on "Alpha"
theme to pack leadership

Ole Thom

Right!
Other than to say I ain't biting ~ I ain't biting!
Scout

"Bob Crantz" wrote in message
ink.net...
Compare the Canadian marajuana violence with the actions of labor unions
in
the United States. Using the same logic, labor unions should be outlawed.

Amen!

Holy smokes!

Bob Crantz


"jlrogers±³©" wrote in message
...

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp.../ts_csm/odrugs
TORONTO - On the street it's called Northern Lights, Ontario Hydro, and
B.C. bud. It's one of Canada's biggest agricultural exports - a potent
form
of marijuana cultivated in sprawling "grow houses," worth an estimated
US$4
billion to $7 billion annually. Much of it is smuggled into the US.

Once hidden in farming communities and well-heeled suburbs, grow
operations - indoor nurseries with high-tech lighting and temperature
controls - have been thrust into the national spotlight. Thursday Canada
buried four young Royal Canadian Mounted Police officers who were killed
during a bust in rural Alberta March 3.


The Alberta grow house was just one of thousands across Canada. Here in
Ontario, police say indoor pot operations have risen 250 percent in the
past
four years. And Vancouver is home to some 7,000 "grow ops" at any time,
police say.


The tragedy - the deadliest incident for Canada's national police force
in
120 years - has ignited debate as Canadians begin to question whether
liberal attitudes toward marijuana and lenient laws enacted over the past
two decades have contributed to the drug boom.


"It's really got people talking about the problem," says Marc Pinault,
staff
sergeant with the Ottawa Police Service's drug unit. "It's pretty clear
that
we produce a pile of pot, and it's really good stuff. I don't know that
that's something we should be really proud of."


Drugs moving east
British Columbia has long been the hub of sophisticated, high-tech
nurseries
capable of producing pot with nearly 30 times the kick of what was found
on
the street a decade ago, according to the Drug Enforcement Agency.
Sergeant
Pinault says the increasing numbers of massive growing operations - once
largely the preserve of Asian gangs and bikers on the West Coast -
indicate
the problem is moving East into provinces like Ontario and Quebec.


Tom Stamatakis, a Vancouver police officer and a member of the Canadian
Professional Police Association, says criminals across the country are
modeling their operations after those found in and around Vancouver.


For example, he says, grow houses are increasingly found in upscale areas
of
the city as criminals ply their trade behind picket fences and a facade
of
respectability. Inside, they're a hotbed of danger - rigged with booby
traps
to ward off intruders and noxious chemical compounds that pose serious
health threats.


But those aren't the only perils. DEA special agent Rodney Benson of
Seattle
says recent busts have also netted a pile of automatic weapons and
explosive
devices.


"We're definitely seeing more violence," explains Mr. Benson, who
recently
oversaw a year long, cross- border sting called Operation Hockey Bag, in
which investigators charged 22 people and seized more than 400 lbs. of
marijuana, along with $3.4 million and a dozen firearms. "It's not just
weapons - it's what we're seeing from the organization. They rule and
intimidate from within."


RCMP investigators are still sifting through the evidence, trying to find
out what led to the killing of the four officers last week. The incident
began as an attempt to repossess a pickup truck but ballooned into a
larger
investigation after the marijuana growing operation was discovered. The
gunman, Jim Roszko, killed the officers and later turned a high-powered,
semiautomatic weapon on himself.


Canadian officials stress that it was an isolated act of extreme
violence -
and they hope to keep it that way. Many, like Mr. Stamatakis of
Vancouver,
say that Canadian lawmakers are too lenient in meting out penalties for
those involved in growing operations contributing to the drug explosion.


"When even the outgoing prime minister [Jean Chrétien] makes a flippant
comment like, 'What's the big deal about marijuana? I've probably had a
few
puffs myself.' That sends the wrong message to the community and the
courts," Stamatakis says.


Softer laws for using, harder for selling
There has been a major push to decriminalize marijuana across the country
in
recent years. Canada was the first country to regulate its medicinal use,
in
1999. However, while the government has recently moved to introduce
softer
penalties for possession, penalties for growers could get stiffer. A
marijuana bill, reintroduced in November, advocates that possession of up
to
15 grams would be punishable by fines of C$100 to C$150 ($85 to $125),
but
would no longer lead to a criminal record.


For growers, those caught with more than three plants, face up to five
years
in jail, or 18 months plus a C$25,000 ($20,700) fine. Those caught with
more
than 25 plants could face 10 years in jail, while the bill provides a
maximum sentence of up to 14 years for operations with more than 50
plants.


Last week, Public Safety Minister Anne McLellan issued a warning in the
wake
of the shootings, telling judges that they will be forced to explain
their
decisions in writing if jail terms are not imposed on those who grow
plants.
Under Canadian laws, criminals face a maximum seven-year jail term. In
practice, however, many people convicted of growing marijuana receive
sentences of little more than a few months, police say.


Criminologist Patrick Parnaby says the events of last week are likely to
lead to stiffer penalties. When something like narcotics is intimately
tied
to violence, there is going to be a powerful public backlash, says the
associate professor at the University of Guelph in Ontario. "Stricter
laws
will make the public feel a whole lot better," he says.





But many users pushing for decriminalization couldn't disagree more.
Blair
Longley, leader of the federal Marijuana Party, says legalization would
wipe
out criminal enterprises across the country.

"They've just used this [the Alberta shootings] as an excuse to crack
down
and enforce outdated laws," says Mr. Longley. "In reality, liberalizing
the
laws would mean you would get rid of almost all the profits and,
therefore,
all the crime."

--



jlrogers±³©
Beaten by George W. Bush! Now that's funny!

"Bob Crantz" wrote in message

Compare the Canadian marajuana violence with the actions of labor unions
in
the United States. Using the same logic, labor unions should be outlawed.

Amen!

Holy smokes!

That Rastafarians think so.

Max

"Bob Crantz" wrote in message
ink.net...
Compare the Canadian marajuana violence with the actions of labor unions
in
the United States. Using the same logic, labor unions should be outlawed.

Most labour unions seem to think that people should get paid even if they
don't produce anything. If labour unions had their way, then the American
Dream would collapse in no time at all.

Labour Unions and Prosperity are mutually exclusive.


Are you some sort of communist, Bob?




Regards


Donal
--

Donal,
No wonder my Irish ancestors left you behind.
When they arrived in America, America took a big **** on them. They worked
the coal mines for less than their daily bread. When they'd had enough,
they stood up for themselves, fought for fair wages, and made such a stink
that even the president of the US took note and began to make changes in the
law to protect the working man. A lot of blood got spilled but they figured
if they were gonna die, it would be at the end of a gun and not by
starvation.
Now you and others here are trying to say that people are all nicey nice,
and the laws wouldn't allow that to happen today. RIGHT! That's why business
is moving over seas, so they can treat those people like ****, the way big
business treated Americans 100 years ago, and less. This mentality of screw
the little guy will bite them in the ass when the little guys get together
and start cutting frigging heads off.
And by the way, the mentality of "the worker gets **** while the
sales-businessman gets all the profit" is what got the Jews hated in
Germany. I have a copy of an 1895 encyclopedia I'd love to share with you in
which it discusses the "growing" problem between German craftsman and Jewish
business owners. It's really quite interesting, considering when it was
written.
Scout

"Donal" wrote in message
...

"Bob Crantz" wrote in message
ink.net...
Compare the Canadian marajuana violence with the actions of labor unions
in
the United States. Using the same logic, labor unions should be outlawed.

Most labour unions seem to think that people should get paid even if they
don't produce anything. If labour unions had their way, then the American
Dream would collapse in no time at all.

Labour Unions and Prosperity are mutually exclusive.


Are you some sort of communist, Bob?




Regards


Donal
--

Capital will always flow to where it will produce the highest returns. The
influx of capital will always raise the standard of living of those in the
region to which it flows. The premise, of course, is that the capital is
managed by those who created it or their agents by choice.
The penalty for driving capital away is a lowering of living standard.

As far as laws go, they don't protect much. They offer a little protection
for the low wage hourly worker and that is all. You should see the white
collar slavery that presently goes on in this country. 80 hour workweeks
demanded (40 hours pay), employees pitted against one another for raises, on
the job injuries/ illnesses counted against you, no training, no tools, etc,
I could go on and on. I remind you that these employees are regarded as
"professionals".

I doubt you will ever see the hatred built up against the Jews come up again
against any group that controls capital. The reason being that it is very
easy today to move your money. The Jews were stuck in Germany.

Organized labor did do quite a bit in creating a safe, uniform and fair work
environment. The intent of business is not to treat people poorly, it is to
make money. Unfortunately, people of very small mentalities dedicate their
lives solely to work and rise in a corporation. It is there that they use
their positions to fill every crevice of their personality disorders or
mental problems. These are the people that make business look bad. There are
many, many businesses that treat their people well and the employees are
very loyal. These are typically the most successful of businesses. They know
how to treat human capital.

Amen!

Jimmy Hoffa burns in hell!

Bob Crantz




"Scout" wrote in message
...
Donal,
No wonder my Irish ancestors left you behind.
When they arrived in America, America took a big **** on them. They worked
the coal mines for less than their daily bread. When they'd had enough,
they stood up for themselves, fought for fair wages, and made such a stink
that even the president of the US took note and began to make changes in
the
law to protect the working man. A lot of blood got spilled but they
figured
if they were gonna die, it would be at the end of a gun and not by
starvation.
Now you and others here are trying to say that people are all nicey nice,
and the laws wouldn't allow that to happen today. RIGHT! That's why
business
is moving over seas, so they can treat those people like ****, the way big
business treated Americans 100 years ago, and less. This mentality of
screw
the little guy will bite them in the ass when the little guys get together
and start cutting frigging heads off.
And by the way, the mentality of "the worker gets **** while the
sales-businessman gets all the profit" is what got the Jews hated in
Germany. I have a copy of an 1895 encyclopedia I'd love to share with you
in
which it discusses the "growing" problem between German craftsman and
Jewish
business owners. It's really quite interesting, considering when it was
written.
Scout

"Donal" wrote in message
...

"Bob Crantz" wrote in message
ink.net...
Compare the Canadian marajuana violence with the actions of labor
unions
in
the United States. Using the same logic, labor unions should be
outlawed.

Most labour unions seem to think that people should get paid even if
they
don't produce anything. If labour unions had their way, then the
American
Dream would collapse in no time at all.

Labour Unions and Prosperity are mutually exclusive.


Are you some sort of communist, Bob?




Regards


Donal
--

"Bob Crantz" wrote
Capital will always flow to where it will produce the highest returns. The
influx of capital will always raise the standard of living of those in the
region to which it flows.

Yea, well tell that to the West Virginia coal miners of the late 1800s.

The problem often is that the owners of a business do not manage it. The
managament is done by a special group of employees called "managers" or
"bean counters". They manage it to benefit themselves, not the owners
(shareholders) and certainly not the workers. Unions counterbalance these
oft-dishonest people. Look at the scandals!

That's always been my contention, unions were needed back then, and
they worked . unfortunately they've gone too far in a lot of cases.
Why are you up at 0400?

Scotty


"Scout" wrote in message
...
Donal,
No wonder my Irish ancestors left you behind.
When they arrived in America, America took a big **** on them. They
worked
the coal mines for less than their daily bread. When they'd had
enough,
they stood up for themselves, fought for fair wages, and made such a
stink
that even the president of the US took note and began to make
changes in the
law to protect the working man. A lot of blood got spilled but they
figured
if they were gonna die, it would be at the end of a gun and not by
starvation.
Now you and others here are trying to say that people are all nicey
nice,
and the laws wouldn't allow that to happen today. RIGHT! That's why
business
is moving over seas, so they can treat those people like ****, the
way big
business treated Americans 100 years ago, and less. This mentality
of screw
the little guy will bite them in the ass when the little guys get
together
and start cutting frigging heads off.
And by the way, the mentality of "the worker gets **** while the
sales-businessman gets all the profit" is what got the Jews hated in
Germany. I have a copy of an 1895 encyclopedia I'd love to share
with you in
which it discusses the "growing" problem between German craftsman
and Jewish
business owners. It's really quite interesting, considering when it
was
written.
Scout

"Donal" wrote in message
...

"Bob Crantz" wrote in message
ink.net...
Compare the Canadian marajuana violence with the actions of labor
unions
in
the United States. Using the same logic, labor unions should be
outlawed.

Most labour unions seem to think that people should get paid even
if they
don't produce anything. If labour unions had their way, then the
American
Dream would collapse in no time at all.

Labour Unions and Prosperity are mutually exclusive.


Are you some sort of communist, Bob?




Regards


Donal
--

Scotty,
I've worked 3 jobs for the past 20 years in order to put myself, my wife and
kids through college (6 undergrad and 2 grad degrees). You already know what
my day job is. At night, I draw electrical schematics in AutoCAD and program
ddc graphics for Honeywell. On the weekends I have what has turned into a
cushy job operating a power plant (sounds better than boiler room).
I used to open the boilers and work all the mechanical projects, but on the
midnight shift I just watch gauges, flip switches, open and close valves,
and read read read. Oh, and sometimes I come on here to make a little
trouble. Pathetic, eh?
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
That's always been my contention, unions were needed back then, and
they worked . unfortunately they've gone too far in a lot of cases.
Why are you up at 0400?

You're not at Limerick, are you? Which trash-to-steam plants have you
been at? Back in the '70s -'80s
I delivered a lot of 'bag houses' and other equipment to TTS plants.

Scotty


"Scout" wrote in message
news
Scotty,
I've worked 3 jobs for the past 20 years in order to put myself, my
wife and
kids through college (6 undergrad and 2 grad degrees). You already
know what
my day job is. At night, I draw electrical schematics in AutoCAD and
program
ddc graphics for Honeywell. On the weekends I have what has turned
into a
cushy job operating a power plant (sounds better than boiler room).
I used to open the boilers and work all the mechanical projects, but
on the
midnight shift I just watch gauges, flip switches, open and close
valves,
and read read read. Oh, and sometimes I come on here to make a
little
trouble. Pathetic, eh?
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
That's always been my contention, unions were needed back then,
and
they worked . unfortunately they've gone too far in a lot of
cases.
Why are you up at 0400?