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Rules of the Road Question #8
BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND
hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. |
A
"Bart Senior" wrote in message ups.com... BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. |
Wrong! Oh Barnacled one. wrote in message ... On 8 Dec 2004 08:33:31 -0800, "Bart Senior" wrote: BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. There is no such thing as "right of way" in the regs. BB |
Bad question. None of the responses are always correct.
Cheers Bart Senior wrote: BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. |
"Bart Senior" wrote in message ups.com... BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. E. Neither. E. Regards Donal -- |
"Donal" wrote in message ... "Bart Senior" wrote in message ups.com... BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. E. Neither. E. Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow is the give-way vessel. It follows that the other vessel has the right of way. It's right of way makes it the stand-on vessel. I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand about this. I always sit in my motor dinghy straddling the center thwart and looking primarily to starboard. I do this so I can give-way to vessels that are on a crossing course and are on my starboard bow. This tells me that vessel has the right of way. In other it's way shall not be impeded by me. I hope this helps. CN CN |
"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message ... "Donal" wrote in message ... "Bart Senior" wrote in message ups.com... BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. E. Neither. E. Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow is the give-way vessel. As always, you are correct! It follows that the other vessel has the right of way. Wrong. It's right of way makes it the stand-on vessel. Nope!! I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand about this. Why not? Don't you understand that the Coll Regs also state that all vessels must take any necessary action to avoid a collision? There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you seem to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe. Regards Donal -- |
Capt. Neal® wrote:
Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow is the give-way vessel. It follows that the other vessel has the right of way. It's right of way makes it the stand-on vessel. I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand about this. I always sit in my motor dinghy straddling the center thwart and looking primarily to starboard. I do this so I can give-way to vessels that are on a crossing course and are on my starboard bow. This tells me that vessel has the right of way. In other it's way shall not be impeded by me. I hope this helps. I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way". otn |
"otnmbrd" wrote in message ink.net... Capt. Neal® wrote: Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow is the give-way vessel. It follows that the other vessel has the right of way. It's right of way makes it the stand-on vessel. I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand about this. I always sit in my motor dinghy straddling the center thwart and looking primarily to starboard. I do this so I can give-way to vessels that are on a crossing course and are on my starboard bow. This tells me that vessel has the right of way. In other it's way shall not be impeded by me. I hope this helps. I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way". otn That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable of seeing the bigger picture. CN |
"otnmbrd" wrote in message ink.net... Capt. Neal® wrote: Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow is the give-way vessel. It follows that the other vessel has the right of way. It's right of way makes it the stand-on vessel. I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand about this. I always sit in my motor dinghy straddling the center thwart and looking primarily to starboard. I do this so I can give-way to vessels that are on a crossing course and are on my starboard bow. This tells me that vessel has the right of way. In other it's way shall not be impeded by me. I hope this helps. I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way". otn It is a good point. I have a friend that has served as an expert witness at trial, they will divvy up the blame, even if you have the "right of way". John Cairns |
"Donal" wrote in message ... "Capt. Neal®" wrote in message ... "Donal" wrote in message ... "Bart Senior" wrote in message ups.com... BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. E. Neither. E. Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow is the give-way vessel. As always, you are correct! It follows that the other vessel has the right of way. Wrong. It's right of way makes it the stand-on vessel. Nope!! I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand about this. Why not? Don't you understand that the Coll Regs also state that all vessels must take any necessary action to avoid a collision? There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you seem to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe. And don't YOU realize that in the COLREGS all vessels must follow the Rules that apply. In the case of stand-on and give-way the stand on vessel is required to stand on and the give-way vessel is required to give way. Only if the give-way vessel does not follow the rules and causes a close quarters situation where there is a possibility of a collision is the stand-on vessel allowed to deviate from the Rules. This means the stand-on vessel has the right of way. That it is not granted the right of way does not make the fact of its right of way any less so. CN |
Capt. Neal® wrote:
That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable of seeing the bigger picture. CN G You won't get an argument from me, about that. However, every time a "Rules" thread comes up, this is one point that many will consider important. Personally, if I'm talking with someone who doesn't mind the term, then I feel free to use it. However, if talking with those who have a problem with it's use, for whatever reason, I refrain. otn |
A
"Bart Senior" wrote in message ups.com... BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. |
John Cairns wrote:
It is a good point. I have a friend that has served as an expert witness at trial, they will divvy up the blame, even if you have the "right of way". John Cairns If you only, truly understand one rule .... Rule 2 .... you will realize that it is next to impossible to have a collision where you won't have at least some percentage of the blame. otn |
There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you seem
to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe. Awwwww geee, Donal. I thumpt I was doing pretty good. Shen |
"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message ... "Donal" wrote in message ... Don't you understand that the Coll Regs also state that all vessels must take any necessary action to avoid a collision? There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you seem to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe. And don't YOU realize that in the COLREGS all vessels must follow the Rules that apply. In the case of stand-on and give-way the stand on vessel is required to stand on and the give-way vessel is required to give way. Only if the give-way vessel does not follow the rules and causes a close quarters situation where there is a possibility of a collision is the stand-on vessel allowed to deviate from the Rules. Wrong!!!! In these circumstances, the "stand on" vessel is not *allowed* to deviate, it is *required* to deviate from the rules. Regards Donal -- |
What you have forgotten is that the starboard rule does not always apply
between power vessels. Hope this helps Cheers Capt. Neal® wrote: "Donal" wrote in message ... "Bart Senior" wrote in message roups.com... BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which vessel has the right of way? A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel. B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel. C. The larger vessel. D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal. E. Neither. E. Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow is the give-way vessel. It follows that the other vessel has the right of way. It's right of way makes it the stand-on vessel. I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand about this. I always sit in my motor dinghy straddling the center thwart and looking primarily to starboard. I do this so I can give-way to vessels that are on a crossing course and are on my starboard bow. This tells me that vessel has the right of way. In other it's way shall not be impeded by me. I hope this helps. CN CN |
"Donal" wrote in message ... "Capt. Neal®" wrote in message ... "Donal" wrote in message ... Don't you understand that the Coll Regs also state that all vessels must take any necessary action to avoid a collision? There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you seem to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe. And don't YOU realize that in the COLREGS all vessels must follow the Rules that apply. In the case of stand-on and give-way the stand on vessel is required to stand on and the give-way vessel is required to give way. Only if the give-way vessel does not follow the rules and causes a close quarters situation where there is a possibility of a collision is the stand-on vessel allowed to deviate from the Rules. Wrong!!!! In these circumstances, the "stand on" vessel is not *allowed* to deviate, it is *required* to deviate from the rules. Semantics! I could argue in the same vane and say there is no rule countermanding the captains actions as long as whatever action he took avoided the collision. The caption is the final authority- not the rules. CN |
Capt. Neal® wrote: I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way". otn That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable of seeing the bigger picture. The big picture is that a real sailor does not assume the other vessel will hold her course or give way in simple crossing situation. Only a fool thinks there is a 'right of way' in this scenario. A real sailor knows the other vessel may not give way for a multitude of reasons includind CBD, RAM and NUC -let alone trawling. Hope this helps. Cheers |
But there IS a right of way. The rules give it to the stand-on vessel.
Otherwise there would be chaos. Just like the green traffic light gives you the right of way does not mean it will keep some idiot from running the read light and smashing into you but you do have the right of way until such time as that happens. Same holds true with the Colregs. They are a guide and a good one. But like any guide they cannot be written to cover every eventuality. That is why right of way is not an absolute but there is right of way nonetheless. CN "Nav" wrote in message ... Capt. Neal® wrote: I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way". otn That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable of seeing the bigger picture. The big picture is that a real sailor does not assume the other vessel will hold her course or give way in simple crossing situation. Only a fool thinks there is a 'right of way' in this scenario. A real sailor knows the other vessel may not give way for a multitude of reasons includind CBD, RAM and NUC -let alone trawling. Hope this helps. Cheers |
Capt. Neal® wrote: But there IS a right of way. The rules give it to the stand-on vessel. Which may NOT be the vessel on your starboard. Do you see it now? Cheers Otherwise there would be chaos. Just like the green traffic light gives you the right of way does not mean it will keep some idiot from running the read light and smashing into you but you do have the right of way until such time as that happens. Same holds true with the Colregs. They are a guide and a good one. But like any guide they cannot be written to cover every eventuality. That is why right of way is not an absolute but there is right of way nonetheless. CN "Nav" wrote in message ... Capt. Neal® wrote: I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way". otn That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable of seeing the bigger picture. The big picture is that a real sailor does not assume the other vessel will hold her course or give way in simple crossing situation. Only a fool thinks there is a 'right of way' in this scenario. A real sailor knows the other vessel may not give way for a multitude of reasons includind CBD, RAM and NUC -let alone trawling. Hope this helps. Cheers |
You're Canadian?
"Capt. Neal®" wrote .... A |
Donal is a liberal. He feels the term ''right of way'' is too harsh
and may hurt somebody's feelings and give them low self esteem. Scotty "Capt. Neal®" wrote in message ... "otnmbrd" wrote in message ink.net... Capt. Neal® wrote: Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow is the give-way vessel. It follows that the other vessel has the right of way. It's right of way makes it the stand-on vessel. I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand about this. I always sit in my motor dinghy straddling the center thwart and looking primarily to starboard. I do this so I can give-way to vessels that are on a crossing course and are on my starboard bow. This tells me that vessel has the right of way. In other it's way shall not be impeded by me. I hope this helps. I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way". otn That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable of seeing the bigger picture. CN |
Shen44 wrote:
BG Taking a test is one thing. That requires precise use of the terminology to be sure you pick the right answer. Or at least the ability to spot "trick" wording of questions. Having a "discussion", let's say, preparatory, to taking that test, is another matter. During that time, especially with a "Rules" discussion, you want to note all the possible interpretations and why they are correct or why they can get you in trouble so that when you take the test (be it a classroom or out on the water) you know what the rule means as well as what it says. So, again, I have no problem with someone using the phrase "right of way" in the context of this type of discussion, when the point about "stand on", "give way" is being discussed by those who have frequently gone down this waterway before. I also have no problem with a quick blurb from someone, reminding us all that others are reading this who may not be aware of the distinction .... I just don't feel it requires umpteen post to rehash it. Agreed on all points. The problem with the term "Right Of Way" is that it's subject to misinterpretation by many. That's one reason why it's been dropped from most of the ColRegs. 'Stand On' and 'Give Way' are much clearer descriptive terms IMHO. Fresh Breezes- Doug King |
Subject: Rules of the Road Question #8
From: This thread IS a test. Please look at the subject header. Thank you! BB If a quiz is quizzical, then a test is... ? LOL Ok, Bill, if you insist. I thought we had taken the test and were into the discussion stage. BTW, if you look back, I doubt you'd find a case where I used the term, other than in the context of the particular inland rule, unless we were discussing it's "inappropriate" usage. Shen |
Subject: Rules of the Road Question #8
From: DSK Agreed on all points. The problem with the term "Right Of Way" is that it's subject to misinterpretation by many. That's one reason why it's been dropped from most of the ColRegs. 'Stand On' and 'Give Way' are much clearer descriptive terms IMHO. Fresh Breezes- Doug King My feeling on this issue is that the term implies an absolute right on someone's part, whereas the truth is that ALL vessels are tasked with taking whatever steps necessary to avoid a collision, be they "stand-on" or "giveway". Shen |
Scott Vernon wrote: Donal is a liberal. He feels the term ''right of way'' is too harsh and may hurt somebody's feelings and give them low self esteem. How could that apply to you? Cheers |
These are actual USCG test questions.
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hey, I have feelings too, ya know!!!!!!
"Nav" wrote in message ... Scott Vernon wrote: Donal is a liberal. He feels the term ''right of way'' is too harsh and may hurt somebody's feelings and give them low self esteem. How could that apply to you? Cheers |
"Scott Vernon" wrote in message ... Donal is a liberal. He feels the term ''right of way'' is too harsh and may hurt somebody's feelings and give them low self esteem. Correct! I am probably one of the nicest people here. Regards Donal -- |
You've beaten Nav..... he's much too cowardly to face the truth about his
intellectual incapacities. You have to bait Nav... get him blubbering and bragging before you slam him. Whacking him on the noggin with a baseball bat like a 'pop gopher' really isn't sporting. Now you've gone and intimidated him...... he'll be shy about replying! Try baiting him out with a tender nugget he'll feel able to wrap his jaws around..... don't get to technical and scare him off. CM "Shen44" wrote in message ... Subject: Rules of the Road Question #8 From: "Donal" "Scott Vernon" wrote in message ... Donal is a liberal. He feels the term ''right of way'' is too harsh and may hurt somebody's feelings and give them low self esteem. Correct! I am probably one of the nicest people here. Regards Donal -- Alas, here I sit hoping I'll get some response from Nav, and what do I get, but Donal, displaying typical UK scarcastic humor. Shen |
"Shen44" wrote in message ... Alas, here I sit hoping I'll get some response from Nav, and what do I get, but Donal, displaying typical UK scarcastic humor. Please accept my apologies. I'm really sorry that you have failed to bait Nav. Also, in future I'll bear in mind that you don't appreciate humour. However, I can offer some guidance to help you out of your current predicament. All you need to do is learn a little bit about sailing! The Navigator never wastes his time with people who are completely ignorant of sailing matters. Once you know anything at all about sailing, you may bait Nav. You're lucky that the good Capt Neal is kind enough to offer you the benefit of his experience. In the old days, he was very intolerant of ignorance. He seems to have mellowed lately. Regards Donal -- |
Subject: Rules of the Road Question #8
From: "Donal" Please accept my apologies. I'm really sorry that you have failed to bait Nav. Also, in future I'll bear in mind that you don't appreciate humour. No apologies necessary. As for Nav, he's probably still trying to figure out the relation of the question to rule 24(g)(iv). As for appreciating humor, I've developed an appreciation for the UK version thereof, so feel free to attempt it at will. However, I can offer some guidance to help you out of your current predicament. All you need to do is learn a little bit about sailing! The Navigator never wastes his time with people who are completely ignorant of sailing matters. Once you know anything at all about sailing, you may bait Nav. ROFL Since, during a good deal of my younger years when I was boating recreationally, it was spent on sailboats, I would say I have at least a passing knowledge of sailing, though what this would have to do with someones knowledge of the rules of the road, escapes me as I'm seeing not a great deal of expertise being shown by yourself or Nav. You're lucky that the good Capt Neal is kind enough to offer you the benefit of his experience. In the old days, he was very intolerant of ignorance. He seems to have mellowed lately. I see that, and note he has "let you off the hook", so far. Regards Shen |
"Shen44" wrote in message ... ROFL Since, during a good deal of my younger years when I was boating recreationally, it was spent on sailboats, I would say I have at least a passing knowledge of sailing, though what this would have to do with someones knowledge of the rules of the road, escapes me as I'm seeing not a great deal of expertise being shown by yourself or Nav. Unfortunately, it takes a certain amount of knowledge to recognise true expertise. Soon, you may have this knowledge. You're lucky that the good Capt Neal is kind enough to offer you the benefit of his experience. In the old days, he was very intolerant of ignorance. He seems to have mellowed lately. I see that, and note he has "let you off the hook", so far. Rubbish! He used to give me a good kicking. After a while I realised that he was a better sailor than I, and I discovered that I could learn from him. He is very tolerant of people who are willing to learn from their betters. I have learned much from him, and I am now also tolerant of ignorant people who demonstrate a willingness to learn. You could be like me, if you tried! Good luck! Regards Donal -- |
ct: Rules of the Road Question #8
From: "Donal" Unfortunately, it takes a certain amount of knowledge to recognise true expertise. Soon, you may have this knowledge. The problem/shame is, that whether someone spends all their time on sailboats or powerboats, is no guarantee as to full understanding of the "rules", as you and Nav are proving. Recognising "true expertise" on any subject, involves a degree of expertise, which apparently is alluding you on the subject of "the Rules of the Road". Rubbish! He used to give me a good kicking. After a while I realised that he was a better sailor than I, and I discovered that I could learn from him. He is very tolerant of people who are willing to learn from their betters. I have learned much from him, and I am now also tolerant of ignorant people who demonstrate a willingness to learn. You could be like me, if you tried! Good luck. BG Donal, I have many people ( be they weekend warriors, seasonal boaters, sailboaters, powerboaters, professional, amateur, etc.) who are better than me on many aspects of sailing/boating, which includes "Rules". BUT, although I am still learning, there are few who can surpass my "in depth" knowledge of the subjects I will address, within these NG's, including "Rules". I am not perfect. I will be wrong, but as I told Nav "I don't squirm". If I'm wrong I will say so ..... and I wasn't wrong in what I said and tried to teach him about "Ristricted in ability to maneuver". Now, as I told Nav .... take your attitude and shove it up your ass, I'm not interested in your stupid bickerings. If you have a valid question as to what I've said, ask it. BG Regards Shen |
Shen44 wrote: ct: Rules of the Road Question #8 From: "Donal" Unfortunately, it takes a certain amount of knowledge to recognise true expertise. Soon, you may have this knowledge. The problem/shame is, that whether someone spends all their time on sailboats or powerboats, is no guarantee as to full understanding of the "rules", as you and Nav are proving. Recognising "true expertise" on any subject, involves a degree of expertise, which apparently is alluding you on the subject of "the Rules of the Road". That's why you have rule book beside you while I work from memory of my yachmaster exams! Cheers |
In article , Donal
wrote: "Shen44" wrote in message ... ROFL Since, during a good deal of my younger years when I was boating recreationally, it was spent on sailboats, I would say I have at least a passing knowledge of sailing, though what this would have to do with someones knowledge of the rules of the road, escapes me as I'm seeing not a great deal of expertise being shown by yourself or Nav. Unfortunately, it takes a certain amount of knowledge to recognise true expertise. Soon, you may have this knowledge. You're lucky that the good Capt Neal is kind enough to offer you the benefit of his experience. In the old days, he was very intolerant of ignorance. He seems to have mellowed lately. I see that, and note he has "let you off the hook", so far. Rubbish! He used to give me a good kicking. After a while I realised that he was a better sailor than I, and I discovered that I could learn from him. He is very tolerant of people who are willing to learn from their betters. I have learned much from him, and I am now also tolerant of ignorant people who demonstrate a willingness to learn. You could be like me, if you had a lobotomy! Good luck! Regards Donal -- |
"Peter Wiley" wrote in message . .. In article , Donal wrote: You could be like me, if you had a lobotomy! Good luck! Brilliant!!! That's an excellent beginner's attempt at wit. I'm really impressed. Regards Donal -- |
In article , Donal
wrote: "Peter Wiley" wrote in message . .. In article , Donal wrote: You could be like me, if you had a lobotomy! Good luck! Brilliant!!! That's an excellent beginner's attempt at wit. I'm really impressed. I'm trying to alter my IQ so I can understand what you type. Unfortunately I doubt I can ever aspire to true success. However, the rum does help. PDW |
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