*Yawn*. The logical conclusion is one you were told many times over. We
don't care.

I assume you've decided not to buy a boat sice you can't get anyone to
agree with your approach.

PDW

In article , Jim Cate
wrote:

To summarize the discussion following this question, 95% of the
responses were to the effect that my question was not relevant, or, for
some reason or another, shouldn't have been asked in the first place.
Almost no one was willing to answer the question direclty.

This naturally raises the question, why? What's the problem? The
logical conclusion is that this is an issue most sailors would prefer to
ignore.

Jim



Jim Cate wrote:


As discussed in other subject strings, I'm looking at 30 to 35-foot used
boats such as Cals, O'Days, Catalinas, etc. My intended use would be for
day sailing and sailing offshore near the coast in the Texas Gulf. As
mentioned, offshore sailing would probably require four or five days in
our area because of the distances involved.

Although I know it all depends on the person, the crew, the
circumstances, the boat, etc., have there been any studies or surveys
that might provide some idea of how many days of sailing per year an
owner of such a boat typically gets, particularly after the first year?
Again, it's obvious that it all depends, on the person, the individual
circumstances, his work load, etc., and that there can be no
generalizations. (No need to tell me this. - It's pretty self-evident.)
Still, there may have been some polls or surveys, or at least, some
general experience and consensus regarding the question. The reason for
asking is that, though I'm anxious to get out to the blue water, I'm
wondering whether I would be the exception to what seems to be the
general rule in this area, in which the boats seem to sit in their slips
for 99.9 percent of the time. For example, one of the brokers I spoke
with last week bragged that the owner of that boat had only taken the
boat out some 10-12 times in the past ten years. - Any estimates, guesses?

Jim

Nah, he already bought it and is looking for validation of his stupid
move.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Peter Wiley" wrote in message
. ..

*Yawn*. The logical conclusion is one you were told many times over. We
don't care.

I assume you've decided not to buy a boat sice you can't get anyone to
agree with your approach.

PDW

In article , Jim Cate
wrote:

To summarize the discussion following this question, 95% of the
responses were to the effect that my question was not relevant, or, for
some reason or another, shouldn't have been asked in the first place.
Almost no one was willing to answer the question direclty.

This naturally raises the question, why? What's the problem? The
logical conclusion is that this is an issue most sailors would prefer to
ignore.

Jim



Jim Cate wrote:


As discussed in other subject strings, I'm looking at 30 to 35-foot
used
boats such as Cals, O'Days, Catalinas, etc. My intended use would be
for
day sailing and sailing offshore near the coast in the Texas Gulf. As
mentioned, offshore sailing would probably require four or five days
in
our area because of the distances involved.

Although I know it all depends on the person, the crew, the
circumstances, the boat, etc., have there been any studies or surveys
that might provide some idea of how many days of sailing per year an
owner of such a boat typically gets, particularly after the first
year?
Again, it's obvious that it all depends, on the person, the
individual
circumstances, his work load, etc., and that there can be no
generalizations. (No need to tell me this. - It's pretty
self-evident.)
Still, there may have been some polls or surveys, or at least, some
general experience and consensus regarding the question. The reason
for
asking is that, though I'm anxious to get out to the blue water, I'm
wondering whether I would be the exception to what seems to be the
general rule in this area, in which the boats seem to sit in their
slips
for 99.9 percent of the time. For example, one of the brokers I spoke
with last week bragged that the owner of that boat had only taken the
boat out some 10-12 times in the past ten years. - Any estimates,
guesses?

Jim

In article , Jonathan Ganz
wrote:

Nah, he already bought it and is looking for validation of his stupid
move.

Hey, you were right! He probably bought it before his first post here
and hasn't been able to bring himself to admit it.

I've never even seen one of these things, doubt they'd go well in
Hobart where we can get 40+ knots up the channel.

PDW

Peter Wiley wrote:
*Yawn*. The logical conclusion is one you were told many times over. We
don't care.




"Yawn" is the response you would like to pretend is the case, but in my
experience, its not the truth. Boat owners I speak with DO concern
themselves with the fact that they pay their money to the marinas and
the insurance company and various other expenses, but can only sail
infrequently. Many of them seem to find their use tapering off over
time, and finally selling their boat after realizing they aren't using
it as they had anticipated. As I mentioned previously, I'm not saying
that this (time spent sailing per dollar spent) is the only, or even the
primary consideration. - Some people seem to enjoy owning a boat so that
they can talk about it on this ng. - But it is ONE factor that should be
taken into consideration, IMO.

I assume you've decided not to buy a boat sice you can't get anyone to
agree with your approach.

PDW

Nope. Wrong again.

Jim

"Jim Cate" wrote
"Yawn" is the response I get a lot.

I'm sure


Boat owners I speak with DO concern
themselves with the fact that they pay their money to the marinas and
the insurance company and various other expenses, but can only sail
infrequently. Many of them seem to find their use tapering off over
time, and finally selling their boat after realizing they aren't using
it as they had anticipated.


Well, there's the problem, you spoke to 'boat owners' and not 'sailors'.



Some people seem to enjoy owning a boat so that
they can talk about it on this ng. -


Not if they own a Mac26X.


--
Scotty
S/V Lisa Marie
Balt. MD USA

On Thu, 1 Apr 2004 10:02:37 -0500, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:

"Jim Cate" wrote
"Yawn" is the response I get a lot.

I'm sure


Boat owners I speak with DO concern
themselves with the fact that they pay their money to the marinas and
the insurance company and various other expenses, but can only sail
infrequently. Many of them seem to find their use tapering off over
time, and finally selling their boat after realizing they aren't using
it as they had anticipated.


Well, there's the problem, you spoke to 'boat owners' and not 'sailors'.



Some people seem to enjoy owning a boat so that
they can talk about it on this ng. -


Not if they own a Mac26X.

You have obviously made the mistake of comparing the Mac26X with the
"New and Improved" Mac26M. Apparently Macgregor has completely
designed the 26X, generally regarded as one of the most laughable
piece of crap boats on the market to a yacht that some buyers are
considering as an alternative to the Valiant If you are wondering
how to tell the difference between the "old" and the "new" 26, the new
ones are apparently blue or red and the old ones are generally white.
I am not certain when the option of a carbon fiber spar will be made
available for the Mac...that is what I am waiting for

By the way, I was forced to use one of those firberglass portapotties
at the park the other day and I was a bit surprised to see that they
are made by Macgregor. It was apparently the 7V, or 7' Vertical
model. It seemed to be better built than their line of
boats...probably faster under sail as well

See... I was right. He bought the piece of junk as is now trying to
justify the purchase.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...


Peter Wiley wrote:
*Yawn*. The logical conclusion is one you were told many times over. We
don't care.




"Yawn" is the response you would like to pretend is the case, but in my
experience, its not the truth. Boat owners I speak with DO concern
themselves with the fact that they pay their money to the marinas and
the insurance company and various other expenses, but can only sail
infrequently. Many of them seem to find their use tapering off over
time, and finally selling their boat after realizing they aren't using
it as they had anticipated. As I mentioned previously, I'm not saying
that this (time spent sailing per dollar spent) is the only, or even the
primary consideration. - Some people seem to enjoy owning a boat so that
they can talk about it on this ng. - But it is ONE factor that should be
taken into consideration, IMO.

I assume you've decided not to buy a boat sice you can't get anyone to
agree with your approach.

PDW

Nope. Wrong again.

Jim

In article , Jim Cate
wrote:

Peter Wiley wrote:
*Yawn*. The logical conclusion is one you were told many times over. We
don't care.




"Yawn" is the response you would like to pretend is the case,

It *is* the case.

but in my
experience, its not the truth. Boat owners I speak with DO concern
themselves with the fact that they pay their money to the marinas and
the insurance company and various other expenses, but can only sail
infrequently.

Then they shouldn't have bought a boat, they should charter one when
they have time and let someone else wear the expenses when it's idle.

Many of them seem to find their use tapering off over
time, and finally selling their boat after realizing they aren't using
it as they had anticipated.

So what? I did this with SCUBA diving and a number of
otherhobbies/activities. Didn't stop me from doing them & enjoying
them. I didn't stop because of money tied up, I stopped because I
wanted to do something different. Hell, I own a 600 acre place in
another state that I get to a couple times a year. I don't bother
thinking about opportunity costs etc etc.

As I mentioned previously, I'm not saying
that this (time spent sailing per dollar spent) is the only, or even the
primary consideration. - Some people seem to enjoy owning a boat so that
they can talk about it on this ng. - But it is ONE factor that should be
taken into consideration, IMO.

Yeah - your opinion. Fact is, most of us here simply don't care. That
makes you the odd one out on this n/g. Your problem, IOW, not ours.
Find another n/g more simpatico rather than ranting here.

I assume you've decided not to buy a boat sice you can't get anyone to
agree with your approach.

PDW

Nope. Wrong again.

You *did* buy what everyone here advised against? Enjoy.........

PDW

The guy sounds a bit like bob. Wonder if it's him trolling? Bob always
cared more about how much a boat costs or what he could make on it than the
actualy sailing. He also was into counting his cute little day sails as
sailing time and bragging about it.

SV

"Peter Wiley" wrote in message
. ..
In article , Jim Cate
wrote:

Peter Wiley wrote:
*Yawn*. The logical conclusion is one you were told many times over.
We
don't care.




"Yawn" is the response you would like to pretend is the case,

It *is* the case.

but in my
experience, its not the truth. Boat owners I speak with DO concern
themselves with the fact that they pay their money to the marinas and
the insurance company and various other expenses, but can only sail
infrequently.

Then they shouldn't have bought a boat, they should charter one when
they have time and let someone else wear the expenses when it's idle.

Many of them seem to find their use tapering off over
time, and finally selling their boat after realizing they aren't using
it as they had anticipated.

So what? I did this with SCUBA diving and a number of
otherhobbies/activities. Didn't stop me from doing them & enjoying
them. I didn't stop because of money tied up, I stopped because I
wanted to do something different. Hell, I own a 600 acre place in
another state that I get to a couple times a year. I don't bother
thinking about opportunity costs etc etc.

As I mentioned previously, I'm not saying
that this (time spent sailing per dollar spent) is the only, or even the
primary consideration. - Some people seem to enjoy owning a boat so that
they can talk about it on this ng. - But it is ONE factor that should be
taken into consideration, IMO.

Yeah - your opinion. Fact is, most of us here simply don't care. That
makes you the odd one out on this n/g. Your problem, IOW, not ours.
Find another n/g more simpatico rather than ranting here.

I assume you've decided not to buy a boat sice you can't get anyone to
agree with your approach.

PDW

Nope. Wrong again.

You *did* buy what everyone here advised against? Enjoy.........

PDW

Jim observed:

-- Many of them seem to find their use tapering off over
time, and finally selling their boat after realizing they aren't using
it as they had anticipated

None of those people are regulars here. Those are hobby sailors...they
haven't committed. And anyone who looks at sailing as a financial
proposition where you can get out fiscally solvent is a fool. It does
happen once in a while...we made a profit on both the O'Days...but in
reality, you're putting your money into the enjoyment of sailing and "being
there".
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein