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Which Radar, Redux
wrote in message
So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Why do you think you need any Radar? Do you often travel in fog? Are you headed Down East? A small radar will help a lot if you get caught in Vineyard Sound and want to stay clear of the ferry, but it sounds like this would only happen once a year, if that. You can make a case for more powerful radar if you cruise the Maine Coast all summer, but not for LIS. -- -jeff www.sv-loki.com "The sea was angry that day, my friend. Like an old man trying to send back soup at the deli." |
Which Radar, Redux
You're new to this group so I can't blame you for
falling prey to the wannabes and pretenders who are here mostly to disrupt this group. These people don't sail, don't have any first hand sailing knowledge and don't even own real sailboats. For your edification here is a list of people to ignore. Bobsprit - just a troll and a know-nothing troll at that. Navigator - a foreigner and wannabe from New Zealand Jeff Morris - has potential but is a catamaran motor boater Capetanios Oz - loser, best to kill file the jerk Donal - does sail but rarely shares sailing topics, mostly a communist Rick, otnmbrd, Shen44 - motorboat refugees from rec.boats Katysails - post menopausal housewife with an ignorant attitude S.Simon wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:09:13 -0500, "Jeff Morris" wrote: wrote in message So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Why do you think you need any Radar? Do you often travel in fog? Are you headed Down East? A small radar will help a lot if you get caught in Vineyard Sound and want to stay clear of the ferry, but it sounds like this would only happen once a year, if that. You can make a case for more powerful radar if you cruise the Maine Coast all summer, but not for LIS. I was hoping for some input from people with actual experience and knowledge. You and that Mooron guy (Who can't even spell moron correctly) seem more interested in trying to inflate your own weak and faltering egos more than adding anything of value. Yes, I frequently encounter fog in the LIS, as well as moderate darkness most nights. If you had a boat and sailed it, you would be more familiar with these concepts. Thanks anyway, jackass. Joey |
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wrote in message ... Well, I've decided that the JRC 1000, at any price is really not quite adequate. One thing I've found in the less expensive monochrome displays is that the Furuno 1623 is a quantum leap ahead of most of the other lower end displays as far as being easy to see. That "bright silver" thingy really makes a huge difference! Are you the same person who asked this question last week? Regards Donal -- |
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Yes, I frequently encounter fog in the LIS, as well as moderate darkness most
nights. If you had a boat and sailed it, you would be more familiar with these concepts. Joey, I think you got plenty of good info. I sail on the LIS, days and nights and fog happens but it's not common. My C&C 32 came with radar, but it's not something I'd swear is needed on the LIS, as others pointed out. Most days I see fog in the mornings, burning off pretty quickly. Once we got caught in some very thick stuff on my old Catalina 27 and we used the GPS to ring our way home. Most parts of the LIS are VERY well lit due to NYC glow. A clear moonless night can test your nightvision at times, but again, you can do it without radar. Hey, I like toys too, but let's be real about this. As others pointed out, the JRC, Furuno and other low end units will work fine. Go buy one and let us know how it works for you. Capt RB C&C 32 NY |
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Really? I'm mostly above the Connecticut River. NYC glow is not a factor at
all. You must be very limited in your sailing range. NYC is at one extreme end of the LIS. Look at a chart if you need to, to confirm this. Sailing near port jeff we were able to see quite clearly as well as leaving the Thimble Isle area. We did NOT use the radar to enter port jeff. Suzanne is learning nav and she wanted to take care. You don't "need" radar on the LIS on a small sailboat. Get as nasty as you like, but it won't change. NOAA would not disagree on the fog issue. It's not a common occurance by any means. And when it does come, it's rarely the pea-soup variety. RB |
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Did your GPS show you any yachts, ferries or barges that might be an issue?
Alright, let's start ripping you down. Do you actually sail? Do ferries and barges just wander all over the LIS? No, they operate in lanes that can easily be avoided with GPS. As for yachts, you have horn/bells It's clear you know little about sailing. The #1 reason for radar on the LIS is for tracking thunderstorms. Try asking a few people who use it and see. Even the fishing boats on City Isle. use it primarily for that. Sorry, you've made a jerk out of yourself....or you were one all along. You actually sound a lot like Binary Jane! RB |
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Damn... I didn't make the list.
"Simple Simon" wrote in message ... You're new to this group so I can't blame you for falling prey to the wannabes and pretenders who are here mostly to disrupt this group. These people don't sail, don't have any first hand sailing knowledge and don't even own real sailboats. For your edification here is a list of people to ignore. Bobsprit - just a troll and a know-nothing troll at that. Navigator - a foreigner and wannabe from New Zealand Jeff Morris - has potential but is a catamaran motor boater Capetanios Oz - loser, best to kill file the jerk Donal - does sail but rarely shares sailing topics, mostly a communist Rick, otnmbrd, Shen44 - motorboat refugees from rec.boats Katysails - post menopausal housewife with an ignorant attitude S.Simon wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:09:13 -0500, "Jeff Morris" wrote: wrote in message So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Why do you think you need any Radar? Do you often travel in fog? Are you headed Down East? A small radar will help a lot if you get caught in Vineyard Sound and want to stay clear of the ferry, but it sounds like this would only happen once a year, if that. You can make a case for more powerful radar if you cruise the Maine Coast all summer, but not for LIS. I was hoping for some input from people with actual experience and knowledge. You and that Mooron guy (Who can't even spell moron correctly) seem more interested in trying to inflate your own weak and faltering egos more than adding anything of value. Yes, I frequently encounter fog in the LIS, as well as moderate darkness most nights. If you had a boat and sailed it, you would be more familiar with these concepts. Thanks anyway, jackass. Joey |
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What about DSK, Mooron, Two wheels... The list is far complete if we are
to have a FAQ! Cheers MC Simple Simon wrote: You're new to this group so I can't blame you for falling prey to the wannabes and pretenders who are here mostly to disrupt this group. These people don't sail, don't have any first hand sailing knowledge and don't even own real sailboats. For your edification here is a list of people to ignore. Bobsprit - just a troll and a know-nothing troll at that. Navigator - a foreigner and wannabe from New Zealand Jeff Morris - has potential but is a catamaran motor boater Capetanios Oz - loser, best to kill file the jerk Donal - does sail but rarely shares sailing topics, mostly a communist Rick, otnmbrd, Shen44 - motorboat refugees from rec.boats Katysails - post menopausal housewife with an ignorant attitude S.Simon wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:09:13 -0500, "Jeff Morris" wrote: wrote in message So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Why do you think you need any Radar? Do you often travel in fog? Are you headed Down East? A small radar will help a lot if you get caught in Vineyard Sound and want to stay clear of the ferry, but it sounds like this would only happen once a year, if that. You can make a case for more powerful radar if you cruise the Maine Coast all summer, but not for LIS. I was hoping for some input from people with actual experience and knowledge. You and that Mooron guy (Who can't even spell moron correctly) seem more interested in trying to inflate your own weak and faltering egos more than adding anything of value. Yes, I frequently encounter fog in the LIS, as well as moderate darkness most nights. If you had a boat and sailed it, you would be more familiar with these concepts. Thanks anyway, jackass. Joey |
Which Radar, Redux
Sorry, Joey, I tried to give you reasonable advise. I have sailed in New England for over
40 years. The last dozen years I've had radar, and I've been happy to have it. But I cruise the Maine Coast, Buzzard's Bay, and Vineyard Sound - all places that have more than their share of fog. I've also traveled the East Coast to Florida several times, and haven't used radar more than few times south of Newport. LIS has very little fog; roughly 1% of observations have visibility less than 1/2 mile. If you "frequently encounter fog" in LIS, you don't know what fog is. When you get further East, you run into more consistent soup: Nantucket is 10% of observations. Even in the cities in Maine the number is 4%, but offshore that can go much higher. And while radar is handy at night, it shouldn't be needed in good visibility. Further, you asked if you need anything more than a 1623. The answer, in my opinion, is no. You'll make marginal use of a small radar on LIS; I don't see any reason to spend money on a bigger. What do you think you need? More power? More range? Better resolution? A bigger screen? You tell us, what feature do you think you need? You haven't told us what kind of boat you actually have, or where you plan to cruise. BTW, I've worked my way down in radars - I started with a Vigil, then a Ray 10XX, now a Ray SL70, which is roughly equivalent to the 1623. The first two were in the cockpit, but away from the helm; the SL70 I have at the helm so I can practice with it all the time. If you're planning on mounting it below at the "nav station" it's a waste. You won't practice with it enough to learn how to use it when its really needed. -- -jeff www.sv-loki.com If you can't say something nice, say something surrealistic. -Zippy wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:09:13 -0500, "Jeff Morris" wrote: wrote in message So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Why do you think you need any Radar? Do you often travel in fog? Are you headed Down East? A small radar will help a lot if you get caught in Vineyard Sound and want to stay clear of the ferry, but it sounds like this would only happen once a year, if that. You can make a case for more powerful radar if you cruise the Maine Coast all summer, but not for LIS. I was hoping for some input from people with actual experience and knowledge. You and that Mooron guy (Who can't even spell moron correctly) seem more interested in trying to inflate your own weak and faltering egos more than adding anything of value. Yes, I frequently encounter fog in the LIS, as well as moderate darkness most nights. If you had a boat and sailed it, you would be more familiar with these concepts. Thanks anyway, jackass. Joey |
Which Radar, Redux
Once again, a special place is reserved at the end of the list:
"Simple Simon" wrote in message ... For your edification here is a list of people to ignore. ... S.Simon |
Which Radar, Redux
This is not a forum to ask questions about sailing for any purpose other
than entertainment. I certianly would not preface any purchase or use of any equipment with information supplied here. Many try, but a few are here only to confuse and inflate their own ego's. The latter tend to throw enough disinformation around your time is better spent any where else, if true useable information is required. wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:09:13 -0500, "Jeff Morris" wrote: wrote in message So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Why do you think you need any Radar? Do you often travel in fog? Are you headed Down East? A small radar will help a lot if you get caught in Vineyard Sound and want to stay clear of the ferry, but it sounds like this would only happen once a year, if that. You can make a case for more powerful radar if you cruise the Maine Coast all summer, but not for LIS. I was hoping for some input from people with actual experience and knowledge. You and that Mooron guy (Who can't even spell moron correctly) seem more interested in trying to inflate your own weak and faltering egos more than adding anything of value. Yes, I frequently encounter fog in the LIS, as well as moderate darkness most nights. If you had a boat and sailed it, you would be more familiar with these concepts. Thanks anyway, jackass. Joey |
Which Radar, Redux
That's a nice philosophical argument, but what's the point? I'm not saying you shouldn't
get a radar, although I did question why you think you need it. I'm saying that unless you have a special need you haven't mentioned, you don't need more than a quality basic unit. So I'll ask you a third time, what aspect of the Furuno 1623 do you think might be lacking? wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 21:04:14 -0500, "Jeff Morris" wrote: Sorry, Joey, I tried to give you reasonable advise. I have sailed in New England for over 40 years. The last dozen years I've had radar, and I've been happy to have it. But I cruise the Maine Coast, Buzzard's Bay, and Vineyard Sound - all places that have more than their share of fog. I've also traveled the East Coast to Florida several times, and haven't used radar more than few times south of Newport. LIS has very little fog; roughly 1% of observations have visibility less than 1/2 mile. If you "frequently encounter fog" in LIS, you don't know what fog is. When you get further East, you run into more consistent soup: Nantucket is 10% of observations. Even in the cities in Maine the number is 4%, but offshore that can go much higher. And while radar is handy at night, it shouldn't be needed in good visibility. Further, you asked if you need anything more than a 1623. The answer, in my opinion, is no. You'll make marginal use of a small radar on LIS; I don't see any reason to spend money on a bigger. What do you think you need? More power? More range? Better resolution? A bigger screen? You tell us, what feature do you think you need? You haven't told us what kind of boat you actually have, or where you plan to cruise. A big factor for me is being able to see the display. My vision isn't as good as it used to be. The Furuno seems to have a big advantage in that regard. I certainly don't suggest that there is constant fog on the LIS. As far as I'm concerned, if there is fog when I want to sail, then I need radar. Is that such a foolish notion? Last summer I sailed down the coast in extremely thick fog. For much of the time visibility was between 20 and 300 feet. I navigated from buoy to buoy using a compass, a watch, a knotlog and a chart. Radar would have been REALLY nice when passing New Haven and Bridgeport. I don't care if I don't need radar often. My preference is to have it when I need it. Just like my PFD, EPIRB, and other safety equipment. I don't need any of those most of the time, but in certain rare situations, they can save me. In this month's Sail Mag, there is a good quote. It was from someone who had been in a few situations where he had to abandon ship. In each case, as he boarded the liferaft, he said to himself that he wished he had spent more money on the life raft. Joey |
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LIS has very little fog; roughly 1% of observations have visibility less than
1/2 mile. If you "frequently encounter fog" in LIS, you don't know what fog is. No, he's already told us that NOAA says there's fog all the time! RB |
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Do ferries and
barges just wander all over the LIS? No, they operate in lanes that can easily be avoided with GPS. Totally incorrect as any real sailor could tell you. I guess by your resoning there is no reason for ferries and barges to have radar or even keep a wath, since they are so predictable. Yes, they stay in deep channel's and in the last 8 years I have yet to see a ferry or tug off it's lane. You're a joke and a troll. You clearly don't sail. You already got busted on the "fog" comment. LIS has very little in the way of visibility issues. If your vision is failing stay home. RB |
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As for yachts, you have horn/bells
Yes, Ferries always avoid striking yachts with bells. Thanks for that clarification. Here we go again. Can't use a GPS to stay out of the main cargo and ferry lanes? You don't sail, bub. RB |
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It's clear you know little about sailing.
And you, far less. At least I know what fog is! bwahahahahaaha! RB |
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Go stuff yourself you walking talking bag of whining crap. You offer nothing
here but idiotic blubbering on a plethora of topics. Your input is absent and your opinions are worthless. CM "The Carrolls" wrote in message ... | This is not a forum to ask questions about sailing for any purpose other | than entertainment. I certianly would not preface any purchase or use of any | equipment with information supplied here. Many try, but a few are here only | to confuse and inflate their own ego's. The latter tend to throw enough | disinformation around your time is better spent any where else, if true | useable information is required. | wrote in message | ... | On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:09:13 -0500, "Jeff Morris" | wrote: | | wrote in message | So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional | forays to | open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's | model | 1623? | | Why do you think you need any Radar? Do you often travel in fog? Are | you headed Down | East? | | A small radar will help a lot if you get caught in Vineyard Sound and | want to stay clear | of the ferry, but it sounds like this would only happen once a year, if | that. | | You can make a case for more powerful radar if you cruise the Maine Coast | all summer, but | not for LIS. | | I was hoping for some input from people with actual experience and | knowledge. | You and that Mooron guy (Who can't even spell moron correctly) seem more | interested in trying to inflate your own weak and faltering egos more than | adding anything of value. | | Yes, I frequently encounter fog in the LIS, as well as moderate darkness | most | nights. If you had a boat and sailed it, you would be more familiar with | these | concepts. | | Thanks anyway, jackass. | | Joey | | |
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Yeah... this idiot probably takes 6 hours to decide on a friggin'
flashlight! CM "Donal" wrote in message ... | | wrote in message | ... | Well, I've decided that the JRC 1000, at any price is really not quite | adequate. | One thing I've found in the less expensive monochrome displays is that the | Furuno 1623 is a quantum leap ahead of most of the other lower end | displays as | far as being easy to see. That "bright silver" thingy really makes a huge | difference! | | | Are you the same person who asked this question last week? | | | | Regards | | | Donal | -- | | | | |
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just a little testy? Did my post offend you? sorry...ya right, stuff your
self "Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ... Go stuff yourself you walking talking bag of whining crap. You offer nothing here but idiotic blubbering on a plethora of topics. Your input is absent and your opinions are worthless. CM "The Carrolls" wrote in message ... | This is not a forum to ask questions about sailing for any purpose other | than entertainment. I certianly would not preface any purchase or use of any | equipment with information supplied here. Many try, but a few are here only | to confuse and inflate their own ego's. The latter tend to throw enough | disinformation around your time is better spent any where else, if true | useable information is required. | wrote in message | ... | On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:09:13 -0500, "Jeff Morris" | wrote: | | wrote in message | So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional | forays to | open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's | model | 1623? | | Why do you think you need any Radar? Do you often travel in fog? Are | you headed Down | East? | | A small radar will help a lot if you get caught in Vineyard Sound and | want to stay clear | of the ferry, but it sounds like this would only happen once a year, if | that. | | You can make a case for more powerful radar if you cruise the Maine Coast | all summer, but | not for LIS. | | I was hoping for some input from people with actual experience and | knowledge. | You and that Mooron guy (Who can't even spell moron correctly) seem more | interested in trying to inflate your own weak and faltering egos more than | adding anything of value. | | Yes, I frequently encounter fog in the LIS, as well as moderate darkness | most | nights. If you had a boat and sailed it, you would be more familiar with | these | concepts. | | Thanks anyway, jackass. | | Joey | | |
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Speaking for yourself, of course.
-- Oz1...evil twin of the 3 twins I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you. Capetanios Oz wrote in message ... On Mon, 17 Nov 2003 05:19:45 GMT, "The Carrolls" wrote: just a little testy? Nah, little testes! Oz1...of the 3 twins. I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you. |
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wrote in message ... Bobsprit's sailing And you, far less. Joey Bwahahahahhahahahhahah! Even a newbie to the group sizes up Bobsprit in less than two posts. Attaboy Joey! S.Simon |
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Bwahahahahhahahahhahah! Even a newbie to the group sizes up Bobsprit in less than two posts. Attaboy Joey! Spelled...SOCKPUPPET Poor Neal thinks Joey's a newbie, but he read my Port Jeff post from 5 months ago! Neal, how can you be SO dumb? RB |
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wrote in message ... | There was, of course, the collision-related death earlier this summer | after a large (moving at abt. 7 kts) N.Y.C.-based cruise boat crashed | into a J-105 on its way from Larchmont to Block Island which then sank | off the coast of Connecticut. Though reports of that incident suggest | that the collision resulted mostly from the respective crews' | inattention aggravated by the sailing crew's failure to turn off their | boat's autopilot when they saw the motor vessel approaching, one | legitimately might wonder what may have occurred if both (or, for that | matter, either) of the crews were using radar on that dark night. Interesting. You'd have to know the bearings and sighting distances involved. Let's face it. Radar is a big advantage if used correctly. It opens the way to safe night sailing and offers another fix for confirmation to chart. I'm not willing to go digital chart/plotter. I do like being able to track unseen vessels in limited visibility and confirm my location in relation to objects about me. Would you consider that if the sailboat crew had a 6 nautical mile warning time they may have had more reaction time? CM |
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Though reports of that incident suggest
that the collision resulted mostly from the respective crews' inattention aggravated by the sailing crew's failure to turn off their boat's autopilot when they saw the motor vessel approaching, A poor example in this case, since they saw the boat coming and STILL couldn't get out of the way. Perhaps they had radar. Didn't matter. The way this clown talks, he probably thinks the radar will blow away the fog, which he might see once a season. RB |
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I believe that the large ship, the 122 foot Mariner, had functioning radar. The J boat,
Hilaria, didn't have radar, and I don't think they had a radar reflector. I haven't seen the final report, but failure to alter course or slow down after seeing the ship is the cause I heard cited. I'm skeptical that they would have been able to use the radar if the autopilot was beyond their skills, but if they had a minimal radar, and knew how to use it, they would have seen the large ship earlier. I don't agree with RB that its easy to avoid ferries because their course is predictable. Boston Harbor, for instance, has "booze cruises" that meander randomly. And many of the ports have cruise ships, commuters, or head boats, that use different routes depending on the tides. And, of course, it always seems that the ferries are going to the same places I headed toward. My claim is not the radar isn't useful, but that a basic radar should do a reasonable job of ferry avoidance. wrote in message ... On 17 Nov 2003, (Bobsprit) wrote: Do ferries and barges just wander all over the LIS? No, they operate in lanes that can easily be avoided with GPS. Totally incorrect as any real sailor could tell you. I guess by your resoning there is no reason for ferries and barges to have radar or even keep a wath, since they are so predictable. Yes, they stay in deep channel's and in the last 8 years I have yet to see a ferry or tug off it's lane. There was, of course, the collision-related death earlier this summer after a large (moving at abt. 7 kts) N.Y.C.-based cruise boat crashed into a J-105 on its way from Larchmont to Block Island which then sank off the coast of Connecticut. Though reports of that incident suggest that the collision resulted mostly from the respective crews' inattention aggravated by the sailing crew's failure to turn off their boat's autopilot when they saw the motor vessel approaching, one legitimately might wonder what may have occurred if both (or, for that matter, either) of the crews were using radar on that dark night. [Most of] LIS has very little in the way of visibility issues [on most days]. As Mr. Morris and others, too, have noted, this is almost always correct. |
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So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to
open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Joey Need: If you're sailing in areas where you are doing night time or occasional sailing in fog, you could make points for and against radar. Certainly, radar can make things easier. Afford: You need to look at many things here, not the least of which, is your wallet, but you also need to know what you can afford to put on your boat, considering space for components and power requirements, coupled with your own comfort level of viewing and using the unit .... you may end up being able to go high end, or have to settle for low end .... only you can say. Once you decide on a set (if you're thinking about it, you'll probably end up getting it), keep in mind that the installation, to suit your needs or financial requirements, is only the beginning ..... now you need to learn how to use it. My quess? 90% of those with small boat radar, get a maximum of 50% of the capabilities/ advantages, that a radar can give. Between not knowing how to tune for conditions, not being able to interpret the display, not understanding relative motion and plotting, and thinking that since they have radar, they are now safe, a high percentage of those with radar, are more dangerous, now, than when they didn't have radar. It's a great tool, but you need to understand it and know how to use it .... if you don't, it's a waste of money. Shen |
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"Bobsprit" wrote in message ... Bwahahahahhahahahhahah! Even a newbie to the group sizes up Bobsprit in less than two posts. Attaboy Joey! Spelled...SOCKPUPPET Poor Neal thinks Joey's a newbie, but he read my Port Jeff post from 5 months ago! So you admit that anybody who reads your posts for five months will conclude that you are an idiot who cannot sail??? Bob, how can you be SO dumb? Regards Donal -- |
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Another thing to consider as well. According to the COLREGS
any vessel that has operational radar installed is required to use it at all times when underway - even with unlimited visibility. Do you really want to be washed with microwaves the whole time you're sailing? Then there's the COLREG requirement that in restricted vis. if you have radar you must plot and ascertain the course of all traffic you see on the screen. This is a lot of work and very difficult on a small sailboat that is being tossed around by any seas and wakes that may be evident. Once you do get the coursed plotted it is up to the vessel with radar to use that information to avoid a collision. This makes the radar-using vessel a defacto give-way vessel where as a small sailboat without radar can simply stand-on. S.Simon "Shen44" wrote in message ... So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Joey Need: If you're sailing in areas where you are doing night time or occasional sailing in fog, you could make points for and against radar. Certainly, radar can make things easier. Afford: You need to look at many things here, not the least of which, is your wallet, but you also need to know what you can afford to put on your boat, considering space for components and power requirements, coupled with your own comfort level of viewing and using the unit .... you may end up being able to go high end, or have to settle for low end .... only you can say. Once you decide on a set (if you're thinking about it, you'll probably end up getting it), keep in mind that the installation, to suit your needs or financial requirements, is only the beginning ..... now you need to learn how to use it. My quess? 90% of those with small boat radar, get a maximum of 50% of the capabilities/ advantages, that a radar can give. Between not knowing how to tune for conditions, not being able to interpret the display, not understanding relative motion and plotting, and thinking that since they have radar, they are now safe, a high percentage of those with radar, are more dangerous, now, than when they didn't have radar. It's a great tool, but you need to understand it and know how to use it .... if you don't, it's a waste of money. Shen |
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Subject: Which Radar, Redux
From: "Simple Simon" Another example of why we consider Neal to be the Southern member of the "Booby Twins" ... Bobsprit, being the Northern Another thing to consider as well. According to the COLREGS any vessel that has operational radar installed is required to use it at all times when underway - even with unlimited visibility. Do you really want to be washed with microwaves the whole time you're sailing? G Although I might agree with the technical accuracy of this statement ..... get real, neal. Then there's the COLREG requirement that in restricted vis. if you have radar you must plot and ascertain the course of all traffic you see on the screen. This is a lot of work and very difficult on a small sailboat that is being tossed around by any seas and wakes that may be evident. For someone, such as yourself, with zero radar experience, the above could be true. Actually, plotting is quite simple and easily accomplished ..... and, as per usual, in the real world, there's plotting, and there's plotting..... Once you do get the coursed plotted it is up to the vessel with radar to use that information to avoid a collision. This makes the radar-using vessel a defacto give-way vessel where as a small sailboat without radar can simply stand-on. ROFLMAO ....still trying the BS, I see. HEY, Joey !! Never, I repeat, NEVER, trust any statement, regarding the Rules, posted by Neal. Shen |
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So you admit that anybody who reads your posts for five months will conclude
that you are an idiot who cannot sail??? Bob, how can you be SO dumb? Poor Donal misses the irony even in his own posts. Donal, where exactly did I make two passes before entering? Was it Port Jeff? Duh! RB |
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I don't agree with RB that its easy to avoid ferries because their course is
predictable. There are no such ferries on the LIS. The only risk would be the party fishing boats, but they also have a pretty tight zone of operation. RB |
Which Radar, Redux
I differ with Neal on this there may be some scatter on the deck of your
vessel but the main thrust of radar is focused much in the way light is with a trouble lamp. It goes out where it is pointed. Unless you are in the bonsuns chair stairing into the horn!! Then you will start to drip like a good humor in July!! Holding the colregs up as some sort of disadvantage..... I believe the one to avoid trouble first is the best of Captains.... The one taking liberty because he/she can or is too cheap, will be an ex-scoundrel.... under the ferry someday!! The best way I believe is to set a safe perimeter on your radar to give yourself enough time to manuver and plot around most obsticles. Plot stuff that is pertinant in your field of interest. Stay away from other boats and you dont need to plot! Neal do you still have the 27 foot coronado? Dr Strangelove "Simple Simon" wrote in message ... Another thing to consider as well. According to the COLREGS any vessel that has operational radar installed is required to use it at all times when underway - even with unlimited visibility. Do you really want to be washed with microwaves the whole time you're sailing? Then there's the COLREG requirement that in restricted vis. if you have radar you must plot and ascertain the course of all traffic you see on the screen. This is a lot of work and very difficult on a small sailboat that is being tossed around by any seas and wakes that may be evident. Once you do get the coursed plotted it is up to the vessel with radar to use that information to avoid a collision. This makes the radar-using vessel a defacto give-way vessel where as a small sailboat without radar can simply stand-on. S.Simon "Shen44" wrote in message ... So, I'm wondering... For coastal sailing in LIS and very occasional forays to open ocean points north of there, do I need anything more than Furuno's model 1623? Joey Need: If you're sailing in areas where you are doing night time or occasional sailing in fog, you could make points for and against radar. Certainly, radar can make things easier. Afford: You need to look at many things here, not the least of which, is your wallet, but you also need to know what you can afford to put on your boat, considering space for components and power requirements, coupled with your own comfort level of viewing and using the unit .... you may end up being able to go high end, or have to settle for low end .... only you can say. Once you decide on a set (if you're thinking about it, you'll probably end up getting it), keep in mind that the installation, to suit your needs or financial requirements, is only the beginning ..... now you need to learn how to use it. My quess? 90% of those with small boat radar, get a maximum of 50% of the capabilities/ advantages, that a radar can give. Between not knowing how to tune for conditions, not being able to interpret the display, not understanding relative motion and plotting, and thinking that since they have radar, they are now safe, a high percentage of those with radar, are more dangerous, now, than when they didn't have radar. It's a great tool, but you need to understand it and know how to use it ..... if you don't, it's a waste of money. Shen |
Which Radar, Redux
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Which Radar, Redux
"Bobsprit" wrote in message ... So you admit that anybody who reads your posts for five months will conclude that you are an idiot who cannot sail??? Bob, how can you be SO dumb? Poor Donal misses the irony even in his own posts. Donal, where exactly did I make two passes before entering? Was it Port Jeff? Duh! Once again Bob thinks that we cannot see him running across the pitch with a goalpost under each arm! Put the goalposts back, Bob! We are talking about the fact that nobody is surprised that a newbie can so accurately sum you up after such a short time. IIRC, he correctly identified you as an idiot who knows nothing about sailing. You didn't seem surprised at his assessment. Regards Donal -- |
Which Radar, Redux
There are, in fact, several high-speed commuting ferries regularly
operating on the L.I. side of the sound Yes, notably the one that crosses over from Port Jeff, very fast that one. Still, easily avoided due to it's fairly specific area of operation. No radar needed on the LIS. Period. RB |
Which Radar, Redux
That ferry might be approaching you from ahead, or from behind.
Those white ferries blend in pretty well, even in moderate fog or drizzle conditions. Ummmm...I don't know how to break this to you, but there are TWO ferries working Port Jeff. More proof that you're a fraud. At least you got the color right. RB |
Which Radar, Redux
What a dope! The PJ ferry is not even remotely considered a high speed
ferry! Right, it's a "low speed" ferry. In fact I passed it easily in light air. Dummy! Bwahahahahaha! RB |
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