I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Here's what really happened when Donal experienced the delay in course change
aboard a badly trimmed Beneteau.
He put the wheel over ( not HARD over) for a tack and the boat failed to
respond as quickly as his performance oriented 1st series. It did NOT hold it's
course for 2 SECONDS before responding. If anything there was a delay of a
fraction of a second and the boat altered course slowly.

There there, Donal...now isn't that what REALLY happened?

Capt RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

"CANDChelp" wrote in message
...
Here's what really happened when Donal experienced the delay in course
change
aboard a badly trimmed Beneteau.

"Badly trimmed". How stupid can you get?

Do you really think that the sails were up before I used the wheel for the
first time?

Try not to look soooooo stupid.



He put the wheel over ( not HARD over) for a tack

Tack?

You really are losing the plot! Think about it. The first time that I
used the rudder, I was only a boatlength away from the pontoon.

and the boat failed to
respond as quickly as his performance oriented 1st series. It did NOT hold
it's
course for 2 SECONDS before responding. If anything there was a delay of a
fraction of a second and the boat altered course slowly.

There there, Donal...now isn't that what REALLY happened?

That would not be at all inconsistent with my original post. Here it is
yet again:

"They are a very nice cruising boat, which has very comfortable accomodation
for a 31 footer. The 311 is an Oceanis, which is quite different to my
boat.

The last time that I helmed an Oceanis, I thought that there was a serious
problem with the wheel steering. It turned out that I just wasn't used to
the small rudder."

And here is your hysterical reaction.

"Donal displays his incredible lack of sailing knowledge at every turn. With
a
comment like his, it's easy to see why he bought into Beneteau ads.
He found the 31 tough to steer? What boat is tough to steer when trimmed
correctly. Answer: None, not even the 31 with it's cruising underbody."

The hysteria in your post is easy to see. You made incorrect assumptions in
every single sentence.
The boat wasn't a 31, the sails weren't up, and I didn't find it tough to
steer!



Are you beginning to realise what a complete idiot that you are making out
of yourself!

You haven't taken a beating like this since Capt. Neal was King of the
group.

Regards


Donal
--

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Do you really think that the sails were up before I used the wheel for the
first time?

Oh, so now you're saying that everyone should know that you POWERED the boat
1st and that indicates overall helm responsiveness???
Oh, OKAY, Donal!!!

Bwahahahahahahahaha!!! Keem em' coming!

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Why Bobsprit! What an inspired application of what you learnt
today about variations in sensitivity resulting from different
rudder specs!

Well, seeing that we're in agreement on what happened, perhaps you can calm
poor loco down.
He's now claiming he motored the boat 1st and lord knows what's next.

RN

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

CANDChelp wrote:

Why Bobsprit! What an inspired application of what you learnt
today about variations in sensitivity resulting from different
rudder specs!

Well, seeing that we're in agreement on what happened, perhaps you can calm
poor loco down.
He's now claiming he motored the boat 1st and lord knows what's next.

RN

Who, me, agreeable? Not so. I was just admiring the summary of
my little homilies to you on different rudder responses being
thrown up as a desperate defence against the
fast-closing-in-on-you Donal.
--
Flying Tadpole

-------------------------
Learn what lies below the waves of cyberspace!
http://www.internetopera.netfirms.com

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Who, me, agreeable? Not so.

You just said you were happy with my summary of what Donal actually experienced
and that it reflected what was said earlier.
Are you backpedaling now or standing fast?

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

CANDChelp wrote:

Who, me, agreeable? Not so.

You just said you were happy with my summary of what Donal actually experienced
and that it reflected what was said earlier.
Are you backpedaling now or standing fast?

Ha! what I said was:

Why Bobsprit! What an inspired application of what you learnt
today about variations in sensitivity resulting from different
rudder specs!

A typically ambiguous FT statement. It is open to multiple
interpretation. You're free to put your interpretation on it.
However, your attempt to move me from ambiguity to standing at
your right hand was a bit crass. Hence my subsequent comment.

--
Flying Tadpole

-------------------------
Learn what lies below the waves of cyberspace!
http://www.internetopera.netfirms.com

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

"CANDChelp" wrote in message
...
Do you really think that the sails were up before I used the wheel for the
first time?

Oh, so now you're saying that everyone should know that you POWERED the
boat
1st and that indicates overall helm responsiveness???

Now you are trying to pretend that you thought that I would sail a charter
boat off of the pontoon - the very first time that I stepped aboard!!!
C'mon Bob, we know that you can be a bit dim,... but really!!!

You are losing more credibility with every post. Ummmm ... scrub that!
You can't lose what you don't have.




Regards


Donal
--

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Now you are trying to pretend that you thought that I would sail a charter
boat off of the pontoon - the very first time that I stepped aboard!!!

Ohhhhhh...now it's a charter boat??? Funny how your post never mentioned it was
a charter boat!!!

Deeper deeeeeper deeeeeeeeper!!! Bwahahaha! Don't stop now, Donal!!!

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

It is open to multiple
interpretation. You're free to put your interpretation on it.
However, your attempt to move me from ambiguity to standing at
your right hand was a bit crass. Hence my subsequent comment.

Well written, but I'm afraid the direction of your post puts you at my side,
and opposing Donal's claims. Your protest has otherwise been noted and I fully
appreciate the nature of your objection. It takes a tough soul to admit when
he's wrong and Capt. RB was right.
Within the confines set by the vice-like group mentality, you went as far as
you dared.

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

"CANDChelp" wrote in message
...
Now you are trying to pretend that you thought that I would sail a charter
boat off of the pontoon - the very first time that I stepped aboard!!!

Ohhhhhh...now it's a charter boat??? Funny how your post never mentioned
it was
a charter boat!!!


Are you claiming that you would expect a charter boat to behave in the
manner that I described?

You really are splashing around in a barrel, aren't you.



Deeper deeeeeper deeeeeeeeper!!! Bwahahaha! Don't stop now, Donal!!!


Why should I. It's already clear that you grasped the wrong end of the
stick at the outset. You then proceeded to beat yourself over the head
with it. Fortunately, you have an exceptionally thick skull.

You'll stop when the pain gets too great.



Regards


Donal
--

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

a charter boat!!!


Are you claiming that you would expect a charter boat to behave in the
manner that I described?

Donal, I've sailed a LOT of boats, mostly cruisers in the 27-40 foot range. I
never felt a 2 second delay in helm response.

And neither did you. Now go take a vitamin and get some sleep!

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

"CANDChelp" wrote in message

| Donal, I've sailed a LOT of boats, mostly cruisers in the 27-40 foot
range. I
| never felt a 2 second delay in helm response.

Sorry Bob but I'll have to call "Bull****" again..... there is a noticeable
lag from helm to course change which increases with the size of the vessel.
If you are unaware of this ... your claim to have never noticed this is no
doubt due to the fact you where never at the helm.

You will definitly notice a delay on my full keeler. I have seen a friend
who upon leaving dock his first time at the helm on a 52 ft Gulf Star looked
at me quizzically due to no immediate response to the wheel... I simply
smiled and then the vessel began to obey the helm. There was a delay he was
not familiar with since his experience was limited to fin keeled 27 footers
and smaller craft.

CM

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Sorry Bob but I'll have to call "Bull****" again..... there is a noticeable
lag from helm to course change which increases with the size of the vessel.
If you are unaware of this

Nope. No way you turn the wheel and NOTHING happens for 2 full seconds.
Sorry. I've helmed C&C's, Cape Dory's, Tartans, Pearson's, Albergs....
It just doesn't happen. On my C&C, a TINY input at the wheel give INSTANT
course adjustment. The level of the response may vary from design to design,
but the response is still gonna happen when you move the rudder.

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

He's right. The bigger the ship the longer the delay.

On a bulk carrier it might be as much as half a minute
before there is noticable response to the helm.


"CANDChelp" wrote in message ...
You are displaying a lack of experience with that statement and it throws
all your other claims into question. Helm response delay is a fact.

No it's not. Not 2 seconds worth.

No way.

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On a bulk carrier it might be as much as half a minute
before there is noticable response to the helm.

Yup...big ships turn slow.
What do you think of the Beneteau which takes 2 full seconds to respond to the
helm?

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Something is seriously wrong with it.


"CANDChelp" wrote in message ...
What do you think of the Beneteau which takes 2 full seconds to respond to the
helm?

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Something is seriously wrong with it.

Like Donal at the helm, perhaps?


RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

The first time that I used the rudder on the Oceanis, I thought that it was
broken.

Wanna write "Great friken grief." again - OR, have you learned something?

Great friken grief!! I've learned that you don't know how to sail, no way, no
how!
I've really enjoyed reading everyone's posts on how small sailboats don't
respond their helms right away!!

Bwahahahahahha! Yup...went pretty well indeed!

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

CANDChelp wrote:

It takes a tough soul to admit when
he's wrong and Capt. RB was right.


Then obviously you have misinterpreted, since I have the soul of
a fresh-made marshmallow.

--
Flying Tadpole

-------------------------
Learn what lies below the waves of cyberspace!
http://www.internetopera.netfirms.com

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

he's foaming at the mouth, he can't even keep track who's trolling him.

I notice he had no response to his boyfriend, Mooron.

SV

"CANDChelp" wrote
Well, seeing that we're in agreement on what happened, perhaps you can
calm
poor loco down.
He's now claiming he motored the boat 1st and lord knows what's next.

RN

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

You mean used to a real thing like a woman? Like I am? Yup. That's right.

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
If Donal is at the helm he probably has the king spoke stuck up
his ass. No wonder he can't feel any response. He's more used
to the real thing like Ganz.


"CANDChelp" wrote in message
...
Something is seriously wrong with it.

Like Donal at the helm, perhaps?


RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message

| I notice he had no response to his boyfriend, Mooron.

Huh.. oh!.. Yeah Scotty... sorry I was just topping off the glass with some
rum while dipping one of these field fresh plumb strawberries into melted
Belgian chocolate prior to sweeping the works through some home made whipped
cream.... who had no response from their boyfriend?

CM

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

You mean used to a real thing like a woman? Like I am? Yup. That's right.

Ganz, I'm sure you didn't mean that YOU are a real woman, right?

Freudian slip? More like a Freudian cocktail dress.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

BFD, I'm eating Doritos and drinking Pink Lemonade.

Scotty

"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message
...

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message

| I notice he had no response to his boyfriend, Mooron.

Huh.. oh!.. Yeah Scotty... sorry I was just topping off the glass with
some
rum while dipping one of these field fresh plumb strawberries into melted
Belgian chocolate prior to sweeping the works through some home made
whipped
cream.... who had no response from their boyfriend?

CM

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Nuthin' wrong with Doritos and lemonade!

If life is done with you and all you have is a Siedelmann, I say throw in some
Devil Dogs and Yohoo to boot.

Bwahahahaaha!

RB

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 22:04:41 -0400, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:

BFD, I'm eating Doritos and drinking Pink Lemonade.

*******. I miss pink lemonade.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 22:05:35 -0400, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:

bob seems curious, no?

Yeah. If he found out that Ganz *was* a woman, he'd lose interest.

"SkitchNYC" wrote in message
...
You mean used to a real thing like a woman? Like I am? Yup. That's
right.

Ganz, I'm sure you didn't mean that YOU are a real woman, right?

Freudian slip? More like a Freudian cocktail dress.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

miss it? what 3rd world, back-woods country are you in that you can't get
pink lemonade?


"Peter Wiley" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 22:04:41 -0400, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:

BFD, I'm eating Doritos and drinking Pink Lemonade.

*******. I miss pink lemonade.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On Fri, 25 Jul 2003 09:05:27 -0400, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:

miss it? what 3rd world, back-woods country are you in that you can't get
pink lemonade?

Australia and in particular, Tasmania. There might be pink lemonade
somewhere but not that I've seen and not like I could get everywhere
in Tucson.

No pink lemonade down here, alas. OTOH I only have a 15 minute commute
to work with not a single traffic light. Can't have everything.

Worse than no pink lemonade, there's no Borders or Barnes & Noble in
Hobart, so I have to get my book fix when I'm in Sydney Buying over
the net is OK but reading them over a coffee is both better & cheaper.


"Peter Wiley" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 22:04:41 -0400, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:

BFD, I'm eating Doritos and drinking Pink Lemonade.

*******. I miss pink lemonade.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

"katysails" wrote:
Peter,
No pink lemonade??? No Barnes & Noble's???? How do you survive????

If you can buy maraschino cherries in the grocery there, (ya know, the
bright red ones in the glass jar full of sugar water?) just add some
of that juice to regular lemonade. Instant pink lemonade! (And
actually, IIRC, it's the way pink lemonade was originally
invented/made.)

But no Barnes & Noble? Shudder!

Frank

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Do you have any idea how they're made? If you did, you'd
probably never want to eat one again.

"Frank and Ronnie Maier" wrote in message
om...
"katysails" wrote:
Peter,
No pink lemonade??? No Barnes & Noble's???? How do you survive????

If you can buy maraschino cherries in the grocery there, (ya know, the
bright red ones in the glass jar full of sugar water?) just add some
of that juice to regular lemonade. Instant pink lemonade! (And
actually, IIRC, it's the way pink lemonade was originally
invented/made.)

But no Barnes & Noble? Shudder!

Frank

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

"Peter Wiley" wrote

miss it? what 3rd world, back-woods country are you in that you can't
get
pink lemonade?

Australia

OH, nough said.



OTOH I only have a 15 minute commute
to work with not a single traffic light. Can't have everything.

I have a 30' walk to work.


Worse than no pink lemonade, there's no Borders or Barnes & Noble


We've got both, 15 min. drive , 3 traffic lights.
But my boat is 2 hours away :(


--
Scott Vernon
Plowville PA __/)__/)__

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On Tue, 29 Jul 2003 10:34:44 -0400, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:


"Peter Wiley" wrote

miss it? what 3rd world, back-woods country are you in that you can't
get
pink lemonade?

Australia

OH, nough said.

New Zealand is the *real* 3rd world place. We're 1.5 world.

OTOH I only have a 15 minute commute
to work with not a single traffic light. Can't have everything.

I have a 30' walk to work.

So do I - when I'm at sea.

Worse than no pink lemonade, there's no Borders or Barnes & Noble


We've got both, 15 min. drive , 3 traffic lights.

Yeah - had that when I lived in Tucson but the nearest real water was
in Mexico. Not a good trade from my POV. I go to Sydney or Melbourne
4-5 times a year, there's a couple Borders bookshops in both cities
plus other specialty shops.

But my boat is 2 hours away :(

Mine is 100m from my front door and I'm putting a mooring in that's in
sight from my living room window, maybe 400m away. If/when I get a
bigger boat, that's where it'll be.

Normal lemonade, raspberry cordial and 2 oz of Absolut vodka might be
worth trying as a substitute for pink lemonade.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On Mon, 28 Jul 2003 07:23:00 -0400, "katysails"
wrote:

Peter,
No pink lemonade??? No Barnes & Noble's???? How do you survive????

Aircraft, Amazon, Absolut vodka and Bundaberg rum.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

In your living room?

Cheers MCX

Scott Vernon wrote:
OK, you win. No need to rub it in.

Scotty


"Peter Wiley" wrote

But my boat is 2 hours away :(

Mine is 100m from my front door and I'm putting a mooring in that's in
sight from my living room window, maybe 400m away. If/when I get a
bigger boat, that's where it'll be.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

Normal lemonade, raspberry cordial and 2 oz of Absolut vodka might be
worth trying as a substitute for pink lemonade.

More than worth trying...I have made similar...(couldn't afford Absolut at the time...probably used soemthing glocky like
Mohawk)
--
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On Wed, 30 Jul 2003 13:46:37 +1200, The_navigator©
wrote:

Peter you sound bitter.

Nah, I've been to NZ once. Great scenery, nice people but... I can
recognise reality when it stares me in the face. You're a lot further
behind than Australia is when it comes to amenities and standard of
living, and we're somewhat behind the USA, Singapore, Japan and Europe
but in front of just about everywhere else . Once you factor in
lifestyle, Australia is miles ahead of everywhere but some pockets of
the USA. You guys have a good climate and lovely environment but lack
the critical mass of people for a 1st World economy and are doing your
best to bugger what economy you do have. That isn't intended as a
flame, it's a fact. Tasmania would be in exactly the same situation
(actually worse) if it wasn't a state of Australia yet I chose to live
here. Eventually Australia and Australians are going to own NZ; we'll
have your moribund railway system soon.

I can fly to Sydney in less than 2 hours and Melbourne in less than 1.
Both cities offer pretty much everything any 1st World city can offer.
You have to fly to Sydney or Melbourne too except it takes longer and
because you kept letting in migrants who used NZ as a waystation to
Australia, we've been tightening up on your access to Australia and
will keep doing so. I think this is a pity but if you want to complain
about us doing it, look to yourselves for the root cause.

I'm never bitter; life's too much fun.

Cheers MC

Peter Wiley wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2003 10:34:44 -0400, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:


"Peter Wiley" wrote

miss it? what 3rd world, back-woods country are you in that you can't

get

pink lemonade?

Australia

OH, nough said.


New Zealand is the *real* 3rd world place. We're 1.5 world.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On Wed, 30 Jul 2003 13:49:09 +1200, The_navigator©
wrote:

In your living room?

Well, duh! If I had the bigger boat, it'd *be* the living room. Get
with the program, MC.

Cheers MCX

Scott Vernon wrote:
OK, you win. No need to rub it in.

Scotty


"Peter Wiley" wrote

But my boat is 2 hours away :(

Mine is 100m from my front door and I'm putting a mooring in that's in
sight from my living room window, maybe 400m away. If/when I get a
bigger boat, that's where it'll be.

I'm Letting Donal off the Hook
 

On Tue, 29 Jul 2003 21:49:04 -0400, "Scott Vernon"
wrote:

OK, you win. No need to rub it in.

But I still don't have pink lemonade or Barnes & Noble.

Scotty


"Peter Wiley" wrote

But my boat is 2 hours away :(

Mine is 100m from my front door and I'm putting a mooring in that's in
sight from my living room window, maybe 400m away. If/when I get a
bigger boat, that's where it'll be.