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how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Just out of curiosity, Jan-Olov, what boat do you sail?
"Jan-Olov Newborg" wrote in message om... Very good webpage about physical Sail/Lift Theory Pim! The best I have seen so far on the web! Mikko in Finland has a very good page also with airflow computer animations. It´s only Navier-Stokes Lift calculations that comes close to the real physics! Prandtl "Lifting Line Theory" is only useful for a physical non existing "ideal/perfect fluid" created only by mathematical equations! Jan-Olov Newborg |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Didn't you break them stuffing them in the bag?
Cheers MC Capt. Mooron wrote: Kinda makes sense in a way.... I had full battens installed a few years ago on my bagged main and noticed a big difference in point and speed. The full battens induce a nice curve even in the lightest air. CM "PIM" wrote in message ... | I am suggesting a curved plate works better! |
how a sail works, Windtunnel Tests.
Hahahhahahaha. Can't even put the correct letters after you name? Talk
about a vacuum! Cheers MC dowra wrote: The_navigator_© wrote in message ... Guess thats why you get sucked aground eh? Cheers MC Very witty and informative response! Duh, wish I waz da navagatar tu. Farr boats are garbage. Cheers M(ore)C(ock)last name P(lease) DOWRA the Physicist. BS. MS. member NASPS. |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
OOPS.......
CM "The_navigator_©" wrote in message ... | Don't be silly. Read the thread! | | Cheers MC | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | | You bag your main?????? | | CM | | "The_navigator_©" wrote in message | ... | | Didn't you break them stuffing them in the bag? | | | | Cheers MC | | | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | | | | Kinda makes sense in a way.... I had full battens installed a few years | ago | | on my bagged main and noticed a big difference in point and speed. | | | | The full battens induce a nice curve even in the lightest air. | | | | CM | | | | | | "PIM" wrote in message ... | | | I am suggesting a curved plate works better! | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
"Simple Simon" wrote in message ...
Just out of curiosity, Jan-Olov, what boat do you sail? "Jan-Olov Newborg" wrote in message om... Very good webpage about physical Sail/Lift Theory Pim! The best I have seen so far on the web! Mikko in Finland has a very good page also with airflow computer animations. It´s only Navier-Stokes Lift calculations that comes close to the real physics! Prandtl "Lifting Line Theory" is only useful for a physical non existing "ideal/perfect fluid" created only by mathematical equations! Jan-Olov Newborg Today I sail an old English boat called Vivacity, a very slow type! I have been on board Americas Cup/Volvo Ocean Race Cup boat, "Assa Abloy and the catamaran "Nokia" sailing with 265 m2 sailarea. By the way, do you belive in "Bernoulli law" , saying that "High Airflow velocity causing Low Pressure"? That should mean the the jetblast behind an F-16 Fighter running on afterburner should create low pressure! But thats not being the case! The total pressure is very high due to the high dynamic pressure! The Venturi effect you discuss is pure due to "The Coanda effect" and the turning of the airflow along the walls of the divergentpart of the pipe! How local pressure gradients are created by turning the fluidflow you can read he http://www.scienceweb.org/movies/aero.htm Jan-Olov Newborg Here are some links of flow physics (not flow mathematics): A Physical Description of Flight © http://www.aa.washington.edu/faculty/eberhardt/lift.htm Bernoulli Versus Newton http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/bernnew.html What is Ground Effect? http://home.mira.net/~radacorp/ground_effect.html Operational use of angle of attack (AOA) on modern commercial jet airplanes http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aer...12/attack.html Weltner Lift http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~weltner/ http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~welt...ht/PHYSIC4.htm Weltner Bernoulli http://www.informatik.uni-frankfurt..../MIS/mis6.html Incorrect theory number three http://www.grc.nasa.gov/Other_Groups...ne/wrong3.html Lift from flow turning http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/www/K-12/airplane/right2.html Jef Raskin - Coanda Effect: Understanding Why Wings Work http://www.jefraskin.com/forjef/jefw...da_effect.html F18 Soundbarrier and highspeed pass http://www.algonet.se/~newborg/ Beaty Gif pictures smokepuls plus SAAB 2000 http://www.amasci.com/wing/airgif2.html Prof. Colombinis photogallery http://www.diam.unige.it/~irro/gallery.html Flow around an airfoil http://www.diam.unige.it/~irro/profilo_e.html ScienceWeb - Aerodynamics http://www.scienceweb.org/movies/aero.htm Lift from spinning balls This website gives a lot of references all back to Newton/Robbins! The Magnus Effect http://www.geocities.com/k_achutarao...ew_magnus.html The Science of Swing, maintained by James Foster http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...ter/swing.html Normal Swing http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...er/normal.html Reversed Magnus effect explained http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...r/reverse.html Wrong lift explanations Smithsonian http://www.nasm.edu/galleries/gal109/NEWHTF/HTF510.HTM False Bernoulli explanations How things fly, an interactive gallery. Bernoulli Brain-Teasers. Activities you can do at home http://www.nasm.edu/galleries/gal109...XT/TEASERS.HTM US AirForce Museum http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/zone/ff3.htm Dr. John S. Denker online aerodynamic book. Wrong Lift explanation explained by "Circulation flow 'creating' the Velocity Field" http://www.monmouth.com/~jsd/fly/how/htm/ http://www.monmouth.com/~jsd/fly/how/htm/airfoils.html |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
By the way, do you belive in "Bernoulli law" , saying that "High
Airflow velocity causing Low Pressure"? I believe in the phenomena of decreased internal pressure with increased stream velocity. That should mean the the jetblast behind an F-16 Fighter running on afterburner should create low pressure! If that were true it should mean that you could put jet fuel in a container and ignite it and then low pressure will suck the container into a ball. But thats not being the case! The total pressure is very high due to the high dynamic pressure! And that would be due to the expansion of gases among other things associated with the combustion of jet fuel. The Venturi effect you discuss is pure due to "The Coanda effect" and the turning of the airflow along the walls of the divergentpart of the pipe! How local pressure gradients are created by turning the fluidflow you can read he Local pressure gradients are created by a solid object and a relative airflow pushing and pulling on each other. This pushing and pulling is what turns the relative airflow. Local pressure gradients are a characteristic of this pushing and pulling not the cause. You got the horse before the cart. Its like saying cars go fast because of miles per hour. |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Why don't you read them yourself? WE already know how a sailboat works.
Cheers MC Jan-Olov Newborg wrote: "Simple Simon" wrote in message ... Just out of curiosity, Jan-Olov, what boat do you sail? "Jan-Olov Newborg" wrote in message om... Very good webpage about physical Sail/Lift Theory Pim! The best I have seen so far on the web! Mikko in Finland has a very good page also with airflow computer animations. It´s only Navier-Stokes Lift calculations that comes close to the real physics! Prandtl "Lifting Line Theory" is only useful for a physical non existing "ideal/perfect fluid" created only by mathematical equations! Jan-Olov Newborg Today I sail an old English boat called Vivacity, a very slow type! I have been on board Americas Cup/Volvo Ocean Race Cup boat, "Assa Abloy and the catamaran "Nokia" sailing with 265 m2 sailarea. By the way, do you belive in "Bernoulli law" , saying that "High Airflow velocity causing Low Pressure"? That should mean the the jetblast behind an F-16 Fighter running on afterburner should create low pressure! But thats not being the case! The total pressure is very high due to the high dynamic pressure! The Venturi effect you discuss is pure due to "The Coanda effect" and the turning of the airflow along the walls of the divergentpart of the pipe! How local pressure gradients are created by turning the fluidflow you can read he http://www.scienceweb.org/movies/aero.htm Jan-Olov Newborg Here are some links of flow physics (not flow mathematics): A Physical Description of Flight © http://www.aa.washington.edu/faculty/eberhardt/lift.htm Bernoulli Versus Newton http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/bernnew.html What is Ground Effect? http://home.mira.net/~radacorp/ground_effect.html Operational use of angle of attack (AOA) on modern commercial jet airplanes http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aer...12/attack.html Weltner Lift http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~weltner/ http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~welt...ht/PHYSIC4.htm Weltner Bernoulli http://www.informatik.uni-frankfurt..../MIS/mis6.html Incorrect theory number three http://www.grc.nasa.gov/Other_Groups...ne/wrong3.html Lift from flow turning http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/www/K-12/airplane/right2.html Jef Raskin - Coanda Effect: Understanding Why Wings Work http://www.jefraskin.com/forjef/jefw...da_effect.html F18 Soundbarrier and highspeed pass http://www.algonet.se/~newborg/ Beaty Gif pictures smokepuls plus SAAB 2000 http://www.amasci.com/wing/airgif2.html Prof. Colombinis photogallery http://www.diam.unige.it/~irro/gallery.html Flow around an airfoil http://www.diam.unige.it/~irro/profilo_e.html ScienceWeb - Aerodynamics http://www.scienceweb.org/movies/aero.htm Lift from spinning balls This website gives a lot of references all back to Newton/Robbins! The Magnus Effect http://www.geocities.com/k_achutarao...ew_magnus.html The Science of Swing, maintained by James Foster http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...ter/swing.html Normal Swing http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...er/normal.html Reversed Magnus effect explained http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...r/reverse.html Wrong lift explanations Smithsonian http://www.nasm.edu/galleries/gal109/NEWHTF/HTF510.HTM False Bernoulli explanations How things fly, an interactive gallery. Bernoulli Brain-Teasers. Activities you can do at home http://www.nasm.edu/galleries/gal109...XT/TEASERS.HTM US AirForce Museum http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/zone/ff3.htm Dr. John S. Denker online aerodynamic book. Wrong Lift explanation explained by "Circulation flow 'creating' the Velocity Field" http://www.monmouth.com/~jsd/fly/how/htm/ http://www.monmouth.com/~jsd/fly/how/htm/airfoils.html |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Spock,
I suggest you consider the names of the fuel and the engnes , Jet fuel, Jet after brners, jet fighters and try to imagine the operations that created those names OT |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
The_navigator_© wrote in message ...
Why don't you read them yourself? WE already know how a sailboat works. Cheers MC Since you try to explain the sailforces using false "longer airflow path behind the sail and sail beeing a "half venturi pipe", you seems to need more correct physical flow information! Jan-Olov Newborg How local pressure gradients are created by turning the fluidflow you can read he http://www.scienceweb.org/movies/aero.htm Here are some links of flow physics (not flow mathematics): A Physical Description of Flight © http://www.aa.washington.edu/faculty/eberhardt/lift.htm Bernoulli Versus Newton http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/bernnew.html What is Ground Effect? http://home.mira.net/~radacorp/ground_effect.html Operational use of angle of attack (AOA) on modern commercial jet airplanes http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aer...12/attack.html Weltner Lift http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~weltner/ http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~welt...ht/PHYSIC4.htm Weltner Bernoulli http://www.informatik.uni-frankfurt..../MIS/mis6.html Incorrect theory number three http://www.grc.nasa.gov/Other_Groups...ne/wrong3.html Lift from flow turning http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/www/K-12/airplane/right2.html Jef Raskin - Coanda Effect: Understanding Why Wings Work http://www.jefraskin.com/forjef/jefw...da_effect.html F18 Soundbarrier and highspeed pass http://www.algonet.se/~newborg/ Beaty Gif pictures smokepuls plus SAAB 2000 http://www.amasci.com/wing/airgif2.html Prof. Colombinis photogallery http://www.diam.unige.it/~irro/gallery.html Flow around an airfoil http://www.diam.unige.it/~irro/profilo_e.html ScienceWeb - Aerodynamics http://www.scienceweb.org/movies/aero.htm Lift from spinning balls This website gives a lot of references all back to Newton/Robbins! The Magnus Effect http://www.geocities.com/k_achutarao...ew_magnus.html The Science of Swing, maintained by James Foster http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...ter/swing.html Normal Swing http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...er/normal.html Reversed Magnus effect explained http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/STUDE...r/reverse.html Wrong lift explanations Smithsonian http://www.nasm.edu/galleries/gal109/NEWHTF/HTF510.HTM False Bernoulli explanations How things fly, an interactive gallery. Bernoulli Brain-Teasers. Activities you can do at home http://www.nasm.edu/galleries/gal109...XT/TEASERS.HTM US AirForce Museum http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/zone/ff3.htm Dr. John S. Denker online aerodynamic book. Wrong Lift explanation explained by "Circulation flow 'creating' the Velocity Field" http://www.monmouth.com/~jsd/fly/how/htm/ http://www.monmouth.com/~jsd/fly/how/htm/airfoils.html -- |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
The_navigator© wrote in message ...
Don't be silly I never said such a thing. BUT energy conservation laws do apply. Cheers MC BUT energy conservation laws does not consider friction losses, compression and turbulence. They are a result of a mathematical construction for an non existing mathematical perfect fluid. Prof. em John D. Anderson,Maryland University, writes in one of his aerodynamic books, that Bernoulli equation can be used only for a straight centerline of a venturi pipe, and then you have not considered the compressibility of the fluid along that centerline! Jan-Olov Newborg |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
The_navigator© wrote in message ...
Where do you get these ideas? Of course energy conservation laws consider (and implicitly include) friction losses, compression and turbulence. Now just because you are familiar with *one* form of the Bernouille equation does not mean that is the only form. It is possible to derive forms for any set of integral boundary conditions with the proviso that you follow a streamline for continuity. Finally, although you seem to have missed it, the Bernoulli equation expressly considers compression of a fluid. -it comes into the density term(s). As I said, we understand how a sail works but you seem to be struggling. Cheers MC Leonard Eulers so called "Bernoulli equation" is the 1D (one dimensional case) of his 3D equations for an non existing, mathematical modeled fluid! Bernoulli equation is the integralform of Newton second law F=m*a! It is easier to show the direction of the Lifting Force using Newton´s second law directly. Many books explain Lift with the so called "Bernoulli effect", which means that " high airflow velocity causes low airpressure"! Professor Dooley shows here below that this is wrong: According to Professor Dooley, Millerville University, it will take one generation to understand Bernoulli equation and that " high velocity does not causes low pressure". http://muweb.millersv.edu/~jdooley/m...erap/eulap.htm Professor Dooyley writes down the page: "One confusing detail about Bernoulli's equation needs discussion: In elementary treatments it is often stated that, because of Bernoulli's equation, high velocity causes low pressure. This is like saying that the high velocity of bullet leaving a gun caused the low pressure of the gas outside the barrel of the gun. The field treatment embodied in Euler's and Bernoulli's equations does not discuss cause and effect. The field view tells us what parameters "go together" without implying that one causes the other. If we trace back to the roots of these equations in Newton's laws, we can extract a cause and effect statement: Forces are said to cause accelerations. In the same sense, pressure gradients cause changes in velocity; not the other way around." In real aerodynamic books one never finds the expression "Bernoulli Effect"! Wings of all new airliners are almost flat on upper surface! That´s called "Supercritical Wings" and they save their operators (as example airbus340 ) some 15 % over older aircrafts (Boeing 747-400)! http://aerodyn.org/HighSpeed/supercritical.html They now have longer airflow path below the wing compared to to upper surface! Some Professors explains Lift with "The Circulation Theory"! But Potential Theory and it´s correction, the superpositioned "Circulation Field" is not reality, only a mathematical model! Jan-Olov Newborg |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Jan-Olov Newborg wrote: The_navigator© wrote in message ... Where do you get these ideas? Of course energy conservation laws consider (and implicitly include) friction losses, compression and turbulence. Now just because you are familiar with *one* form of the Bernouille equation does not mean that is the only form. It is possible to derive forms for any set of integral boundary conditions with the proviso that you follow a streamline for continuity. Finally, although you seem to have missed it, the Bernoulli equation expressly considers compression of a fluid. -it comes into the density term(s). As I said, we understand how a sail works but you seem to be struggling. Cheers MC Leonard Eulers so called "Bernoulli equation" is the 1D (one dimensional case) of his 3D equations for an non existing, mathematical modeled fluid! Hahahahhah. Does energy exist? Bernoulli equation is the integralform of Newton second law F=m*a! Bzzzzzzzzt wrong. It is easier to show the direction of the Lifting Force using Newton´s second law directly. Many books explain Lift with the so called "Bernoulli effect", which means that " high airflow velocity causes low airpressure"! Bernoulli does not say that. It is the misinterpretaion of the equation by mathematically impaired people that says that. Professor Dooley shows here below that this is wrong: According to Professor Dooley, Millerville University, it will take one generation to understand Bernoulli equation and that " high velocity does not causes low pressure". Yawn. So he's the only genius that can understand the derivation of an equation? Is this not a wonderful exaple of a one eyed man in a velley of the blind? http://muweb.millersv.edu/~jdooley/m...erap/eulap.htm Professor Dooyley writes down the page: "One confusing detail about Bernoulli's equation needs discussion: In elementary treatments it is often stated that, because of Bernoulli's equation, high velocity causes low pressure. Note the ELEMENYTARY! In this NG we are not at ELEMENTARY level and are so far above average understanding of how a sail works and how to make it work at close to 100% efficiency that people like Dooyley have nothing of value to offer. In real aerodynamic books one never finds the expression "Bernoulli Effect"! Yawn. Of course. Wings of all new airliners are almost flat on upper surface! That´s called "Supercritical Wings" and they save their operators (as example airbus340 ) some 15 % over older aircrafts (Boeing 747-400)! Now you are being really silly, do you think sailboats work in the spercritical regime? http://aerodyn.org/HighSpeed/supercritical.html They now have longer airflow path below the wing compared to to upper surface! Some Professors explains Lift with "The Circulation Theory"! But Potential Theory and it´s correction, the superpositioned "Circulation Field" is not reality, only a mathematical model! Say my model of you is a mathematical midget. Does that mean it's incorrect -just because it is a model? Cheers MC |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
The_navigator© wrote in message ...
Jan-Olov Newborg wrote: The_navigator© wrote in message ... Where do you get these ideas? Of course energy conservation laws consider (and implicitly include) friction losses, compression and turbulence. Now just because you are familiar with *one* form of the Bernouille equation does not mean that is the only form. It is possible to derive forms for any set of integral boundary conditions with the proviso that you follow a streamline for continuity. Finally, although you seem to have missed it, the Bernoulli equation expressly considers compression of a fluid. -it comes into the density term(s). As I said, we understand how a sail works but you seem to be struggling. Cheers MC Leonard Eulers so called "Bernoulli equation" is the 1D (one dimensional case) of his 3D equations for an non existing, mathematical modeled fluid! Hahahahhah. Does energy exist? Bernoulli equation is the integralform of Newton second law F=m*a! Bzzzzzzzzt wrong. It is easier to show the direction of the Lifting Force using Newton´s second law directly. Many books explain Lift with the so called "Bernoulli effect", which means that " high airflow velocity causes low airpressure"! Bernoulli does not say that. It is the misinterpretaion of the equation by mathematically impaired people that says that. Professor Dooley shows here below that this is wrong: According to Professor Dooley, Millerville University, it will take one generation to understand Bernoulli equation and that " high velocity does not causes low pressure". Yawn. So he's the only genius that can understand the derivation of an equation? Is this not a wonderful exaple of a one eyed man in a velley of the blind? http://muweb.millersv.edu/~jdooley/m...erap/eulap.htm Professor Dooyley writes down the page: "One confusing detail about Bernoulli's equation needs discussion: In elementary treatments it is often stated that, because of Bernoulli's equation, high velocity causes low pressure. Note the ELEMENYTARY! In this NG we are not at ELEMENTARY level and are so far above average understanding of how a sail works and how to make it work at close to 100% efficiency that people like Dooyley have nothing of value to offer. In real aerodynamic books one never finds the expression "Bernoulli Effect"! Yawn. Of course. Wings of all new airliners are almost flat on upper surface! That´s called "Supercritical Wings" and they save their operators (as example airbus340 ) some 15 % over older aircrafts (Boeing 747-400)! Now you are being really silly, do you think sailboats work in the spercritical regime? http://aerodyn.org/HighSpeed/supercritical.html They now have longer airflow path below the wing compared to to upper surface! Some Professors explains Lift with "The Circulation Theory"! But Potential Theory and it´s correction, the superpositioned "Circulation Field" is not reality, only a mathematical model! Say my model of you is a mathematical midget. Does that mean it's incorrect -just because it is a model? Cheers MC You don´t seems to understand the fluid flow physics and it´s connections to mathematical idealized models! PIM s webpage shows the real physics! Once Professor Hoerner wrote: "Only a mathematician can create Lift by means of a Line"! (Lifting Line Theory). If you are a mathematical midget or not I don´t know! Jan-Olov Newborg |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Jan-Olov Newborg wrote: The_navigator© wrote in message ... Jan-Olov Newborg wrote: The_navigator© wrote in message ... Where do you get these ideas? Of course energy conservation laws consider (and implicitly include) friction losses, compression and turbulence. Now just because you are familiar with *one* form of the Bernouille equation does not mean that is the only form. It is possible to derive forms for any set of integral boundary conditions with the proviso that you follow a streamline for continuity. Finally, although you seem to have missed it, the Bernoulli equation expressly considers compression of a fluid. -it comes into the density term(s). As I said, we understand how a sail works but you seem to be struggling. Cheers MC Leonard Eulers so called "Bernoulli equation" is the 1D (one dimensional case) of his 3D equations for an non existing, mathematical modeled fluid! Hahahahhah. Does energy exist? Bernoulli equation is the integralform of Newton second law F=m*a! Bzzzzzzzzt wrong. It is easier to show the direction of the Lifting Force using Newton´s second law directly. Many books explain Lift with the so called "Bernoulli effect", which means that " high airflow velocity causes low airpressure"! Bernoulli does not say that. It is the misinterpretaion of the equation by mathematically impaired people that says that. Professor Dooley shows here below that this is wrong: According to Professor Dooley, Millerville University, it will take one generation to understand Bernoulli equation and that " high velocity does not causes low pressure". Yawn. So he's the only genius that can understand the derivation of an equation? Is this not a wonderful exaple of a one eyed man in a velley of the blind? http://muweb.millersv.edu/~jdooley/m...erap/eulap.htm Professor Dooyley writes down the page: "One confusing detail about Bernoulli's equation needs discussion: In elementary treatments it is often stated that, because of Bernoulli's equation, high velocity causes low pressure. Note the ELEMENYTARY! In this NG we are not at ELEMENTARY level and are so far above average understanding of how a sail works and how to make it work at close to 100% efficiency that people like Dooyley have nothing of value to offer. In real aerodynamic books one never finds the expression "Bernoulli Effect"! Yawn. Of course. Wings of all new airliners are almost flat on upper surface! That´s called "Supercritical Wings" and they save their operators (as example airbus340 ) some 15 % over older aircrafts (Boeing 747-400)! Now you are being really silly, do you think sailboats work in the spercritical regime? http://aerodyn.org/HighSpeed/supercritical.html They now have longer airflow path below the wing compared to to upper surface! Some Professors explains Lift with "The Circulation Theory"! But Potential Theory and it´s correction, the superpositioned "Circulation Field" is not reality, only a mathematical model! Say my model of you is a mathematical midget. Does that mean it's incorrect -just because it is a model? Cheers MC You don´t seems to understand the fluid flow physics and it´s connections to mathematical idealized models! Silly boy, all phsyics is model based! PIM s webpage shows the real physics! Yawn Once Professor Hoerner wrote: "Only a mathematician can create Lift by means of a Line"! (Lifting Line Theory). Hyperbole. If you are a mathematical midget or not I don´t know! At last a correct statement! Yes you don't know -in fact you have no idea! Cheers MC |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
I'm the one who says it will obey energy conservation! What's this
"Bernouille law"? Did you just make it up? Cheers MC PS How you *think* the molecules of air 'know' there's a windsock in front of them? Jan-Olov Newborg wrote: The_navigator© wrote in message I would like to see you explain why the Jetblast behind a F16 Fighting Falcon and also the Windsock seen at every airport, does not obey the "Bernoulli law" and your mathematical model! |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Jan,
You sure are choosing the wrong examples to biscredit Bernoulli The Name of the engine you are discribing should explain the action. F15 JET. Jet being the key word. Don't yor know how a jet operates? We have many in this group who can explain this better than I Jan again you are proving Bernoulli Theorem. A Jet is based pretty much on a venture or a Jet nozzil. The rotating blades pull air into a narrowd section or Jet, increasing the vel |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Sorry Jan, hit the wrong key,
But to continue the turbine fans increase the air flow thru a narrow section, there by reducing pressure( Bernoulli) The back draft you are refering to is the recovery area of the air thru the Jet. I'm not sure but this maybe the reaction area if it is so Newton's Law. I'm in over my head here but the jet is creating lower pressure by increasing velocity |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Jan,
I'm sorry to tell you pitotube isn't a good example of Bernoulli. A pitotube is a comparision of Impact Pressure/static pressure. It isn't a reduction in pressure due to velocity Ole Thom |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 10:16:26 +1200, The_navigator© wrote:
Think about this, F=ma cannot be correct unless the object applying/experiencing F also changes energy content! Now do you get it? How's a ten pound rock sitting on the ground changing energy content? S/V Cat's Meow http://www.catsmeow.org |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
How did it get there?
Cheers MC Gerard Weatherby wrote: On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 10:16:26 +1200, The_navigator© wrote: Think about this, F=ma cannot be correct unless the object applying/experiencing F also changes energy content! Now do you get it? How's a ten pound rock sitting on the ground changing energy content? S/V Cat's Meow http://www.catsmeow.org |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:42:51 +1200, The_navigator© wrote:
How did it get there? Glacial erratic. Backhoe dumped in there. Fell off a stone wall. Ejected by a volcano. Pick one. S/V Cat's Meow http://www.catsmeow.org |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:45:04 +1200, The_navigator© wrote:
Why is it sitting there when it's accelerating? How does the gound resist it's weight? Doesn't look like it's accelerating to me. Electrostatic force. That's three irrelevant questions I've answered. Are you to continue to duck or answer my simple one? S/V Cat's Meow http://www.catsmeow.org |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling?
Cheers MC Gerard Weatherby wrote: On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:42:51 +1200, The_navigator© wrote: How did it get there? Glacial erratic. Backhoe dumped in there. Fell off a stone wall. Ejected by a volcano. Pick one. S/V Cat's Meow http://www.catsmeow.org |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
But is it accelerating (it's moving with the earth). Yes, electrostaitc
forces resist weight by compression and that stores energy... OK? Cheers MC Gerard Weatherby wrote: On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:45:04 +1200, The_navigator© wrote: Why is it sitting there when it's accelerating? How does the gound resist it's weight? Doesn't look like it's accelerating to me. Electrostatic force. That's three irrelevant questions I've answered. Are you to continue to duck or answer my simple one? S/V Cat's Meow http://www.catsmeow.org |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Yes that's true. Now what is the linear velocity of an object moving in
a circle? Cheers MC Gerard Weatherby wrote: On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:07:03 +1200, The_navigator© wrote: But is it accelerating (it's moving with the earth). Accleration isn't movement -- it's a change in velocity. S/V Cat's Meow http://www.catsmeow.org |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:07:03 +1200, The_navigator© wrote:
But is it accelerating (it's moving with the earth). Accleration isn't movement -- it's a change in velocity. S/V Cat's Meow http://www.catsmeow.org |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
.....density of the matrix?
CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | Cheers MC | | Gerard Weatherby wrote: | On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:42:51 +1200, The_navigator© wrote: | | | How did it get there? | | | Glacial erratic. Backhoe dumped in there. Fell off a stone wall. Ejected by a | volcano. Pick one. | | S/V Cat's Meow | http://www.catsmeow.org | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
No, the answer is not that your head is in the way. Sheesh, you try to
get some scientific converstaion about sailing going and look what drops in! :-P Cheers MC Capt. Mooron wrote: ....density of the matrix? CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | Cheers MC | | Gerard Weatherby wrote: | On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:42:51 +1200, The_navigator© wrote: | | | How did it get there? | | | Glacial erratic. Backhoe dumped in there. Fell off a stone wall. Ejected by a | volcano. Pick one. | | S/V Cat's Meow | http://www.catsmeow.org | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
duuuuuhhhhhhh, force pushing up = force pushing down?
Scout From: "The_navigator©" wrote: OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? Cheers MC |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Oh damn... that was what was giving me the headache... science & sails
forum... Gawk! CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | No, the answer is not that your head is in the way. Sheesh, you try to | get some scientific converstaion about sailing going and look what drops in! | | :-P | | Cheers MC | Capt. Mooron wrote: | ....density of the matrix? | | CM | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | ... | | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | | | Cheers MC | | | | Gerard Weatherby wrote: | | On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:42:51 +1200, The_navigator© | wrote: | | | | | | How did it get there? | | | | | | Glacial erratic. Backhoe dumped in there. Fell off a stone wall. | Ejected by a | | volcano. Pick one. | | | | S/V Cat's Meow | | http://www.catsmeow.org | | | | | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Is the object accelerating? :-P
CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | Yes that's true. Now what is the linear velocity of an object moving in | a circle? | | Cheers MC | | Gerard Weatherby wrote: | On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:07:03 +1200, The_navigator© wrote: | | | But is it accelerating (it's moving with the earth). | | | Accleration isn't movement -- it's a change in velocity. | | | S/V Cat's Meow | http://www.catsmeow.org | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Friction!!!! ..... I saw it on "The Ripping Friends"
CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | So 'duuuuuhhhhhhh' how is this 'pushing up' force produced? | | Cheers MC | | Scout wrote: | duuuuuhhhhhhh, force pushing up = force pushing down? | Scout | | | From: "The_navigator©" wrote: | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | Cheers MC | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Yes, I know you should killfile any intellectual threads.
Cheers MC Capt. Mooron wrote: Oh damn... that was what was giving me the headache... science & sails forum... Gawk! CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | No, the answer is not that your head is in the way. Sheesh, you try to | get some scientific converstaion about sailing going and look what drops in! | | :-P | | Cheers MC | Capt. Mooron wrote: | ....density of the matrix? | | CM | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | ... | | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | | | Cheers MC | | | | Gerard Weatherby wrote: | | On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:42:51 +1200, The_navigator© | wrote: | | | | | | How did it get there? | | | | | | Glacial erratic. Backhoe dumped in there. Fell off a stone wall. | Ejected by a | | volcano. Pick one. | | | | S/V Cat's Meow | | http://www.catsmeow.org | | | | | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
I know you know all about friction pushing things up. Have you broken
the 5" barrier yet? Cheers MC Capt. Mooron wrote: Friction!!!! ..... I saw it on "The Ripping Friends" CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | So 'duuuuuhhhhhhh' how is this 'pushing up' force produced? | | Cheers MC | | Scout wrote: | duuuuuhhhhhhh, force pushing up = force pushing down? | Scout | | | From: "The_navigator©" wrote: | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | Cheers MC | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
How can they be intellectual if I don't understand them?
CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | Yes, I know you should killfile any intellectual threads. | | Cheers MC | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | Oh damn... that was what was giving me the headache... science & sails | forum... Gawk! | | CM | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | ... | | No, the answer is not that your head is in the way. Sheesh, you try to | | get some scientific converstaion about sailing going and look what drops | in! | | | | :-P | | | | Cheers MC | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | | ....density of the matrix? | | | | CM | | | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | | ... | | | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | | | | | Cheers MC | | | | | | Gerard Weatherby wrote: | | | On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:42:51 +1200, The_navigator© | | | wrote: | | | | | | | | | How did it get there? | | | | | | | | | Glacial erratic. Backhoe dumped in there. Fell off a stone wall. | | Ejected by a | | | volcano. Pick one. | | | | | | S/V Cat's Meow | | | http://www.catsmeow.org | | | | | | | | | | | | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Not when she's wearing her pantyhose......
CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | I know you know all about friction pushing things up. Have you broken | the 5" barrier yet? | | Cheers MC | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | Friction!!!! ..... I saw it on "The Ripping Friends" | | CM | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | ... | | So 'duuuuuhhhhhhh' how is this 'pushing up' force produced? | | | | Cheers MC | | | | Scout wrote: | | duuuuuhhhhhhh, force pushing up = force pushing down? | | Scout | | | | | | From: "The_navigator©" wrote: | | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | Cheers MC | | | | | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Hey, just kill file them anyway! I do!
Cheers MC Capt. Mooron wrote: How can they be intellectual if I don't understand them? CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | Yes, I know you should killfile any intellectual threads. | | Cheers MC | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | Oh damn... that was what was giving me the headache... science & sails | forum... Gawk! | | CM | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | ... | | No, the answer is not that your head is in the way. Sheesh, you try to | | get some scientific converstaion about sailing going and look what drops | in! | | | | :-P | | | | Cheers MC | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | | ....density of the matrix? | | | | CM | | | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | | ... | | | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | | | | | Cheers MC | | | | | | Gerard Weatherby wrote: | | | On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:42:51 +1200, The_navigator© | | | wrote: | | | | | | | | | How did it get there? | | | | | | | | | Glacial erratic. Backhoe dumped in there. Fell off a stone wall. | | Ejected by a | | | volcano. Pick one. | | | | | | S/V Cat's Meow | | | http://www.catsmeow.org | | | | | | | | | | | | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Now I've told you, a strainer will not stop big strong sperm. However in
your case, you don't have to worry as they have to stop for a drink half way and get lost! Cheers MC Capt. Mooron wrote: Not when she's wearing her pantyhose...... CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | I know you know all about friction pushing things up. Have you broken | the 5" barrier yet? | | Cheers MC | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | Friction!!!! ..... I saw it on "The Ripping Friends" | | CM | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | ... | | So 'duuuuuhhhhhhh' how is this 'pushing up' force produced? | | | | Cheers MC | | | | Scout wrote: | | duuuuuhhhhhhh, force pushing up = force pushing down? | | Scout | | | | | | From: "The_navigator©" wrote: | | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | Cheers MC | | | | | |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
Normal force, which is, essentially, chemical in nature, and occurs when the
electrons in adjacent atoms push away from each other Now I'm outta here, see you all in a few days! Scout "The_navigator©" wrote | So 'duuuuuhhhhhhh' how is this 'pushing up' force produced? |
how a sail works, who can help me explain?
They don't get lost... they win on corrected time... what can I say.. I've
got a FULL Keel! CM "The_navigator©" wrote in message ... | Now I've told you, a strainer will not stop big strong sperm. However in | your case, you don't have to worry as they have to stop for a drink half | way and get lost! | | Cheers MC | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | Not when she's wearing her pantyhose...... | | CM | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | ... | | I know you know all about friction pushing things up. Have you broken | | the 5" barrier yet? | | | | Cheers MC | | | | Capt. Mooron wrote: | | Friction!!!! ..... I saw it on "The Ripping Friends" | | | | CM | | | | "The_navigator©" wrote in message | | ... | | | So 'duuuuuhhhhhhh' how is this 'pushing up' force produced? | | | | | | Cheers MC | | | | | | Scout wrote: | | | duuuuuhhhhhhh, force pushing up = force pushing down? | | | Scout | | | | | | | | | From: "The_navigator©" wrote: | | | OK fell off a wall. Now why doesn't it keep falling? | | | Cheers MC | | | | | | | | | | | | |
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