Nauti-babble! You're just showing how little you know!


Wetted surface and hull shape is babble? Oh. Okay!


So you didn't understand the numbers and you gave up learning.
This is
a common pattern for you, isn't it?


Nope, I learned that the numbers is a starting point, but hardly the
final determination of a boats real world performance. In fact many of
the folks here taught me that when I whipped out a bunch of silly
numbers against Neal's Coronado 27.


but the NS 36 SD is almost as fast as your boat;

It's almost as fast like my boat is almost as fast as a J29...except
it isn't.


in some situations its faster, like if you leave your jib at home.



Uh huh. And if I just leave the anchor down you'd certainly pass
me...eventually!


and you'll catch up to where I was
about 40 years ago.


Aboard a Nonsuch? No thanks!


You've totally lost it here, booby! Are you seriously claiming
that the
35s5 without a jib can beat a boat that rates at 141 or even 160???



You clearly don't understand the fractional rig at all. Most of the
35s5's drive comes from the mainsail. She does everything well under
her main alone, even besting hull speed with good wind. She's
thousands of lbs less than a Nonsuch, has less drag and so on. It's
not a debate, except for you, Jeff. We've done it.



And
you think you have any credibility left? BWHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Credibility with....a guy who sails a Siedelmann, a fellow with a
Trawler, and old fart who's never owned a performance disp.
monohull...and who else? Sockpuppets? I'm one of the few people who's
actually sailing out of this group! Don't make me laugh! Who else is
on that team of yours? Sloco with his Depressed 30 PHRF
Slothosaurus??? Bwahahahahaha!



But this just proves my point. If you're claiming that a boat
that's a
couple of percent faster is all the difference in the world, then the
crude VPP numbers I gave are actually pretty definitive in showing
that
there's no way that a Benny without a jib can overcome that handicap.



You can crunch those numbers until you turn blue. Nothing beats the
actual sailing itself. The blue hulled NS36 fell behind us on two
tacks on a close reach. Later, on more of a beam reach it was very
close, but we still pulled away when the heavy puffs came along and
the 35s5 just surges forward. The NS36 did not respond that way. This
was not the 1st time we sailed next to an NS. We sail over to them
often because they're pretty to look at.


But these moments
usually last a few seconds are caused by surfing and momentary gusts.
They don't happen often (except in your fantasies) on a close reach
in
18-20 knots steady.


No, Jeff. They don't happen on a Nonsuch. But on a 35s5 they happen
more often. And on a J Boat they happen even more often. That's why
the Nonsuch won't rate 126 like a 35s5 and rates 165 here.



Of course, but its essentially the same hull shape.


Essentially...yes. Drives me nuts when folks say they're identical.


USSailing lists the NS 36 SD as 141.


Get over yourself. That would mean the NS36 could take on a J30!!!!
BWAHAHAHHA! The most common rating for the NS36 in the US is 156,
which is much like my C&C 32. The 35s5 sails circles around on the C&C
32 just like it does to the NS36. Ask Sloco if his Express 30, which
rates close to 141, would be beaten by a NS36! Boat for boat he'd
trounce the Nonsuch.


So what is it? Does it have a low rating because its raced by pros,
or a
high rating because its too hard for the average racer? You seem to
flip you argument back and forth.


She's now too old to be raced by many pros. The 36.7 is the pick of
the moment and even that's getting old. The 35s5 is tricky to sail at
it's best and hard for the average racer to deal with. I was well
warned by other racers before I bought her, but then we didn't plan to
race, so moot issue. 35s5's that win often are campaigned by pretty
high end crews. Windriven is such a boat and the owner admits the 35s5
does not hit it's rating without great tuning and a very well adapted
crew. It's just not a great boat to race unless you plan to really get
into it. As a fun and fast daysailer and cruiser she's perfect.




You made that claim that without your jib you can outsail a NS 36.



We passed the NS36 with just our mainsail on Saturday in fairly strong
winds, yes.


Its real simple: in F5 the Nonsuch (and most other boats) will be at or
near hull speed when carrying full sail. Take away the jib and the
benny doesn't have a prayer.


It's real simple. On a reach, in gusts over 20 knots, we surged right
by the Nonsuch. Was she dragging something? Your ego perhaps? I dunno,
but we passed her...as we usually do.



Without your jib? That's the whole topic of this discussion, even
though you keep avoiding it.

Not avoiding it, Jeff. No one was more surprised than me by the 35s5's
speed under the main in strong gusts. Everyone aboard was impressed.
We'd surge well above 7 knots, fall back to 6 and change. It's those
surges that put us out in front.
I don't know what else to tell you, except to post a photo sequence,
You'll claim it's fake I suppose. Oh well. Sailing tomorrow, Jeff.



RB
35s5
NY