|
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael"
wrote: "John H." wrote in message .. . Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! -- John H. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:15:01 -0400, John H.
wrote: Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. As others have mentioned, the two most likely causes are either low voltage or insufficient anti-cycling delay in the condenser controller. Excessive cycling can be caused by poor air flow among other things - clogged filter, fan speed too low, etc. |
Holy shit!
Don White wrote:
"A Boater" wrote in message ... Ohmigod! Don's been *plonked* by JustWaitaLoogy! The horror of it. Don...will you require therapy for this? :) An 18 pack of Labatt Blue should help me cope with this disaster. One Corona with lime would do it for me. |
Holy shit!
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 11:01:06 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jim" wrote in message ... John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:32:21 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message m... Temp does have something to do with it. At higher outside temps ac runs higher pressures. Takes more current to start the compressor. AC copmpressors have to start under a load so they need a lot of current initially. First make sure you have the correct circuit breaker. Then replace if it's old it cause when they get old they blow at lower than rated. Voltage brownout will do it as well. Check and tighten all the connections. None of that works call the service guy cause you're probably not qualified to go any deeper. Exactly. The problem with these rigs when used in travel trailers is the poor insulation of the trailer itself. On hot days the temperature can rise back up over the thermostat setpoint before the head pressure bleeds off. But, I am willing to be his problem was low RV park voltage. Eisboch I'm hoping you're correct! But, I'll probably never know for sure. Maybe the dealer will find a bad capacitor or something. But I'm going to change the circuit breaker first. Easter egg hunting is not a good troubleshooting method, and it could get costly. You need a good multimeter that is capable of reading at least 30 amps AC and AC volts. Keep in mind amps are read in series. Meaning you have to break open a circuit or use a clamp on pickup or if the Air Conditioner unit plugs into an outlet, instead of being hardwired, you can use an adapter with the clamp on pickup or a killowatt type of device to take readings. Heh .... I drafted a post for John, describing the old Navy "Easter Egging" technique of troubleshooting, and recommended he do a more logical series of tests, but then I realized that people need to do what they need to do, so I deleted the post. I doubt very much his circuit breaker is bad. Could be wrong, but there are other things I'd check first. But, I have a feeling he's going to claim the problem as being fixed after he replaces it. For a while. Then, sometime in the future when conditions are similar to that he wrote about, the problem will return. Eisboch Give me a break! I don't usually make a lot of claims that aren't true. Perhaps you're confusing me with someone else. The new circuit breaker costs $12 bucks. I won't know if that's the problem until we get another 95 degree day. If the problem returns, then I'll know it wasn't the circuit breaker. Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. I think he meant because of cooler weather, you will think it is cured. |
Holy shit!
Reginald P. Smithers III wrote:
John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 11:01:06 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jim" wrote in message ... John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:32:21 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message m... Temp does have something to do with it. At higher outside temps ac runs higher pressures. Takes more current to start the compressor. AC copmpressors have to start under a load so they need a lot of current initially. First make sure you have the correct circuit breaker. Then replace if it's old it cause when they get old they blow at lower than rated. Voltage brownout will do it as well. Check and tighten all the connections. None of that works call the service guy cause you're probably not qualified to go any deeper. Exactly. The problem with these rigs when used in travel trailers is the poor insulation of the trailer itself. On hot days the temperature can rise back up over the thermostat setpoint before the head pressure bleeds off. But, I am willing to be his problem was low RV park voltage. Eisboch I'm hoping you're correct! But, I'll probably never know for sure. Maybe the dealer will find a bad capacitor or something. But I'm going to change the circuit breaker first. Easter egg hunting is not a good troubleshooting method, and it could get costly. You need a good multimeter that is capable of reading at least 30 amps AC and AC volts. Keep in mind amps are read in series. Meaning you have to break open a circuit or use a clamp on pickup or if the Air Conditioner unit plugs into an outlet, instead of being hardwired, you can use an adapter with the clamp on pickup or a killowatt type of device to take readings. Heh .... I drafted a post for John, describing the old Navy "Easter Egging" technique of troubleshooting, and recommended he do a more logical series of tests, but then I realized that people need to do what they need to do, so I deleted the post. I doubt very much his circuit breaker is bad. Could be wrong, but there are other things I'd check first. But, I have a feeling he's going to claim the problem as being fixed after he replaces it. For a while. Then, sometime in the future when conditions are similar to that he wrote about, the problem will return. Eisboch Give me a break! I don't usually make a lot of claims that aren't true. Perhaps you're confusing me with someone else. The new circuit breaker costs $12 bucks. I won't know if that's the problem until we get another 95 degree day. If the problem returns, then I'll know it wasn't the circuit breaker. Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. I think he meant because of cooler weather, you will think it is cured. Herring was an injineeeear but doesn't know anything about electricity? |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 15:45:03 -0400, "Reginald P. Smithers III"
wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 11:01:06 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jim" wrote in message ... John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:32:21 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message m... Temp does have something to do with it. At higher outside temps ac runs higher pressures. Takes more current to start the compressor. AC copmpressors have to start under a load so they need a lot of current initially. First make sure you have the correct circuit breaker. Then replace if it's old it cause when they get old they blow at lower than rated. Voltage brownout will do it as well. Check and tighten all the connections. None of that works call the service guy cause you're probably not qualified to go any deeper. Exactly. The problem with these rigs when used in travel trailers is the poor insulation of the trailer itself. On hot days the temperature can rise back up over the thermostat setpoint before the head pressure bleeds off. But, I am willing to be his problem was low RV park voltage. Eisboch I'm hoping you're correct! But, I'll probably never know for sure. Maybe the dealer will find a bad capacitor or something. But I'm going to change the circuit breaker first. Easter egg hunting is not a good troubleshooting method, and it could get costly. You need a good multimeter that is capable of reading at least 30 amps AC and AC volts. Keep in mind amps are read in series. Meaning you have to break open a circuit or use a clamp on pickup or if the Air Conditioner unit plugs into an outlet, instead of being hardwired, you can use an adapter with the clamp on pickup or a killowatt type of device to take readings. Heh .... I drafted a post for John, describing the old Navy "Easter Egging" technique of troubleshooting, and recommended he do a more logical series of tests, but then I realized that people need to do what they need to do, so I deleted the post. I doubt very much his circuit breaker is bad. Could be wrong, but there are other things I'd check first. But, I have a feeling he's going to claim the problem as being fixed after he replaces it. For a while. Then, sometime in the future when conditions are similar to that he wrote about, the problem will return. Eisboch Give me a break! I don't usually make a lot of claims that aren't true. Perhaps you're confusing me with someone else. The new circuit breaker costs $12 bucks. I won't know if that's the problem until we get another 95 degree day. If the problem returns, then I'll know it wasn't the circuit breaker. Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. I think he meant because of cooler weather, you will think it is cured. Hopefully, it's straightened out. I obviously can't test it until I get a 95 degree day with high humidity, which isn't going to happen until next summer unless I go to Disney World in December. Hell, I've been told about 14 things to look for, test, buy or otherwise do in hopes of fixing the problem. So far I've done three or four. Replacing the circuit breaker was one of the first things I was told, by several people, including my BIL who runs an appliance store in Richmond and was on scene when the problem appeared. -- John H. |
Holy shit!
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael |
Holy shit!
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 15:45:03 -0400, "Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 11:01:06 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jim" wrote in message ... John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:32:21 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message m... Temp does have something to do with it. At higher outside temps ac runs higher pressures. Takes more current to start the compressor. AC copmpressors have to start under a load so they need a lot of current initially. First make sure you have the correct circuit breaker. Then replace if it's old it cause when they get old they blow at lower than rated. Voltage brownout will do it as well. Check and tighten all the connections. None of that works call the service guy cause you're probably not qualified to go any deeper. Exactly. The problem with these rigs when used in travel trailers is the poor insulation of the trailer itself. On hot days the temperature can rise back up over the thermostat setpoint before the head pressure bleeds off. But, I am willing to be his problem was low RV park voltage. Eisboch I'm hoping you're correct! But, I'll probably never know for sure. Maybe the dealer will find a bad capacitor or something. But I'm going to change the circuit breaker first. Easter egg hunting is not a good troubleshooting method, and it could get costly. You need a good multimeter that is capable of reading at least 30 amps AC and AC volts. Keep in mind amps are read in series. Meaning you have to break open a circuit or use a clamp on pickup or if the Air Conditioner unit plugs into an outlet, instead of being hardwired, you can use an adapter with the clamp on pickup or a killowatt type of device to take readings. Heh .... I drafted a post for John, describing the old Navy "Easter Egging" technique of troubleshooting, and recommended he do a more logical series of tests, but then I realized that people need to do what they need to do, so I deleted the post. I doubt very much his circuit breaker is bad. Could be wrong, but there are other things I'd check first. But, I have a feeling he's going to claim the problem as being fixed after he replaces it. For a while. Then, sometime in the future when conditions are similar to that he wrote about, the problem will return. Eisboch Give me a break! I don't usually make a lot of claims that aren't true. Perhaps you're confusing me with someone else. The new circuit breaker costs $12 bucks. I won't know if that's the problem until we get another 95 degree day. If the problem returns, then I'll know it wasn't the circuit breaker. Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. I think he meant because of cooler weather, you will think it is cured. Hopefully, it's straightened out. I obviously can't test it until I get a 95 degree day with high humidity, which isn't going to happen until next summer unless I go to Disney World in December. Hell, I've been told about 14 things to look for, test, buy or otherwise do in hopes of fixing the problem. So far I've done three or four. Replacing the circuit breaker was one of the first things I was told, by several people, including my BIL who runs an appliance store in Richmond and was on scene when the problem appeared. You won't likely see 95 degrees at Disney in December. In fact 95 Degrees is rare anytime during the year. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 15:54:11 -0400, A Boater wrote:
Reginald P. Smithers III wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 11:01:06 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jim" wrote in message ... John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:32:21 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: "jamesgangnc" wrote in message m... Temp does have something to do with it. At higher outside temps ac runs higher pressures. Takes more current to start the compressor. AC copmpressors have to start under a load so they need a lot of current initially. First make sure you have the correct circuit breaker. Then replace if it's old it cause when they get old they blow at lower than rated. Voltage brownout will do it as well. Check and tighten all the connections. None of that works call the service guy cause you're probably not qualified to go any deeper. Exactly. The problem with these rigs when used in travel trailers is the poor insulation of the trailer itself. On hot days the temperature can rise back up over the thermostat setpoint before the head pressure bleeds off. But, I am willing to be his problem was low RV park voltage. Eisboch I'm hoping you're correct! But, I'll probably never know for sure. Maybe the dealer will find a bad capacitor or something. But I'm going to change the circuit breaker first. Easter egg hunting is not a good troubleshooting method, and it could get costly. You need a good multimeter that is capable of reading at least 30 amps AC and AC volts. Keep in mind amps are read in series. Meaning you have to break open a circuit or use a clamp on pickup or if the Air Conditioner unit plugs into an outlet, instead of being hardwired, you can use an adapter with the clamp on pickup or a killowatt type of device to take readings. Heh .... I drafted a post for John, describing the old Navy "Easter Egging" technique of troubleshooting, and recommended he do a more logical series of tests, but then I realized that people need to do what they need to do, so I deleted the post. I doubt very much his circuit breaker is bad. Could be wrong, but there are other things I'd check first. But, I have a feeling he's going to claim the problem as being fixed after he replaces it. For a while. Then, sometime in the future when conditions are similar to that he wrote about, the problem will return. Eisboch Give me a break! I don't usually make a lot of claims that aren't true. Perhaps you're confusing me with someone else. The new circuit breaker costs $12 bucks. I won't know if that's the problem until we get another 95 degree day. If the problem returns, then I'll know it wasn't the circuit breaker. Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. I think he meant because of cooler weather, you will think it is cured. Herring was an injineeeear but doesn't know anything about electricity? Goodandplenty, goodandplenty, goodandplenty. WOOOOO- Wooooooo! Yep, he was an engineer, alright. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote:
John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. |
Holy shit!
On Sep 16, 8:12*pm, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, *A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. *You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. *If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say.. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. All I can say is...........unfrickenbelievable. 'nuff said. |
Holy shit!
"John H." wrote in message ... I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch |
Holy shit!
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. You're on a roll now. I see you've been here already. www.fixya.com/support/dometic/air_conditioners |
Holy shit!
"John H." wrote in message ... On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:57:17 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:15:01 -0400, John H. wrote: Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. As others have mentioned, the two most likely causes are either low voltage or insufficient anti-cycling delay in the condenser controller. Excessive cycling can be caused by poor air flow among other things - clogged filter, fan speed too low, etc. When I got the circuit breaker, the service guy at the dealership mentioned that on hot, humid days the fan should always be going full blast. Now I know. Thanks for the come back. -- John H. You also need a circuit breaker with a slow trip curve. I think it is a "C" curve, but will not stand behind the statement. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 20:30:10 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:
"John H." wrote in message .. . I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch Thanks. I'll check on that. -- John H. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 20:59:44 -0400, jim wrote:
John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. You're on a roll now. I see you've been here already. www.fixya.com/support/dometic/air_conditioners Yes. I found that place soon. -- John H. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 18:29:31 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote: "John H." wrote in message .. . On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:57:17 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:15:01 -0400, John H. wrote: Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. As others have mentioned, the two most likely causes are either low voltage or insufficient anti-cycling delay in the condenser controller. Excessive cycling can be caused by poor air flow among other things - clogged filter, fan speed too low, etc. When I got the circuit breaker, the service guy at the dealership mentioned that on hot, humid days the fan should always be going full blast. Now I know. Thanks for the come back. -- John H. You also need a circuit breaker with a slow trip curve. I think it is a "C" curve, but will not stand behind the statement. I've already replaced it. I just took the one the dealer gave me, same as the old one. -- John H. |
Holy shit!
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 20:59:44 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. You're on a roll now. I see you've been here already. www.fixya.com/support/dometic/air_conditioners Yes. I found that place soon. Ya'll be sure to let us know how that new manicure shop works out. |
Holy shit!
On Sep 16, 8:30*pm, "Eisboch" wrote:
"John H." wrote in message ... I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. *They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! |
Holy shit!
wrote in message ... On Sep 16, 8:30 pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! ------------------------- You trying to pick a fight, Pilgrim? EIsboch |
Holy shit!
On Sep 17, 11:48*am, "Eisboch" wrote:
wrote in message ... On Sep 16, 8:30 pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message .. . I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. They are not expensive.. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! ------------------------- You trying to pick a fight, Pilgrim? EIsboch- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Nah, just replying to a stupid notion of someone here that stated this: "Herring was an injineeeear but doesn't know anything about electricity?" |
Holy shit!
On Sep 17, 11:46*am, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 08:39:14 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 16, 8:30*pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message . .. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. *They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! A reasonable person would expect that an engineer in ANY field would have at least a small aptitude for learning and understanding very simple concepts in another field. Especially when the simple concepts are learned and understood pretty easily by a lay person of average intelligence. Just about anybody standing in line at the checkout of Home Depot could handle this.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - IF that person were so inclined. So tell me, what exactly IS the line condition at the particular RV park where John was? |
Holy shit!
wrote in message ... On Sep 17, 11:48 am, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message ... On Sep 16, 8:30 pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message .. . I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! ------------------------- You trying to pick a fight, Pilgrim? EIsboch- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Nah, just replying to a stupid notion of someone here that stated this: "Herring was an injineeeear but doesn't know anything about electricity?" The person hurling that insult hasn't a clue what an Army Engineer is or does. Eisboch |
Holy shit!
wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:34:14 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: The person hurling that insult hasn't a clue what an Army Engineer is or does. Eisboch Well, if JohnH is an example of an "Army Engineer", then I guess you can file it next to "Army Intelligence" in the book of oxymorons. Just think though. He did his job a hell of a lot better than you could. EIsboch |
Holy shit!
|
Holy shit!
On Sep 17, 1:02*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:51:32 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 17, 11:46*am, wrote: On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 08:39:14 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 16, 8:30*pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message . .. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. *They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! A reasonable person would expect that an engineer in ANY field would have at least a small aptitude for learning and understanding very simple concepts in another field. Especially when the simple concepts are learned and understood pretty easily by a lay person of average intelligence. Just about anybody standing in line at the checkout of Home Depot could handle this.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - IF that person were so inclined. So tell me, what exactly IS the line condition at the particular RV park where John was? *It would take a team of electrical Engineers from M.I.T. several weeks to determine that. It's VERY complicated, dontcha know...- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Well, if you're so damned smart, TELL ME. What was the cause of John's problem? How do you KNOW what the cause is? What data did you use to determine said cause? |
Holy shit!
On Sep 17, 2:26*pm, wrote:
On Sep 17, 1:02*pm, wrote: On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:51:32 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 17, 11:46*am, wrote: On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 08:39:14 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 16, 8:30*pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message . .. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. *They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! A reasonable person would expect that an engineer in ANY field would have at least a small aptitude for learning and understanding very simple concepts in another field. Especially when the simple concepts are learned and understood pretty easily by a lay person of average intelligence. Just about anybody standing in line at the checkout of Home Depot could handle this.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - IF that person were so inclined. So tell me, what exactly IS the line condition at the particular RV park where John was? *It would take a team of electrical Engineers from M.I.T. several weeks to determine that. It's VERY complicated, dontcha know...- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Well, if you're so damned smart, TELL ME. What was the cause of John's problem? How do you KNOW what the cause is? What data did you use to determine said cause? This thread is hilarious. |
Holy shit!
wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:52:46 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message . .. On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:34:14 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: The person hurling that insult hasn't a clue what an Army Engineer is or does. Eisboch Well, if JohnH is an example of an "Army Engineer", then I guess you can file it next to "Army Intelligence" in the book of oxymorons. Just think though. He did his job a hell of a lot better than you could. EIsboch Highly doubful. Your competence is in question as well. You've posted some pretty foolish notions recently. Typical. I post some things you disagree with and suddenly my competence is in question. Guess what? I couldn't care less. Eisboch |
Holy shit!
"John H." wrote in message ... I'm not an engineer. In the Army I was a 'Combat Engineer'. There's a big difference between a 'Combat Engineer' and a professional engineer in any field. Ah, rats. It was more fun watching them guess while making fools of themselves. Eisboch |
Holy shit!
wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:42:29 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message . .. On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:52:46 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message m... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:34:14 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: The person hurling that insult hasn't a clue what an Army Engineer is or does. Eisboch Well, if JohnH is an example of an "Army Engineer", then I guess you can file it next to "Army Intelligence" in the book of oxymorons. Just think though. He did his job a hell of a lot better than you could. EIsboch Highly doubful. Your competence is in question as well. You've posted some pretty foolish notions recently. Typical. I post some things you disagree with and suddenly my competence is in question. Guess what? I couldn't care less. That's because you are too stupid to care. I had to be smart all my life. Now that I can, I love being stupid. I get to type on a computer arguing with other stupid people. Eisboch |
Holy shit!
wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:51:03 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message . .. On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:42:29 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message m... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:52:46 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message news:dng2d49ojihrn622dif2t0frmudmrjrud9@4ax. com... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:34:14 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: The person hurling that insult hasn't a clue what an Army Engineer is or does. Eisboch Well, if JohnH is an example of an "Army Engineer", then I guess you can file it next to "Army Intelligence" in the book of oxymorons. Just think though. He did his job a hell of a lot better than you could. EIsboch Highly doubful. Your competence is in question as well. You've posted some pretty foolish notions recently. Typical. I post some things you disagree with and suddenly my competence is in question. Guess what? I couldn't care less. That's because you are too stupid to care. I had to be smart all my life. Now that I can, I love being stupid. I get to type on a computer arguing with other stupid people. Eisboch Harry has succeeded in his efforts and brought out the worst in you. You should be ashamed of yourself for falling so low. Simply following his lead. Stupid, you know. Eisboch |
Holy shit!
On Sep 17, 2:38*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 11:26:54 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 17, 1:02*pm, wrote: On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:51:32 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 17, 11:46*am, wrote: On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 08:39:14 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 16, 8:30*pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message . .. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. *They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! A reasonable person would expect that an engineer in ANY field would have at least a small aptitude for learning and understanding very simple concepts in another field. Especially when the simple concepts are learned and understood pretty easily by a lay person of average intelligence. Just about anybody standing in line at the checkout of Home Depot could handle this.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - IF that person were so inclined. So tell me, what exactly IS the line condition at the particular RV park where John was? *It would take a team of electrical Engineers from M.I.T. several weeks to determine that. It's VERY complicated, dontcha know...- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Well, if you're so damned smart, TELL ME. What was the cause of John's problem? How do you KNOW what the cause is? What data did you use to determine said cause? I never once said I had a firm diagnosis. You are an ignorant **** who can't even keep track of what you are yammering about. From JohnH's posts, and his buying of a circuit breaker just because it made him feel like he was addressing the problem, it's clear that he needs some instruction on basic troubleshooting. Knowing how to trouble shoot is completely separate from having knowledge in any particular area. It's a skill he, and very obviously, you, lack.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You know nothing about me. But, I see that you understand you are an idiot for thinking that because someone has expertise in a certain field that they should know about any other field. Hence the return to gutter trash name calling. |
Holy shit!
On Sep 17, 2:31*pm, JimH wrote:
On Sep 17, 2:26*pm, wrote: On Sep 17, 1:02*pm, wrote: On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:51:32 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 17, 11:46*am, wrote: On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 08:39:14 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Sep 16, 8:30*pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message . .. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on.. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. *They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! A reasonable person would expect that an engineer in ANY field would have at least a small aptitude for learning and understanding very simple concepts in another field. Especially when the simple concepts are learned and understood pretty easily by a lay person of average intelligence. Just about anybody standing in line at the checkout of Home Depot could handle this.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - IF that person were so inclined. So tell me, what exactly IS the line condition at the particular RV park where John was? *It would take a team of electrical Engineers from M.I.T. several weeks to determine that. It's VERY complicated, dontcha know...- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Well, if you're so damned smart, TELL ME. What was the cause of John's problem? How do you KNOW what the cause is? What data did you use to determine said cause? This thread is hilarious.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - That's because you're a moron. |
Holy shit!
"Eisboch" wrote in message ... wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:42:29 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:52:46 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message om... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:34:14 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: The person hurling that insult hasn't a clue what an Army Engineer is or does. Eisboch Well, if JohnH is an example of an "Army Engineer", then I guess you can file it next to "Army Intelligence" in the book of oxymorons. Just think though. He did his job a hell of a lot better than you could. EIsboch Highly doubful. Your competence is in question as well. You've posted some pretty foolish notions recently. Typical. I post some things you disagree with and suddenly my competence is in question. Guess what? I couldn't care less. That's because you are too stupid to care. I had to be smart all my life. Now that I can, I love being stupid. I get to type on a computer arguing with other stupid people. Eisboch LOL! |
Holy shit!
wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:57:00 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: That's because you are too stupid to care. I had to be smart all my life. Now that I can, I love being stupid. I get to type on a computer arguing with other stupid people. Eisboch Harry has succeeded in his efforts and brought out the worst in you. You should be ashamed of yourself for falling so low. Simply following his lead. Stupid, you know. Eisboch disappointing Well, I admit to having a disadvantage. You see, in my communications with others during my life so far I didn't have the vast vocabulary containing foul mouthed, vulgar, and insulting words that people like you and Harry have in your hip pocket, ready to use in a disagreement or to impress others. I never had to learn or use them to impress anybody or resolve differences of opinions. So, I am learning, doing catch-up, if you will. Meanwhile, I've enlisted the aid of one of Harry's idols: "You starvelling, you eel-skin, you dried neat's-tongue, you bull's-pizzle, you stock-fish--O for breath to utter what is like thee!-you tailor's-yard, you sheath, you bow-case, you vile standing tuck!" Eisboch |
Holy shit!
Eisboch wrote:
wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:51:03 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:42:29 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:52:46 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message ... On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:34:14 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote: The person hurling that insult hasn't a clue what an Army Engineer is or does. Eisboch Well, if JohnH is an example of an "Army Engineer", then I guess you can file it next to "Army Intelligence" in the book of oxymorons. Just think though. He did his job a hell of a lot better than you could. EIsboch Highly doubful. Your competence is in question as well. You've posted some pretty foolish notions recently. Typical. I post some things you disagree with and suddenly my competence is in question. Guess what? I couldn't care less. That's because you are too stupid to care. I had to be smart all my life. Now that I can, I love being stupid. I get to type on a computer arguing with other stupid people. Eisboch Harry has succeeded in his efforts and brought out the worst in you. You should be ashamed of yourself for falling so low. Simply following his lead. Stupid, you know. Eisboch I have 1 filter I've named "3 salted nuts". In it I have don jim saltine and the many faces of WAFA. That cuts 70 percent of the useless crap. Try it. You might like it. |
Holy shit!
"jim" wrote in message ... I have 1 filter I've named "3 salted nuts". In it I have don jim saltine and the many faces of WAFA. That cuts 70 percent of the useless crap. Try it. You might like it. Sorry. Can't talk to you. You are not stupid. Eisboch |
Holy shit!
Eisboch wrote:
"jim" wrote in message ... I have 1 filter I've named "3 salted nuts". In it I have don jim saltine and the many faces of WAFA. That cuts 70 percent of the useless crap. Try it. You might like it. Sorry. Can't talk to you. You are not stupid. Eisboch Well Pftttt! to you . Why the sudden fascination with these morons? |
Holy shit!
On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:21:11 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:
Well, I admit to having a disadvantage. You see, in my communications with others during my life so far I didn't have the vast vocabulary containing foul mouthed, vulgar, and insulting words Hey, I thought you were in the Navy. --Vic |
Holy shit!
"Eisboch" wrote in message ... "jim" wrote in message ... I have 1 filter I've named "3 salted nuts". In it I have don jim saltine and the many faces of WAFA. That cuts 70 percent of the useless crap. Try it. You might like it. Sorry. Can't talk to you. You are not stupid. Eisboch I wouldn't bet my portfolo on that... Looks like he salted himself.. as per... "I've named "3 salted nuts". In it I have don jim saltine" |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:38 PM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2014 BoatBanter.com