Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Casady

Watching boats in chop
 

Richard Casady wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:

JimH wrote:
On Aug 18, 12:30 am, Wayne.B wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 19:30:21 -0400, hk wrote:
Parker's solid fir plywood stringer system continues to give
customers the strongest, toughest and safest fiberglass boats built.
~~ snerk~~
Plywood stringers indeed. At least they're not chip board.
Parker and Grady use the same XL ply stringer material, as do many other
manufacturers of top-quality boats. What are the stringers made of in
your floating RV?
Probably solid teak, everything else is.

There was a 60 some foot GB docked alongside the Yacht Club on the
River this weekend. Looked like a planked teak transom on a
fiberglass hull.

Nice looking boat.

Which goes to show how subjective taste is. I've never liked teak on a
boat. On the exterior, I always preferred mahogany, the real stuff, not
the crap that is sold most often these days as mahogany. In a cabin, I
pretty cherry or oak.

All the cruise ships seem to have three inch thick unfinished teak
weather decks. Where you go to run laps. They sand it once a year, and
hose it down occasionally. US battleships had four inch teak decks.
Also unfinished.

Casady


I'll keep that in mind when I go shopping for a cruise ship or battleship.


--
I am only one, but I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can do
something. And because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do
the something that I can do. What I can do, I should do. And what I
should do, by the grace of God, I will do.

— Edward Everett Hale (1822-1909)

Watching boats in chop
 

Richard Casady wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Casady


The underside of Formica is made up of kraft paper infused with resin.

According to the Formica web site, the product is composed of
"melamine-impregnated decorative surface paper combined with
phenolic-treated kraft paper and consolidated
in a press at high pressures."

I have Formica in mind.



--
I am only one, but I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can do
something. And because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do
the something that I can do. What I can do, I should do. And what I
should do, by the grace of God, I will do.

— Edward Everett Hale (1822-1909)

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:41:09 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Heck, I thought you googled it, but I guess not. I just did and found
plenty of references to paper, but "resin impregnated paper."
Don't think it matters, but I'm not a materials expert.
I did find that Nordhavn offers formica cladding on the interior
though. Link is too long, but you can google
"RETAIL SPECIFICATIONS - NORDHAVN 57 HULL "

wherein"

"note: If preferred, at time of order, bulkheads, cabinetry and
countertops can be specified in Formica"

--Vic

Watching boats in chop
 

Vic Smith wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:41:09 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.
I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Heck, I thought you googled it, but I guess not. I just did and found
plenty of references to paper, but "resin impregnated paper."
Don't think it matters, but I'm not a materials expert.
I did find that Nordhavn offers formica cladding on the interior
though. Link is too long, but you can google
"RETAIL SPECIFICATIONS - NORDHAVN 57 HULL "

wherein"

"note: If preferred, at time of order, bulkheads, cabinetry and
countertops can be specified in Formica"

--Vic


I don't know what Nordhavn uses, but there are several grades and
thicknesses of Formica, including one that is more "plasticy" than "papery."




--
I am only one, but I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can do
something. And because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do
the something that I can do. What I can do, I should do. And what I
should do, by the grace of God, I will do.

— Edward Everett Hale (1822-1909)

Watching boats in chop
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 13:52:05 -0700 (PDT), JimH
wrote:

There was a 60 some foot GB docked alongside the Yacht Club on the
River this weekend. Looked like a planked teak transom on a
fiberglass hull.

What river is that? We live just off the Caloosahatchie in SWFL.

The teak (over fiberglass) transom is one of Grand Bank's most
recogniziable features. They look great when properly finished but
it's a lot of work to keep it up. Mine is about ready for another
re-do but we're in the middle of the rainy season here and ducking
hurricanes.


http://www.eisboch.com/transomname.jpg

Eisboch

Watching boats in chop
 

"hk" wrote in message
. ..
Eisboch wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:

Which goes to show how subjective taste is. I've never liked teak on a
boat. On the exterior, I always preferred mahogany, the real stuff, not
the crap that is sold most often these days as mahogany. In a cabin, I
pretty cherry or oak.


I guess the boys over at American Marine Ltd. never got your memo.


Eisboch





If someone gave me one of their barges, I would sell it in a New York
minute.


Really? Not me. ....

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...leryMain03.jpg

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...kplanStdMd.jpg

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...leryMain05.jpg

Eisboch

Watching boats in chop
 

"Richard Casady" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:


All the cruise ships seem to have three inch thick unfinished teak
weather decks. Where you go to run laps. They sand it once a year, and
hose it down occasionally. US battleships had four inch teak decks.
Also unfinished.

Casady


Harry doesn't do cruise ships or battleships.

He prefers mahogany, you see.

Eisboch

Watching boats in chop
 

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"hk" wrote in message
. ..
Eisboch wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:

Which goes to show how subjective taste is. I've never liked teak on a
boat. On the exterior, I always preferred mahogany, the real stuff,
not
the crap that is sold most often these days as mahogany. In a cabin, I
pretty cherry or oak.


I guess the boys over at American Marine Ltd. never got your memo.


Eisboch





If someone gave me one of their barges, I would sell it in a New York
minute.


Really? Not me. ....

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...leryMain03.jpg

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...kplanStdMd.jpg

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...leryMain05.jpg

Eisboch


Ahhh....floating RVs. 8)

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:46:03 -0400, hk wrote:

If someone gave me one of their barges, I would sell it in a New York
minute.

You would not.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:41:09 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Casady

No, he's correct. Formica is simply paper or cloth laminated using
melamine as the binder and topcoat. Melamine is also used as a finish
on very cheap kitchen cabinets and "assemble yourself" furniture.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:15:49 -0400, hk wrote:

Vic Smith wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:41:09 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.
I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Heck, I thought you googled it, but I guess not. I just did and found
plenty of references to paper, but "resin impregnated paper."
Don't think it matters, but I'm not a materials expert.
I did find that Nordhavn offers formica cladding on the interior
though. Link is too long, but you can google
"RETAIL SPECIFICATIONS - NORDHAVN 57 HULL "

wherein"

"note: If preferred, at time of order, bulkheads, cabinetry and
countertops can be specified in Formica"

--Vic


I don't know what Nordhavn uses, but there are several grades and
thicknesses of Formica, including one that is more "plasticy" than "papery."

It's not great for use in boats because after awhile it gets moldy and
smelly.

Watching boats in chop
 

"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:41:09 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Heck, I thought you googled it, but I guess not. I just did and found
plenty of references to paper, but "resin impregnated paper."
Don't think it matters, but I'm not a materials expert.
I did find that Nordhavn offers formica cladding on the interior
though. Link is too long, but you can google
"RETAIL SPECIFICATIONS - NORDHAVN 57 HULL "

wherein"

"note: If preferred, at time of order, bulkheads, cabinetry and
countertops can be specified in Formica"

--Vic


I think there's a big difference between "paper backed" and "resin
impregnated paper".

I've seen many older boats with Formica countertops and tables. They may be
nicked and scratched, but
otherwise don't show any unusual wear or aging just because they are on a
boat.

Not for the weatherdecks, for sure, but inside seems fine.



BTW ..... speaking of countertops .... I read recently that the use of
granite counters in homes is being questioned.
Granite's popularity has caused increased Radon readings in new and
renovated kitchens that have granite counters.

Eisboch

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:15:49 -0400, hk wrote:



I don't know what Nordhavn uses, but there are several grades and
thicknesses of Formica, including one that is more "plasticy" than "papery."

I wish the Carolina Skiffs would go to a plain white interior instead
of that speckled/mottled finish. Some like it because it supposedly
"hides" stains.
To me, the finish just looks a bunch of "stains."
Rather make my own stains, and know when I'm making them.

--Vic

Watching boats in chop
 

"hk" wrote in message
. ..
Vic Smith wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:41:09 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.
I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.
Heck, I thought you googled it, but I guess not. I just did and found
plenty of references to paper, but "resin impregnated paper."
Don't think it matters, but I'm not a materials expert.
I did find that Nordhavn offers formica cladding on the interior
though. Link is too long, but you can google
"RETAIL SPECIFICATIONS - NORDHAVN 57 HULL "

wherein"

"note: If preferred, at time of order, bulkheads, cabinetry and
countertops can be specified in Formica"

--Vic


I don't know what Nordhavn uses, but there are several grades and
thicknesses of Formica, including one that is more "plasticy" than
"papery."


I spent 2 days at their Cinci HQ's that included a detailed review of
production processes and a detailed walk through of the laminating plant on
site.

Needless to say............you guys are both wrong and should just drop it.

Watching boats in chop
 

Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
...

Not entirely true. Been on a couple of Lindblad's cruises, considering
another for next year. We like the smaller ships.


Will you share some of your experiences and recommendations, based on the
two that you have been on?
I have absolutely no desire to take a typical, conventional cruise vacation
to the Bahamas or similar, but something like this may be interesting.

Eisboch



What? In this snake pit? No thanks. This forum is for throwaway posts
only. We took a 14-day cruise through the Greek Isles, and some years
later, another 14-day trip through the British and Irish Isles. We'd
both like to see Alaska, and might do it next year.

Watching boats in chop
 

Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..
Eisboch wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:

Which goes to show how subjective taste is. I've never liked teak on a
boat. On the exterior, I always preferred mahogany, the real stuff, not
the crap that is sold most often these days as mahogany. In a cabin, I
pretty cherry or oak.

I guess the boys over at American Marine Ltd. never got your memo.


Eisboch




If someone gave me one of their barges, I would sell it in a New York
minute.


Really? Not me. ....

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...leryMain03.jpg

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...kplanStdMd.jpg

http://www.grandbanks.com/images/yac...leryMain05.jpg

Eisboch



Damn nice looking floating RV's. I would take one if it had a cherry
interior.

Watching boats in chop
 

Eisboch wrote:
"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:41:09 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.
I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Heck, I thought you googled it, but I guess not. I just did and found
plenty of references to paper, but "resin impregnated paper."
Don't think it matters, but I'm not a materials expert.
I did find that Nordhavn offers formica cladding on the interior
though. Link is too long, but you can google
"RETAIL SPECIFICATIONS - NORDHAVN 57 HULL "

wherein"

"note: If preferred, at time of order, bulkheads, cabinetry and
countertops can be specified in Formica"

--Vic


I think there's a big difference between "paper backed" and "resin
impregnated paper".

I've seen many older boats with Formica countertops and tables. They may be
nicked and scratched, but
otherwise don't show any unusual wear or aging just because they are on a
boat.

Not for the weatherdecks, for sure, but inside seems fine.



BTW ..... speaking of countertops .... I read recently that the use of
granite counters in homes is being questioned.
Granite's popularity has caused increased Radon readings in new and
renovated kitchens that have granite counters.

Eisboch



I am not sure, but don't they make Parker boats out of resin impregnated
cloth?

Watching boats in chop
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:

Which goes to show how subjective taste is. I've never liked teak on a
boat. On the exterior, I always preferred mahogany, the real stuff, not
the crap that is sold most often these days as mahogany. In a cabin, I
pretty cherry or oak.

Mahogany and teak actually look a lot alike when properly finished
with a good varnish but teak is much more durable.


Real Mahogany, not the Philippine Mahogany, does not look like teak.
Actually I think it looks a lot nicer. But, teak is much more durable. My
mothers home is paneled in real Mahogany and when the ceiling dripped, the
wood took a lot more to get it nice looking than teak would of. Her house
was built in 1908, when you could get large sheets of mahogany paneling.

Watching boats in chop
 

"Richard Casady" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:

JimH wrote:
On Aug 18, 12:30 am, Wayne.B wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 19:30:21 -0400, hk wrote:
Parker's solid fir plywood stringer system continues to give
customers the strongest, toughest and safest fiberglass boats built.
~~ snerk~~
Plywood stringers indeed. At least they're not chip board.
Parker and Grady use the same XL ply stringer material, as do many
other
manufacturers of top-quality boats. What are the stringers made of in
your floating RV?
Probably solid teak, everything else is.


There was a 60 some foot GB docked alongside the Yacht Club on the
River this weekend. Looked like a planked teak transom on a
fiberglass hull.

Nice looking boat.


Which goes to show how subjective taste is. I've never liked teak on a
boat. On the exterior, I always preferred mahogany, the real stuff, not
the crap that is sold most often these days as mahogany. In a cabin, I
pretty cherry or oak.

All the cruise ships seem to have three inch thick unfinished teak
weather decks. Where you go to run laps. They sand it once a year, and
hose it down occasionally. US battleships had four inch teak decks.
Also unfinished.

Casady

Not all battleships still have teak decks. To expensive. Friend redid the
deck of the Iowa in, I think, Sitka Spruce. Was not teak.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 21:58:03 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

Speaking of that, you gonig to head out and tie off between a couple
of deadmen? :)

I loved that story.

That was Hurricane Charlie 4 years ago. We'd only owned the boat for
about 6 weeks and had no permanent dock of our own at the time. They
bumped up the forecast to Cat 3+ with about 24 hours to go and we
decided to high tail it up river as far inland as we could get.

This one is much different, looks like it will not even make full
hurricane strength.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

Don't tell that to Bertram. They've been using it on interiors for
years and it holds up very well.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 20:28:35 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:

Not all battleships still have teak decks. To expensive. Friend redid the
deck of the Iowa in, I think, Sitka Spruce. Was not teak.

Sitka spruce has about the best strength to weight of any wood. They
use it for things like main spars for aircraft. Not to mention masts,
booms, gaffs, and so on. It isn't either cheap or especially good as
decking. Teak may be costly, but an ash baseball bat costs a hundred
bucks. A major league grade glove is only about one sixty. Go figure.

Casady

Watching boats in chop
 

Wayne.B wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

Don't tell that to Bertram. They've been using it on interiors for
years and it holds up very well.


So? Oh, I get it...because some corporation, the latest of many, that
bought out the Bertram name uses it, I should want it, too. Baaaaa,
baaaaa, baaaaa.



--
I am only one, but I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can do
something. And because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do
the something that I can do. What I can do, I should do. And what I
should do, by the grace of God, I will do.

— Edward Everett Hale (1822-1909)

Watching boats in chop
 

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 10:13:15 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:46:16 -0400, wrote:

I don't know what Nordhavn uses, but there are several grades and
thicknesses of Formica, including one that is more "plasticy" than "papery."

It's not great for use in boats because after awhile it gets moldy and
smelly.

Go look at a 20 year old Bertram that has been well maintained.

Formica in a moist environment eventually stinks. Maintenance has
nothing to do with it, as there is no "maintenance" for formica other
than cleaning the top surface.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 06:36:40 -0400, hk wrote:

So? Oh, I get it...because some corporation, the latest of many, that
bought out the Bertram name uses it, I should want it, too. Baaaaa,
baaaaa, baaaaa.

WAFA

Bertram was using it 30 years ago. It still looks good on well
maintained boats.

You are such a jerk.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 10:04:58 -0400, hk wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 09:44:15 -0400, hk wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 06:33:31 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Aug 18, 5:47 pm, hk wrote:
Vic Smith wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 16:15:32 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:
Which goes to show how subjective taste is. I've never liked teak on a
boat. On the exterior, I always preferred mahogany, the real stuff, not
the crap that is sold most often these days as mahogany. In a cabin, I
pretty cherry or oak.
After maintaining hardwoods for many years, when I see a beautifully
finished grain I think.......can I get this in a non-scratch plastic?
Yep, taste is subjective, and changing.
That was wrong actually. I wouldn't get a wood grain in plastic.
I like "light" which might be because my eyes aren't as good as they
once were. Besides the maintenance issues, dark woods don't
lend themselves to bright atmospheres, which is my preference now.
Think formica. Or whatever.
--Vic
Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper.
Bull****.
The paper is soaked with resins, therefore paper is never in contact
with anything.
Also, you are lumping Formica with all laminates, idiot.
The fact that the paper in formica absorbs moisture and begins to
smell over time in a marine environment is well known. It's a smell
that you cannot get rid of unless you get rid of the formica.



While I knew the composition of Formica previously, I got some of the
quotes regarding the product (the part about paper) right off the
Formica site. In fact, I thought I put those quotes in quotes and
mentioned the Formica site. I'm not sure what it is loogy is trying to
argue, but I had that same problem with most of his posts, when I
bothered to read them. The boy is drain-bamaged.

One of my "hobbies" is building guitars. For a while in the 80's, it
was all the rage to use phenolic for fretboards. It looked like ebony,
was very strong and stable, and was touted as the "lifetime fretboard
material". It was likewise, made from paper and resin, but used
phenolic resin, and was much thicker than formica countertops. The
color was not just on the surface, either.

The phone company used a lot of phenolic laminate for switch gear.


Is that the stuff that used to be called "bakelite"?

cousins

Watching boats in chop
 

Watching boats in chop
 

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 10:13:15 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:46:16 -0400, wrote:

I don't know what Nordhavn uses, but there are several grades and
thicknesses of Formica, including one that is more "plasticy" than "papery."

It's not great for use in boats because after awhile it gets moldy and
smelly.

Go look at a 20 year old Bertram that has been well maintained.

Lots of things on a boat foster mold more readily than formica,
including wood. I've read mold can even etch the glass of binoculars.
But if something stinks, hey, blame the formica.

--Vic

Watching boats in chop
 

Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 06:36:40 -0400, hk wrote:

So? Oh, I get it...because some corporation, the latest of many, that
bought out the Bertram name uses it, I should want it, too. Baaaaa,
baaaaa, baaaaa.

WAFA

Bertram was using it 30 years ago. It still looks good on well
maintained boats.

You are such a jerk.


What's your point here, W'hine, that *I* should like Formica as an
interior material on boats because you and Bertram like it?

Told you, I don't like the material on boats. I prefer real wood trim
and paneling, not Formica.




--
I am only one, but I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can do
something. And because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do
the something that I can do. What I can do, I should do. And what I
should do, by the grace of God, I will do.

— Edward Everett Hale (1822-1909)

Watching boats in chop
 

"hk" wrote in message
. ..


What's your point here, W'hine, that *I* should like Formica as an
interior material on boats because you and Bertram like it?

Told you, I don't like the material on boats. I prefer real wood trim and
paneling, not Formica.




Then you would *really* like his GB.

Eisboch

Watching boats in chop
 

Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..
What's your point here, W'hine, that *I* should like Formica as an
interior material on boats because you and Bertram like it?

Told you, I don't like the material on boats. I prefer real wood trim and
paneling, not Formica.




Then you would *really* like his GB.

Eisboch


Actually, no. Too big. You guys act as if I have never seen a GB or
been aboard one. There are lots of them here on the Bay, and I've been
aboard several over the years. I simply don't like the larger ones. I do
like the one you had, though...the smaller one.


--
I am only one, but I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can do
something. And because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do
the something that I can do. What I can do, I should do. And what I
should do, by the grace of God, I will do.

— Edward Everett Hale (1822-1909)

Watching boats in chop
 

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:07:37 -0400, hk wrote:

Richard Casady wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Casady


The underside of Formica is made up of kraft paper infused with resin.

According to the Formica web site, the product is composed of
"melamine-impregnated decorative surface paper combined with
phenolic-treated kraft paper and consolidated
in a press at high pressures."

I have Formica in mind.

OK. The paper wasn't evident when I sawed, drilled etc the stuff. I
believe you when you say the paper is there, but I never noticed.

Casady

Watching boats in chop
 

Richard Casady wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:07:37 -0400, hk wrote:

Richard Casady wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:47:06 -0400, hk wrote:

Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper. It's certainly ok for
a kitchen, but on a boat, I'd want something not paper-backed.

I have been sawing, drilling, sanding, grinding Formica for more than
fifty years and I have never seen a hint of any paper. You must have
another product in mind.

Casady

The underside of Formica is made up of kraft paper infused with resin.

According to the Formica web site, the product is composed of
"melamine-impregnated decorative surface paper combined with
phenolic-treated kraft paper and consolidated
in a press at high pressures."

I have Formica in mind.

OK. The paper wasn't evident when I sawed, drilled etc the stuff. I
believe you when you say the paper is there, but I never noticed.

Casady


Note that I am not knocking Formica. It's a good product, and useful. I
just don't like it on boats.



--
I am only one, but I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can do
something. And because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do
the something that I can do. What I can do, I should do. And what I
should do, by the grace of God, I will do.

— Edward Everett Hale (1822-1909)

Watching boats in chop
 

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 09:44:46 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

Lots of things on a boat foster mold more readily than formica,
including wood. I've read mold can even etch the glass of binoculars.
But if something stinks, hey, blame the formica.

Exactly. Laminate/formica that is kept clean and dry does not develop
mold. That is what I call good maintenance.

*Anything* that accumulates dirt in a moist environment will mold
however.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 11:02:38 -0400, hk wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..
What's your point here, W'hine, that *I* should like Formica as an
interior material on boats because you and Bertram like it?

Told you, I don't like the material on boats. I prefer real wood trim and
paneling, not Formica.




Then you would *really* like his GB.

Eisboch


Actually, no. Too big. You guys act as if I have never seen a GB or
been aboard one. There are lots of them here on the Bay, and I've been
aboard several over the years. I simply don't like the larger ones. I do
like the one you had, though...the smaller one.

You're right Harry, it is too big, barely fits on the 54 ft dock in
front of the house and quite a struggle to trailer it.

I'd much prefer your Parker. Not the big one, the little one you have
now. It would make a really good tender for a properly sized GB.

Watching boats in chop
 

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 11:59:00 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 09:44:46 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

Lots of things on a boat foster mold more readily than formica,
including wood. I've read mold can even etch the glass of binoculars.
But if something stinks, hey, blame the formica.

Exactly. Laminate/formica that is kept clean and dry does not develop
mold. That is what I call good maintenance.

*Anything* that accumulates dirt in a moist environment will mold
however.

Exactly how do you prevent water absorption within the Formica by
"maintenance, Wayne? It draws this moisture out of the air, not from
your spilled beer, and not through the top surface.

Watching boats in chop
 

"Richard Casady" wrote in message
...


Is that the stuff that used to be called "bakelite"?

No. While bakelite is phenolic, it is homogenous. not laminated. There
is phenolic and cloth, called micarta. Makes good knife and pistol
handles. It has been used for circuit boards. You can mount relays on
it.

Casady

What is the stuff the old tube sockets were made of? I always thought it
was Bakelite.

Eisboch

Watching boats in chop
 

Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 11:02:38 -0400, hk wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..
What's your point here, W'hine, that *I* should like Formica as an
interior material on boats because you and Bertram like it?

Told you, I don't like the material on boats. I prefer real wood trim and
paneling, not Formica.



Then you would *really* like his GB.

Eisboch


Actually, no. Too big. You guys act as if I have never seen a GB or
been aboard one. There are lots of them here on the Bay, and I've been
aboard several over the years. I simply don't like the larger ones. I do
like the one you had, though...the smaller one.

You're right Harry, it is too big, barely fits on the 54 ft dock in
front of the house and quite a struggle to trailer it.

I'd much prefer your Parker. Not the big one, the little one you have
now. It would make a really good tender for a properly sized GB.


We have the watercraft we want at the moment.

W'hine, I'm not impressed by your boat, your dock, your canal, or what
looks like eifs-sheathed houses across the canal. I'm least impressed by
you.

I find it funny you constantly try to insult me because of the size of
my Parker, and the fact that your GB is larger. Your incessant harping
on that subject tells me a truth about the two of us: my dick is larger
than yours and harder, and I don't need a 49' long RV to convince myself
of it.

Maybe if you had a younger wife, you could deal with having a smaller
boat, eh?

:)

Watching boats in chop
 

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 10:04:58 -0400, hk wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 09:44:15 -0400, hk wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 06:33:31 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Aug 18, 5:47 pm, hk wrote:
Vic Smith wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 16:15:32 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:02:11 -0400, hk wrote:
Which goes to show how subjective taste is. I've never liked teak on a
boat. On the exterior, I always preferred mahogany, the real stuff, not
the crap that is sold most often these days as mahogany. In a cabin, I
pretty cherry or oak.
After maintaining hardwoods for many years, when I see a beautifully
finished grain I think.......can I get this in a non-scratch plastic?
Yep, taste is subjective, and changing.
That was wrong actually. I wouldn't get a wood grain in plastic.
I like "light" which might be because my eyes aren't as good as they
once were. Besides the maintenance issues, dark woods don't
lend themselves to bright atmospheres, which is my preference now.
Think formica. Or whatever.
--Vic
Formica is just a plasticized coating over paper.
Bull****.
The paper is soaked with resins, therefore paper is never in contact
with anything.
Also, you are lumping Formica with all laminates, idiot.
The fact that the paper in formica absorbs moisture and begins to
smell over time in a marine environment is well known. It's a smell
that you cannot get rid of unless you get rid of the formica.



While I knew the composition of Formica previously, I got some of the
quotes regarding the product (the part about paper) right off the
Formica site. In fact, I thought I put those quotes in quotes and
mentioned the Formica site. I'm not sure what it is loogy is trying to
argue, but I had that same problem with most of his posts, when I
bothered to read them. The boy is drain-bamaged.

One of my "hobbies" is building guitars. For a while in the 80's, it
was all the rage to use phenolic for fretboards. It looked like ebony,
was very strong and stable, and was touted as the "lifetime fretboard
material". It was likewise, made from paper and resin, but used
phenolic resin, and was much thicker than formica countertops. The
color was not just on the surface, either.

The phone company used a lot of phenolic laminate for switch gear.


Is that the stuff that used to be called "bakelite"?

No. While bakelite is phenolic, it is homogenous. not laminated. There
is phenolic and cloth, called micarta. Makes good knife and pistol
handles. It has been used for circuit boards. You can mount relays on
it.

Casady