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Canuck57 March 2nd 08 03:36 AM

Your President At Work
 

"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.



Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians, current
or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch


I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair, that
and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting on big
oil boards.


Try putting some value to the greenback would be more like it.

Jump interest rates to 15% to attract investment. Make the banks/owners
honor the sub-prime or fold. Big government prints money and bail outs are
just screwing the value of the USD on the world markets.

Say for example the USD currency was not so diluted by debt bail outs and so
forth, and 1/2 the dollars out there were not printed. The remaining
dollars would be twice as much and the cost of gasoline would go down to 1/2
of what it is. Or about $50 USD per barrel.

This problem of oil is a born in the USA issue, pure and simple. And if not
fixed, count on a big flush.




Short Wave Sportfishing March 2nd 08 03:36 AM

Your President At Work
 
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 21:48:00 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 20:25:28 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:



I don't know about that. There's nothing on the horizon to influence it
that way. I'd like to hear your reasoning.


It's pretty simple - it's a huge commodity bubble. There is absoutely
nothing, and I mean nothing, to support these levels in any sense of
the word. It's too much money chasing too little profit - a sort of
currency inflation if you will. If I'm right, and I'm pretty sure I
am, economic data will provide the catalyst for the crash - sometime
around the middle to the end of July.


Hmmmmm..... It sounds like you are basically in agreement with Doug.
Did hell just freeze over?


Well, obviously - six inches of snow last night and no open water
anywhere. :)

I'd add this - out of control information flow is also a function of
this - anything will move the market. If somebody sneezes in Nigeria,
another $.50 to $1. Fog in the Houston shipping channel - another
$.50 to a $1. And it happens more and more often - issues that
wouldn't have affected the price 10 years ago, now can cause 1-2%
changes in price instantly.

There is also the self-fullfilling prophecy aspect of this - goals are
set by people who have a vested interest making sure it happens and
the market does it's best to meet it.

That is classically a bubble - no other way around it.

And as fast as it went up, it will be faster coming down.

Canuck57 March 2nd 08 03:43 AM

Your President At Work
 

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.


Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians, current
or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch



I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair, that
and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting on big
oil boards.


How will that affect the price of a barrel of oil here? Or in Japan? or
in China? or in Sweden? or in Great Britain? or in Germany? or Italy?

Eisboch


Tax would just be passed onto the consumer, the US average Joe filling up to
go to work.

Companies could not pass that tax on abroad for very long, making the US
company less competitive.

Gasoline has not increase in those countries you mentioned like it has in
the US.

The real answer is to get the Fed currency management on a tight leash.



Canuck57 March 2nd 08 03:45 AM

Your President At Work
 

"HK" wrote in message
...
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.

Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians, current
or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch

I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair,
that and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting
on big oil boards.



Excess profits in what terms? Straight dollars, or percentage? It really
wouldn't matter. Unlike the vast majority of businesses, crude oil is
priced by a gambling parlor. Even if you (and I mean YOU specifically)
could somehow control the profits of the oil companies, they still have
to buy crude at prices determined by sheer lunacy.


"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it doesn't
have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?


So if you (and millions of others) buy less, they need to buy less and the
prices fall.



Canuck57 March 2nd 08 03:46 AM

Your President At Work
 

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"HK" wrote in message
...
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.

Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians,
current or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch

I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair,
that and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting
on big oil boards.


Excess profits in what terms? Straight dollars, or percentage? It really
wouldn't matter. Unlike the vast majority of businesses, crude oil is
priced by a gambling parlor. Even if you (and I mean YOU specifically)
could somehow control the profits of the oil companies, they still have
to buy crude at prices determined by sheer lunacy.



"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it doesn't
have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?


Is that why we never see much of Cheney? Is he too busy attending OPEC
committee meetings, encouraging them to increase the price of oil?

Eisboch


Big government does like higher oil prices, bigger tax revenue when indexed
on the price as a percentage.



Canuck57 March 2nd 08 03:49 AM

Your President At Work
 

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...


"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it
doesn't have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?


I'm sure they do. But, there are also speculators at work, in the
exact same way speculators dick with the price of stocks to the point
where their prices are completely disconnected from physical &
financial reality.

Speculative nonsense:


Think back. Although laughable when compared to current values, the
price of oil quadrupled during the oil "shortage" crisis in the early
70's on Nixon's watch. Later that decade, under Carter it doubled
again in less than 12 months.

Neither had anything to do with Wall Street, Dick Cheney or secret "Big
Oil" meetings with OPEC.

Eisboch



That was then. This is now. And (separate issue), in this discussion,
I'm not concerned with any particular politician.

In the long list of things you buy regularly, can you think of 5 or 6
whose prices are determined by speculators, causing almost daily price
swings? I'm in the grocery biz, and I handle about 500 different
products. I don't see this happening.

How about shoes, or anything else you buy?


I am on a conservation kick. I go barefoot.

Seriously, at 100 bucks or so a barrel, I don't see daily price swings of
a few dollars per barrel as being very significant.
There's something more than speculators causing prices to more than
double in two years. I admit, I don't fully understand how oil prices
are "set" despite JimH's links. Seems to me that those who control the
goods determine the price.

Eisboch


It's all the factors working together. Demand is part of it, but not all
of it. The problem is that people will gamble on absolutely anything. If
we added chick pea futures to the other available via the commodities
exchanges, people would be gambling on chick peas.


And if they are wrong, they lose their shirts.

Supply and demand eventually wins.



Canuck57 March 2nd 08 03:50 AM

Your President At Work
 

"JimH" wrote in message
...

"Canuck57" wrote in message
news:4Jmyj.31064$w94.3216@pd7urf2no...

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:32:58 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

Everyone says 4 dollars... I will throw my prediction in, I think we
will test 5 dollars a gallon before the end of the year.

I'll take that bet. I'll say that gas will be back at $2.34/gal by
the end of the year.

And oil will be down around $60/bl.


What do you base that on?

Fantasy what?

If I knew you, I would gave you 3:1 odds against and an $10,000 wager you
are wrong.


I would up the odds to 4::1 on $100,000.

There is no way oil will drop to $60/barrel and gasoline drop to $2.34 by
the end of 2008, Presidential election year or not.

This series of posts is a keeper. ;-)


Hey, I was trying to make money on an almost assured bet, you undercut
me....

Will do 5:1?



Canuck57 March 2nd 08 03:58 AM

Your President At Work
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...

Supplies will rise due to decreased demand. Take this past week for
example - crude stocks are at six year highs and gas is at a four year
high - distilates are at normal levels - and every one of them
experienced a increase in price.

It's just not logical, sustainable or in any way makeing economic
sense. And when it doesn't make economic sense, it's a bubble.


Not really a bubble at all.

Say 1 barrel was worth one Kazoo dollar. The USD was worth $75 Kazoo
dollars.

The next day you woke up, the USD devalues by 33%, now takes $100 USD to by
$1 Kazoo. Still, $1 Kazoo per barrel.

That is what is happening for the most part. It isn't oil that is nuts, it
is the value, or lack of value in the currency. Hard to hear, but is what
is happening.

Look to monetary policy by the US Fed and congress. If I was a US citizen,
I wouldn't vote for my congress person.



Don White March 2nd 08 04:11 AM

Your President At Work
 

wrote in message
...
On Mar 1, 8:13 pm, Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 16:50:23 -0800 (PST),





wrote:
On Mar 1, 7:41 pm, "Canuck57" wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
messagenews:38sjs3h82ded28g7gqgm79uq7djnd2ag6e@4ax .com...


On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:32:58 -0800 (PST),
wrote:


Everyone says 4 dollars... I will throw my prediction in, I think we
will test 5 dollars a gallon before the end of the year.


I'll take that bet. I'll say that gas will be back at $2.34/gal by
the end of the year.


And oil will be down around $60/bl.


What do you base that on?


Fantasy what?


If I knew you, I would gave you 3:1 odds against and an $10,000 wager
you
are wrong.


Holy crap, I was just going to bet him and the loser has to answer the
drunken dougies questions for a week;)


For you and you only.

If oil doesn't drop to around - say plus 5/minus4 - $60 by the end of
the year, *I will give you that boat I told you about a month or so
ago*.

There - right out in public. :)- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Holy crap, bookmarked.....;)


What the 'ell!
Hope he wasn't talking about some 8' dinghy.



Don White March 2nd 08 04:14 AM

Your President At Work
 

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"HK" wrote in message
...
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.

Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians,
current or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch

I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair,
that and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting
on big oil boards.


Excess profits in what terms? Straight dollars, or percentage? It really
wouldn't matter. Unlike the vast majority of businesses, crude oil is
priced by a gambling parlor. Even if you (and I mean YOU specifically)
could somehow control the profits of the oil companies, they still have
to buy crude at prices determined by sheer lunacy.



"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it doesn't
have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?


Is that why we never see much of Cheney? Is he too busy attending OPEC
committee meetings, encouraging them to increase the price of oil?

Eisboch


Speaking of that...do you still have a vice president down there? We never
hear of him up this way.



BAR March 2nd 08 04:46 AM

Your President At Work
 
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"John H." wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:23:44 -0500, HK wrote:

BAR wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- President Bush, saying he was unaware of
predictions of $4-a-gallon gasoline in the coming months, told
reporters Thursday that the best way to help Americans fend off
high
prices is for Congress to make his first-term tax cuts permanent.

...

Analysts have said that gasoline could reach $4 a gallon by this
spring, due to strong demand and a change in formulation, among
other reasons.

When taking the question about the $4 milestone, Bush told the
reporter, *"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that."*
Strong demand. What a crock of ****. Last spring, it was "on fears
of
renewed violence in Baghdad". Prices are effected by events in a
country from which we get pretty much zero oil?

Can somebody please explain to me why high oil prices is perceived as
a unique problem to the USA with Bush at the center of the cause?
Political blame for US election advantage.

The sad thing is that Bush leaves office as soon as the next President
is sworn in on 1/20/09. Why is everyone running against Bush?


The sad thing? There will be dancing in the streets when the IDIOT
heads
back to Crawford, or wherever he plans to go to take up his video
games,
booze, coke, and drunken driving.

Oh...it is the *failed* Bush-GOP policies against which the Dems will
run. Got it?
Harry, does your mother know you're telling lies about her?

You're still past tense.
--
John H


Back to bringing families into the foolishness here eh Johnny?
Time for an extended Goofy cruise..... from now until May would just
about do it.

Did you lazy son drink all of your beer again?


Speaking of idiots...........



I don't have a lazy son laying around my house, watching my TV, eating
my food and drinking my beer.


Tim March 2nd 08 05:32 AM

Your President At Work
 
On Mar 1, 9:46*pm, "Canuck57" wrote:
"Eisboch" wrote in message

...







"HK" wrote in message
...
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.


Sure he is Harry. *Sure he is.


The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians,
current or past.
The blame resides with us.


Eisboch


I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair,
that and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting
on big oil boards.


Excess profits in what terms? Straight dollars, or percentage? It really
wouldn't matter. Unlike the vast majority of businesses, crude oil is
priced by a gambling parlor. Even if you (and I mean YOU specifically)
could somehow control the profits of the oil companies, they still have
to buy crude at prices determined by sheer lunacy.


"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it doesn't
have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?


Is that why we never see much of Cheney? *Is he too busy attending OPEC
committee meetings, encouraging them to increase the price of oil?


Eisboch


Big government does like higher oil prices, bigger tax revenue when indexed
on the price as a percentage.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


No kidding!

Here a few years ago when pump gas jumped from about 1.35 to 2.35,
Gov. George Ryan put a stay on sales tax (6.25%) per gallon, andheld
it for about 6 mo. Does'n't sound like much, but when you consider the
big pic. it was a pretty good discount. Now comes our present
governor. Price jmps over the $3.00 mark and people were saying "Hey
guv. How about doing something with this gas sales tax?" The answer?
"Nah, we're leaving it on this time because we're broke!"

Errrr. OK so now the state is pulling in 6.75% per gal. on pump gas,
and the state has more money flowing in from motor fuels tax revenues
then they'd ever seen before. HUGE amounts! Like double what it was 10
years ago.

The gov. still says we're broke.

yeah.... r-r-r-r-ight!

John H.[_3_] March 2nd 08 12:13 PM

Your President At Work
 
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 21:09:02 -0500, HK wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.
Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians, current
or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch
I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair,
that and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting
on big oil boards.
How will that affect the price of a barrel of oil here? Or in Japan?
or in China? or in Sweden? or in Great Britain? or in Germany? or
Italy?

Eisboch
Oversight and pressure, and the excess profits tax could be used to help
non-profit entities unaffiliated with big oil develop alternative energy
sources.


Wistful thinking. Despite your protests, industry drives innovation and
technical development, not "non-profit" centers staffed with lifelong
members of academia making a living on government grants. I've been
exposed to both for many, many years.
Industry is what makes things happen and imposing more taxes on it simply
slows things down.

Eisboch




I see no reason to trust Big Oil, and I wasn't suggesting academia.


Harry, your original comment was pure, liberal, anti-Bush, stupid. But, it
did get Eisboch talking to you again, to tell you so. Therefore, it must
have been worthwhile.
--
John H

"All decisions are the result of binary thinking."

John H.[_3_] March 2nd 08 12:15 PM

Your President At Work
 
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 21:02:18 -0500, HK wrote:

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.

Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians, current
or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch

I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair, that
and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting on big
oil boards.



Excess profits in what terms? Straight dollars, or percentage? It really
wouldn't matter. Unlike the vast majority of businesses, crude oil is priced
by a gambling parlor. Even if you (and I mean YOU specifically) could
somehow control the profits of the oil companies, they still have to buy
crude at prices determined by sheer lunacy.




"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it doesn't
have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?


More of your stupid, liberal, anti-Bush ****.
--
John H

"All decisions are the result of binary thinking."

HK March 2nd 08 02:06 PM

Your President At Work
 
Don White wrote:
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.
Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians,
current or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch
I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair,
that and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting
on big oil boards.

Excess profits in what terms? Straight dollars, or percentage? It really
wouldn't matter. Unlike the vast majority of businesses, crude oil is
priced by a gambling parlor. Even if you (and I mean YOU specifically)
could somehow control the profits of the oil companies, they still have
to buy crude at prices determined by sheer lunacy.

"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it doesn't
have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?

Is that why we never see much of Cheney? Is he too busy attending OPEC
committee meetings, encouraging them to increase the price of oil?

Eisboch


Speaking of that...do you still have a vice president down there? We never
hear of him up this way.




He's in a halfway house, hopefully on his way to a "fullway" house. :)

Don White March 2nd 08 02:06 PM

Your President At Work
 

"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"John H." wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:23:44 -0500, HK wrote:

BAR wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- President Bush, saying he was unaware
of
predictions of $4-a-gallon gasoline in the coming months, told
reporters Thursday that the best way to help Americans fend off
high
prices is for Congress to make his first-term tax cuts permanent.

...

Analysts have said that gasoline could reach $4 a gallon by this
spring, due to strong demand and a change in formulation, among
other reasons.

When taking the question about the $4 milestone, Bush told the
reporter, *"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that."*
Strong demand. What a crock of ****. Last spring, it was "on fears
of
renewed violence in Baghdad". Prices are effected by events in a
country from which we get pretty much zero oil?

Can somebody please explain to me why high oil prices is perceived
as
a unique problem to the USA with Bush at the center of the cause?
Political blame for US election advantage.

The sad thing is that Bush leaves office as soon as the next
President
is sworn in on 1/20/09. Why is everyone running against Bush?


The sad thing? There will be dancing in the streets when the IDIOT
heads
back to Crawford, or wherever he plans to go to take up his video
games,
booze, coke, and drunken driving.

Oh...it is the *failed* Bush-GOP policies against which the Dems will
run. Got it?
Harry, does your mother know you're telling lies about her?

You're still past tense.
--
John H


Back to bringing families into the foolishness here eh Johnny?
Time for an extended Goofy cruise..... from now until May would just
about do it.
Did you lazy son drink all of your beer again?


Speaking of idiots...........


I don't have a lazy son laying around my house, watching my TV, eating my
food and drinking my beer.


Well.. believe it or not, looks like we have something in common.
The only thing my son does on your list is .. he eats most of his meals
here...... but since he pays 'room & board', I assume this is acceptable to
you?



HK March 2nd 08 02:09 PM

Your President At Work
 
John H. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 21:09:02 -0500, HK wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG OIL"
buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily two weeks
before the November elections.
Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians, current
or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch
I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a hair,
that and members representing the public and responsible to it sitting
on big oil boards.
How will that affect the price of a barrel of oil here? Or in Japan?
or in China? or in Sweden? or in Great Britain? or in Germany? or
Italy?

Eisboch
Oversight and pressure, and the excess profits tax could be used to help
non-profit entities unaffiliated with big oil develop alternative energy
sources.
Wistful thinking. Despite your protests, industry drives innovation and
technical development, not "non-profit" centers staffed with lifelong
members of academia making a living on government grants. I've been
exposed to both for many, many years.
Industry is what makes things happen and imposing more taxes on it simply
slows things down.

Eisboch



I see no reason to trust Big Oil, and I wasn't suggesting academia.


Harry, your original comment was pure, liberal, anti-Bush, stupid. But, it
did get Eisboch talking to you again, to tell you so. Therefore, it must
have been worthwhile.



You don't really think I give a damn about what your three crosswired
synapses produce, do you?

Short Wave Sportfishing March 2nd 08 02:10 PM

Your President At Work
 
On Sun, 02 Mar 2008 08:17:15 -0500, Gene Kearns
wrote:

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 17:43:56 -0500, Eisboch penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:


Nuclear power is the answer. Clean, safe and has been the center of our
solar system and of the universe for that matter, for billions of years.


That sounds more like an endorsement for solar power. Leave the
reactor on the sun where it belongs!


Luddite.

And I mean that in a most positive way.

Eisboch March 2nd 08 02:13 PM

Your President At Work
 

"Gene Kearns" wrote in message
...

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 17:43:56 -0500, Eisboch penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:


Nuclear power is the answer. Clean, safe and has been the center of our
solar system and of the universe for that matter, for billions of years.




That sounds more like an endorsement for solar power. Leave the
reactor on the sun where it belongs!



Wind and solar power are nice to dream about but unless you want to
radically change the way we live, (meaning going back to the early 1900's)
they simply are not practical yet, nor will they be for quite a while when
you compare them to nuclear generated power.

The largest wind generator (as of 2005) is an off-shore monster that
generates 5 mega watts of power.

http://www.reuk.co.uk/Worlds-Largest...-Generator.htm

The US currently has 104 operating nuclear plants that combined produce
almost 100,000 mega watts.
It would take about 20,000 of the wind monsters to equal that. Where are
they going to be situated?

Solar, although getting better, is still less efficient than wind.

Eisboch



Short Wave Sportfishing March 2nd 08 02:16 PM

Your President At Work
 
On Sun, 02 Mar 2008 08:19:55 -0500, Gene Kearns
wrote:

I didn't look at the links, but that is solvable with citing and
engineering refinements. When they installed a test farm here in the
mountains of NC, the low frequency created by the airfoils drove
people nuts.... even miles away and in the privacy of their home. I
think we have enough data, now, to design around such considerations.


You can cite them all you want, but I think a better option might be
siting - heh, heh,heh...

There are options other than nukes - I agree. And I think that solar
is one good option. I also think that wind is another option.
Geothermal is an option as is gravity generation (wave generators).

Having said that, you will still need capacity for back up and clean
coal plants cost as much, from an engineering/siting standpoint, as a
nuke which has more capacity and is more efficient.

BAR March 2nd 08 02:25 PM

Your President At Work
 
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"John H." wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:23:44 -0500, HK wrote:

BAR wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- President Bush, saying he was unaware
of
predictions of $4-a-gallon gasoline in the coming months, told
reporters Thursday that the best way to help Americans fend off
high
prices is for Congress to make his first-term tax cuts permanent.

...

Analysts have said that gasoline could reach $4 a gallon by this
spring, due to strong demand and a change in formulation, among
other reasons.

When taking the question about the $4 milestone, Bush told the
reporter, *"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that."*
Strong demand. What a crock of ****. Last spring, it was "on fears
of
renewed violence in Baghdad". Prices are effected by events in a
country from which we get pretty much zero oil?

Can somebody please explain to me why high oil prices is perceived
as
a unique problem to the USA with Bush at the center of the cause?
Political blame for US election advantage.

The sad thing is that Bush leaves office as soon as the next
President
is sworn in on 1/20/09. Why is everyone running against Bush?


The sad thing? There will be dancing in the streets when the IDIOT
heads
back to Crawford, or wherever he plans to go to take up his video
games,
booze, coke, and drunken driving.

Oh...it is the *failed* Bush-GOP policies against which the Dems will
run. Got it?
Harry, does your mother know you're telling lies about her?

You're still past tense.
--
John H

Back to bringing families into the foolishness here eh Johnny?
Time for an extended Goofy cruise..... from now until May would just
about do it.
Did you lazy son drink all of your beer again?

Speaking of idiots...........

I don't have a lazy son laying around my house, watching my TV, eating my
food and drinking my beer.


Well.. believe it or not, looks like we have something in common.
The only thing my son does on your list is .. he eats most of his meals
here...... but since he pays 'room & board', I assume this is acceptable to
you?


Any child over the age of 25 still living at home regardless of paying
rent or room and board should be pushed out the door. Your children need
to find their own way in life and they should be strongly encouraged to
do so. There are exceptions for physically or mentally disabled.





BAR March 2nd 08 02:26 PM

Your President At Work
 
HK wrote:
John H. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 21:09:02 -0500, HK wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG
OIL" buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily
two weeks before the November elections.
Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians,
current or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch
I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a
hair, that and members representing the public and responsible to
it sitting on big oil boards.
How will that affect the price of a barrel of oil here? Or in
Japan? or in China? or in Sweden? or in Great Britain? or in
Germany? or Italy?

Eisboch
Oversight and pressure, and the excess profits tax could be used to
help non-profit entities unaffiliated with big oil develop
alternative energy sources.
Wistful thinking. Despite your protests, industry drives innovation
and technical development, not "non-profit" centers staffed with
lifelong members of academia making a living on government grants.
I've been exposed to both for many, many years.
Industry is what makes things happen and imposing more taxes on it
simply slows things down.

Eisboch


I see no reason to trust Big Oil, and I wasn't suggesting academia.


Harry, your original comment was pure, liberal, anti-Bush, stupid.
But, it
did get Eisboch talking to you again, to tell you so. Therefore, it must
have been worthwhile.



You don't really think I give a damn about what your three crosswired
synapses produce, do you?


If you didn't care you wouldn't respond.

Short Wave Sportfishing March 2nd 08 02:28 PM

Your President At Work
 
On Sun, 02 Mar 2008 03:50:39 GMT, "Canuck57"
wrote:


"JimH" wrote in message
.. .

"Canuck57" wrote in message
news:4Jmyj.31064$w94.3216@pd7urf2no...

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:32:58 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

Everyone says 4 dollars... I will throw my prediction in, I think we
will test 5 dollars a gallon before the end of the year.

I'll take that bet. I'll say that gas will be back at $2.34/gal by
the end of the year.

And oil will be down around $60/bl.

What do you base that on?

Fantasy what?

If I knew you, I would gave you 3:1 odds against and an $10,000 wager you
are wrong.


I would up the odds to 4::1 on $100,000.

There is no way oil will drop to $60/barrel and gasoline drop to $2.34 by
the end of 2008, Presidential election year or not.

This series of posts is a keeper. ;-)


Hey, I was trying to make money on an almost assured bet, you undercut
me....

Will do 5:1?


We'll see who is right. :)

Don White March 2nd 08 02:35 PM

Your President At Work
 

"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"John H." wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:23:44 -0500, HK
wrote:

BAR wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- President Bush, saying he was
unaware of
predictions of $4-a-gallon gasoline in the coming months, told
reporters Thursday that the best way to help Americans fend off
high
prices is for Congress to make his first-term tax cuts
permanent.

...

Analysts have said that gasoline could reach $4 a gallon by
this
spring, due to strong demand and a change in formulation, among
other reasons.

When taking the question about the $4 milestone, Bush told the
reporter, *"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that."*
Strong demand. What a crock of ****. Last spring, it was "on
fears of
renewed violence in Baghdad". Prices are effected by events in a
country from which we get pretty much zero oil?

Can somebody please explain to me why high oil prices is
perceived as
a unique problem to the USA with Bush at the center of the cause?
Political blame for US election advantage.

The sad thing is that Bush leaves office as soon as the next
President
is sworn in on 1/20/09. Why is everyone running against Bush?


The sad thing? There will be dancing in the streets when the IDIOT
heads
back to Crawford, or wherever he plans to go to take up his video
games,
booze, coke, and drunken driving.

Oh...it is the *failed* Bush-GOP policies against which the Dems
will
run. Got it?
Harry, does your mother know you're telling lies about her?

You're still past tense.
--
John H

Back to bringing families into the foolishness here eh Johnny?
Time for an extended Goofy cruise..... from now until May would just
about do it.
Did you lazy son drink all of your beer again?

Speaking of idiots...........
I don't have a lazy son laying around my house, watching my TV, eating
my food and drinking my beer.


Well.. believe it or not, looks like we have something in common.
The only thing my son does on your list is .. he eats most of his meals
here...... but since he pays 'room & board', I assume this is acceptable
to you?


Any child over the age of 25 still living at home regardless of paying
rent or room and board should be pushed out the door. Your children need
to find their own way in life and they should be strongly encouraged to do
so. There are exceptions for physically or mentally disabled.



Is this Blurt, the pseudo Christian or Blurt, the pseudo marine talkin'?



Don White March 2nd 08 02:39 PM

Your President At Work
 

"HK" wrote in message
...



He's in a halfway house, hopefully on his way to a "fullway" house. :)



I wouldn't hold my breath...those %^%& politicians are slippery *******s.
We would love to nail a former prime minister ( Ronnie Reagan bum boy) up
here, but with his Conservative party currently in power....... he shucks &
jives with the best of them.



HK March 2nd 08 02:45 PM

Your President At Work
 
BAR wrote:
HK wrote:
John H. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 21:09:02 -0500, HK wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG
OIL" buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily
two weeks before the November elections.
Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians,
current or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch
I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a
hair, that and members representing the public and responsible
to it sitting on big oil boards.
How will that affect the price of a barrel of oil here? Or in
Japan? or in China? or in Sweden? or in Great Britain? or in
Germany? or Italy?

Eisboch
Oversight and pressure, and the excess profits tax could be used
to help non-profit entities unaffiliated with big oil develop
alternative energy sources.
Wistful thinking. Despite your protests, industry drives
innovation and technical development, not "non-profit" centers
staffed with lifelong members of academia making a living on
government grants. I've been exposed to both for many, many years.
Industry is what makes things happen and imposing more taxes on it
simply slows things down.

Eisboch


I see no reason to trust Big Oil, and I wasn't suggesting academia.

Harry, your original comment was pure, liberal, anti-Bush, stupid.
But, it
did get Eisboch talking to you again, to tell you so. Therefore, it must
have been worthwhile.



You don't really think I give a damn about what your three crosswired
synapses produce, do you?


If you didn't care you wouldn't respond.



You ought to consider putting a halt to your projecting, Blurt.

To me, the non-thinking, doctrinaire *far* righties like Herring, you,
and a couple of others here are just subjects for ridicule, certainly
not anyone to take seriously.

Why would I care what you think? What you think doesn't matter.

BAR March 2nd 08 02:55 PM

Your President At Work
 
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"John H." wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:23:44 -0500, HK
wrote:

BAR wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- President Bush, saying he was
unaware of
predictions of $4-a-gallon gasoline in the coming months, told
reporters Thursday that the best way to help Americans fend off
high
prices is for Congress to make his first-term tax cuts
permanent.

...

Analysts have said that gasoline could reach $4 a gallon by
this
spring, due to strong demand and a change in formulation, among
other reasons.

When taking the question about the $4 milestone, Bush told the
reporter, *"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that."*
Strong demand. What a crock of ****. Last spring, it was "on
fears of
renewed violence in Baghdad". Prices are effected by events in a
country from which we get pretty much zero oil?

Can somebody please explain to me why high oil prices is
perceived as
a unique problem to the USA with Bush at the center of the cause?
Political blame for US election advantage.

The sad thing is that Bush leaves office as soon as the next
President
is sworn in on 1/20/09. Why is everyone running against Bush?


The sad thing? There will be dancing in the streets when the IDIOT
heads
back to Crawford, or wherever he plans to go to take up his video
games,
booze, coke, and drunken driving.

Oh...it is the *failed* Bush-GOP policies against which the Dems
will
run. Got it?
Harry, does your mother know you're telling lies about her?

You're still past tense.
--
John H

Back to bringing families into the foolishness here eh Johnny?
Time for an extended Goofy cruise..... from now until May would just
about do it.
Did you lazy son drink all of your beer again?

Speaking of idiots...........
I don't have a lazy son laying around my house, watching my TV, eating
my food and drinking my beer.

Well.. believe it or not, looks like we have something in common.
The only thing my son does on your list is .. he eats most of his meals
here...... but since he pays 'room & board', I assume this is acceptable
to you?

Any child over the age of 25 still living at home regardless of paying
rent or room and board should be pushed out the door. Your children need
to find their own way in life and they should be strongly encouraged to do
so. There are exceptions for physically or mentally disabled.



Is this Blurt, the pseudo Christian or Blurt, the pseudo marine talkin'?



It is Mr. Blurt to you Don. I am a Christian. I am a former Marine. I am
proud of my life, what I have done so far and what I plan to do in the
future.

Loving your children does not require that you coddle them.

BAR March 2nd 08 02:57 PM

Your President At Work
 
Don White wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...

He's in a halfway house, hopefully on his way to a "fullway" house. :)



I wouldn't hold my breath...those %^%& politicians are slippery *******s.
We would love to nail a former prime minister ( Ronnie Reagan bum boy) up
here, but with his Conservative party currently in power....... he shucks &
jives with the best of them.



Have you stopped and taken a look at why the Conservative party is in
power? You can bitch about all you want but, a majority of your fellow
citizens disagree with you.


JoeSpareBedroom March 2nd 08 02:57 PM

Your President At Work
 
"Canuck57" wrote in message
news:Mspyj.32409$w94.4370@pd7urf2no...

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...


"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it
doesn't have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?


I'm sure they do. But, there are also speculators at work, in the
exact same way speculators dick with the price of stocks to the point
where their prices are completely disconnected from physical &
financial reality.

Speculative nonsense:


Think back. Although laughable when compared to current values, the
price of oil quadrupled during the oil "shortage" crisis in the early
70's on Nixon's watch. Later that decade, under Carter it doubled
again in less than 12 months.

Neither had anything to do with Wall Street, Dick Cheney or secret
"Big Oil" meetings with OPEC.

Eisboch



That was then. This is now. And (separate issue), in this discussion,
I'm not concerned with any particular politician.

In the long list of things you buy regularly, can you think of 5 or 6
whose prices are determined by speculators, causing almost daily price
swings? I'm in the grocery biz, and I handle about 500 different
products. I don't see this happening.

How about shoes, or anything else you buy?


I am on a conservation kick. I go barefoot.

Seriously, at 100 bucks or so a barrel, I don't see daily price swings
of a few dollars per barrel as being very significant.
There's something more than speculators causing prices to more than
double in two years. I admit, I don't fully understand how oil prices
are "set" despite JimH's links. Seems to me that those who control the
goods determine the price.

Eisboch


It's all the factors working together. Demand is part of it, but not all
of it. The problem is that people will gamble on absolutely anything. If
we added chick pea futures to the other available via the commodities
exchanges, people would be gambling on chick peas.


And if they are wrong, they lose their shirts.

Supply and demand eventually wins.


But someone always wins, no matter what happens to the speculators. That's a
multi-million dollar business, and it does not serve the best interests of
this country.



BAR March 2nd 08 02:59 PM

Your President At Work
 
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"Canuck57" wrote in message
news:Mspyj.32409$w94.4370@pd7urf2no...
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...

"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it
doesn't have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?

I'm sure they do. But, there are also speculators at work, in the
exact same way speculators dick with the price of stocks to the point
where their prices are completely disconnected from physical &
financial reality.

Speculative nonsense:

Think back. Although laughable when compared to current values, the
price of oil quadrupled during the oil "shortage" crisis in the early
70's on Nixon's watch. Later that decade, under Carter it doubled
again in less than 12 months.

Neither had anything to do with Wall Street, Dick Cheney or secret
"Big Oil" meetings with OPEC.

Eisboch


That was then. This is now. And (separate issue), in this discussion,
I'm not concerned with any particular politician.

In the long list of things you buy regularly, can you think of 5 or 6
whose prices are determined by speculators, causing almost daily price
swings? I'm in the grocery biz, and I handle about 500 different
products. I don't see this happening.

How about shoes, or anything else you buy?

I am on a conservation kick. I go barefoot.

Seriously, at 100 bucks or so a barrel, I don't see daily price swings
of a few dollars per barrel as being very significant.
There's something more than speculators causing prices to more than
double in two years. I admit, I don't fully understand how oil prices
are "set" despite JimH's links. Seems to me that those who control the
goods determine the price.

Eisboch

It's all the factors working together. Demand is part of it, but not all
of it. The problem is that people will gamble on absolutely anything. If
we added chick pea futures to the other available via the commodities
exchanges, people would be gambling on chick peas.

And if they are wrong, they lose their shirts.

Supply and demand eventually wins.


But someone always wins, no matter what happens to the speculators. That's a
multi-million dollar business, and it does not serve the best interests of
this country.



Why doesn't it serve the best interests of this country?


JoeSpareBedroom March 2nd 08 03:02 PM

Your President At Work
 
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 21:48:00 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
. ..

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 20:25:28 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:



I don't know about that. There's nothing on the horizon to influence
it
that way. I'd like to hear your reasoning.

It's pretty simple - it's a huge commodity bubble. There is absoutely
nothing, and I mean nothing, to support these levels in any sense of
the word. It's too much money chasing too little profit - a sort of
currency inflation if you will. If I'm right, and I'm pretty sure I
am, economic data will provide the catalyst for the crash - sometime
around the middle to the end of July.


Hmmmmm..... It sounds like you are basically in agreement with Doug.
Did hell just freeze over?


Well, obviously - six inches of snow last night and no open water
anywhere. :)

I'd add this - out of control information flow is also a function of
this - anything will move the market. If somebody sneezes in Nigeria,
another $.50 to $1. Fog in the Houston shipping channel - another
$.50 to a $1. And it happens more and more often - issues that
wouldn't have affected the price 10 years ago, now can cause 1-2%
changes in price instantly.



Bingo. And, it works in the exact same way as when irrelevant financial news
causes nervous old ladies to sell their Toyota stock because Kroger reported
a bad quarter.



JoeSpareBedroom March 2nd 08 03:03 PM

Your President At Work
 
"Gene Kearns" wrote in message
...

What other monies will be spent to clean
up after the coal?


What is there to clean up? Modern scrubbers take nearly all of the
particulate matter out of the exhaust.



This assumes that some utilities don't purchase the privilege to not install
the latest equipment. As things stand right now, they are able to purchase
that privilege, and some have done so.



JoeSpareBedroom March 2nd 08 03:04 PM

Your President At Work
 
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"Canuck57" wrote in message
news:Mspyj.32409$w94.4370@pd7urf2no...
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eisboch" wrote in message
...
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...

"Big Oil" helps set the price of the crude it buys. You think it
doesn't have "partners" sitting on the OPEC committees?

I'm sure they do. But, there are also speculators at work, in the
exact same way speculators dick with the price of stocks to the
point where their prices are completely disconnected from physical
& financial reality.

Speculative nonsense:

Think back. Although laughable when compared to current values, the
price of oil quadrupled during the oil "shortage" crisis in the
early 70's on Nixon's watch. Later that decade, under Carter it
doubled again in less than 12 months.

Neither had anything to do with Wall Street, Dick Cheney or secret
"Big Oil" meetings with OPEC.

Eisboch


That was then. This is now. And (separate issue), in this discussion,
I'm not concerned with any particular politician.

In the long list of things you buy regularly, can you think of 5 or 6
whose prices are determined by speculators, causing almost daily
price swings? I'm in the grocery biz, and I handle about 500
different products. I don't see this happening.

How about shoes, or anything else you buy?

I am on a conservation kick. I go barefoot.

Seriously, at 100 bucks or so a barrel, I don't see daily price swings
of a few dollars per barrel as being very significant.
There's something more than speculators causing prices to more than
double in two years. I admit, I don't fully understand how oil
prices are "set" despite JimH's links. Seems to me that those who
control the goods determine the price.

Eisboch

It's all the factors working together. Demand is part of it, but not
all of it. The problem is that people will gamble on absolutely
anything. If we added chick pea futures to the other available via the
commodities exchanges, people would be gambling on chick peas.
And if they are wrong, they lose their shirts.

Supply and demand eventually wins.


But someone always wins, no matter what happens to the speculators.
That's a multi-million dollar business, and it does not serve the best
interests of this country.


Why doesn't it serve the best interests of this country?



I'll need to use an analogy to answer that question. You OK with that?



John H.[_3_] March 2nd 08 03:30 PM

Your President At Work
 
On Sun, 02 Mar 2008 08:14:43 -0500, Gene Kearns
wrote:

On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 16:20:57 -0500, John H. penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

On Sat, 1 Mar 2008 13:16:03 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Mar 1, 3:26*pm, John H. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 15:01:04 -0500, Gene Kearns





wrote:
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 13:29:41 -0500, John H. penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:52:23 -0500, BAR wrote:

Solution:

- build nuclear power plants
- build the wind farm off of Cape Cod
- drill to pump oil out of all of the oil fields within the US
- drill the hell out of the coast of Florida before the Chinese do
- build more refineries

I'll plagiarize that every chance I get.

Don't make yourself look silly.....

1) I pay bills at 2 locations: one coal fired, one nukular fired. The
nukular bill is about 1/3 higher. That isn't much of a "deal." I,
also, have a problem with sweeping the radioactive waste under the
carpet.

Which provides the cleaner energy? What other monies will be spent to clean
up after the coal? Is the difference in price due to the difference in
production cost or for some other reason?

2) I don't mind ****ing off the Kennedy's, but geographically I hope
it is not cutting off one's nose to spite one's face (the studies say,
not). Wind is a good way to go, though, and I suspect that the project
will be approved this year and we may see a turbine in place in about
4 years....

We are way behind. Take a trip through Denmark. You'll see what wind use is
all about. I don't believe it's possible to stop anywhere in the country
and not see a wind mill farm.

3) We might need those reserves for something regarding national
defense. Don't squander the nest egg for a big night on the town....

Don't know if he meant to pump out the old fields or drill and pump new
ones. You made a good point. Once things really get tight, we'll need the
oil to power our bombers and submarines.

4) Another geographically challenged thought.

But one that makes good sense. Do you think the Chinese are *not* working
with the Cubans to drill off the coast of Florida?

5) Tell the oil companies to stop CLOSING refineries. Has anybody
figured out that we have 1/2 the refineries we used to have and that
"lack of capacity" has the oil companies weeping all of the way to the
bank?

The oil companies closed old, small, inefficient refineries.

Certainly, America can develop technologies that will make oil
unnecessary. Then we would have an economic advantage far exceeding of
the current countries with significant oil reserves.

Go NUCLEAR!
--
John H

"All decisions are the result of binary thinking."- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I agree, but the problem is that it isn't an instant fix by a long
shot. It takes a hell of a long time to get a nuke plant built, and
online. Was watching an economist and energy expert talking about this
just today, and he, like me is all for nuclear energy, but in the
meantime thinks, as do I that we need to do more to get solar and wind
farms up and running to offset the lag time in getting nuke plants
operational.


Loogy, you should have started talking to the liberals about 20 years ago!


Maybe we should just emulate the French.....
http://www.uic.com.au/nip28.htm


We should. I said this a couple years ago. Note the comments on the
recycling of nuclear waste. This greatly reduces the waste problem you
mentioned in an earlier message.
--
John H

"All decisions are the result of binary thinking."

John H.[_3_] March 2nd 08 03:34 PM

Your President At Work
 
On Sun, 2 Mar 2008 10:35:57 -0400, "Don White"
wrote:


"BAR" wrote in message
...
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"John H." wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:23:44 -0500, HK
wrote:

BAR wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- President Bush, saying he was
unaware of
predictions of $4-a-gallon gasoline in the coming months, told
reporters Thursday that the best way to help Americans fend off
high
prices is for Congress to make his first-term tax cuts
permanent.

...

Analysts have said that gasoline could reach $4 a gallon by
this
spring, due to strong demand and a change in formulation, among
other reasons.

When taking the question about the $4 milestone, Bush told the
reporter, *"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that."*
Strong demand. What a crock of ****. Last spring, it was "on
fears of
renewed violence in Baghdad". Prices are effected by events in a
country from which we get pretty much zero oil?

Can somebody please explain to me why high oil prices is
perceived as
a unique problem to the USA with Bush at the center of the cause?
Political blame for US election advantage.

The sad thing is that Bush leaves office as soon as the next
President
is sworn in on 1/20/09. Why is everyone running against Bush?


The sad thing? There will be dancing in the streets when the IDIOT
heads
back to Crawford, or wherever he plans to go to take up his video
games,
booze, coke, and drunken driving.

Oh...it is the *failed* Bush-GOP policies against which the Dems
will
run. Got it?
Harry, does your mother know you're telling lies about her?

You're still past tense.
--
John H

Back to bringing families into the foolishness here eh Johnny?
Time for an extended Goofy cruise..... from now until May would just
about do it.
Did you lazy son drink all of your beer again?

Speaking of idiots...........
I don't have a lazy son laying around my house, watching my TV, eating
my food and drinking my beer.


Well.. believe it or not, looks like we have something in common.
The only thing my son does on your list is .. he eats most of his meals
here...... but since he pays 'room & board', I assume this is acceptable
to you?


Any child over the age of 25 still living at home regardless of paying
rent or room and board should be pushed out the door. Your children need
to find their own way in life and they should be strongly encouraged to do
so. There are exceptions for physically or mentally disabled.



Is this Blurt, the pseudo Christian or Blurt, the pseudo marine talkin'?


Smart assed question from one who wouldn't make a pimple on a Marine's ass.

Be your own man, Don. Harry doesn't need your hand-licking, tail-wagging,
puppy dogging.
--
John H

"All decisions are the result of binary thinking."

John H.[_3_] March 2nd 08 03:36 PM

Your President At Work
 
On Sun, 02 Mar 2008 09:45:29 -0500, HK wrote:

BAR wrote:
HK wrote:
John H. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 21:09:02 -0500, HK wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
I'll bet that Dicque Cheney is working right now with his "BIG
OIL" buddies to try to knock the price of gas down temporarily
two weeks before the November elections.
Sure he is Harry. Sure he is.

The blame for the price of oil doesn't reside with politicians,
current or past.
The blame resides with us.

Eisboch
I think a steep "excess profits tax" would tighten things up a
hair, that and members representing the public and responsible
to it sitting on big oil boards.
How will that affect the price of a barrel of oil here? Or in
Japan? or in China? or in Sweden? or in Great Britain? or in
Germany? or Italy?

Eisboch
Oversight and pressure, and the excess profits tax could be used
to help non-profit entities unaffiliated with big oil develop
alternative energy sources.
Wistful thinking. Despite your protests, industry drives
innovation and technical development, not "non-profit" centers
staffed with lifelong members of academia making a living on
government grants. I've been exposed to both for many, many years.
Industry is what makes things happen and imposing more taxes on it
simply slows things down.

Eisboch


I see no reason to trust Big Oil, and I wasn't suggesting academia.

Harry, your original comment was pure, liberal, anti-Bush, stupid.
But, it
did get Eisboch talking to you again, to tell you so. Therefore, it must
have been worthwhile.


You don't really think I give a damn about what your three crosswired
synapses produce, do you?


If you didn't care you wouldn't respond.



You ought to consider putting a halt to your projecting, Blurt.

To me, the non-thinking, doctrinaire *far* righties like Herring, you,
and a couple of others here are just subjects for ridicule, certainly
not anyone to take seriously.

Why would I care what you think? What you think doesn't matter.


Harry, you're the reigning expert on receiving ridicule. I'll bow to your
expertise in that arena.

How's the lobsta' boat?
--
John H

"All decisions are the result of binary thinking."

JoeSpareBedroom March 2nd 08 03:37 PM

Your President At Work
 
"John H." wrote in message
...
On Sun, 2 Mar 2008 10:35:57 -0400, "Don White"
wrote:


"BAR" wrote in message
m...
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"BAR" wrote in message
. ..
Don White wrote:
"John H." wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:23:44 -0500, HK
wrote:

BAR wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"HK" wrote in message
...
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- President Bush, saying he was
unaware of
predictions of $4-a-gallon gasoline in the coming months,
told
reporters Thursday that the best way to help Americans fend
off
high
prices is for Congress to make his first-term tax cuts
permanent.

...

Analysts have said that gasoline could reach $4 a gallon by
this
spring, due to strong demand and a change in formulation,
among
other reasons.

When taking the question about the $4 milestone, Bush told
the
reporter, *"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that."*
Strong demand. What a crock of ****. Last spring, it was "on
fears of
renewed violence in Baghdad". Prices are effected by events in
a
country from which we get pretty much zero oil?

Can somebody please explain to me why high oil prices is
perceived as
a unique problem to the USA with Bush at the center of the
cause?
Political blame for US election advantage.

The sad thing is that Bush leaves office as soon as the next
President
is sworn in on 1/20/09. Why is everyone running against Bush?


The sad thing? There will be dancing in the streets when the
IDIOT
heads
back to Crawford, or wherever he plans to go to take up his video
games,
booze, coke, and drunken driving.

Oh...it is the *failed* Bush-GOP policies against which the Dems
will
run. Got it?
Harry, does your mother know you're telling lies about her?

You're still past tense.
--
John H

Back to bringing families into the foolishness here eh Johnny?
Time for an extended Goofy cruise..... from now until May would
just
about do it.
Did you lazy son drink all of your beer again?

Speaking of idiots...........
I don't have a lazy son laying around my house, watching my TV, eating
my food and drinking my beer.


Well.. believe it or not, looks like we have something in common.
The only thing my son does on your list is .. he eats most of his meals
here...... but since he pays 'room & board', I assume this is
acceptable
to you?

Any child over the age of 25 still living at home regardless of paying
rent or room and board should be pushed out the door. Your children need
to find their own way in life and they should be strongly encouraged to
do
so. There are exceptions for physically or mentally disabled.



Is this Blurt, the pseudo Christian or Blurt, the pseudo marine talkin'?


Smart assed question from one who wouldn't make a pimple on a Marine's
ass.

Be your own man, Don. Harry doesn't need your hand-licking, tail-wagging,
puppy dogging.
--
John H



The connection between Harry and anyone else is largely imaginary. He just
jumps in the "help" whether anyone needs it or not. But, you're the same
way. When you live in a glass house, don't throw stones.



HK March 2nd 08 03:38 PM

Your President At Work
 
John H. wrote:


Smart assed question from one who wouldn't make a pimple on a Marine's ass.



Tough soldier talk! snerk

Herring, of course, is the newsgroup expert on soldier ass.

Don White March 2nd 08 03:48 PM

Your President At Work
 

"HK" wrote in message
...
John H. wrote:


Smart assed question from one who wouldn't make a pimple on a Marine's
ass.



Tough soldier talk! snerk

Herring, of course, is the newsgroup expert on soldier ass.



I'm betting he's seen his share!



HK March 2nd 08 03:49 PM

Your President At Work
 
Don White wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
John H. wrote:

Smart assed question from one who wouldn't make a pimple on a Marine's
ass.


Tough soldier talk! snerk

Herring, of course, is the newsgroup expert on soldier ass.



I'm betting he's seen his share!


Up close, too. Real close. Kissing distance.


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