krueger wrote:

A group of us open boaters were on the Klamath 4th July week, and normally
we see rafters and kayakers, but rarely canoeist. Curly Jack CG, Sarah
Totten CG are full, commercial rafters at Trees of Heaven, Happy Camp,
Curley Jack, and Ferry Point put-ins. This year we saw one youth group of 3
rafts, and one guided raft on the Happy Camp run, and one group at Trees of
Heaven, and the camp grounds were basicly empty... Unheard of! To our
surprise though, the surf wave at School House is now considered a "park 'n
play" spot, and was occupied with lots of kayakers.

We were on the Forks o' Payette over July 4th, and it was interesting
that some runs on the river were virtually devoid of people, whereas
others such as Staircase, the Main Payette, and Cabarton were swarming.
However the best runs we did IMO-- the Gorge where Walt Blackadar died,
the South Fork Boise (not technically a fork o' Payette) and the
upper South Fork near Lowman-- had no other boaters on the river!

We still enjoyed having the river to ourselves, but it was almost too quiet!

It's nice having solitude, though!
The park'n'play aspect of recent kayaking has reduced river touring use,
and perhaps the emphasis on Xtreme kayaking has caused moderate people
to lose interest in the sport.

Added note: Rattle Snake and The Trench have seen some changes from our
last visit 2 years ago.

Can you describe how they changed?

riverman wrote:
: I'm calling it. 17:34 local time, Oct 27, 2007. Cause of Death;
: overwhelming spam, apathy, sex ads, garbage and general toxicity.

: We should have taken better care of her...

You should see my spam folder... it's impossible to read or reply to emails
at this point...

--
John Nelson
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chicago Area Paddling/Fishing Page
http://www.chicagopaddling.org http://www.chicagofishing.org
(A Non-Commercial Web Site: No Sponsors, No Paid Ads and Nothing to Sell)

Melissa (bonny wee boaty :-)) asked me to post her reply to Myron's
post, due to her having some problems posting it to RBP on her own, so
here it is:

Hi riverman,

On Sat, 27 Oct 2007 02:36:25 -0700, you wrote:

I'm calling it. 17:34 local time, Oct 27, 2007. Cause of Death;
overwhelming spam, apathy, sex ads, garbage and general toxicity.

We should have taken better care of her...

As I sit here waiting for my shuttle driver (going for a one-way
down-the-coast paddle today! :-) , I stumble upon rbp, and find this
sad thread. Imminent demise or not, I'd like to take this moment to
express my gratitude for rbp (and the apparently nearly dead rbpt as
well)...at least for "what it was".

For the past few years, I've mainly just lurked here...when I feel I
have the time (after all, I'd rather be paddling than sitting here in
front of the computer). As a primarily solo paddler--both by choice
and local circumstance--the Internet (news groups, email lists, and
message boards) has been where I enjoy sharing my love of paddling
with others; without necessarily having to paddle with them! ;-)). In
this sense, rbp and rbpt have been, all things considered, a
wonderful experience for me, and I have all the great people who have
populated these news groups over the years to thank for this.

Though I don't have time to mention everyone, just the people I see so
far in this thread would certainly be at the top of such a list, so
I'll take this opportunity to thank all of you. Thanks! :-)

Perhaps at one point in time, news groups were indeed just about the
"only game in town" with regards to Internet discussion forums, but
now, and for the past several years, email lists and website forums
have come into their own as well. Even if some news groups do fade
away, I don't think that we paddlers will ever stop finding ways to
reach out to each other in one way or another.

I still participate in several of these types of forums, though for
the past few years, I've cut down considerably; mainly due to my
preference for spending more time on the water than on the keyboard
(there was a point, several years ago, that I did feel I was spending
time at the computer at the expense of potential water time, and I
found that to be an unacceptable situation).

It's time for me to now climb into my paddling gear and do what I'm
supposed to be doing, so I'll sign off for now. It would be lovely
to see rbp come back to life, but even if it doesn't, it will always
be remembered fondly, and I will always appreciate the people who
have made it something worth remembering.

Thanks again! :-)

-- Melissa

--
Wilko van den Bergh wilkoa t)dse(d o tnl
Eindhoven The Netherlands Europe
---Look at the possibilities, don't worry about the limitations.---
http://kayaker.nl/

Gee my sever must be taking great care of me. I've been mostly lurking
here for years and only seeing 5 to 10 posts a day mostly on topic
with very few flame wars. I like checking in on this group except
when the sponson thing happens

I'm calling it. 17:34 local time, Oct 27, 2007. Cause of Death;
overwhelming spam, apathy, sex ads, garbage and general toxicity.

We should have taken better care of her...

--riverman

On Oct 28, 8:17 pm, (Drew Dalgleish)
wrote:
Gee my sever must be taking great care of me. I've been mostly lurking
here for years and only seeing 5 to 10 posts a day mostly on topic
with very few flame wars. I like checking in on this group except
when the sponson thing happens

I just Googled "Tim Imgram", and there's a LOT of Tim Ingrams out
there!

Good ole Sponson Boy! I wonder what meds he's on these days! ;-)

John Kuthe...

On Oct 28, 8:51 pm, John Kuthe wrote:
On Oct 28, 8:17 pm, (Drew Dalgleish)
wrote:

Gee my sever must be taking great care of me. I've been mostly lurking
here for years and only seeing 5 to 10 posts a day mostly on topic
with very few flame wars. I like checking in on this group except
when the sponson thing happens

I just Googled "Tim Imgram", and there's a LOT of Tim Ingrams out
there!

Good ole Sponson Boy! I wonder what meds he's on these days! ;-)

Argh! My proof reading's nonexistent!


John Kuthe...

On Oct 28, 11:29 pm, John Kuthe wrote:
On Oct 28, 8:51 pm, John Kuthe wrote:

On Oct 28, 8:17 pm, (Drew Dalgleish)
wrote:

Gee my sever must be taking great care of me. I've been mostly lurking
here for years and only seeing 5 to 10 posts a day mostly on topic
with very few flame wars. I like checking in on this group except
when the sponson thing happens

I just Googled "Tim Imgram", and there's a LOT of Tim Ingrams out
there!

Good ole Sponson Boy! I wonder what meds he's on these days! ;-)

"'Good' ole Sponson Boy?" The advent of Ingram and Njall, just at the
point of technology when alternative online forums (elsewhere adduced)
were emerging, is the biggest single reason for the demise of our
favorite online hangout. Those guys turned away enough of our number,
who by then had different places to go for similar correspondence, to
reduce our numbers below the critical mass necessary to keep such a
forum vibrant and progressive. These guys are mindless vandals who
destroyed a thing of beauty, out of simple selfish glee.

I hung in there for several years after the sponson wars, but there
were just too few of us to keep any good discussions going, so I
finally gave up and went to BoaterTalk. As fate would have it, Eric
Princen, owner of BoaterTalk, around then had cleaned up BoaterTalk's
act sufficiently that I was able to enjoy it. So there was both a
carrot and a stick drawing me away from r.b.p.

I've continued to check in almost daily over the last few years, just
popping my head in and rarely seeing any new threads of interest to me
(Bill Tuthill's wonderful trip reports being the most glaring
exception), and now I find that over the last few months I am looking
in less and less frequently. Today is the first time in a week or
more. Yet I still check BoaterTalk, Paddle Prattle, and CBoats.net
almost daily, and get a flood of eMail from the lists of three
paddling clubs.

So long, friends. I still hope to run into all of you on some river
some time. I hope NOT to run into Ingram or Njall, because then I
might end up in jail.

-Richard, His Kanubic Travesty
--
Richard Hopley, Winston-Salem, NC, USA
Nothing really matters except Boats, Sex, and Rock'n'Roll

"Oci-One Kanubi" wrote in message
ps.com...
On Oct 28, 11:29 pm, John Kuthe wrote:
On Oct 28, 8:51 pm, John Kuthe wrote:

On Oct 28, 8:17 pm, (Drew Dalgleish)
wrote:

Gee my sever must be taking great care of me. I've been mostly
lurking
here for years and only seeing 5 to 10 posts a day mostly on topic
with very few flame wars. I like checking in on this group except
when the sponson thing happens

I just Googled "Tim Imgram", and there's a LOT of Tim Ingrams out
there!

Good ole Sponson Boy! I wonder what meds he's on these days! ;-)

"'Good' ole Sponson Boy?" The advent of Ingram and Njall, just at the
point of technology when alternative online forums (elsewhere adduced)
were emerging, is the biggest single reason for the demise of our
favorite online hangout. Those guys turned away enough of our number,
who by then had different places to go for similar correspondence, to
reduce our numbers below the critical mass necessary to keep such a
forum vibrant and progressive. These guys are mindless vandals who
destroyed a thing of beauty, out of simple selfish glee.

I hung in there for several years after the sponson wars, but there
were just too few of us to keep any good discussions going, so I
finally gave up and went to BoaterTalk. As fate would have it, Eric
Princen, owner of BoaterTalk, around then had cleaned up BoaterTalk's
act sufficiently that I was able to enjoy it. So there was both a
carrot and a stick drawing me away from r.b.p.

I've continued to check in almost daily over the last few years, just
popping my head in and rarely seeing any new threads of interest to me
(Bill Tuthill's wonderful trip reports being the most glaring
exception), and now I find that over the last few months I am looking
in less and less frequently. Today is the first time in a week or
more. Yet I still check BoaterTalk, Paddle Prattle, and CBoats.net
almost daily, and get a flood of eMail from the lists of three
paddling clubs.

So long, friends. I still hope to run into all of you on some river
some time. I hope NOT to run into Ingram or Njall, because then I
might end up in jail.

-Richard, His Kanubic Travesty
--
Richard Hopley, Winston-Salem, NC, USA
Nothing really matters except Boats, Sex, and Rock'n'Roll


Good lord, I have been bopping in and out of here longer than I thought -
even I vaguely remember the sponson wars, though not any personalities
associated with them...or even what the actual argument was. Sponson is
just sort of one of those words that sticks in your head if repeated often
enough.

Cricket

On Oct 27, 5:36 am, riverman wrote:
I'm calling it. 17:34 local time, Oct 27, 2007. Cause of Death;
overwhelming spam, apathy, sex ads, garbage and general toxicity.

We should have taken better care of her...

--riverman

Long time lurker, occasional poster calling in.

Would anyone be interested in moderated forum on a private board? I've
got some server room to play with and I might could set this up if
there is enough interest.

-John

www.sourcetosea.net

SourcetoSea wrote:

Long time lurker, occasional poster calling in.
Would anyone be interested in moderated forum on a private board?
I've got some server room to play with and I might could set this up
if there is enough interest.

Usually those don't have enough readers. There is already BoaterTalk
(unmoderated) and several great Yahoo groups (semi-moderated) including

idahowhitewater
utahrafters
gcpba (Grand Canyon private boaters assoc.)
wrrr (Washington recreational river runners
PDXrecreationalKayaker (Portland OR)
inflatable-kayaking
paddler (???)