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More Nukes on the Bay?
US eyes boom in nuclear reactors
By Laura Smith-Spark BBC News, Washington Almost three decades have passed since the last application was filed to build a new nuclear reactor in the US. Now, up to 30 are expected in the next three years. As time has passed, memories have faded of the 1979 radioactive leak at the Three Mile Island nuclear plant in Pennsylvania that threw the US nuclear industry into disarray. Meanwhile, energy security concerns and worries about climate change have reshaped the debate, and financial incentives and a new licensing process have altered the economics. The first full application for two new reactors, in southern Texas, was submitted at the end of September. Another four are due by the end of the year and a dozen in 2008, many in south-eastern states, the federal Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) said. The earliest could be in operation by 2015. A range of factors is fuelling the renewed enthusiasm: * The introduction of a new fast-track combined construction and operation permit, making new reactors easier and cheaper to build * A tax credit, introduced in the 2005 Energy Policy Act, of 1.8 cents per kilowatt hour for the first 6,000 megawatts generated by nuclear plants * Risk insurance adding up to $2bn for the first six plants to be built, protecting companies against the cost of delays in construction * Multi-billion-dollar loan guarantees * A likelihood that the cost of emitting CO2 will rise as the battle against climate change intensifies But the impending flood of applications is fuelling a new row over whether nuclear power represents a bold step to address 21st Century needs or a mistaken return to flawed 20th Century technology. 'Reliable source' Supporters say new reactors are the only way to meet a projected 40% increase in US electricity demand by 2030 - a result of the country's growing population. "Our country needs the electricity and it needs clean sources of electricity that are reliable - and that's exactly what nuclear energy is," says Steve Kerekes, spokesman for industry group the Nuclear Energy Institute (NEI). Thanks to improvements in efficiency, 104 reactors across 31 states already produce 20% of the nation's total electricity supply, he points out. The NEI also argues that nuclear power is cleaner than gas and coal-fired plants and says studies show that over a nuclear plant's life-cycle - including construction and the mining of uranium ore - its greenhouse gas emissions are comparable to those of wind and hydro power. "We wouldn't pretend for a second that we should be 100% of our energy supply going forward - but there is a role for us to play in a diversified energy supply that includes renewables, coal and nuclear," says Mr Kerekes. 'Massive subsidies' However, others dispute this. This is a renaissance that is only proposed because of massive - you could say unprecedented - federal subsidies Tyson Slocum, Public Citizen "It is absolutely not a clean energy source," says Tyson Slocum, director of energy policy for public interest group Public Citizen. "Does it produce less greenhouse gas emissions than coal or gas? Yes. "But it produces waste potentially more problematic not only from the mining aspect but from the high-level radioactive waste that a commercial nuclear reactor is going to produce." Mr Slocum says the industry's apparent renaissance is due very largely to "massive - you could say unprecedented - federal subsidies". "If you had a programme like this for wind and solar, wind and solar would be the biggest energy sources in the next 20 years," he said. Security risk? The question of how nuclear waste is stored is already a controversial issue in the US. A planned national repository for spent fuel at Yucca Mountain in Nevada has run into sustained opposition from some local lawmakers, including Democratic Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid. The government is due to submit an application to the NRC to start construction at the site by 30 June next year. But while it is scheduled to open before 2020, it could still be delayed or blocked altogether. In the meantime, nuclear waste will continue to be stored on site at power plants. Critics argue that this inevitably increases the risk that plants will become a terror target, despite steps to give nuclear facilities extra protection after 9/11. Local fight Public reaction to the planned expansion in reactors has so far been fairly muted. Opponents say that is because the nuclear lobby has exploited concerns over climate change. But the NEI points to evidence that people living near existing plants are more strongly in favour of nuclear power than the general public. At least one proposal has sparked local opposition, however. This is a bid by US energy firm Constellation, in partnership with France's EDF, to build a new reactor at Calvert Cliffs in Maryland - the companies filed a partial application in July and are due to file the rest of the paperwork early next year. In June, Green Party activist Steve Warner founded the Chesapeake Safe Energy Coalition to fight the plan, bringing together local people, environmental and public interest groups. We would really like to see other forms of energy investigated Steve Warner Maryland campaigner He argues the addition of a new reactor, generating as much power as the two already at Calvert Cliffs, will push combined radioactive emissions above safe levels. Of particular concern to the campaigners is whether the reactor could have an impact on the marine wildlife in the Chesapeake Bay, known for its blue crabs. The project has been backed by the Calvert County authorities because it promises to create 700 jobs, but the coalition hopes to persuade the state legislature to oppose it. "The main focus is to not build any more reactors until we resolve the waste issues and get some reasonable assurance of how they monitor the emissions," Mr Warner said. "We would really like to see other forms of energy investigated." Story from BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/h...as/7027147.stm ________________________________ The existing facility at Calvert Cliffs is very well run. I live near it, and have no objection to proper construction and operation of some additional reactors, especially since the jobs created will be union jobs. The waste fuel rod problem is easy to resolve...load the stuff up in drone airplanes and drop it onto red states. The radiation surely will improve the gene pool. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
Great post, and definitely related to this NG. It is nice to see you make a constructive post without trolling for a political flamefest. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 10:26 am, HK wrote:
especially since the jobs created will be union jobs. Yeah, we need unions to do to the nuke industry what they have done to the Grocery, Airline, Auto, Manufacturing, and so many other industries who have been driven over the borders, and into bankruptcy... |
More Nukes on the Bay?
John H. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 10:26:49 -0400, HK wrote: US eyes boom in nuclear reactors By Laura Smith-Spark BBC News, Washington Almost three decades have passed since the last application was filed to build a new nuclear reactor in the US. Now, up to 30 are expected in the next three years. About time. The article doesn't mention that new technology greatly reduces the amount of waste from the plants. This is one case where the French have led the way. We've wasted too much time not following their lead. You've gotta admit that the Calvert plant has helped the fishing in the area! Well, I liked it a lot better when I could tie up to the wharf and drop baits right down there. The rips there have been less than great for me lately. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
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More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 10:58 am, HK wrote:
wrote: On Oct 11, 10:26 am, HK wrote: especially since the jobs created will be union jobs. Yeah, we need unions to do to the nuke industry what they have done to the Grocery, Airline, Auto, Manufacturing, and so many other industries who have been driven over the borders, and into bankruptcy... Please. The skills required by the steamfitters who build nuke plants are not easily found among the non-unionized workforce. You need years of specialized training for that kind of work. Just because you don't have the skills necessary for high-end work doesn't mean you have to take potshots at those who do. My friend was an inspector/engineer at Haddam Neck... I know a lot more than you would think. I am not sure I want an organizaton that serves to protect the lowest common denominator from getting fired for not doing their job, building a nuke plant. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 10:58 am, HK wrote:
The skills required by the steamfitters who build nuke plants are not easily found among the non-unionized workforce. And this is just bull****. More than likely, just the opposite. Unions protect those who could not compete in a free market society. Please Harry, show me some statistics or research that backs up this statement. Or, just put me in the bozo bin again;) |
More Nukes on the Bay?
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More Nukes on the Bay?
"HK" wrote in message . .. US eyes boom in nuclear reactors By Laura Smith-Spark BBC News, Washington Almost three decades have passed since the last application was filed to build a new nuclear reactor in the US. Now, up to 30 are expected in the next three years. As time has passed, memories have faded of the 1979 radioactive leak at the Three Mile Island nuclear plant in Pennsylvania that threw the US nuclear industry into disarray. Meanwhile, energy security concerns and worries about climate change have reshaped the debate, and financial incentives and a new licensing process have altered the economics. The first full application for two new reactors, in southern Texas, was submitted at the end of September. Another four are due by the end of the year and a dozen in 2008, many in south-eastern states, the federal Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) said. The earliest could be in operation by 2015. A range of factors is fuelling the renewed enthusiasm: * The introduction of a new fast-track combined construction and operation permit, making new reactors easier and cheaper to build * A tax credit, introduced in the 2005 Energy Policy Act, of 1.8 cents per kilowatt hour for the first 6,000 megawatts generated by nuclear plants * Risk insurance adding up to $2bn for the first six plants to be built, protecting companies against the cost of delays in construction * Multi-billion-dollar loan guarantees * A likelihood that the cost of emitting CO2 will rise as the battle against climate change intensifies But the impending flood of applications is fuelling a new row over whether nuclear power represents a bold step to address 21st Century needs or a mistaken return to flawed 20th Century technology. 'Reliable source' Supporters say new reactors are the only way to meet a projected 40% increase in US electricity demand by 2030 - a result of the country's growing population. "Our country needs the electricity and it needs clean sources of electricity that are reliable - and that's exactly what nuclear energy is," says Steve Kerekes, spokesman for industry group the Nuclear Energy Institute (NEI). Thanks to improvements in efficiency, 104 reactors across 31 states already produce 20% of the nation's total electricity supply, he points out. The NEI also argues that nuclear power is cleaner than gas and coal-fired plants and says studies show that over a nuclear plant's life-cycle - including construction and the mining of uranium ore - its greenhouse gas emissions are comparable to those of wind and hydro power. "We wouldn't pretend for a second that we should be 100% of our energy supply going forward - but there is a role for us to play in a diversified energy supply that includes renewables, coal and nuclear," says Mr Kerekes. 'Massive subsidies' However, others dispute this. This is a renaissance that is only proposed because of massive - you could say unprecedented - federal subsidies Tyson Slocum, Public Citizen "It is absolutely not a clean energy source," says Tyson Slocum, director of energy policy for public interest group Public Citizen. "Does it produce less greenhouse gas emissions than coal or gas? Yes. "But it produces waste potentially more problematic not only from the mining aspect but from the high-level radioactive waste that a commercial nuclear reactor is going to produce." Mr Slocum says the industry's apparent renaissance is due very largely to "massive - you could say unprecedented - federal subsidies". "If you had a programme like this for wind and solar, wind and solar would be the biggest energy sources in the next 20 years," he said. Security risk? The question of how nuclear waste is stored is already a controversial issue in the US. A planned national repository for spent fuel at Yucca Mountain in Nevada has run into sustained opposition from some local lawmakers, including Democratic Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid. The government is due to submit an application to the NRC to start construction at the site by 30 June next year. But while it is scheduled to open before 2020, it could still be delayed or blocked altogether. In the meantime, nuclear waste will continue to be stored on site at power plants. Critics argue that this inevitably increases the risk that plants will become a terror target, despite steps to give nuclear facilities extra protection after 9/11. Local fight Public reaction to the planned expansion in reactors has so far been fairly muted. Opponents say that is because the nuclear lobby has exploited concerns over climate change. But the NEI points to evidence that people living near existing plants are more strongly in favour of nuclear power than the general public. At least one proposal has sparked local opposition, however. This is a bid by US energy firm Constellation, in partnership with France's EDF, to build a new reactor at Calvert Cliffs in Maryland - the companies filed a partial application in July and are due to file the rest of the paperwork early next year. In June, Green Party activist Steve Warner founded the Chesapeake Safe Energy Coalition to fight the plan, bringing together local people, environmental and public interest groups. We would really like to see other forms of energy investigated Steve Warner Maryland campaigner He argues the addition of a new reactor, generating as much power as the two already at Calvert Cliffs, will push combined radioactive emissions above safe levels. Of particular concern to the campaigners is whether the reactor could have an impact on the marine wildlife in the Chesapeake Bay, known for its blue crabs. The project has been backed by the Calvert County authorities because it promises to create 700 jobs, but the coalition hopes to persuade the state legislature to oppose it. "The main focus is to not build any more reactors until we resolve the waste issues and get some reasonable assurance of how they monitor the emissions," Mr Warner said. "We would really like to see other forms of energy investigated." Story from BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/h...as/7027147.stm ________________________________ The existing facility at Calvert Cliffs is very well run. I live near it, and have no objection to proper construction and operation of some additional reactors, especially since the jobs created will be union jobs. I have no problem with it either. Shearon Harris was originally designed to accommodate 4 reactors. Only 1 was built. I boat on that lake quite often. As long as they hire competent people to design, build and run the joint... more power to 'em/us. AFAIK, The Harris plant stores its own waste and receives BIG $$ to store other's waste as well. The only problem we are having now is an extremely low lake level. If the lake level goes so low, the plant will have to shut down. If your ever out on the lake, you'll probably spot the plant patrol in the woods, ..... white suburbans, uniforms, dark shades, rifles, and binocs.. (checking you out on the water). You kinda forget about them after a while. db |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 11:07 am, HK wrote:
wrote: On Oct 11, 10:58 am, HK wrote: wrote: On Oct 11, 10:26 am, HK wrote: especially since the jobs created will be union jobs. Yeah, we need unions to do to the nuke industry what they have done to the Grocery, Airline, Auto, Manufacturing, and so many other industries who have been driven over the borders, and into bankruptcy... Please. The skills required by the steamfitters who build nuke plants are not easily found among the non-unionized workforce. You need years of specialized training for that kind of work. Just because you don't have the skills necessary for high-end work doesn't mean you have to take potshots at those who do. My friend was an inspector/engineer at Haddam Neck... I know a lot more than you would think. I am not sure I want an organizaton that serves to protect the lowest common denominator from getting fired for not doing their job, building a nuke plant. Ahh, lowest common denominator...the Bush clowns.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Even you can't defend unions. Bush has nothing to do with it. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
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More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 7:44?am, wrote:
On Oct 11, 10:26 am, HK wrote: especially since the jobs created will be union jobs. Yeah, we need unions to do to the nuke industry what they have done to the Grocery, Airline, Auto, Manufacturing, and so many other industries who have been driven over the borders, and into bankruptcy... One batch of *******s steals for one group of special interests, and the other batch of *******s steals for the other. Industries haven't been "driven over the borders", they have moved to where socialist economies, substandard "standards" of living, and very little expectation of property ownership or wealth accumulation among the working class provide unlimited numbers of people willing to work for $50-$100 US per week. I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. But we can't simply blame the industrialists. (On topic, here..). Certain products wouldn't even exist if they had to be built in the US. Sure, when WalMart dictates to an appliance company that it will only pay $6 for a waffle iron (but will buy a million of them a year) a lot of companies are forced to move offshore to compete. That $6 wholesale allows Walmart to sell that waffle iron for $19.99 and come out OK. If Walmart would pay $10 for the same waffle iron, consumers might have to pay $25, but there would be a waffle iron factory in Chicago rather than in Shanghai..... but that's waffle irons, and not what I'm referring to. When it comes to boats it's not so simple. Even manufacturing in China results in 7-figure price tages on 55-60 foot boats. Having $1-million puts you somewhere near upper-middle class these days, (70,000 families in my home county are reputed to have $1 million or more in net financial assets *excluding* equity in a home), but still there are a limited number of people who have the means and will so prioritize their spending to sink $1,2, or 3 million into a boat. Manufacturing some of the larger yacts in the US, even in a "right to work (for less)" environment would probably double the pricing on many large yachts. Case in point: Recently compared two very nice boats. One built in the US selling for just under $900,000 and one bult in China selling for just over $1mm. The US boat is a 42-footer, the boat built in China is 59 feet. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote:
I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 10:26:49 -0400, HK wrote:
US eyes boom in nuclear reactors By Laura Smith-Spark BBC News, Washington Almost three decades have passed since the last application was filed to build a new nuclear reactor in the US. Now, up to 30 are expected in the next three years. About time. The article doesn't mention that new technology greatly reduces the amount of waste from the plants. This is one case where the French have led the way. We've wasted too much time not following their lead. You've gotta admit that the Calvert plant has helped the fishing in the area! |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote:
On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 10:04?am, John H. wrote:
.. Was the quality of construction the same on both of those boats?- Hide quoted text - Both laid up with infusion process, both with Kevlar reinforced hull. Systems installation and quality of stainless steel slightly better on the US built boat. *Quantity* of stainless steel greater on the Chinese boat. Interior joinery and workmanship, fit and finish good or better on the US made boat, woodworking especially noteworthy on the Chinese vessel. Engines and major systems all US made, both boats. Wiring outstanding on the US vessel, and even though not quite up to the same level still admirably accomplished on the Chinese. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote:
Just because Hillary puts a D behind her name does not mean she is a Democrat. She is showing us more and more communist tendencies, as is the rest of her party. Redistribution of wealth, censorship or dismissal of opposing views, restrictions on religeous opinion/ institutional atheism, and shameless rehiring of convicted criminals to her cabinet, for a few recent expamles. Call it the "new democatic party" if you want, but it is communist, pure and simple. Like I said, if we elect a communist government, we will be a communist country. Free speech will only be the first right that they will censor with the "anti-free enterprise and accountability reduction" doctrine.. uh, the "fairness act";) |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 11:02 am, wrote:
.. I am not sure I want an organizaton that serves to protect the lowest common denominator from getting fired for not doing their job, building a nuke plant. Specialized training Mandatory drug testing Safety training Turnover problems And on and on...... |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote:
On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist". |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 12:59 pm, wrote:
On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Another substancless name caller. Can you explain to me how the redistribution of wealth programs Hillary is pandering with lately, are not socialist?? Or, you could just call me some names;) |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 08:39:57 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote: On Oct 11, 7:44?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 10:26 am, HK wrote: especially since the jobs created will be union jobs. Yeah, we need unions to do to the nuke industry what they have done to the Grocery, Airline, Auto, Manufacturing, and so many other industries who have been driven over the borders, and into bankruptcy... One batch of *******s steals for one group of special interests, and the other batch of *******s steals for the other. Industries haven't been "driven over the borders", they have moved to where socialist economies, substandard "standards" of living, and very little expectation of property ownership or wealth accumulation among the working class provide unlimited numbers of people willing to work for $50-$100 US per week. I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. But we can't simply blame the industrialists. (On topic, here..). Certain products wouldn't even exist if they had to be built in the US. Sure, when WalMart dictates to an appliance company that it will only pay $6 for a waffle iron (but will buy a million of them a year) a lot of companies are forced to move offshore to compete. That $6 wholesale allows Walmart to sell that waffle iron for $19.99 and come out OK. If Walmart would pay $10 for the same waffle iron, consumers might have to pay $25, but there would be a waffle iron factory in Chicago rather than in Shanghai..... but that's waffle irons, and not what I'm referring to. When it comes to boats it's not so simple. Even manufacturing in China results in 7-figure price tages on 55-60 foot boats. Having $1-million puts you somewhere near upper-middle class these days, (70,000 families in my home county are reputed to have $1 million or more in net financial assets *excluding* equity in a home), but still there are a limited number of people who have the means and will so prioritize their spending to sink $1,2, or 3 million into a boat. Manufacturing some of the larger yacts in the US, even in a "right to work (for less)" environment would probably double the pricing on many large yachts. Case in point: Recently compared two very nice boats. One built in the US selling for just under $900,000 and one bult in China selling for just over $1mm. The US boat is a 42-footer, the boat built in China is 59 feet. Hey Chuck! Just think, when the socialists get our economy to their liking, our cardboard boxes may be a little bigger, and we may be making $100-$150 a week. But, we'll sure be proud of our redistributed wealth. Of course the wealthy politicos (socialists, of course), will be living high on the hog. (That's where the tenderloin is, high on the hog.) Then, only the bosses will be able to afford a (on topic again) boat, whether made in China or the USA. Was the quality of construction the same on both of those boats? |
More Nukes on the Bay?
|
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 1:04 pm, wrote:
On Oct 11, 12:59 pm, wrote: On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Another substancless name caller. Can you explain to me how the redistribution of wealth programs Hillary is pandering with lately, are not socialist?? Or, you could just call me some names;)- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - crickets ;) |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 10:13?am, "JimH" ask wrote:
wrote in message ups.com... On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist". Hamm. Now what is that old saying again? Oh yes........If it looks like a duck................- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - It goes, "If you think it looks like a duck, better be sure you know what a duck actually looks like. Otherwise, you might be a quack." Exhibit A: http://www.themilitant.com/index.shtml (the duck) Speaking of ducks- do they winter over on your section of Lake Erie or does it get so cold that they all migrate elsewhere? We have some ducks that spend the entire winter in this area, but others varieties seem to fly through on their way north or south in the spring and fall. I often marvel at how unpertubed our local ducks can be when a boat is approaching. They seem to swim or dive non-chalantly out of the way, regardless of the vessel's speed. I've never seen a duck, seagull, or any other bird get clobbered on the water. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 1:41 pm, Chuck Gould wrote:
On Oct 11, 10:13?am, "JimH" ask wrote: wrote in message oups.com... On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist". Hamm. Now what is that old saying again? Oh yes........If it looks like a duck................- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - It goes, "If you think it looks like a duck, better be sure you know what a duck actually looks like. Otherwise, you might be a quack." Exhibit A: http://www.themilitant.com/index.shtml (the duck) Speaking of ducks- do they winter over on your section of Lake Erie or does it get so cold that they all migrate elsewhere? We have some ducks that spend the entire winter in this area, but others varieties seem to fly through on their way north or south in the spring and fall. I often marvel at how unpertubed our local ducks can be when a boat is approaching. They seem to swim or dive non-chalantly out of the way, regardless of the vessel's speed. I've never seen a duck, seagull, or any other bird get clobbered on the water.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - So, you don't think Hillary, Pelosi, are socialists? And that Clinton/Soros website does not represent Socialists. I have in my family high ranking officials in the Socialist party before the two party system took control. They were the party of the working man back then, patriotic Americans. Not "militants", and self loathing phonys.. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 2:12 pm, wrote:
On Oct 11, 1:41 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 10:13?am, "JimH" ask wrote: wrote in message oups.com... On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist". Hamm. Now what is that old saying again? Oh yes........If it looks like a duck................- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - It goes, "If you think it looks like a duck, better be sure you know what a duck actually looks like. Otherwise, you might be a quack." Exhibit A: http://www.themilitant.com/index.shtml (the duck) Speaking of ducks- do they winter over on your section of Lake Erie or does it get so cold that they all migrate elsewhere? We have some ducks that spend the entire winter in this area, but others varieties seem to fly through on their way north or south in the spring and fall. I often marvel at how unpertubed our local ducks can be when a boat is approaching. They seem to swim or dive non-chalantly out of the way, regardless of the vessel's speed. I've never seen a duck, seagull, or any other bird get clobbered on the water.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - So, you don't think Hillary, Pelosi, are socialists? And that Clinton/Soros website does not represent Socialists. I have in my family high ranking officials in the Socialist party before the two party system took control. They were the party of the working man back then, patriotic Americans. Not "militants", and self loathing phonys..- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Now that I think about it, Hillary is probably more communist than socialist.. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 1:04 pm, wrote:
On Oct 11, 12:59 pm, wrote: On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Another substancless name caller. Can you explain to me how the redistribution of wealth programs Hillary is pandering with lately, are not socialist?? Or, you could just call me some names;)- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I can, and will as soon as you learn how to stop using those silly Republican talking points and stupid Republican key words. You sound just like Hannity. Ever have a thought of your own? |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 1:17 pm, wrote:
On Oct 11, 1:04 pm, wrote: On Oct 11, 12:59 pm, wrote: On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Another substancless name caller. Can you explain to me how the redistribution of wealth programs Hillary is pandering with lately, are not socialist?? Or, you could just call me some names;)- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - crickets ;)- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Oh, damn, I forgot. I should do nothing with my life except scan rec.boats political rantings 24-7. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 1:17 pm, wrote:
On Oct 11, 1:04 pm, wrote: On Oct 11, 12:59 pm, wrote: On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Another substancless name caller. Can you explain to me how the redistribution of wealth programs Hillary is pandering with lately, are not socialist?? Or, you could just call me some names;)- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - crickets ;)- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - And, just for the record, what names have I called you? |
More Nukes on the Bay?
JimH wrote:
wrote in message ups.com... On Oct 11, 1:41 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 10:13?am, "JimH" ask wrote: wrote in message ups.com... On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist". Hmmmm. Now what is that old saying again? Oh yes........If it looks like a duck................- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - It goes, "If you think it looks like a duck, better be sure you know what a duck actually looks like. Otherwise, you might be a quack." Exhibit A: http://www.themilitant.com/index.shtml (the duck) Speaking of ducks- do they winter over on your section of Lake Erie or does it get so cold that they all migrate elsewhere? We have some ducks that spend the entire winter in this area, but others varieties seem to fly through on their way north or south in the spring and fall. I often marvel at how unpertubed our local ducks can be when a boat is approaching. They seem to swim or dive non-chalantly out of the way, regardless of the vessel's speed. I've never seen a duck, seagull, or any other bird get clobbered on the water.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - So, you don't think Hillary, Pelosi, are socialists? I believe Chuck call them (and himself) "progressives" in order to avoid the label of socialist. ;-) Neither Clinton nor Pelosi are socialists. I have no idea what Chuck is, politically. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist". Good to see you're out of the hospital Kevin. Why the change from the famous "basskisser" ID? |
More Nukes on the Bay?
JimH wrote:
"HK" wrote in message ... JimH wrote: wrote in message - Show quoted text - So, you don't think Hillary, Pelosi, are socialists? I believe Chuck calls them (and himself) "progressives" in order to avoid the label of socialist. ;-) Neither Clinton nor Pelosi are socialists. I have no idea what Chuck is, politically. http://tinyurl.com/2oks7w You might want to read a few neutral discourses on socialism and then explain how Clinton or Pelosi are socialists. Richard Nixon was more of a socialist than either Clinton or Pelosi will ever be. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 8:46?am, John H. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 10:26:49 -0400, HK wrote: US eyes boom in nuclear reactors By Laura Smith-Spark BBC News, Washington Almost three decades have passed since the last application was filed to build a new nuclear reactor in the US. Now, up to 30 are expected in the next three years. About time. The article doesn't mention that new technology greatly reduces the amount of waste from the plants. This is one case where the French have led the way. We've wasted too much time not following their lead. You've gotta admit that the Calvert plant has helped the fishing in the area! Especially at night. Aren't the fish easier to find when they glow in the dark? :-) |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 09:37:01 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. ~~ cough - cough ~~ "Bernard "Bernie" Sanders (born September 8, 1941) is the current junior United States Senator from Vermont. Sanders was elected on November 7, 2006, and is presently a member of the 110th United States Congress. Before becoming Senator, Sanders represented Vermont's at-large district in the United States House of Representatives for 15 years. Sanders is a DEMOCRATIC SOCIALIST, but because he does not belong to a formal political party he appears as an independent on the ballot." Sanders is the first self-described socialist to be elected to the U.S. Senate." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Sanders http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6173577.stm http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/21/ma...=1&oref=slogin The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 3:12 pm, wrote:
On Oct 11, 1:04 pm, wrote: On Oct 11, 12:59 pm, wrote: On Oct 11, 12:37 pm, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing. Exactly, Busheep talking points. Ever hear Horseface Colter and that simp Sean Hannity together? Ever third word is either "Socialist" or "Communist".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Another substancless name caller. Can you explain to me how the redistribution of wealth programs Hillary is pandering with lately, are not socialist?? Or, you could just call me some names;)- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I can, and will as soon as you learn how to stop using those silly Republican talking points and stupid Republican key words. You sound just like Hannity. Ever have a thought of your own?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Why yes, yes I do. Ever pull your head out of your butt?? |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Oct 11, 2:53?pm, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote: On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 09:37:01 -0700, Chuck Gould wrote: On Oct 11, 8:45?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 11:39 am, Chuck Gould wrote: I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. Am I the only one who remembers Clinton saying he did not care if we were all making potato chips for minimum wage, as long as we were all working? If we continue to elect communist/socialist to our govt. we will be there soon enough... I'm missing something. A quick mental review of the executive and legistlative branches of the FEDGOV fails to identify anybody in office who is a communist or socialist. ~~ cough - cough ~~ "Bernard "Bernie" Sanders (born September 8, 1941) is the current junior United States Senator from Vermont. Sanders was elected on November 7, 2006, and is presently a member of the 110th United States Congress. Before becoming Senator, Sanders represented Vermont's at-large district in the United States House of Representatives for 15 years. Sanders is a DEMOCRATIC SOCIALIST, but because he does not belong to a formal political party he appears as an independent on the ballot." Sanders is the first self-described socialist to be elected to the U.S. Senate." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Sanders http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6173577.stm http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/21/ma...html?_r=1&oref... The Executive branch is entirely Republican, and has been for almost seven years. The Legislative branch is a mixture of Democrats and Republicans, with the Democrats currently holding a slim majority (after about 15 years of a Republican majority there). As for Clinton's comment, you may be right. Members of the other party, (in charge of stealing for the other special interest groups) might have said, "Why the heck should the government dictate how many dollars per hour (minimum wage) we ought to pay the people working in our potato chip plants?" :-) But here's an odd question: Why does anybody give a darn? Politics will bleed you dry, and leave your discarded body along the road without even a "thank you very much". None of us really make a difference, it's just a farce. We would do better to concentrate on the simple pleasures in life, (like boating). We are so manipulated these days by people with one agenda or another- whether it's on talk radio, the internet, TV, newspaper, or whatever. At least with a boat you can control your immediate environment. You will be safe or in peril depending to a large degree on how well you prepared before setting out, and sometimes you will be called upon to employ skills that will make an important difference. That's what life ought to be about, not simply and dutifully repeating the latest "talking point" from PBS, Al Gore, moveon.org, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity. The American public can be such sheep, it's really embarrassing.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - An exception proves the rule. :-) |
More Nukes on the Bay?
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 16:18:18 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote: An exception proves the rule. :-) 10-4. :) People tend to forget about Vermont. I wonder why? :) |
More Nukes on the Bay?
wrote in message ups.com... Oh, damn, I forgot. I should do nothing with my life except scan rec.boats political rantings 24-7. Well that is your MO, basskisser. |
More Nukes on the Bay?
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message ps.com... On Oct 11, 7:44?am, wrote: On Oct 11, 10:26 am, HK wrote: especially since the jobs created will be union jobs. Yeah, we need unions to do to the nuke industry what they have done to the Grocery, Airline, Auto, Manufacturing, and so many other industries who have been driven over the borders, and into bankruptcy... One batch of *******s steals for one group of special interests, and the other batch of *******s steals for the other. Industries haven't been "driven over the borders", they have moved to where socialist economies, substandard "standards" of living, and very little expectation of property ownership or wealth accumulation among the working class provide unlimited numbers of people willing to work for $50-$100 US per week. I'm sure that if there were enough people in the US willing to sleep in cardboard boxes along side the road, eat 600 calories a day, die of simple diseases before age 45 and therefore able to work for that same $50-$100 a week the industries that have been "driven away" would come back in a heartbeat. But we can't simply blame the industrialists. (On topic, here..). Certain products wouldn't even exist if they had to be built in the US. Sure, when WalMart dictates to an appliance company that it will only pay $6 for a waffle iron (but will buy a million of them a year) a lot of companies are forced to move offshore to compete. That $6 wholesale allows Walmart to sell that waffle iron for $19.99 and come out OK. If Walmart would pay $10 for the same waffle iron, consumers might have to pay $25, but there would be a waffle iron factory in Chicago rather than in Shanghai..... but that's waffle irons, and not what I'm referring to. When it comes to boats it's not so simple. Even manufacturing in China results in 7-figure price tages on 55-60 foot boats. Having $1-million puts you somewhere near upper-middle class these days, (70,000 families in my home county are reputed to have $1 million or more in net financial assets *excluding* equity in a home), but still there are a limited number of people who have the means and will so prioritize their spending to sink $1,2, or 3 million into a boat. Manufacturing some of the larger yacts in the US, even in a "right to work (for less)" environment would probably double the pricing on many large yachts. Case in point: Recently compared two very nice boats. One built in the US selling for just under $900,000 and one bult in China selling for just over $1mm. The US boat is a 42-footer, the boat built in China is 59 feet. You should travel more. Lots of home ownership in those foreign countries. May not be the 2000+ sq ft McMansions, but homes are owned. The people buy food, cost is less than here, and may be different, but the hours worked per loaf of bread may be very similar. Due to exorbitant contracts and over spending by the Federal Government over the last 50 years (both parties) we have priced ourselves out of a lot of the global markets. 25 years ago a good white collar engineering job was in the $20-30k range. Due to big inflation that same job is a $100-140k job. 5x or so increase. 25 years ago, the US worker did not make 10-20x the wage of an overseas worker. Maybe a 2x amount. We need to vote out almost all the leaders we now have and make it more of a people run government. Now it is life time employment with fantastic perks and full salary for life after about 2 terms. We are being controlled by an elitest group who basically let us vote for a couple of stooges running for office. Closest we got to breaking that cycle is when Perot made a 3rd party run. Unfortunately, that has also given us a couple of real Bozos as leaders and looks like the next POTUS will also be either a Bozo or Bozette. |
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