Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

Hi Tom,
I was playing a little with "Nathan Branden" in ASA this evening and a
question occured to me and I'm sorry to say I don't know the answer.
My understanding is that Marine Corps Officers don't go to boot camp
(Mustangs excepted). I know they must do some kind of training but I
have no idea what the requirements are.
I should be ashamed to admit it but I guess I'm too old to let my
crappy memory bother me.
Thanks for any help in enlightening the vast empty spaces in my mind.

Mark E. Williams

PS...I know there are other Marines in the Group but you were the
first one that poped into my mind. :o)
Sometimes it doesn't pay to stand out. LOL

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

"Maynard G. Krebbs" wrote in message
...
Hi Tom,
I was playing a little with "Nathan Branden" in ASA this evening and a
question occured to me and I'm sorry to say I don't know the answer.
My understanding is that Marine Corps Officers don't go to boot camp
(Mustangs excepted). I know they must do some kind of training but I
have no idea what the requirements are.
I should be ashamed to admit it but I guess I'm too old to let my
crappy memory bother me.
Thanks for any help in enlightening the vast empty spaces in my mind.

Mark E. Williams

PS...I know there are other Marines in the Group but you were the
first one that poped into my mind. :o)
Sometimes it doesn't pay to stand out. LOL


I'm not Tom and not an ex-jarhead .... (Navy) ..... but if the Marines are
like the Navy, the officers do indeed do a "boot camp" although it is much
shorter in duration than the boot camp the enlisted attend. Of course,
Navy training was a bit tougher, so maybe the Marines don't have to.
(Remember .... the Marines are a branch of the Navy)

Eisboch

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 19:34:32 -0500, Maynard G. Krebbs
wrote:

Sometimes it doesn't pay to stand out. LOL

Heh...

It's a little different that it was in my day, but basically you enter
through several programs - PLC (Platoon Leaders School), NROTC -
Marine concentration, OCS or through USNA.

After that, it's to what they now call The Basic School where they
have basically 6 months of Basic Training but with concentrations on
officer responsibilities.

The basic military training is provided by the base courses in college
or at USNA, then TBS, then operational speciality if that's an option.

Pretty cool actually.

http://www.tecom.usmc.mil/TBS/default.htm

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Sun, 1 Jul 2007 20:37:36 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:


"Maynard G. Krebbs" wrote in message
.. .
Hi Tom,
I was playing a little with "Nathan Branden" in ASA this evening and a
question occured to me and I'm sorry to say I don't know the answer.
My understanding is that Marine Corps Officers don't go to boot camp
(Mustangs excepted). I know they must do some kind of training but I
have no idea what the requirements are.
I should be ashamed to admit it but I guess I'm too old to let my
crappy memory bother me.
Thanks for any help in enlightening the vast empty spaces in my mind.

Mark E. Williams

PS...I know there are other Marines in the Group but you were the
first one that poped into my mind. :o)
Sometimes it doesn't pay to stand out. LOL


I'm not Tom and not an ex-jarhead .... (Navy) ..... but if the Marines are
like the Navy, the officers do indeed do a "boot camp" although it is much
shorter in duration than the boot camp the enlisted attend. Of course,
Navy training was a bit tougher, so maybe the Marines don't have to.
(Remember .... the Marines are a branch of the Navy)

Squiids - can't live with 'em, can't get there without 'em. :)

And it's former Jarhead thank you very much. :)

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 19:34:32 -0500, Maynard G. Krebbs
wrote:

I was playing a little with "Nathan Branden" in ASA this evening

What's ASA?

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 19:34:32 -0500, Maynard G. Krebbs
wrote:

I was playing a little with "Nathan Branden" in ASA this evening

What's ASA?

alt.sailing.asa

The nautical nut house of usenet.

Eisboch

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 19:34:32 -0500, Maynard G. Krebbs
wrote:

Sometimes it doesn't pay to stand out. LOL

Heh...

It's a little different that it was in my day, but basically you enter
through several programs - PLC (Platoon Leaders School), NROTC -
Marine concentration, OCS or through USNA.

After that, it's to what they now call The Basic School where they
have basically 6 months of Basic Training but with concentrations on
officer responsibilities.

The basic military training is provided by the base courses in college
or at USNA, then TBS, then operational speciality if that's an option.

Pretty cool actually.

http://www.tecom.usmc.mil/TBS/default.htm


The Navy teaches their NROTC guys how to speak Portuguese and find whore
houses in Rio. That's an important skill.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

I was actually in this program a few years back. I had a medical
disqualification. It turns out I am deathly allergic to petroleum
based products, who knew, and you can't get a waver for that. I got
pretty far along in the course before I had these issues so I do know
what I am talking about.

I was in the PLC program. Basically what happens is that instead of
boot camp you do Officer Candidate school, which many enlisted friends
of mine that were at OCS said is much harder that boot.The various
programs are in place because you have to be a college graduate to be
an officer and they want to get you through in a timely manner. The
PLC program did 6 weeks of OCS one summer then 6 weeks the next.
During the year while you are in school there is an office you train
out of and are expected to keep up your physical and mental
performance. There are other programs like ROTC and the OCC. They
are just variations on the same thing. After you graduate from OCS
and college you go to the basic school. 6 months of training that
they say is both the best and worst times you will have in the Corps.
Then you go to your specialty school. The Marine Corps is the only
military force in the world with anything like TBS. The Navy guys
will all talk about how much harder they had it but I hate to tell
them they are wrong but hey, any time we need to go fight they give us
a ride so please don't pick on them too much.

The thing about OCS in the Corp is that they don't help you through.
In boot if you want to be there and try hard they will make you into a
Marine. They have a very low drop-out rate comparatively. OCS has a
60% attrition rate. When I went it was much higher. We had 60% drop
in the first summer session. Not all of those go back and then
probably another 60% that did dropped in the seniors session. The
whole idea is to see if they can get you to quit and if you will break
under the pressure. You learn everything you need at TBS so here they
just try to see if you will quit. It's loads of fun.

Bill

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 18:36:38 -0700, Bill
wrote:

I was actually in this program a few years back. I had a medical
disqualification. It turns out I am deathly allergic to petroleum
based products, who knew, and you can't get a waver for that. I got
pretty far along in the course before I had these issues so I do know
what I am talking about.

That's gotta suck. Sorry about that.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

That's gotta suck. Sorry about that.

Thanks.

The thing that really is strange to me is how other people react. I
started the program in 99 when I was just starting college and along
the way 9/11 happened. Not long after I had my medical issues and I
couldn't get cleared by a doctor. A lot of people that new that I was
doing this told me afterwards "I bet your glad you aren't there now
huh?" That really ****es me off because I would like to be there with
the other Marines. If I could go and let one other Marine come home a
little earlier I would. I just tell them that I wanted this since I
was a kid and I not because we weren't at war at the time. Dreams are
hard to live, Marines are warriors, all of them. If you need them to
fight they go. It's that simple. I don't get why everyone thinks
that I would want to be here while my friends are fighting on the
other side of the planet. Now I'm older, graduated from college and
lot more cynical. I have a good job and a bright future but I would
go tomorrow if they said I could. I never officially earned my
commission but I still feel like every Marine is my brother. Most
people can't understand that I guess.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 19:34:32 -0500, Maynard G. Krebbs
wrote:

Sometimes it doesn't pay to stand out. LOL

Heh...

It's a little different that it was in my day, but basically you enter
through several programs - PLC (Platoon Leaders School), NROTC -
Marine concentration, OCS or through USNA.

After that, it's to what they now call The Basic School where they
have basically 6 months of Basic Training but with concentrations on
officer responsibilities.

The basic military training is provided by the base courses in college
or at USNA, then TBS, then operational speciality if that's an option.

Pretty cool actually.

http://www.tecom.usmc.mil/TBS/default.htm

If you walk in off the street and want to be a Marine Corps Officer you
go to OCS, Officer Candidate School, which is officer's boot camp and it
lasts about 11 or 12 weeks just about the same length as enlisted boot
camp, which is about 12 weeks. OCS stresses leadership enlisted boot
camp is all about discipline and following orders.

I have two cousins, first cousins, who are now 2nd Lt's in the USMC. One
fresh out of the USNA and the other one year out of BC and who went
through PLC. Damn kids weren't even born when I got out of the Corps.

My kids keep asking me if they should go into the military. I tell them
to wait until they graduate from college, officers have a much better
life in the military.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

I have two cousins, first cousins, who are now 2nd Lt's in the USMC. One
fresh out of the USNA and the other one year out of BC and who went
through PLC. Damn kids weren't even born when I got out of the Corps.

Do you know the difference between a 2nd Lt and a PFC? The PFC has
been promoted.



HAHHAHAAHAHA Old joke but I had to say it.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 23:11:27 -0400, BAR wrote:

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 19:34:32 -0500, Maynard G. Krebbs
wrote:

Sometimes it doesn't pay to stand out. LOL

Heh...

It's a little different that it was in my day, but basically you enter
through several programs - PLC (Platoon Leaders School), NROTC -
Marine concentration, OCS or through USNA.

After that, it's to what they now call The Basic School where they
have basically 6 months of Basic Training but with concentrations on
officer responsibilities.

The basic military training is provided by the base courses in college
or at USNA, then TBS, then operational speciality if that's an option.

Pretty cool actually.

http://www.tecom.usmc.mil/TBS/default.htm

If you walk in off the street and want to be a Marine Corps Officer you
go to OCS, Officer Candidate School, which is officer's boot camp and it
lasts about 11 or 12 weeks just about the same length as enlisted boot
camp, which is about 12 weeks. OCS stresses leadership enlisted boot
camp is all about discipline and following orders.

I have two cousins, first cousins, who are now 2nd Lt's in the USMC. One
fresh out of the USNA and the other one year out of BC and who went
through PLC. Damn kids weren't even born when I got out of the Corps.

My kids keep asking me if they should go into the military. I tell them
to wait until they graduate from college, officers have a much better
life in the military.

I wouldn't say that - it's just a different type of service. A lot
more responsibility, the decisions you make affect/effect a lot of
people and you still have to deal with higher ups that can be less
than perceptive.

I wouldn't trade my time as enlisted for anything in the world. Made
some life long friendships including the two guys who married Mrs.
Wave and me. :)

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 23:11:27 -0400, BAR wrote:



I wouldn't trade my time as enlisted for anything in the world. Made
some life long friendships including the two guys who married Mrs.
Wave and me. :)


Hmmm.... I have to think about that one for a while. Meanwhile, let's put
the overnighter to the Vineyard on hold for a while .... :-)

Eisboch

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 06:59:05 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 23:11:27 -0400, BAR wrote:



I wouldn't trade my time as enlisted for anything in the world. Made
some life long friendships including the two guys who married Mrs.
Wave and me. :)


Hmmm.... I have to think about that one for a while. Meanwhile, let's put
the overnighter to the Vineyard on hold for a while .... :-)

One is a priest and the other is a minister.

~~ mutter ~~

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 18:36:38 -0700, Bill
wrote:

I was actually in this program a few years back. I had a medical
disqualification. It turns out I am deathly allergic to petroleum
based products, who knew, and you can't get a waver for that. I got
pretty far along in the course before I had these issues so I do know
what I am talking about.

I was in the PLC program. Basically what happens is that instead of
boot camp you do Officer Candidate school, which many enlisted friends
of mine that were at OCS said is much harder that boot.The various
programs are in place because you have to be a college graduate to be
an officer and they want to get you through in a timely manner. The
PLC program did 6 weeks of OCS one summer then 6 weeks the next.
During the year while you are in school there is an office you train
out of and are expected to keep up your physical and mental
performance. There are other programs like ROTC and the OCC. They
are just variations on the same thing. After you graduate from OCS
and college you go to the basic school. 6 months of training that
they say is both the best and worst times you will have in the Corps.
Then you go to your specialty school. The Marine Corps is the only
military force in the world with anything like TBS. The Navy guys
will all talk about how much harder they had it but I hate to tell
them they are wrong but hey, any time we need to go fight they give us
a ride so please don't pick on them too much.

The thing about OCS in the Corp is that they don't help you through.
In boot if you want to be there and try hard they will make you into a
Marine. They have a very low drop-out rate comparatively. OCS has a
60% attrition rate. When I went it was much higher. We had 60% drop
in the first summer session. Not all of those go back and then
probably another 60% that did dropped in the seniors session. The
whole idea is to see if they can get you to quit and if you will break
under the pressure. You learn everything you need at TBS so here they
just try to see if you will quit. It's loads of fun.

Bill


Sorry to hear that Bill. Nothing you can do about that kind of health
issue. I know it's hard to lose a dream.

The rate of sucess in finishing boot camp as an enlisted person isn't
brought about by them helping you through. LOL It's because you have
very few choices other than graduate. Graduation, death and
illness/injury requiring discharge are the only ways out of boot camp
for enlisted personel.

Dropping-out as an enlisted person comes only later after volunteering
for elite training such as Force Recon. There you are just sent back
to your prior unit if you drop-out. The point is to drive out
everyone who knows how to quit so you don't waste expensive training
on a non-hackers. (It's the same with BUDS for the SEALs.)


Mark E. Williams

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

Maynard G. Krebbs wrote:
On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 18:36:38 -0700, Bill
wrote:

I was actually in this program a few years back. I had a medical
disqualification. It turns out I am deathly allergic to petroleum
based products, who knew, and you can't get a waver for that. I got
pretty far along in the course before I had these issues so I do know
what I am talking about.

I was in the PLC program. Basically what happens is that instead of
boot camp you do Officer Candidate school, which many enlisted friends
of mine that were at OCS said is much harder that boot.The various
programs are in place because you have to be a college graduate to be
an officer and they want to get you through in a timely manner. The
PLC program did 6 weeks of OCS one summer then 6 weeks the next.
During the year while you are in school there is an office you train
out of and are expected to keep up your physical and mental
performance. There are other programs like ROTC and the OCC. They
are just variations on the same thing. After you graduate from OCS
and college you go to the basic school. 6 months of training that
they say is both the best and worst times you will have in the Corps.
Then you go to your specialty school. The Marine Corps is the only
military force in the world with anything like TBS. The Navy guys
will all talk about how much harder they had it but I hate to tell
them they are wrong but hey, any time we need to go fight they give us
a ride so please don't pick on them too much.

The thing about OCS in the Corp is that they don't help you through.
In boot if you want to be there and try hard they will make you into a
Marine. They have a very low drop-out rate comparatively. OCS has a
60% attrition rate. When I went it was much higher. We had 60% drop
in the first summer session. Not all of those go back and then
probably another 60% that did dropped in the seniors session. The
whole idea is to see if they can get you to quit and if you will break
under the pressure. You learn everything you need at TBS so here they
just try to see if you will quit. It's loads of fun.

Bill


Sorry to hear that Bill. Nothing you can do about that kind of health
issue. I know it's hard to lose a dream.

The rate of sucess in finishing boot camp as an enlisted person isn't
brought about by them helping you through. LOL It's because you have
very few choices other than graduate. Graduation, death and
illness/injury requiring discharge are the only ways out of boot camp
for enlisted personel.

We had many guys drink Wisk, try to escape the island or jack-off in
front of one of the DI's. This got them a quick transfer to medical hold
company. There we guys there 3 to 4 months being "evaluated" for discharge.

Graduation morning we had a private get re-cycled back to training day
1. He was dressed in his Charlie's and had to do the sea-bag drag across
the grinder to get into his new platoon while the rest of us were doing
final review.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

Bill wrote:
I have two cousins, first cousins, who are now 2nd Lt's in the USMC. One
fresh out of the USNA and the other one year out of BC and who went
through PLC. Damn kids weren't even born when I got out of the Corps.

Do you know the difference between a 2nd Lt and a PFC? The PFC has
been promoted.

Who salutes who?

Reminds me of my cousins graduation from Annapolis this past May. The
Blue Angles did a fly by and you could see faces of the pilots. They
were no more than 75 yards away. It was awesome.

The funniest thing was all of the old Gunner's walking around in their
Charlies, flaming asshole on one collar and bar on the other getting a
kick out of saluting all of the new boot louie's and Ensigns. Some of
these guys were in need of walkers but they were having a great time.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 22:30:53 -0400, BAR wrote:



We had many guys drink Wisk, try to escape the island or jack-off in
front of one of the DI's. This got them a quick transfer to medical hold
company. There we guys there 3 to 4 months being "evaluated" for discharge.

There was no Wisk when I was in boot. I think one guy in my company
went over the fence, and one was discharged for "flat feet."
A guy did get caught by the OOD jacking-off while on watch, but he
just suffered KP and embarrassment.
Being a jack-off never disqualified anybody from being in the Navy.

--Vic

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 22:36:10 -0400, BAR wrote:

Bill wrote:
I have two cousins, first cousins, who are now 2nd Lt's in the USMC. One
fresh out of the USNA and the other one year out of BC and who went
through PLC. Damn kids weren't even born when I got out of the Corps.

Do you know the difference between a 2nd Lt and a PFC? The PFC has
been promoted.

Who salutes who?

I always felt some sympathy for officers walking around D&S piers or
NOB in Norfolk. I might salute two or three times walking from my
ship to the gate, while they had to do it maybe a few hundred times.
Sometimes they would hug the walls of buildings, heads averted
so they wouldn't get saluted for the 3 hundredth time in the past ten
minutes. They probably suffered carpal tunnel syndrome.
One time I was walking down the pier away from my can headed for
liberty and a buddy started yakking at me from the ship. I ended up
walking backwards for a bit carrying on the talk and as I turned
around again I bumped into the corner of a limo which had stopped to
keep from running over me.
I think it the first and only time I had seen a non-noisy, non-truck
vehicle on the pier. As I regained my balance he continued slowly
ahead, and I gave the driver a dirty look, not paying attention to the
flag flying on the antenna.
That look was still on my face as the back seat passed. Co
incidently, the flag was the 2nd Fleet flag, and it was the Admiral of
the 2nd Fleet in the back seat, and he got all insulted by me giving
him a dirty look too.
I played stupid and kept walking but sure enough he had his driver
stop and he came storming down the pier after me, with a shout of
Sailor!!
I stopped and turned around, then played Marine, coming to sharp
attention and saluting.
YES SIR!!!
The Admiral was all flustered, and actually sputtering under all those
scrambled eggs on his hat.
"D-D-Didn't you see my car?!!!"
NO SIR!!!
SORRY SIR!!!
MY FAULT SIR!!!
He could see I was dressed sharp, looked sharp, and acted sharp.
I was still at salute since he hadn't yet returned it.
I swear he sputtered out, "B-B-Be a good sailor now!"
YES SIR!!
Then he saluted me and walked back to his limo and I went on liberty,
thinking I don't know what the hell that was all about, but that YES
SIR and saluting stuff sure works good on Admirals.
One time I was sitting on bollard near the quarterdeck with my legs
stretched out. A Captain - Cunningham I think - was piped aboard
and somehow managed to trip over my feet. He dawdled on the
quarterdeck and I thought he was gone so had relaxed.
I did the same SORRY SIR!!! routine on him and he was ok with it,
but my Captain chased the quartermaster after me later with a
reprimand. Can't say I blame him. His crew shouldn't be tripping
visiting Captains.
I was in the day after I turned 17, and it took me a couple years to
learn how to avoid trouble.

--Vic

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

Do you know the difference between a 2nd Lt and a PFC? The PFC has
been promoted.

Who salutes who?

They salute each other and the officer has to do it a lot more times
every day.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 22:36:10 -0400, BAR wrote:

Bill wrote:
I have two cousins, first cousins, who are now 2nd Lt's in the USMC. One
fresh out of the USNA and the other one year out of BC and who went
through PLC. Damn kids weren't even born when I got out of the Corps.

Do you know the difference between a 2nd Lt and a PFC? The PFC has
been promoted.

Who salutes who?

Reminds me of my cousins graduation from Annapolis this past May. The
Blue Angles did a fly by and you could see faces of the pilots. They
were no more than 75 yards away. It was awesome.

I saw that at my oldest's graduation. It an incredible sight.

Were you there for the air show the day before?

The funniest thing was all of the old Gunner's walking around in their
Charlies, flaming asshole on one collar and bar on the other getting a
kick out of saluting all of the new boot louie's and Ensigns. Some of
these guys were in need of walkers but they were having a great time.

Heh.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 23:31:26 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

I was in the day after I turned 17, and it took me a couple years to
learn how to avoid trouble.

I was at El Toro once on manuevers and there was a gaggle of Europeans
there watching.

You couldn't tell the NATO officers from the enlisted types.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 22:36:10 -0400, BAR wrote:

Bill wrote:
I have two cousins, first cousins, who are now 2nd Lt's in the USMC. One
fresh out of the USNA and the other one year out of BC and who went
through PLC. Damn kids weren't even born when I got out of the Corps.
Do you know the difference between a 2nd Lt and a PFC? The PFC has
been promoted.
Who salutes who?

Reminds me of my cousins graduation from Annapolis this past May. The
Blue Angles did a fly by and you could see faces of the pilots. They
were no more than 75 yards away. It was awesome.

I saw that at my oldest's graduation. It an incredible sight.

Were you there for the air show the day before?

No, this thing called work got in the way.

But, I did see them back in 1976 at Annapolis. My dad was putting some
serious heat on me to follow in the his footsteps and attend the
academy, it is a great show.

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 23:31:26 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:


I was in the day after I turned 17, and it took me a couple years to
learn how to avoid trouble.

But I still ain't learnt.
Got a new credit card a couple days ago because I had a bogus charge
so they canceled the old one.
Used it for first time today for a 100 buck purchase.
Good, it worked. Didn't have enough cash for that purchase..
Then went to village hall to buy yard waste stickers.
32 bucks. I figured I'd keep my 40 bucks cash so asked the gal to
charge it. Gave her the card. Denied. Tried again. Denied.
Mentioned I just used the thing to charge 100 bucks. She tried again.
Denied. I paid cash and we chatted about bogus charges, cards not
working, etc.
So I went home to call the CC company instead of going to buy the
lumber as I planned. My wife was going shopping after work for 4th
brats and other picnic stuff, and would be using her card for the
first time. Didn't want her getting skunked at the checkout with a
cart full of goodies.
I pulled the CC out of my wallet to get the phone number and noticed
the card looked worn. It was the old canceled card.
The new one was right next to it.
So though I normally would have cut the old card up as soon as it was
canceled, I slacked off for a minute and failed to do it.
It's now 43 years later, and I'm still f**king up.
Don't know how you might relate this to boating - easy enough - but
it's a damn good reason why I don't go sky diving.

--Vic

Ping...Shortwave Tom - Corps question
 

On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 22:36:10 -0400, BAR wrote:

Bill wrote:
I have two cousins, first cousins, who are now 2nd Lt's in the USMC. One
fresh out of the USNA and the other one year out of BC and who went
through PLC. Damn kids weren't even born when I got out of the Corps.

Do you know the difference between a 2nd Lt and a PFC? The PFC has
been promoted.

Who salutes who?

Reminds me of my cousins graduation from Annapolis this past May. The
Blue Angles did a fly by and you could see faces of the pilots. They
were no more than 75 yards away. It was awesome.

The funniest thing was all of the old Gunner's walking around in their
Charlies, flaming asshole on one collar and bar on the other getting a
kick out of saluting all of the new boot louie's and Ensigns. Some of
these guys were in need of walkers but they were having a great time.

For a real thrill, go play the Oceana Naval Air Station golf courses in
Virginia Beach. The F-18's practice touch 'n goes all day, right over your
head. I'm very surprised they didn't issue ear plugs along with the cart
keys!
--
John H