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Some food for those who still think
Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't
it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. "HarryKrause" wrote in message ... Stories From the Front by Cindy Sheehan Lisa from Washington State writes: My son in law in Iraq said they are being pressured round the clock to re-enlist or face stop loss. They are being offered $30,000 signing bonus, tax free and told if they don't re-enlist, they are going to be stop-lossed and get zero dollars. They are pushing the troops round the clock and Mark only got 3 hours sleep in 48 hours and when they get back, they are faced yet again with re-enlisting. Mark said many guys are scared and signing up and their families at home are very upset. (with good reason) We really need to push our media and congressmen to expose the horrible way our troops are being treated. Lietta, also from Washington State writes: Yes, I have been trying since January 05 to get the word out regarding my own 2 loved ones and the soldiers in their division. Both served in Iraq, and their division, 1st Armored, was the first to be 'extended' so they served 15 months in Iraq, April 03–July 04. They came back to their bases in August 04. A mere 5 months later, Jan 05, their division was told they were under orders to redeploy to Iraq and Stop Lossed and would redeploy in Fall 05. And I have been trying to call attention to the 'Retention' practices ever since. March 05, it was time for both to make decision to re-enlist. As already under orders to redeploy; as already under Stop Loss; their choices = 1) don't re-enlist but you will wind up in Iraq anyway under Stop Loss or 2) re-enlist and while you'll still wind up in Iraq under Stop Loss, at least you'll have the attractive bonus being offered. The point is that the 'Retention' rate that is being touted as demonstrative of soldier's fervor and good faith in the war is another deception being foisted on the media and public.Closer to the truth of the situation is that one they are in, they cannot get out and it is entrapment from the front end with deceptive recruitment practices, again at re-enlistment time with the threat of deployment to Iraq under Stop Loss, again when contract ends and they are kept in and deployed via Stop Loss. What continues to be called an 'all voluntary military' has become an 'involuntary' military through the use strategies of deception and legal maneuvering for which there seems to be no remedy in the Stop Loss. Tia from Baltimore writes (her stepson was KIA in Iraq): But I will never forget one thing: the day we dropped David off for boot camp – the day his father and I first met the recruiter – the recruiter put out his hand, smiled at me, shook my hand and said "you'll never have to worry about him again." I was shocked. I can only speculate what this person was telling David. These are not isolated stories from the illegal occupation but they are illustrative of what is happening to our young people who thought they were doing the right and honorable thing by enlisting in the military. This is an immoral war that our troops never should have been sent to in the first place, and once they are there and have done their time, it is very difficult for them to get out of the distant mental desert and come home to their loved ones. Not only are the backend policies of retention shady, but the front-end policies of recruiting our vulnerable youth are often downright unethical. Few citizens in our country (I know I didn’t) realize that an enlistment contract is only binding on the recruit. Once the recruit raises his/her right hand and swears allegiance to the government, that recruit becomes the property of Uncle Sam and is bound by the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Ethics, promises, and moral correctness often fly out the window as servitude, hardship, and heartache fly in. The only recruiting story I know by heart, and can effectively comment on, is my son Casey’s. I have heard too many similar stories, however. When he was recruited in May 2000, he was promised the moon to get him to join, and he ultimately got an early grave. He was promised a $20,000 signing bonus: he received $4500 and was told that he could use the rest for college. Casey wanted to be a deacon in the Catholic Church, so when he enlisted in the Army, he was promised he could be a Chaplain’s Assistant: don’t believe the Army Band stories, either. When he got to boot camp, he was told that his promised specialty wasn’t open, and he had the choice of being a Humvee mechanic or a cook. His recruiter told him he could finish college while in the military, he could never even get approval to take one class. All of these broken promises mean nothing to me. One does, however. After Casey enlisted he knew I was upset. He told me, "Mom, you don’t have to worry, Sgt. (I forget his name) told me that since I scored so high on the ASVAB (military competency) test, I will never see combat, even if there is a war. I will only be in a support role." I can still hear his voice saying those exact words to me. Those words chilled me to the bone then, and have haunted me since 9/11. First of all, because I thought Casey would be sent to fight terrorists (and "terrorists") wherever they might be, and I could see George and his warmongering band of neocons rushing us into a crazy invasion of Iraq. My premonition came true and Casey was KIA 04/04/04: a mere 5 days after his unit arrived in Sadr City, Baghdad: IN COMBAT. The most troubling thing is, though, that some recruiters are still promising young people that they won’t have to go to Iraq if they sign up. I am being told that all the time by young people who talk to the multi-level marketers working towards their bonuses…oops, I mean military recruiters. As long as our young people are being lied to and used so dishonorably in an unjust invasion and occupation of another country; as long as they are fighting for a corrupt government and still without the proper equipment, food, training, or leadership; as long as moms are having to hold bake sales to buy their sons body armor; as long as our soldiers are being held against their wills long after they have done their duty; as long as they are being sent to kill innocent people; military service should be opposed. Let’s affirm life in the fullest for everybody: the unfortunate, uncounted people living Iraq who are "acceptable" collateral damage to the war hawks, and our own indispensable loved ones. The only way to support our troops is to bring them home from this mess – now. The American public and Congress need to hear more stories from the front. The tragedy and atrocities of this occupation need to be in the forefront of every American’s mind, so there can be an uprising of peace. If you have a story similar to the ones I have told, please forward them to me. Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-Oh) would like to put these stories, now engraved only in our hearts, into the Congressional Record. Thank you. Information on the Homeward Bound Bill. July 13, 2005 Cindy Sheehan [send her mail] is the mother of Spc. Casey Austin Sheehan, KIA 04/04/04 She is co-founder of Gold Star Families for Peace. -- Let's pray the United States survives the rest of Bush's term. |
"NOYB" wrote in message ink.net... Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? Can you imagine what the world would be like if the military of WWII was filled with whiners like that? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. "HarryKrause" wrote in message ... Stories From the Front by Cindy Sheehan Lisa from Washington State writes: My son in law in Iraq said they are being pressured round the clock to re-enlist or face stop loss. They are being offered $30,000 signing bonus, tax free and told if they don't re-enlist, they are going to be stop-lossed and get zero dollars. They are pushing the troops round the clock and Mark only got 3 hours sleep in 48 hours and when they get back, they are faced yet again with re-enlisting. Mark said many guys are scared and signing up and their families at home are very upset. (with good reason) We really need to push our media and congressmen to expose the horrible way our troops are being treated. Lietta, also from Washington State writes: Yes, I have been trying since January 05 to get the word out regarding my own 2 loved ones and the soldiers in their division. Both served in Iraq, and their division, 1st Armored, was the first to be 'extended' so they served 15 months in Iraq, April 03-July 04. They came back to their bases in August 04. A mere 5 months later, Jan 05, their division was told they were under orders to redeploy to Iraq and Stop Lossed and would redeploy in Fall 05. And I have been trying to call attention to the 'Retention' practices ever since. March 05, it was time for both to make decision to re-enlist. As already under orders to redeploy; as already under Stop Loss; their choices = 1) don't re-enlist but you will wind up in Iraq anyway under Stop Loss or 2) re-enlist and while you'll still wind up in Iraq under Stop Loss, at least you'll have the attractive bonus being offered. The point is that the 'Retention' rate that is being touted as demonstrative of soldier's fervor and good faith in the war is another deception being foisted on the media and public.Closer to the truth of the situation is that one they are in, they cannot get out and it is entrapment from the front end with deceptive recruitment practices, again at re-enlistment time with the threat of deployment to Iraq under Stop Loss, again when contract ends and they are kept in and deployed via Stop Loss. What continues to be called an 'all voluntary military' has become an 'involuntary' military through the use strategies of deception and legal maneuvering for which there seems to be no remedy in the Stop Loss. Tia from Baltimore writes (her stepson was KIA in Iraq): But I will never forget one thing: the day we dropped David off for boot camp - the day his father and I first met the recruiter - the recruiter put out his hand, smiled at me, shook my hand and said "you'll never have to worry about him again." I was shocked. I can only speculate what this person was telling David. These are not isolated stories from the illegal occupation but they are illustrative of what is happening to our young people who thought they were doing the right and honorable thing by enlisting in the military. This is an immoral war that our troops never should have been sent to in the first place, and once they are there and have done their time, it is very difficult for them to get out of the distant mental desert and come home to their loved ones. Not only are the backend policies of retention shady, but the front-end policies of recruiting our vulnerable youth are often downright unethical. Few citizens in our country (I know I didn't) realize that an enlistment contract is only binding on the recruit. Once the recruit raises his/her right hand and swears allegiance to the government, that recruit becomes the property of Uncle Sam and is bound by the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Ethics, promises, and moral correctness often fly out the window as servitude, hardship, and heartache fly in. The only recruiting story I know by heart, and can effectively comment on, is my son Casey's. I have heard too many similar stories, however. When he was recruited in May 2000, he was promised the moon to get him to join, and he ultimately got an early grave. He was promised a $20,000 signing bonus: he received $4500 and was told that he could use the rest for college. Casey wanted to be a deacon in the Catholic Church, so when he enlisted in the Army, he was promised he could be a Chaplain's Assistant: don't believe the Army Band stories, either. When he got to boot camp, he was told that his promised specialty wasn't open, and he had the choice of being a Humvee mechanic or a cook. His recruiter told him he could finish college while in the military, he could never even get approval to take one class. All of these broken promises mean nothing to me. One does, however. After Casey enlisted he knew I was upset. He told me, "Mom, you don't have to worry, Sgt. (I forget his name) told me that since I scored so high on the ASVAB (military competency) test, I will never see combat, even if there is a war. I will only be in a support role." I can still hear his voice saying those exact words to me. Those words chilled me to the bone then, and have haunted me since 9/11. First of all, because I thought Casey would be sent to fight terrorists (and "terrorists") wherever they might be, and I could see George and his warmongering band of neocons rushing us into a crazy invasion of Iraq. My premonition came true and Casey was KIA 04/04/04: a mere 5 days after his unit arrived in Sadr City, Baghdad: IN COMBAT. The most troubling thing is, though, that some recruiters are still promising young people that they won't have to go to Iraq if they sign up. I am being told that all the time by young people who talk to the multi-level marketers working towards their bonuses.oops, I mean military recruiters. As long as our young people are being lied to and used so dishonorably in an unjust invasion and occupation of another country; as long as they are fighting for a corrupt government and still without the proper equipment, food, training, or leadership; as long as moms are having to hold bake sales to buy their sons body armor; as long as our soldiers are being held against their wills long after they have done their duty; as long as they are being sent to kill innocent people; military service should be opposed. Let's affirm life in the fullest for everybody: the unfortunate, uncounted people living Iraq who are "acceptable" collateral damage to the war hawks, and our own indispensable loved ones. The only way to support our troops is to bring them home from this mess - now. The American public and Congress need to hear more stories from the front. The tragedy and atrocities of this occupation need to be in the forefront of every American's mind, so there can be an uprising of peace. If you have a story similar to the ones I have told, please forward them to me. Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-Oh) would like to put these stories, now engraved only in our hearts, into the Congressional Record. Thank you. Information on the Homeward Bound Bill. July 13, 2005 Cindy Sheehan [send her mail] is the mother of Spc. Casey Austin Sheehan, KIA 04/04/04 She is co-founder of Gold Star Families for Peace. -- Let's pray the United States survives the rest of Bush's term. |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 20:08:06 +0000, NOYB wrote:
Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? True, but some of these young men and women are on their third tour of Iraq. It seems to me, we are asking too much of too few. |
NOYB wrote:
Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Actually, I think Dutch soldiers have a union. |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:13:38 -0400, P. Fritz wrote:
Can you imagine what the world would be like if the military of WWII was filled with whiners like that? The military of WWII was filled with whiners just like that. They did their job, but they also whined, just like our soldiers in Iraq are doing. |
"HarryKrause" wrote in message ... Stories From the Front by Cindy Sheehan Lisa from Washington State writes: My son in law in Iraq said they are being pressured round the clock to re-enlist or face stop loss. snip Not true according to my friends who both have sons in the Marines, including one presently stationed in Baghdad and one who is soon to go to Iraq. How valid is this story you cut and pasted off the internet Harry? Do you really believe everything you read on the net? (I guess you do). |
HarryKrause wrote:
Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. It would be a real service for someone to make those recruiters put their promises on paper and have the 'contract' duly notarized. It might stop some of the outrageous lies and deception. (wonder how many 'recruits' they would sign up then) |
"thunder" wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Actually, I think Dutch soldiers have a union. That would go over big. Officer: Take that hill. Troops: Its time for our 15 minute morning break. |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:09:57 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Because you can't find a decent job anywhere. This from one who tells Tom he has the highest respect for the military! Harry, you're a card. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 20:53:27 GMT, Don White wrote:
NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. AFGE? -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Thunderous applause... Any soldier has the ability write his congressman about alleged improprieties. Very few members of Congress would let such abuses go by. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 23:33:44 GMT, Don White wrote:
HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. It would be a real service for someone to make those recruiters put their promises on paper and have the 'contract' duly notarized. It might stop some of the outrageous lies and deception. (wonder how many 'recruits' they would sign up then) Their promises are put on paper. It's called an Enlistment Contract. http://usmilitary.about.com/library/pdf/enlistment.pdf Read it carefully. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 19:37:10 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
*JimH* wrote: "HarryKrause" wrote in message ... Stories From the Front by Cindy Sheehan Lisa from Washington State writes: My son in law in Iraq said they are being pressured round the clock to re-enlist or face stop loss. snip Not true according to my friends who both have sons in the Marines, including one presently stationed in Baghdad and one who is soon to go to Iraq. How valid is this story you cut and pasted off the internet Harry? Do you really believe everything you read on the net? (I guess you do). I have no reason to doubt the veracity of "Lisa" from Washington State. I have no reason to believe anything you post. Tell Lisa that she should send a letter to the parents, etc, telling them to send their complaint to the Inspector General and their congressmen/women (if they are legitimate). -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 19:37:10 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
*JimH* wrote: "HarryKrause" wrote in message ... Stories From the Front by Cindy Sheehan Lisa from Washington State writes: My son in law in Iraq said they are being pressured round the clock to re-enlist or face stop loss. snip Not true according to my friends who both have sons in the Marines, including one presently stationed in Baghdad and one who is soon to go to Iraq. How valid is this story you cut and pasted off the internet Harry? Do you really believe everything you read on the net? (I guess you do). I have no reason to doubt the veracity of "Lisa" from Washington State. I have no reason to believe anything you post. PS, "Stop Loss" is not something that is at the discretion of the local company commander. Individuals are not stop-lossed, units or military occupational specialties may be. No commander has the ability to 'stop loss' someone for not reenlisting. One would not expect you to know better. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
"HarryKrause" wrote in message ... Stories From the Front by Cindy Sheehan Lisa from Washington State writes: My son in law in Iraq said they are being pressured round the clock to re-enlist or face stop loss. snip Not true according to my friends who both have sons in the Marines, including one presently stationed in Baghdad and one who is soon to go to Iraq. How valid is this story you cut and pasted off the internet Harry? Do you really believe everything you read on the net? (I guess you do). I have no reason to doubt the veracity of "Lisa" from Washington State. I have no reason to believe anything you post. Why am I not surprised? What was PT Barnum's saying about a fool being born every minute? ;-) |
"John H." wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:09:57 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Because you can't find a decent job anywhere. This from one who tells Tom he has the highest respect for the military! Harry, you're a card. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD His lies keep piling up. |
Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. A soldiers union? OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Take me Lord....I have now seen everything. |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 20:42:09 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
John H. wrote: On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 23:33:44 GMT, Don White wrote: HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. It would be a real service for someone to make those recruiters put their promises on paper and have the 'contract' duly notarized. It might stop some of the outrageous lies and deception. (wonder how many 'recruits' they would sign up then) Their promises are put on paper. It's called an Enlistment Contract. http://usmilitary.about.com/library/pdf/enlistment.pdf Read it carefully. Another crock of crap from our military apologist. Let's see...who was President in August 1998? Oh my goodness! We owe this gem of a contract to Mr. Clinton! -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 20:43:07 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
John H. wrote: On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 19:37:10 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: *JimH* wrote: "HarryKrause" wrote in message ... Stories From the Front by Cindy Sheehan Lisa from Washington State writes: My son in law in Iraq said they are being pressured round the clock to re-enlist or face stop loss. snip Not true according to my friends who both have sons in the Marines, including one presently stationed in Baghdad and one who is soon to go to Iraq. How valid is this story you cut and pasted off the internet Harry? Do you really believe everything you read on the net? (I guess you do). I have no reason to doubt the veracity of "Lisa" from Washington State. I have no reason to believe anything you post. PS, "Stop Loss" is not something that is at the discretion of the local company commander. Individuals are not stop-lossed, units or military occupational specialties may be. No commander has the ability to 'stop loss' someone for not reenlisting. One would not expect you to know better. Doesn't mean an unsophisticated grunt at the front would know that. You've never been there, Harry, so how do you know what they know? Those 'unsophisticated grunts' (as you call them), have a lot more intelligence and 'sophistication' than you give them credit for. Stop putting down those whose shoes you don't fit, let alone have ever walked in. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. It would be a real service for someone to make those recruiters put their promises on paper and have the 'contract' duly notarized. It might stop some of the outrageous lies and deception. (wonder how many 'recruits' they would sign up then) Their promises are put on paper. It's called an Enlistment Contract. http://usmilitary.about.com/library/pdf/enlistment.pdf Read it carefully. Another crock of crap from our military apologist. Why aren't you out on your custom made 36 foot lobster boat Krause? Heck, even when we had our modest 32 footer we would spend every summer weekend (and vacation days) on it cruising around. But you seem to post here 24 x 7. Go figure. |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 20:59:32 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
John H. wrote: On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 20:42:09 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: John H. wrote: On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 23:33:44 GMT, Don White wrote: HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. It would be a real service for someone to make those recruiters put their promises on paper and have the 'contract' duly notarized. It might stop some of the outrageous lies and deception. (wonder how many 'recruits' they would sign up then) Their promises are put on paper. It's called an Enlistment Contract. http://usmilitary.about.com/library/pdf/enlistment.pdf Read it carefully. Another crock of crap from our military apologist. Let's see...who was President in August 1998? Oh my goodness! We owe this gem of a contract to Mr. Clinton! We're talking about recruiters who tell their prey lies, and officers in the field who tell their troops lies. Tell that to Don. He's the one who brought up the enlistment contract. Or, did you miss that? *You* are talking about the 'lies'. I have no expertise in that. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
"John H." wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Thunderous applause... Any soldier has the ability write his congressman about alleged improprieties. Very few members of Congress would let such abuses go by. In boot camp we had recruits that said they were going to write to their congressman and complain about how they were being treated. Then once out in the fleet at the mess halls all of the messmen on the line were bitching and complaing about being cooks. They were all talking about their lawyers were going to get them out. These guys went in on open contracts and were place in MOS's that needed men of their "capabilities." If the troops are bitching then you have something to worry about! |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:02:09 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:
HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. It would be a real service for someone to make those recruiters put their promises on paper and have the 'contract' duly notarized. It might stop some of the outrageous lies and deception. (wonder how many 'recruits' they would sign up then) Their promises are put on paper. It's called an Enlistment Contract. http://usmilitary.about.com/library/pdf/enlistment.pdf Read it carefully. Another crock of crap from our military apologist. Why aren't you out on your custom made 36 foot lobster boat Krause? Heck, even when we had our modest 32 footer we would spend every summer weekend (and vacation days) on it cruising around. But you seem to post here 24 x 7. Go figure. Hold down the fort, Jim. I've got to go watch the Tour de France. Today they went through the Col de la Madelaine, a pass I rode through on my motorcycle with a friend from Holland. Gotta see if they are any faster! -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
"John H." wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:02:09 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote: HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. It would be a real service for someone to make those recruiters put their promises on paper and have the 'contract' duly notarized. It might stop some of the outrageous lies and deception. (wonder how many 'recruits' they would sign up then) Their promises are put on paper. It's called an Enlistment Contract. http://usmilitary.about.com/library/pdf/enlistment.pdf Read it carefully. Another crock of crap from our military apologist. Why aren't you out on your custom made 36 foot lobster boat Krause? Heck, even when we had our modest 32 footer we would spend every summer weekend (and vacation days) on it cruising around. But you seem to post here 24 x 7. Go figure. Hold down the fort, Jim. I've got to go watch the Tour de France. Today they went through the Col de la Madelaine, a pass I rode through on my motorcycle with a friend from Holland. Gotta see if they are any faster! -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD I was talking about Krause, not you John. Heck, Krause said he had 20 or so union brothers on his boat last week. Must be a biggun. Yo-Bro.......Yo-Whore....Yo-Hoe |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:07:24 -0400, "Bert Robbins" wrote:
"John H." wrote in message .. . On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Thunderous applause... Any soldier has the ability write his congressman about alleged improprieties. Very few members of Congress would let such abuses go by. In boot camp we had recruits that said they were going to write to their congressman and complain about how they were being treated. Then once out in the fleet at the mess halls all of the messmen on the line were bitching and complaing about being cooks. They were all talking about their lawyers were going to get them out. These guys went in on open contracts and were place in MOS's that needed men of their "capabilities." If the troops are bitching then you have something to worry about! I know you meant to say, "aren't" bitching! -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:14:09 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
Bert Robbins wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Thunderous applause... Any soldier has the ability write his congressman about alleged improprieties. Very few members of Congress would let such abuses go by. In boot camp we had recruits that said they were going to write to their congressman and complain about how they were being treated. Then once out in the fleet at the mess halls all of the messmen on the line were bitching and complaing about being cooks. They were all talking about their lawyers were going to get them out. These guys went in on open contracts and were place in MOS's that needed men of their "capabilities." If the troops are bitching then you have something to worry about! Your most dangerous time in the stateside marines was...what...the gang showers? Your most dangerous time in the military was... Oh, that's right. You couldn't hack boot camp. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
"John H." wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:14:09 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Bert Robbins wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Thunderous applause... Any soldier has the ability write his congressman about alleged improprieties. Very few members of Congress would let such abuses go by. In boot camp we had recruits that said they were going to write to their congressman and complain about how they were being treated. Then once out in the fleet at the mess halls all of the messmen on the line were bitching and complaing about being cooks. They were all talking about their lawyers were going to get them out. These guys went in on open contracts and were place in MOS's that needed men of their "capabilities." If the troops are bitching then you have something to worry about! Your most dangerous time in the stateside marines was...what...the gang showers? Your most dangerous time in the military was... Oh, that's right. You couldn't hack boot camp. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD I remember him boasting on a Veterans Day several years back about still being able to squeeze into his *uniform*. When pressed on the issue (as someone found a post of his previously stating he never served in the military) he eventually admitted it was his donut or ice cream *uniform* from college. The guy is really a POS. |
"thunder" wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 20:08:06 +0000, NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? True, but some of these young men and women are on their third tour of Iraq. It seems to me, we are asking too much of too few. The great majority of Marines are re-enlisting on their own accord. |
"HarryKrause" wrote in message ... Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Union workers might be Democrats, but they're patriots first. When you're up there, try and start bad-mouthing the "average soldier" (and how stupid you think he is), and see how far you get. I doubt you'll return "unbloodied". |
Bert Robbins wrote:
"thunder" wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Actually, I think Dutch soldiers have a union. That would go over big. Officer: Take that hill. Troops: Its time for our 15 minute morning break. Or they might say...we have a better way than rush up into the opening under machine gun fire to massage some idiot Co's ego. |
*JimH* wrote:
A soldiers union? OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Take me Lord....I have now seen everything. The Lord might have a special place for you 'pretend preachers'. |
"HarryKrause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Actually during peace time the Coast Guard see light actio from smugglers and what not more than anybody else. -- Bob La Londe http://www.YumaBassMan.com |
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 22:48:07 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
John H. wrote: On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:14:09 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Bert Robbins wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Thunderous applause... Any soldier has the ability write his congressman about alleged improprieties. Very few members of Congress would let such abuses go by. In boot camp we had recruits that said they were going to write to their congressman and complain about how they were being treated. Then once out in the fleet at the mess halls all of the messmen on the line were bitching and complaing about being cooks. They were all talking about their lawyers were going to get them out. These guys went in on open contracts and were place in MOS's that needed men of their "capabilities." If the troops are bitching then you have something to worry about! Your most dangerous time in the stateside marines was...what...the gang showers? Your most dangerous time in the military was... Oh, that's right. You couldn't hack boot camp. You were a draftee, right? Yup. I got my letter and went. No excuses, no running to Canada, no fake injuries, and none of the other gimmicks to escape boot camp. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Thu, 14 Jul 2005 07:47:48 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
John H. wrote: On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 22:48:07 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: John H. wrote: On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:14:09 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Bert Robbins wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 16:55:18 -0400, HarryKrause wrote: Don White wrote: NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Isn't it a soldier's role to kill the enemy? If you want to join a branch of the armed forces where you're least likely to see combat, join the Coast Guard. Maybe these young potential recruits need an agent representing them when dealing with the US Military....something like a player agent in professional sports.....or better yet a union. A soldiers' union; I'll bring it up at the AFL-CIO meeting in two weeks in Chicago. I get to go for a day or maybe two, and hope to return unbloodied. Thunderous applause... Any soldier has the ability write his congressman about alleged improprieties. Very few members of Congress would let such abuses go by. In boot camp we had recruits that said they were going to write to their congressman and complain about how they were being treated. Then once out in the fleet at the mess halls all of the messmen on the line were bitching and complaing about being cooks. They were all talking about their lawyers were going to get them out. These guys went in on open contracts and were place in MOS's that needed men of their "capabilities." If the troops are bitching then you have something to worry about! Your most dangerous time in the stateside marines was...what...the gang showers? Your most dangerous time in the military was... Oh, that's right. You couldn't hack boot camp. You were a draftee, right? Yup. I got my letter and went. No excuses, no running to Canada, no fake injuries, and none of the other gimmicks to escape boot camp. Some had more imagination. Some were cowards. Pick your group. -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
On Thu, 14 Jul 2005 08:21:08 -0400, HarryKrause wrote:
John H. wrote: Harry Krause wrote: You were a draftee, right? Yup. I got my letter and went. No excuses, no running to Canada, no fake injuries, and none of the other gimmicks to escape boot camp. Some had more imagination. Some were cowards. Pick your group. You're entitled to say whatever you want to justify your military participation in one of the dumbest foreign misadventures in this nation's history. A huge number of young men, however, realized the war against the Vietnamese was immoral and was only serving to prop up a corrupt right-wing dictatorship. When you have Buddhist monks setting themselves on fire to protest US actions in Da Nang and US support for completely corrupt generals like Ky and Thieu, you should realize by then, at least, that you're not on the side of the angels. What did I say that was a 'justification'? What I said implied that I wasn't cowardly. Do you understand? -- John H. On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD |
"HarryKrause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Because you can't find a decent job anywhere. Then you're not looking. I just hired a 21 year old woman with absolutely no experience in the dental field at $12/hr. plus health insurance and pension plan. She's interested in training to become a dental assistant, but needs the money, so will do it as OTJ training rather than attending the one-year formal program. $30,000/year is a helluva lot of money for someone with no skills. Expanded function certified dental assistants earn $18-20/hr (or more). There are at least 5-10 ads running in the local paper at any given time looking for assistants and/or hygienists. Hygienists, by the way, earn $35-40/hour. Every business owner I know has trouble finding employees. It doesn't matter what field of employment they're looking to fill. I just went to get my haircut the other day and the wait was 2 hours because there was only 1 lady working. All she did was bitch the entire time that nobody wants to work. The jobs are there. |
"NOYB" wrote in message hlink.net... "HarryKrause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Because you can't find a decent job anywhere. Then you're not looking. I just hired a 21 year old woman with absolutely no experience in the dental field at $12/hr. plus health insurance and pension plan. She's interested in training to become a dental assistant, but needs the money, so will do it as OTJ training rather than attending the one-year formal program. $30,000/year is a helluva lot of money for someone with no skills. Expanded function certified dental assistants earn $18-20/hr (or more). There are at least 5-10 ads running in the local paper at any given time looking for assistants and/or hygienists. Hygienists, by the way, earn $35-40/hour. Every business owner I know has trouble finding employees. It doesn't matter what field of employment they're looking to fill. I just went to get my haircut the other day and the wait was 2 hours because there was only 1 lady working. All she did was bitch the entire time that nobody wants to work. The jobs are there. Except in Michigan...(7% unemployment)..with our worthless democrat govenor who thinks she can tax her way to prosperity. |
"P. Fritz" wrote in message ... "NOYB" wrote in message hlink.net... "HarryKrause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Because you can't find a decent job anywhere. Then you're not looking. I just hired a 21 year old woman with absolutely no experience in the dental field at $12/hr. plus health insurance and pension plan. She's interested in training to become a dental assistant, but needs the money, so will do it as OTJ training rather than attending the one-year formal program. $30,000/year is a helluva lot of money for someone with no skills. Expanded function certified dental assistants earn $18-20/hr (or more). There are at least 5-10 ads running in the local paper at any given time looking for assistants and/or hygienists. Hygienists, by the way, earn $35-40/hour. Every business owner I know has trouble finding employees. It doesn't matter what field of employment they're looking to fill. I just went to get my haircut the other day and the wait was 2 hours because there was only 1 lady working. All she did was bitch the entire time that nobody wants to work. The jobs are there. Except in Michigan...(7% unemployment)..with our worthless democrat govenor who thinks she can tax her way to prosperity. I visited with a potential customer this week....a manufacturer of large injection molding machines, extruders, die cast machines and hydraulic presses and are only on of 3 major US manufacturer of injection molding and hydraulic presses. They are expanding and hiring new employees (skilled machinist) as they cannot keep up with demand for their equipment. It seems their customers (other manufacturing companies) are now buying more equipment as they are seeing an increase in sales and demand for their products. The same has been reported with other manufacturing customers of mine...expanding and hiring. One has to have their head in the sand if they think that there are not good jobs out there or that the US economy is hurting. |
"*JimH*" wrote in message ... "P. Fritz" wrote in message ... "NOYB" wrote in message hlink.net... "HarryKrause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: Why would you join the military if there was no chance to see combat? Because you can't find a decent job anywhere. Then you're not looking. I just hired a 21 year old woman with absolutely no experience in the dental field at $12/hr. plus health insurance and pension plan. She's interested in training to become a dental assistant, but needs the money, so will do it as OTJ training rather than attending the one-year formal program. $30,000/year is a helluva lot of money for someone with no skills. Expanded function certified dental assistants earn $18-20/hr (or more). There are at least 5-10 ads running in the local paper at any given time looking for assistants and/or hygienists. Hygienists, by the way, earn $35-40/hour. Every business owner I know has trouble finding employees. It doesn't matter what field of employment they're looking to fill. I just went to get my haircut the other day and the wait was 2 hours because there was only 1 lady working. All she did was bitch the entire time that nobody wants to work. The jobs are there. Except in Michigan...(7% unemployment)..with our worthless democrat govenor who thinks she can tax her way to prosperity. I visited with a potential customer this week....a manufacturer of large injection molding machines, extruders, die cast machines and hydraulic presses and are only on of 3 major US manufacturer of injection molding and hydraulic presses. They are expanding and hiring new employees (skilled machinist) as they cannot keep up with demand for their equipment. It seems their customers (other manufacturing companies) are now buying more equipment as they are seeing an increase in sales and demand for their products. The same has been reported with other manufacturing customers of mine...expanding and hiring. One has to have their head in the sand if they think that there are not good jobs out there or that the US economy is hurting. I talk with other professional in my field all the time, buisness is booming around the country........except in Michigan.......right now it has one of the worst economies in the country, with one of the highest unemployment rates. It is localized due to the faltering auto companies, high cost of labor due to the entrenched union mentality, high taxes, high social costs (the cesspool known as the City of Detroit), and a govenor who thinks she can tax her way to prosperity. We have been thinking of uprooting our business and relocating elsewhere in the country. |
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