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"Jim Carter" wrote:
"Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... I have yet to meet a Canadian or Greenland Eskimo who actually got upset about the term Eskimo. What they get upset about is the attitude of *people*, not the terminology. Every single one of them that I've met were well aware of the proper use of the the term, and had no problem with it. You realize of course that it is rarely ever needed in Canada or Greenland, simply because all of the Eskimos there are indeed Inuit. Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Well Floyd, I guess there are some people in the USA who don't get upset over the term "******" but most do. There is *no* comparison between the two words. Anybody who *doesn't* get upset about the word "******" is an asshole, just for starters and it probably gets worse after that. That word has absolutely *no* credible use in the English language. There are some people in the USA who don't get upset over the term "Eskimo" but most of the Inuit in Canada do get upset over this usage of a term from the past. That isn't true. And as I've noted, there is *no* word in the English language to replace it. Just how many Eskimos have you ever discussed this topic with? You want to insult someone... just try telling a few Yupik people that they really should call themselves Inuit... -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
"Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... .................snip...... Just how many Eskimos have you ever discussed this topic with? Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Hi Floyd: I have discussed it with several Inuit at the home of my niece in Rankin Inlet, Nunavut. James D. Carter |
"Jim Carter" wrote in message ... "Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... ................snip...... Just how many Eskimos have you ever discussed this topic with? Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Hi Floyd: I have discussed it with several Inuit at the home of my niece in Rankin Inlet, Nunavut. Are all persons of first nations identify in Canada called Inuit? I didn't think so! |
"Bert Robbins" wrote in message ... Are all persons of first nations identify in Canada called Inuit? I didn't think so! No Bert, they are not. Some of the First Nations people are referred by name of tribal designation and others by the tribal federations. The Inuit are a people indigenous of the far north. James D. Carter |
"Jim Carter" wrote:
"Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... ................snip...... Just how many Eskimos have you ever discussed this topic with? Hi Floyd: I have discussed it with several Inuit at the home of my niece in Rankin Inlet, Nunavut. You said before that your niece told you how they felt... The only people I've ever seen get as adamant about it as you are, are *all* non-Eskimos, and have also all been people who have limited contact with them at best. (And yes, in my opinion school teachers typically have limited contact with them, unfortunately.) The last school teacher, or former teacher in this case, that I talked to about it was my daughter. She spent three years going to school in Albuquerque a few years ago, and told me that a lot of people objected to her use of the term Eskimo. They'd tell her she should said "Inuit". She'd politely say, "No, I am Yupik Eskimo." -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
"Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... You said before that your niece told you how they felt... The only people I've ever seen get as adamant about it as you are, are *all* non-Eskimos, and have also all been people who have limited contact with them at best. (And yes, in my opinion school teachers typically have limited contact with them, unfortunately.) The last school teacher, or former teacher in this case, that I talked to about it was my daughter. She spent three years going to school in Albuquerque a few years ago, and told me that a lot of people objected to her use of the term Eskimo. They'd tell her she should said "Inuit". She'd politely say, "No, I am Yupik Eskimo." -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Floyd: It takes time for some people to adjust to proper and polite society. It may take years for you to change your outlook on life, as you see it, just as it took years for most people in the USA to accept that certain racial slurs are not acceptable to most people. If you want to call your Yupik people "Eskimo" then by all means, go ahead, it's your life, but, please do not refer to the Inuit in the Canadian Far North as "Eskimo" To do so, you will then be referred to as an uninformed bigot. I am not "Black" but I would not think it proper to call a black person a "******" even if "he" calls himself one. James D. Carter |
This in depth discussion with James and Floyd shows the confusion about the
natives of the North. I found this web site and I would like to hear James and Floyds review of the information provided. This web site agrees with Floyd. http://www.quarkexpeditions.com/arctic/culture.shtml "Jim Carter" wrote in message ... "Bert Robbins" wrote in message ... Are all persons of first nations identify in Canada called Inuit? I didn't think so! No Bert, they are not. Some of the First Nations people are referred by name of tribal designation and others by the tribal federations. The Inuit are a people indigenous of the far north. James D. Carter |
The confusion over "Eskimo" vs. "Inuit" illustrates the paradoxes that
accompany the many attempts these days to change the names of ethnic groups. According to the American Heritage Dictionary, "Many Americans today either avoid this term (Eskimo) or feel uneasy using it." For example, a Web site of the University of Wisconsin School of Education advises teachers, "There are no 'Eskimo' people." That would come as a surprise, however, to thousands of Yup'ik-speaking Eskimos in Western Alaska who much prefer to be called "Eskimo" instead of "Inuit." Why? They aren't Inuit. Steven A. Jacobson, a professor at the Alaska Native Language Center (of the University of Alaska at Fairbanks), told United Press International, "Yup'ik speakers say, 'We're Yup'ik Eskimos; our relatives in northern Alaska, Canada and Greenland are Inuit Eskimos; they aren't Yup'ik, and we aren't Inuit, but we're all Eskimos.' Yup'ik speakers prefer to be called 'Yup'iks' .... and -- in contrast to Inuit in Canada -- don't mind the word 'Eskimo,' but they do not like to be called "Jim Carter" wrote in message ... "Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... You said before that your niece told you how they felt... The only people I've ever seen get as adamant about it as you are, are *all* non-Eskimos, and have also all been people who have limited contact with them at best. (And yes, in my opinion school teachers typically have limited contact with them, unfortunately.) The last school teacher, or former teacher in this case, that I talked to about it was my daughter. She spent three years going to school in Albuquerque a few years ago, and told me that a lot of people objected to her use of the term Eskimo. They'd tell her she should said "Inuit". She'd politely say, "No, I am Yupik Eskimo." -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Floyd: It takes time for some people to adjust to proper and polite society. It may take years for you to change your outlook on life, as you see it, just as it took years for most people in the USA to accept that certain racial slurs are not acceptable to most people. If you want to call your Yupik people "Eskimo" then by all means, go ahead, it's your life, but, please do not refer to the Inuit in the Canadian Far North as "Eskimo" To do so, you will then be referred to as an uninformed bigot. I am not "Black" but I would not think it proper to call a black person a "******" even if "he" calls himself one. James D. Carter |
Floyd,
I stand corrected. My mistake is a common misunderstanding. If you had not taken a firm stand on this misunderstanding, I would not have bothered to find out the truth. "Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... "T S Sherlock" wrote: Paul Eskimo means "eaters of raw meat" and was the name Canadian Indians used when talking about the Inuits. Nahhh. It ain't so. But it does make for a good story... The Inuits have always referred to themselves as Inuit (the Yupik variant is Yuit), which means the "real people." Inuit and Yupik are the same word in two different languages. They both derive from same Proto-Eskimo word (which means that 2000 years ago, the ancestors of both Inuit and Yupik people spoke one language, and the word they used to mean the same thing is something like "Inuy". It does mean "Real People", but in a way that is very difficult to explain to most English speakers because of their religious convictions. It actually means a human in the sense of being the original owner of a human spirit. That would be as opposed to a non-human masquerading as a human, which may well look and sound exactly like a human, but might have the spirit of a bear. (If you think that is unreasonable, just go annoy someone you suspect of being a bear, and see of they don't just turn into one...) It may not be as negative as the N word, but it is definitely antiquated, sort of like calling Native American's "Indians". That's silly. First, it isn't antiquated in any way. It is the one and the only word that refers to all Eskimo people, languages, or cultures. If you want to reference them all, there is no other way to do it. (Which is a common requirement when speaking to Alaskans... or to linguists.) Second, the same problem applies to "Native American's" vs. "Indians". Some people don't like one, some don't like the other. But regardless, the two words have *different* meanings! Indians are American Indians. Native Americans are Indians, Eskimo, Aleuts, Hawaiians, Samoans and probably a couple other types of people who are not Indians. Native American is a word that was coin a few decades ago for use by the government.... "Paul Schilter" ""paulschilter\"@comcast dot net" wrote in message ... Jim, Didn't know that. Where does the term Eskimos come from? I take it they wish to be called "Inuit"? Paul Jim Carter wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Well, she was planning to sell Sterno to Eskimos, but she drank it, instead. ......................snip.............. Good Morning Harry. I am sure you did not know that using the word "Eskimo" to describe the "Inuit" people of the far north, is like calling a black man the " N " word. James D. Carter -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
Sorry, I forgot the link.
http://www.isteve.com/2002_Name_Game..._or_Eskimo.htm "Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... The confusion over "Eskimo" vs. "Inuit" illustrates the paradoxes that accompany the many attempts these days to change the names of ethnic groups. According to the American Heritage Dictionary, "Many Americans today either avoid this term (Eskimo) or feel uneasy using it." For example, a Web site of the University of Wisconsin School of Education advises teachers, "There are no 'Eskimo' people." That would come as a surprise, however, to thousands of Yup'ik-speaking Eskimos in Western Alaska who much prefer to be called "Eskimo" instead of "Inuit." Why? They aren't Inuit. Steven A. Jacobson, a professor at the Alaska Native Language Center (of the University of Alaska at Fairbanks), told United Press International, "Yup'ik speakers say, 'We're Yup'ik Eskimos; our relatives in northern Alaska, Canada and Greenland are Inuit Eskimos; they aren't Yup'ik, and we aren't Inuit, but we're all Eskimos.' Yup'ik speakers prefer to be called 'Yup'iks' ... and -- in contrast to Inuit in Canada -- don't mind the word 'Eskimo,' but they do not like to be called "Jim Carter" wrote in message ... "Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... You said before that your niece told you how they felt... The only people I've ever seen get as adamant about it as you are, are *all* non-Eskimos, and have also all been people who have limited contact with them at best. (And yes, in my opinion school teachers typically have limited contact with them, unfortunately.) The last school teacher, or former teacher in this case, that I talked to about it was my daughter. She spent three years going to school in Albuquerque a few years ago, and told me that a lot of people objected to her use of the term Eskimo. They'd tell her she should said "Inuit". She'd politely say, "No, I am Yupik Eskimo." -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Floyd: It takes time for some people to adjust to proper and polite society. It may take years for you to change your outlook on life, as you see it, just as it took years for most people in the USA to accept that certain racial slurs are not acceptable to most people. If you want to call your Yupik people "Eskimo" then by all means, go ahead, it's your life, but, please do not refer to the Inuit in the Canadian Far North as "Eskimo" To do so, you will then be referred to as an uninformed bigot. I am not "Black" but I would not think it proper to call a black person a "******" even if "he" calls himself one. James D. Carter |
"Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... This in depth discussion with James and Floyd shows the confusion about the natives of the North. I found this web site and I would like to hear James and Floyds review of the information provided. This web site agrees with Floyd. http://www.quarkexpeditions.com/arctic/culture.shtml Hi Dr. Sherlock: The following is a cut and paste from the above web site..... ** The word "Eskimo" comes from eskipot, an Algonquian word meaning "an eater of raw flesh." Some Eskimos feel this attribution puts them in a poor light with modern audiences and prefer to use other terms. The most widely used is "Inuit" which really refers specifically to the Eskimos of the eastern Canadian Arctic.** This is exactly what I was referring to. I am a Canadian. The Inuit are Canadian from the Eastern Arctic. I said that numerous times. ( You will note that the web site is from CT. USA. ) Please, DO NOT refere to the Inuit as "Eskimos". They really don't like it at all! James D. Carter. |
"Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... Sorry, I forgot the link. http://www.isteve.com/2002_Name_Game..._or_Eskimo.htm Hi Dr. Sherlock: Here is another Cut & paste from the above web site: ** Tom Alton, the editor of the University of Alaska at Fairbanks' Alaska Native Language Center, pointed out, "The name 'Eskimo' is considered derogatory in some areas of the North but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** You will note that Tom Alton agrees that the term "Eskimo" is considered derogatory. James D. Carter |
Jim C,
He does agree with you that Eskimo is considered derogatory in some areas of the north ..... "but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** I think where you and Floyd disagree is if natives from the Alaska area would prefer to be called Inuit or Eskimos. According to the two experts I cited, those native to Alaska prefer to be called Eskimos verses Inuit. Since I live in the lower 48 I meet very few Alaskan natives, but I did find this discussion interesting. "Jim Carter" wrote in message ... "Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... Sorry, I forgot the link. http://www.isteve.com/2002_Name_Game..._or_Eskimo.htm Hi Dr. Sherlock: Here is another Cut & paste from the above web site: ** Tom Alton, the editor of the University of Alaska at Fairbanks' Alaska Native Language Center, pointed out, "The name 'Eskimo' is considered derogatory in some areas of the North but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** You will note that Tom Alton agrees that the term "Eskimo" is considered derogatory. James D. Carter |
"Jim Carter" wrote in message ... "Bert Robbins" wrote in message ... Are all persons of first nations identify in Canada called Inuit? I didn't think so! No Bert, they are not. Some of the First Nations people are referred by name of tribal designation and others by the tribal federations. The Inuit are a people indigenous of the far north. The name Eskimo is used in the US of A to identify the native americans of far nothern inhabitation mostly in the upper regions of Canda and Alaska.. |
"Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... Jim C, He does agree with you that Eskimo is considered derogatory in some areas of the north ..... "but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** I think where you and Floyd disagree is if natives from the Alaska area would prefer to be called Inuit or Eskimos. According to the two experts I cited, those native to Alaska prefer to be called Eskimos verses Inuit. Since I live in the lower 48 I meet very few Alaskan natives, but I did find this discussion interesting. Yes, Dr. Sherlock, I also found this discussion very interesting and I also learned something informative about Alaska. James D. Carter |
"Jim Carter" wrote in message ... "Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... You said before that your niece told you how they felt... The only people I've ever seen get as adamant about it as you are, are *all* non-Eskimos, and have also all been people who have limited contact with them at best. (And yes, in my opinion school teachers typically have limited contact with them, unfortunately.) The last school teacher, or former teacher in this case, that I talked to about it was my daughter. She spent three years going to school in Albuquerque a few years ago, and told me that a lot of people objected to her use of the term Eskimo. They'd tell her she should said "Inuit". She'd politely say, "No, I am Yupik Eskimo." -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Floyd: It takes time for some people to adjust to proper and polite society. It may take years for you to change your outlook on life, as you see it, just as it took years for most people in the USA to accept that certain racial slurs are not acceptable to most people. If you want to call your Yupik people "Eskimo" then by all means, go ahead, it's your life, but, please do not refer to the Inuit in the Canadian Far North as "Eskimo" To do so, you will then be referred to as an uninformed bigot. I am not "Black" but I would not think it proper to call a black person a "******" even if "he" calls himself one. Therein lies the problem. If the term is derogatory then it is derogatory by any and all that use it, one segment of society cannot reserve the term for their exclusive use. |
"Jim Carter" wrote:
"Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... Sorry, I forgot the link. http://www.isteve.com/2002_Name_Game..._or_Eskimo.htm Hi Dr. Sherlock: Here is another Cut & paste from the above web site: ** Tom Alton, the editor of the University of Alaska at Fairbanks' Alaska Native Language Center, pointed out, "The name 'Eskimo' is considered derogatory in some areas of the North but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** You will note that Tom Alton agrees that the term "Eskimo" is considered derogatory. You will also note that the Alaska Native Language Center uses the word Eskimo consistently, in virtually everything they publish. You might also note that the Institute of Eskimology at the University of Copenhagen does too, and so does Sila, the Greenland Research Centre at the National Museum of Denmark. The fact is that you cannot teach the history, anthropology, linguistics, or archaeology of either Canada or Greenland with out using the term "Eskimo". You have to realize that not only are Inuit not the only Eskimos in the world, but that historically they were not the only Eskimo cultures and languages in either Canada or Greenland. Suggesting that the word is either racially charged, insulting, or inappropriate is simply ignorant of the English language. And lastly, keep in mind that the whole concept of Eskimo being inappropriate comes from the idea that it is a Cree insult meaning "People who eat raw meat". Of course that isn't insulting, and isn't what the word means anyway. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
"Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... "Jim Carter" wrote: "Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... Sorry, I forgot the link. http://www.isteve.com/2002_Name_Game..._or_Eskimo.htm Hi Dr. Sherlock: Here is another Cut & paste from the above web site: ** Tom Alton, the editor of the University of Alaska at Fairbanks' Alaska Native Language Center, pointed out, "The name 'Eskimo' is considered derogatory in some areas of the North but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** You will note that Tom Alton agrees that the term "Eskimo" is considered derogatory. You will also note that the Alaska Native Language Center uses the word Eskimo consistently, in virtually everything they publish. You might also note that the Institute of Eskimology at the University of Copenhagen does too, and so does Sila, the Greenland Research Centre at the National Museum of Denmark. The fact is that you cannot teach the history, anthropology, linguistics, or archaeology of either Canada or Greenland with out using the term "Eskimo". You have to realize that not only are Inuit not the only Eskimos in the world, but that historically they were not the only Eskimo cultures and languages in either Canada or Greenland. Suggesting that the word is either racially charged, insulting, or inappropriate is simply ignorant of the English language. And lastly, keep in mind that the whole concept of Eskimo being inappropriate comes from the idea that it is a Cree insult meaning "People who eat raw meat". Of course that isn't insulting, and isn't what the word means anyway. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Who cares? 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Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because... |
JimH,
This discussion was more interesting than many in rec.boats. "JimH" wrote in message ... "Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... "Jim Carter" wrote: "Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... Sorry, I forgot the link. http://www.isteve.com/2002_Name_Game..._or_Eskimo.htm Hi Dr. Sherlock: Here is another Cut & paste from the above web site: ** Tom Alton, the editor of the University of Alaska at Fairbanks' Alaska Native Language Center, pointed out, "The name 'Eskimo' is considered derogatory in some areas of the North but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** You will note that Tom Alton agrees that the term "Eskimo" is considered derogatory. You will also note that the Alaska Native Language Center uses the word Eskimo consistently, in virtually everything they publish. You might also note that the Institute of Eskimology at the University of Copenhagen does too, and so does Sila, the Greenland Research Centre at the National Museum of Denmark. The fact is that you cannot teach the history, anthropology, linguistics, or archaeology of either Canada or Greenland with out using the term "Eskimo". You have to realize that not only are Inuit not the only Eskimos in the world, but that historically they were not the only Eskimo cultures and languages in either Canada or Greenland. Suggesting that the word is either racially charged, insulting, or inappropriate is simply ignorant of the English language. And lastly, keep in mind that the whole concept of Eskimo being inappropriate comes from the idea that it is a Cree insult meaning "People who eat raw meat". Of course that isn't insulting, and isn't what the word means anyway. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Who cares? A song for you and Jim...hum along: This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. 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Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because... |
"Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... JimH, This discussion was more interesting than many in rec.boats. Indeed. But it reached a point where arguments were being repeated over and over and over again. |
"Jim Carter" wrote:
"Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote: This in depth discussion with James and Floyd shows the confusion about the natives of the North. I found this web site and I would like to hear James and Floyds review of the information provided. That web site demonstrates a significant problem with learning much of anything about Eskimo people or their cultures. The site is filled with both correct and incorrect information. And generally speaking that is true of almost anything you can find on the Internet or in any library. "Eskimo" is one of the most misunderstood topics that exist. A researcher practically has to be an expert to find useful information, simply because it requires knowing what to accept and what to reject. For the average person that is simply impossible. For example, just about every tale you've ever heard about Eskimos is wrong. They don't give you their wife, they don't put old people out to die, and despite 200 years of claims to the contrary, they do have a *very* sophisticated concept of private property, and a *very* sophisticated form of governance. This web site agrees with Floyd. http://www.quarkexpeditions.com/arctic/culture.shtml Hi Dr. Sherlock: The following is a cut and paste from the above web site..... ** The word "Eskimo" comes from eskipot, an Algonquian word meaning "an eater of raw flesh." Some Eskimos feel this attribution puts them in a poor light with modern audiences and prefer to use other terms. The most widely used is "Inuit" which really refers specifically to the Eskimos of the eastern Canadian Arctic.** "Refers specifically to the Eskimos of the eastern Canadian Arctic"? No, it doesn't. Nor does "Eskimo" come from a single Algonquian word having anything to do with eating raw flesh. Here is a more complete quote, demonstrating the mix of accurate and inaccurate statements: "The most widely used is "Inuit" which really refers specifically to the Eskimos of the eastern Canadian Arctic. In the Bering Sea region, Eskimos prefer to be called "Yup'ik," while the North Slope Alaska Eskimos prefer "Inupiat" and Mackenzie Delta Eskimos prefer "Inuvialuit." (The word "Eskimo" will be used occasionally to refer to all native Arctic people.)" The use of geography to draw the lines between differing Eskimos is erroneous. There are, for example, many Inupiat people living in the Bering Sea region. And of course many of the Yupik people are Alutiiq or Siberia Yupik, not Yup'ik. (The writer of that text is apparently unaware that Yup'ik means only Central Alaskan Yupik, not all Yupik.) It also totally ignores Greenland. There are other similar problems with the entire text. For example the section on cultural history is based on several false premises. It should be noted that the migration of the Inuit language and the Thule technology eastward into Canada and Greenland was a migration of culture, not people. DNA studies have indicated that probably not more that 250 individuals actually migrated into Greenland from more western locations, yet virtually the entire Dorset population of Greenland eventually adopted Thule technology and eventually became today's modern Inuit. This is exactly what I was referring to. I am a Canadian. The Inuit are Canadian from the Eastern Arctic. I said that numerous times. ( You will note that the web site is from CT. USA. ) That is an incorrect statement. There are Inuit people from western Alaska all the way to eastern Greenland. However, the only people who typically refer to themselves as Inuit, when speaking English or Inuit, are the Canadian Inuit you speak of. All of the others use different words to describe themselves, both in their language and in English. Please, DO NOT refere to the Inuit as "Eskimos". They really don't like it at all! That isn't true in the sense that you continue to claim. I'm glad that you live in the same country that some Eskimos do, and have an interest in being polite to them. I've lived most of my life in the same house with Eskimos... Quyanukpuk -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
Well put! I enjoy Chuck's boat reviews.
************* The piece on the 680 Legend isn't really a review. It's called a walkthrough. General description- some impressions. No technical evaluations made, no techncal evaluations claimed. Falls into the same category of "What I like most about......(country music, clam chowder, the Eiffel Tower, scuba diving, etc)" |
"Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote:
Floyd, I stand corrected. My mistake is a common misunderstanding. If you had not taken a firm stand on this misunderstanding, I would not have bothered to find out the truth. You are quite welcome! It is an interesting subject that is obviously much misunderstood by most people. And trying to figure out what is real is exceedingly difficult, unless you happen to have a handy Eskimo historian. :-) Which reminds me of a fun story to tell. A whole lot of years ago, I took a job in Bethel Alaska. I'd never been there and just about all that I knew about it was that most of the people there were Yupik Eskimos, or transients. So while waiting for a plane in the Anchorage airport (and note that this was before there was jet service to Bethel, and we were flying an F-27 turboprop), I wandered through the a bookstore looking for something to read on the long flight (400 miles or so). The book that I bought is one that I still have, and I treasure the memories that came because of it. It is sitting right here next to me! "Napaskiak, An Alaskan Eskimo Community" by Wendell Oswalt. I read most of it on the way to Bethel, and finished it the first night there. Interesting. All about a very small village about 10 miles down the river from Bethel, which in the 1950's was still a very traditional Eskimo culture, including kayaqs and dog teams. Well... I was young then, and wouldn't you know that about three days later I met a very attractive young lady who told me she was from Napaskiak! So I knew just how to get her attention... (and fortunately I wasn't naive and did *not* pass any judgment on what any of it meant) I asked her what _she_ thought of Oswalt's book! Oh, my. She was 18 years old and really good looking... and could swear like a Marine Drill Sargent! She told me *exactly* what she thought of Oswalt, not to mention all of his ancestors and his offspring too! In detail. Wellll... It turned out that we were friends for many years, until her death. I married a friend of hers, she married a friend of mine. After she passed away I more or less adopted one of her daughters, and consider her grandchildren to be my grandchildren. I haven't trusted anything written about Eskimos since. And I should point out that Wendell Oswalt has since apologized for his typically Western anthropological approach to researching Eskimo culture. His most recent books are pretty good. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
"Bert Robbins" wrote:
"Jim Carter" wrote: Floyd: It takes time for some people to adjust to proper and polite society. It may take years for you to change your outlook on life, as you see it, just as it took years for most people in the USA to accept that certain racial slurs are not acceptable to most people. If you want to call your Yupik people "Eskimo" then by all means, go ahead, it's your life, but, please do not refer to the Inuit in the Canadian Far North as "Eskimo" To do so, you will then be referred to as an uninformed bigot. I am not "Black" but I would not think it proper to call a black person a "******" even if "he" calls himself one. Therein lies the problem. If the term is derogatory then it is derogatory by any and all that use it, one segment of society cannot reserve the term for their exclusive use. I'm not sure that is a valid statement. However, one thing is positive, the term "Eskimo" is *not* derogatory by definition. The etymology is not derogatory, the proper meaning is not derogatory, and the common usage is not derogatory. The fact that some Canadians began to use it in a derogatory manner doesn't change the English language around the world. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
"Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote:
Jim C, He does agree with you that Eskimo is considered derogatory in some areas of the north ..... "but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** I think where you and Floyd disagree is if natives from the Alaska area would prefer to be called Inuit or Eskimos. According to the two experts I cited, those native to Alaska prefer to be called Eskimos verses Inuit. There are *no* people in Alaska who commonly refer to themselves or anyone else as Inuit. The Inupiat people (and the majority of people where I live are Inupiat) are in fact Inuit Eskimos. And of course the more numerous Eskimos in Alaska are Yupik, not Inuit. (My children and grandchildren are all Yupik.) And we should note that appropriate use of the term Eskimo is impossible to avoid in Alaska, since there is no other word with the same meaning. That makes it a commonly used word here, but in Canada and Greenland it is rarely needed simply because all Eskimos there are in fact Inuit, and that *is* what they should be called. Since I live in the lower 48 I meet very few Alaskan natives, but I did find this discussion interesting. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
Nice lyrics, but what's the melody? It doesn't work to well with "99 Bottles of
Beer". On Sun, 3 Apr 2005 19:34:52 -0400, "JimH" wrote: "Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ... "Jim Carter" wrote: "Dr. Dr. K.G. Sherlock" wrote in message ... Sorry, I forgot the link. http://www.isteve.com/2002_Name_Game..._or_Eskimo.htm Hi Dr. Sherlock: Here is another Cut & paste from the above web site: ** Tom Alton, the editor of the University of Alaska at Fairbanks' Alaska Native Language Center, pointed out, "The name 'Eskimo' is considered derogatory in some areas of the North but is still acceptable in Alaska, mainly because Alaska includes Yup'ik people who are closely related culturally and linguistically but are not Inuit. 'Eskimo' includes Yup'ik as well as Inuit."** You will note that Tom Alton agrees that the term "Eskimo" is considered derogatory. You will also note that the Alaska Native Language Center uses the word Eskimo consistently, in virtually everything they publish. You might also note that the Institute of Eskimology at the University of Copenhagen does too, and so does Sila, the Greenland Research Centre at the National Museum of Denmark. The fact is that you cannot teach the history, anthropology, linguistics, or archaeology of either Canada or Greenland with out using the term "Eskimo". You have to realize that not only are Inuit not the only Eskimos in the world, but that historically they were not the only Eskimo cultures and languages in either Canada or Greenland. Suggesting that the word is either racially charged, insulting, or inappropriate is simply ignorant of the English language. And lastly, keep in mind that the whole concept of Eskimo being inappropriate comes from the idea that it is a Cree insult meaning "People who eat raw meat". Of course that isn't insulting, and isn't what the word means anyway. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) Who cares? A song for you and Jim...hum along: This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. 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Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because...This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it, not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because... -- John H "All decisions are the result of binary thinking." |
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