The driver deserved a significant, but not life-threatening beating. I
assume you did not give him one.

If I had been the driver, I would have given myself more of a mental beating
than anything physical you could have done. I would be jumping for joy the
kid was alright.

My first time towing, almost happened to me but I had a little more experience
(and luck). I came close to a channel marker...shook me up but nobody (not
even the tuber, an adult) noticed.

Be careful.

On Tue, 22 Jul 2003 01:26:30 GMT, "Charles" wrote:

Gang,

I want to relay an "occurrence" that happened at my local lake this past
weekend. You are NOT getting this story third hand. I was THERE, I SAW it.
This isn't one of those, "I know someone who saw...."

Anyway, I stopped by a friend's house up at the lake this past Sunday. They
had a big crowd all hanging around and we were standing on the dock talking.
There was a fairly large pontoon boat tied along the front or lake-side edge
of the dock. This wasn't on the main lake, but the cove wasn't no-wake.
It's a pretty big cove. Anyway, I was marginally aware of someone out in
the middle towing a tuber but not really watching them closely.

I heard him come by and it seemed fairly close when he passed. Then all of
the women on the dock started screaming "Too close" and I saw the kid in the
tube, headed right for the front of the pontoon boat. The driver had
misjudged or didn't know about the tube "sweeping" wide on the turn. My
eyes are dead on the kid and he sees the pontoon boat coming. He ducks down
tight inside the tube. I didn't see it but apparently the driver saw what
was happening a second or so before and finally backed off. Way too much
momentum to really matter at this point. Well, the tube goes right down the
"tunnel" between the pontoons. The boat is heavier in the back (of course)
so the gap between the bottom of the decking and the water gets narrower as
you go. The tube, kid inside, wedges itself between the deck and the water
about 2/3 the length of the boat.

The women are screaming, the rest of the kids are crying, everyone who could
swim jumps in and drags the tube back out from under the pontoon boat. Not
a scratch on him. He wasn't even crying or really all that upset.

I know what a lot of you are thinking here. The first thought is almost for
sure just anger and calling this guy names. Second thought is, what could
"I" have done, besides not pulling a tube anywhere near another boat or
dock. Let's take a look at the math here. I worked this up at lunch today:

Let's assume the guy was pulling the tube at 20 mph. Not an unreasonable
speed for a tube and I've been wakeboarding for years at 19.5. I feel like
I'm a pretty good judge of 20mph. Anyway, 20 mph is 1760 feet/min which
turns into about 29 feet per second. Let's also assume that the driver saw
what was happening the minute he crossed the bow of the pontoon and has a
zero reaction time to slam into reverse or something. With a 60 foot rope,
he has two seconds before the tube hits the pontoon boat. At 15 mph he has
just a little less than three seconds. "Time is the fire in which we burn."
I ripped that off from a Star Trek movie. With between two or three seconds
at most, that kid is hitting the boat. The math is right there.

Anyway, I am not here to pass judgment or call him names. I'm not going to
get into what "could have happened." I'm telling this story because I want
all of you to always keep in mind what's going on out there. It's all great
fun and everything is a blast until something goes wrong. Please don't let
an inexperienced driver pull a tube or a skier. If that means you, well
maybe the shoe fits.

Be careful out there gang. It's easy to get complacent. Believe me, you
don't want to see something like this happen in front of you. It was really
horrible.

Charles



Charles, thanks for the reminder.

Like you, I have my own thoughts about the operator, but your base
message is more important.

Every boater who leaves the dock needs to pay attention, and put
safety first. Especially inexperienced operators.

Thanks again.
noah

Courtesy of Lee Yeaton,
See the boats of rec.boats
www.TheBayGuide.com/rec.boats

No, I didn't even look at him. He's got his own demons to deal with now.

Charles

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
The driver deserved a significant, but not life-threatening beating. I
assume you did not give him one.

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ...
The driver deserved a significant, but not life-threatening beating. I
assume you did not give him one.

Nah, experience is the BEST teacher. I'm sure that after watching his
kid go under a pontoon boat, he learned a valuable lesson. So, he
learned this lesson without injuring or killing his kid, too bad that
isn't always the case.

Charles wrote:

Gang,

I want to relay an "occurrence" that happened at my local lake this past
weekend. You are NOT getting this story third hand. I was THERE, I SAW it.
This isn't one of those, "I know someone who saw...."

Anyway, I stopped by a friend's house up at the lake this past Sunday. They
had a big crowd all hanging around and we were standing on the dock talking.
There was a fairly large pontoon boat tied along the front or lake-side edge
*****************************************^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^**************
of the dock. This wasn't on the main lake, but the cove wasn't no-wake.
It's a pretty big cove. Anyway, I was marginally aware of someone out in
the middle towing a tuber but not really watching them closely.

I heard him come by and it seemed fairly close when he passed. Then all of
the women on the dock started screaming "Too close" and I saw the kid in the
tube, headed right for the front of the pontoon boat. The driver had
misjudged or didn't know about the tube "sweeping" wide on the turn. My
eyes are dead on the kid and he sees the pontoon boat coming. He ducks down
tight inside the tube. I didn't see it but apparently the driver saw what
was happening a second or so before and finally backed off. Way too much
momentum to really matter at this point. Well, the tube goes right down the
"tunnel" between the pontoons. The boat is heavier in the back (of course)
so the gap between the bottom of the decking and the water gets narrower as
you go. The tube, kid inside, wedges itself between the deck and the water
about 2/3 the length of the boat.

The women are screaming, the rest of the kids are crying, everyone who could
swim jumps in and drags the tube back out from under the pontoon boat. Not
a scratch on him. He wasn't even crying or really all that upset.

I know what a lot of you are thinking here. The first thought is almost for
sure just anger and calling this guy names. Second thought is, what could
"I" have done, besides not pulling a tube anywhere near another boat or
dock. Let's take a look at the math here. I worked this up at lunch today:

Let's assume the guy was pulling the tube at 20 mph. Not an unreasonable
speed for a tube and I've been wakeboarding for years at 19.5. I feel like
I'm a pretty good judge of 20mph. Anyway, 20 mph is 1760 feet/min which
turns into about 29 feet per second. Let's also assume that the driver saw
what was happening the minute he crossed the bow of the pontoon and has a
zero reaction time to slam into reverse or something. With a 60 foot rope,
he has two seconds before the tube hits the pontoon boat. At 15 mph he has
just a little less than three seconds. "Time is the fire in which we burn."
I ripped that off from a Star Trek movie. With between two or three seconds
at most, that kid is hitting the boat. The math is right there.

Anyway, I am not here to pass judgment or call him names. I'm not going to
get into what "could have happened." I'm telling this story because I want
all of you to always keep in mind what's going on out there. It's all great
fun and everything is a blast until something goes wrong. Please don't let
an inexperienced driver pull a tube or a skier. If that means you, well
maybe the shoe fits.

Be careful out there gang. It's easy to get complacent. Believe me, you
don't want to see something like this happen in front of you. It was really
horrible.

Charles


"Capt. Frank" wrote:

Hi Charles,

They sound like a perfect candidates for the USCG Auxillary Boating
safety class. The kid was just plain luckey.

It sounds like between the pontoon boat and the tow boat the bunch
managed to ignore most of the "rules of the road."

The tow boat would have been held culpable had the kid been injured.
I did not notice you mention the pontoon sounding his horn as he left
the dock in a traffic area.
It also sounds as though the tow operator was not familure enough with
his equipment.

I am glad no one was hurt and there was no property damage.

Capt. Frank USCG-A
La Dolce Vita
Formula 26 PC


The way it read to me and everyone else is that the pontoon boat remained
MOORED alongside the dock througout the incident. The driver mentioned is
the driver of the tow boat. Please clarify how or if the pontoon boat
ignored the ColRegs.

--
Ian Malcolm. London, ENGLAND. (NEWSGROUP REPLY PREFERRED)
ianm[at]the[dash]malcolms[dot]freeserve[dot]co[dot]uk [at]=@, [dash]=- &
[dot]=.
*Warning* SPAM TRAP set in header, Use email address in sig. if you must.
'Stingo' Albacore #1554 - 15' Uffa Fox designed, All varnished hot moulded
wooden racing dinghy circa. 1961

"My eyes are dead on the kid and he sees the pontoon boat coming. " From
the above quote.

Ian Malcolm wrote:

Charles wrote:


Gang,

I want to relay an "occurrence" that happened at my local lake this past
weekend. You are NOT getting this story third hand. I was THERE, I SAW it.
This isn't one of those, "I know someone who saw...."

Anyway, I stopped by a friend's house up at the lake this past Sunday. They
had a big crowd all hanging around and we were standing on the dock talking.
There was a fairly large pontoon boat tied along the front or lake-side edge

*****************************************^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^**************

of the dock. This wasn't on the main lake, but the cove wasn't no-wake.
It's a pretty big cove. Anyway, I was marginally aware of someone out in
the middle towing a tuber but not really watching them closely.

I heard him come by and it seemed fairly close when he passed. Then all of
the women on the dock started screaming "Too close" and I saw the kid in the
tube, headed right for the front of the pontoon boat. The driver had
misjudged or didn't know about the tube "sweeping" wide on the turn. My
eyes are dead on the kid and he sees the pontoon boat coming. He ducks down
tight inside the tube. I didn't see it but apparently the driver saw what
was happening a second or so before and finally backed off. Way too much
momentum to really matter at this point. Well, the tube goes right down the
"tunnel" between the pontoons. The boat is heavier in the back (of course)
so the gap between the bottom of the decking and the water gets narrower as
you go. The tube, kid inside, wedges itself between the deck and the water
about 2/3 the length of the boat.

The women are screaming, the rest of the kids are crying, everyone who could
swim jumps in and drags the tube back out from under the pontoon boat. Not
a scratch on him. He wasn't even crying or really all that upset.

I know what a lot of you are thinking here. The first thought is almost for
sure just anger and calling this guy names. Second thought is, what could
"I" have done, besides not pulling a tube anywhere near another boat or
dock. Let's take a look at the math here. I worked this up at lunch today:

Let's assume the guy was pulling the tube at 20 mph. Not an unreasonable
speed for a tube and I've been wakeboarding for years at 19.5. I feel like
I'm a pretty good judge of 20mph. Anyway, 20 mph is 1760 feet/min which
turns into about 29 feet per second. Let's also assume that the driver saw
what was happening the minute he crossed the bow of the pontoon and has a
zero reaction time to slam into reverse or something. With a 60 foot rope,
he has two seconds before the tube hits the pontoon boat. At 15 mph he has
just a little less than three seconds. "Time is the fire in which we burn."
I ripped that off from a Star Trek movie. With between two or three seconds
at most, that kid is hitting the boat. The math is right there.

Anyway, I am not here to pass judgment or call him names. I'm not going to
get into what "could have happened." I'm telling this story because I want
all of you to always keep in mind what's going on out there. It's all great
fun and everything is a blast until something goes wrong. Please don't let
an inexperienced driver pull a tube or a skier. If that means you, well
maybe the shoe fits.

Be careful out there gang. It's easy to get complacent. Believe me, you
don't want to see something like this happen in front of you. It was really
horrible.

Charles



"Capt. Frank" wrote:

Hi Charles,

They sound like a perfect candidates for the USCG Auxillary Boating
safety class. The kid was just plain luckey.

It sounds like between the pontoon boat and the tow boat the bunch
managed to ignore most of the "rules of the road."

The tow boat would have been held culpable had the kid been injured.
I did not notice you mention the pontoon sounding his horn as he left
the dock in a traffic area.
It also sounds as though the tow operator was not familure enough with
his equipment.

I am glad no one was hurt and there was no property damage.

Capt. Frank USCG-A
La Dolce Vita
Formula 26 PC



The way it read to me and everyone else is that the pontoon boat remained
MOORED alongside the dock througout the incident. The driver mentioned is
the driver of the tow boat. Please clarify how or if the pontoon boat
ignored the ColRegs.

"Capt. Frank Hopkins" wrote:

"My eyes are dead on the kid and he sees the pontoon boat coming. " From
the above quote.


"Then all of
the women on the dock started screaming "Too close" and I saw the kid in
the
tube, headed right for the front of the pontoon boat. The driver had
misjudged or didn't know about the tube "sweeping" wide on the turn."
Slightly earlier in the quote (snipped for brevity)

Also dont you suppose that if some axxhole had driven into a kid tubing
we'd have been told all about it? As the pontoon was tied to the dock it
couldn't have gone far without casting off which isn't even hinted at in
the quote.

Of course if the tube boat driver chose to make a close pass at a dock
that a couple of guys are untying and getting into a pontoon, then he's an
even bigger idiot.
Its possible I guess, and neither of us will know unless there is another
witness or a photo out there.

I have been cut up while leaving and approaching docks a time or two
myself. It doesn't help that small sailboats are very constrained by the
wind as to the approach and departure tracks they can choose and often
have no option to 'abort' without subsequently loosing steerage and
control of the boat. Add to the mix some power boats and/or high speed
rowing craft with little or no apparent understanding of the problems and
likely actions of a sailing dinghy and it can cause 'brown trousers'
inducing near misses or even serious incidents. To add to the enjoyment,
we regularly launch off a ramp on the tidal river Thames. Some of the
commercial traffic is capable of throwing a breaking wash without
exceeding the speed limit and there is often some leisure boating pratt
travelling up river plowing bow high and throwing a wash bigger than the
200 person river cruise boats. It also doesn't help that they are often
convinced they are doing a legal speed by their GPS when they have 3 - 4
knots of the ebb tide against them. Those we 'shop' to the port authority
if we can ID them. If you linger on the ramp you risk your boat being
thrown violently up the ramp either holing it or crushing anyone unlucky
enough to get between it and the ramp. Then we have the rowing sculls.
1, 2 and 4 man sculls that do 12 knots and more and BY DESIGN, HAVE NO WAY
OF LOOKING IN FRONT OF THEM. There is no cox looking forward, all the
rowers of course face aft and they like to row about one or two boats
lengths off the bank to get out of the tide. Why the port authority
doesn't require them to fit mirrors, I dont know. Even when its a coxed
boat they can be a serious hazard, I saw one go under a moored power
catamaran at full speed. It resulted in the write-off of a rowing boat
and a couple of rowers in hospital. If you get hit by one, well the bow
is small enough and pointed enough for anyone who's in the way to be
impaled and it will go right through any hull not made of steel.

IMHO any Axxhole who goes faster than dead slow within 2 boats lengths
(theirs that is, and any tow should count as part of their length) of a
dock or ramp should be prosecuted for reckless endangerment. This in
addition to any regulations concerning wakes and distance from docks.



--
Ian Malcolm. London, ENGLAND. (NEWSGROUP REPLY PREFERRED)
ianm[at]the[dash]malcolms[dot]freeserve[dot]co[dot]uk [at]=@, [dash]=- &
[dot]=.
*Warning* SPAM TRAP set in header, Use email address in sig. if you must.
'Stingo' Albacore #1554 - 15' Uffa Fox designed, All varnished hot moulded
wooden racing dinghy circa. 1961

Hey guys,

Yes, the pontoon boat was tied to the dock. Nobody was even standing on it
when the tube came by.

As far as "sounding his horn as he left the dock" goes... I really don't
think you have a clear picture of this. This is not a public dock, fishing
wharf, or any such thing. This was a small private boat dock on an inland
lake. Sure, sound the horn if it makes you happy, but the only people that
are going to hear it are the ones on your own boat.

Charles

"Capt. Frank" wrote in message
hlink.net...
Hi Charles,

They sound like a perfect candidates for the USCG Auxillary Boating
safety class. The kid was just plain luckey.

It sounds like between the pontoon boat and the tow boat the bunch
managed to ignore most of the "rules of the road."

The tow boat would have been held culpable had the kid been injured.
I did not notice you mention the pontoon sounding his horn as he left
the dock in a traffic area.
It also sounds as though the tow operator was not familure enough with
his equipment.

I am glad no one was hurt and there was no property damage.


Capt. Frank USCG-A
La Dolce Vita
Formula 26 PC

Charles wrote:

Gang,

I want to relay an "occurrence" that happened at my local lake this past
weekend. You are NOT getting this story third hand. I was THERE, I SAW
it.
This isn't one of those, "I know someone who saw...."

Anyway, I stopped by a friend's house up at the lake this past Sunday.
They
had a big crowd all hanging around and we were standing on the dock
talking.
There was a fairly large pontoon boat tied along the front or lake-side
edge
of the dock. This wasn't on the main lake, but the cove wasn't no-wake.
It's a pretty big cove. Anyway, I was marginally aware of someone out
in
the middle towing a tuber but not really watching them closely.

I heard him come by and it seemed fairly close when he passed. Then all
of
the women on the dock started screaming "Too close" and I saw the kid in
the
tube, headed right for the front of the pontoon boat. The driver had
misjudged or didn't know about the tube "sweeping" wide on the turn. My
eyes are dead on the kid and he sees the pontoon boat coming. He ducks
down
tight inside the tube. I didn't see it but apparently the driver saw
what
was happening a second or so before and finally backed off. Way too
much
momentum to really matter at this point. Well, the tube goes right down
the
"tunnel" between the pontoons. The boat is heavier in the back (of
course)
so the gap between the bottom of the decking and the water gets narrower
as
you go. The tube, kid inside, wedges itself between the deck and the
water
about 2/3 the length of the boat.

The women are screaming, the rest of the kids are crying, everyone who
could
swim jumps in and drags the tube back out from under the pontoon boat.
Not
a scratch on him. He wasn't even crying or really all that upset.

I know what a lot of you are thinking here. The first thought is almost
for
sure just anger and calling this guy names. Second thought is, what
could
"I" have done, besides not pulling a tube anywhere near another boat or
dock. Let's take a look at the math here. I worked this up at lunch
today:

Let's assume the guy was pulling the tube at 20 mph. Not an
unreasonable
speed for a tube and I've been wakeboarding for years at 19.5. I feel
like
I'm a pretty good judge of 20mph. Anyway, 20 mph is 1760 feet/min which
turns into about 29 feet per second. Let's also assume that the driver
saw
what was happening the minute he crossed the bow of the pontoon and has
a
zero reaction time to slam into reverse or something. With a 60 foot
rope,
he has two seconds before the tube hits the pontoon boat. At 15 mph he
has
just a little less than three seconds. "Time is the fire in which we
burn."
I ripped that off from a Star Trek movie. With between two or three
seconds
at most, that kid is hitting the boat. The math is right there.

Anyway, I am not here to pass judgment or call him names. I'm not going
to
get into what "could have happened." I'm telling this story because I
want
all of you to always keep in mind what's going on out there. It's all
great
fun and everything is a blast until something goes wrong. Please don't
let
an inexperienced driver pull a tube or a skier. If that means you, well
maybe the shoe fits.

Be careful out there gang. It's easy to get complacent. Believe me,
you
don't want to see something like this happen in front of you. It was
really
horrible.

Charles

On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 02:44:36 GMT, "Charles" wrote:

Hey guys,

Yes, the pontoon boat was tied to the dock. Nobody was even standing on it
when the tube came by.

As far as "sounding his horn as he left the dock" goes... I really don't
think you have a clear picture of this. This is not a public dock, fishing
wharf, or any such thing. This was a small private boat dock on an inland
lake. Sure, sound the horn if it makes you happy, but the only people that
are going to hear it are the ones on your own boat.

Charles

I think everybody got the facts except a few latecomers. Thanks,
charles.
noah

"Capt. Frank" wrote in message
thlink.net...
Hi Charles,

They sound like a perfect candidates for the USCG Auxillary Boating
safety class. The kid was just plain luckey.

It sounds like between the pontoon boat and the tow boat the bunch
managed to ignore most of the "rules of the road."

The tow boat would have been held culpable had the kid been injured.
I did not notice you mention the pontoon sounding his horn as he left
the dock in a traffic area.
It also sounds as though the tow operator was not familure enough with
his equipment.

I am glad no one was hurt and there was no property damage.


Capt. Frank USCG-A
La Dolce Vita
Formula 26 PC

Charles wrote:

Gang,

I want to relay an "occurrence" that happened at my local lake this past
weekend. You are NOT getting this story third hand. I was THERE, I SAW
it.
This isn't one of those, "I know someone who saw...."

Anyway, I stopped by a friend's house up at the lake this past Sunday.
They
had a big crowd all hanging around and we were standing on the dock
talking.
There was a fairly large pontoon boat tied along the front or lake-side
edge
of the dock. This wasn't on the main lake, but the cove wasn't no-wake.
It's a pretty big cove. Anyway, I was marginally aware of someone out
in
the middle towing a tuber but not really watching them closely.

I heard him come by and it seemed fairly close when he passed. Then all
of
the women on the dock started screaming "Too close" and I saw the kid in
the
tube, headed right for the front of the pontoon boat. The driver had
misjudged or didn't know about the tube "sweeping" wide on the turn. My
eyes are dead on the kid and he sees the pontoon boat coming. He ducks
down
tight inside the tube. I didn't see it but apparently the driver saw
what
was happening a second or so before and finally backed off. Way too
much
momentum to really matter at this point. Well, the tube goes right down
the
"tunnel" between the pontoons. The boat is heavier in the back (of
course)
so the gap between the bottom of the decking and the water gets narrower
as
you go. The tube, kid inside, wedges itself between the deck and the
water
about 2/3 the length of the boat.

The women are screaming, the rest of the kids are crying, everyone who
could
swim jumps in and drags the tube back out from under the pontoon boat.
Not
a scratch on him. He wasn't even crying or really all that upset.

I know what a lot of you are thinking here. The first thought is almost
for
sure just anger and calling this guy names. Second thought is, what
could
"I" have done, besides not pulling a tube anywhere near another boat or
dock. Let's take a look at the math here. I worked this up at lunch
today:

Let's assume the guy was pulling the tube at 20 mph. Not an
unreasonable
speed for a tube and I've been wakeboarding for years at 19.5. I feel
like
I'm a pretty good judge of 20mph. Anyway, 20 mph is 1760 feet/min which
turns into about 29 feet per second. Let's also assume that the driver
saw
what was happening the minute he crossed the bow of the pontoon and has
a
zero reaction time to slam into reverse or something. With a 60 foot
rope,
he has two seconds before the tube hits the pontoon boat. At 15 mph he
has
just a little less than three seconds. "Time is the fire in which we
burn."
I ripped that off from a Star Trek movie. With between two or three
seconds
at most, that kid is hitting the boat. The math is right there.

Anyway, I am not here to pass judgment or call him names. I'm not going
to
get into what "could have happened." I'm telling this story because I
want
all of you to always keep in mind what's going on out there. It's all
great
fun and everything is a blast until something goes wrong. Please don't
let
an inexperienced driver pull a tube or a skier. If that means you, well
maybe the shoe fits.

Be careful out there gang. It's easy to get complacent. Believe me,
you
don't want to see something like this happen in front of you. It was
really
horrible.

Charles