I am buying my first kayak but have been renting and demoing for a
couple of years. I have narrowed my choices to 3 similar boats. I am
very interested in hearing from those that own or have used these
boats for a period of time.
The boats are VCP Skerray RMX, CD Sirocco, and P&H Cappella 166 RM.

I would also like owner feedback on a Walden Passage, unrelated to the
above boats. Interested for general fooling around usage in addition
to one of the above. Thanks!

(Vee) wrote in
om:

I am buying my first kayak but have been renting and demoing for a
couple of years. I have narrowed my choices to 3 similar boats. I am
very interested in hearing from those that own or have used these
boats for a period of time.
The boats are VCP Skerray RMX, CD Sirocco, and P&H Cappella 166 RM.

The first two at least a designed for a somewhat larger paddler. I've had a
standard size glass VCP Skerray for about seven years and love it. It's very
manoeverable but not exactly a slug for a 17' boat.

I would also like owner feedback on a Walden Passage, unrelated to the
above boats. Interested for general fooling around usage in addition
to one of the above. Thanks!

While I don't own a Passage I've paddled one on several occasions including
a two day trip down the Delaware river which included a legitimate class II
rapid. The boat belonged to my bosses boss (she was paddling a Passage
two). She doesn't have a great deal of experience and just raves about how
perfect the Passage is for her. It's a pretty stable boat that still
responds reasonably well to a lean and rolls quite easily. I've recommended
the model to several first timers looking for an inexpensive entry level
kayak.

Vee wrote:
I am buying my first kayak but have been renting and demoing for a
couple of years. I have narrowed my choices to 3 similar boats. I am
very interested in hearing from those that own or have used these
boats for a period of time.
The boats are VCP Skerray RMX, CD Sirocco, and P&H Cappella 166 RM.

I would also like owner feedback on a Walden Passage, unrelated to the
above boats. Interested for general fooling around usage in addition
to one of the above. Thanks!

For reference, I currently own a Pintail, an Anas Acuta and a Bestsie
Bay Aral. I've previously owned a Passage, a Nordkapp HM, a fiberglass
BBK Recluse and a Nigel Foster Silhouette (European built). I've also
built three Greenland style skin-on-frame kayaks. I've paddled a Skerray
RM (not the RMX) for two weeks in Shetland and have demoed the Capella
and the Gulfstream, which is the Sirocco's fiberglass "brother". I'm 6'
tall and ~170# (currently 165#).

The kayaks on your list are very different boats.

The Passage is at the crossover point between recreational boats and
true sea kayaks. It's pretty capable in rough water, but it's a too
short, too wide and a bit too stable to be optimum. It's also rather
slow, which can be a real handicap on longer days. It tracks moderately
strongly compared to the others. It's a great boat for what it is and it
served me well. If its size and capabilities suit your needs, it would
be a good choice.

The Skerray is a very maneuverable boat, essentially a "plastic
Pintail". It's very confidence inspiring in rough water and seems to be
a bit faster than a Pintail. It's definitely faster than a Passage and
feels far more "spirited". I like the boat a lot. I would own one for
teaching and rock play if I could justify buying another boat.

The Capella feels very well made and has one of the stiffest plastic
hulls on the market. Like the Skerray, it's very maneuverable, but I
found that it weathercocked badly, to the point that the skeg could not
correct it fully. Perhaps your experience has been different. I don't
think it's as stable as the Skerray, but I paddled the boats a couple of
years apart, so I can't say for certain.

The Gulfstream/Scirocco is a bit of a tub, IMO. It's well built, but
it's slow and somewhat ponderous feeling to me, probably because the
cockpit is excessively roomy for someone my size. It tracks reasonably
well and turns well on edge, but it just feels too big.

Depending on your size and personal preferences, you may feel entirely
differently than I do about these boats. I originally favored strong
tracking boats, but now prefer more maneuverable craft, so consider my
opinions in that context.

Brian Nystrom wrote in news:0K8rd.76575$7i4.55243
@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:

Vee wrote:
I am buying my first kayak but have been renting and demoing for a
couple of years. I have narrowed my choices to 3 similar boats. I am
very interested in hearing from those that own or have used these
boats for a period of time.
The boats are VCP Skerray RMX, CD Sirocco, and P&H Cappella 166 RM.


The kayaks on your list are very different boats.

The Passage is at the crossover point between recreational boats and
true sea kayaks. It's pretty capable in rough water, but it's a too
short, too wide and a bit too stable to be optimum. It's also rather
slow, which can be a real handicap on longer days. It tracks moderately
strongly compared to the others. It's a great boat for what it is and it
served me well. If its size and capabilities suit your needs, it would
be a good choice.

Good description of the Passage. It's also worth mentioning that it's
probably the shortest boat on the market that comes equipped with a skeg. I
found that it tracks reasonably well without the skeg deployed but improves
considerabled when dropped. Unlike another boat I won't mention the Passage
is a boat that has been made better with the addition of the skeg.


The Skerray is a very maneuverable boat, essentially a "plastic
Pintail". It's very confidence inspiring in rough water and seems to be
a bit faster than a Pintail. It's definitely faster than a Passage and
feels far more "spirited". I like the boat a lot. I would own one for
teaching and rock play if I could justify buying another boat.

What a terrific assessment of the Skerray, though the Skerray RM is actually
essentially a plastic Skerray. "Spirited" is a very good description of how
it paddles. It's just a fun boat to paddle. Do you really think the Skerray
(I assume you mean the composite version) is faster than a Pintail? I have
used mine for teaching and it's a good fit for that, although when I'm
demonstrating sweep turns or low brace turns I often feeling like I'm
cheating because it's so easy. I often have to explain to students that my
boat has a lot to do with how effective the turning strokes are.

Would you be interested in a fiberglass version with an ocean cockpit? I've
considered selling mine (but always change my mind when I get out and paddle
it again) and might consider selling it to someone I know would appreciate
it.

John Fereira wrote:
Brian Nystrom wrote in news:0K8rd.76575$7i4.55243
@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:


Vee wrote:

I am buying my first kayak but have been renting and demoing for a
couple of years. I have narrowed my choices to 3 similar boats. I am
very interested in hearing from those that own or have used these
boats for a period of time.
The boats are VCP Skerray RMX, CD Sirocco, and P&H Cappella 166 RM.


The kayaks on your list are very different boats.

The Passage is at the crossover point between recreational boats and
true sea kayaks. It's pretty capable in rough water, but it's a too
short, too wide and a bit too stable to be optimum. It's also rather
slow, which can be a real handicap on longer days. It tracks moderately
strongly compared to the others. It's a great boat for what it is and it
served me well. If its size and capabilities suit your needs, it would
be a good choice.


Good description of the Passage. It's also worth mentioning that it's
probably the shortest boat on the market that comes equipped with a skeg. I
found that it tracks reasonably well without the skeg deployed but improves
considerabled when dropped. Unlike another boat I won't mention the Passage
is a boat that has been made better with the addition of the skeg.


The Skerray is a very maneuverable boat, essentially a "plastic
Pintail". It's very confidence inspiring in rough water and seems to be
a bit faster than a Pintail. It's definitely faster than a Passage and
feels far more "spirited". I like the boat a lot. I would own one for
teaching and rock play if I could justify buying another boat.


What a terrific assessment of the Skerray, though the Skerray RM is actually
essentially a plastic Skerray. "Spirited" is a very good description of how
it paddles. It's just a fun boat to paddle. Do you really think the Skerray
(I assume you mean the composite version) is faster than a Pintail?

Actually, I was referring to the Skerray RM and yes, it seems a bit
faster, but perhaps it's just that I consider my Pintail to be a real
pig on flat water. It's the best rough water boat I've ever paddled and
I wouldn't want to be without a pre-'95 Pintail in the "fleet", but it's
drudgery to paddle when it's dead-flat-calm and I'm trying to keep up
with other paddlers in higher performance boats. As you know, it pretty
much "hits a wall" at around 4 knots. I have to admit that I've never
paddled these boats back to back, so perhaps I'm mistaken about the
speed difference.

I have
used mine for teaching and it's a good fit for that, although when I'm
demonstrating sweep turns or low brace turns I often feeling like I'm
cheating because it's so easy. I often have to explain to students that my
boat has a lot to do with how effective the turning strokes are.

Fun, isn't it? That's why I use my Pintail for instructing. My first
instructor (when I was paddling the Passage) paddled a Skerray and I
just assumed that the difference in our abilities was all a matter of
skill. Little did I know that he was cheating...

Would you be interested in a fiberglass version with an ocean cockpit? I've
considered selling mine (but always change my mind when I get out and paddle
it again) and might consider selling it to someone I know would appreciate
it.

I should hate you for tempting me like that! ;-)

Actually, there wouldn't be much point in my getting a 'glass Skerray,
since it wouldn't be much different from the Pintail. I would like to
have an RM for teaching and rock bashing, and had a line on one a while
back, but I just can't swing it right now.

Brian Nystrom wrote in
:

John Fereira wrote:
Brian Nystrom wrote in
news:0K8rd.76575$7i4.55243 @bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:


Vee wrote:

I am buying my first kayak but have been renting and demoing for a
couple of years. I have narrowed my choices to 3 similar boats. I am
very interested in hearing from those that own or have used these
boats for a period of time.
The boats are VCP Skerray RMX, CD Sirocco, and P&H Cappella 166 RM.


The kayaks on your list are very different boats.

The Passage is at the crossover point between recreational boats and
true sea kayaks. It's pretty capable in rough water, but it's a too
short, too wide and a bit too stable to be optimum. It's also rather
slow, which can be a real handicap on longer days. It tracks
moderately strongly compared to the others. It's a great boat for what
it is and it served me well. If its size and capabilities suit your
needs, it would be a good choice.


Good description of the Passage. It's also worth mentioning that it's
probably the shortest boat on the market that comes equipped with a
skeg. I found that it tracks reasonably well without the skeg
deployed but improves considerabled when dropped. Unlike another boat
I won't mention the Passage is a boat that has been made better with
the addition of the skeg.


The Skerray is a very maneuverable boat, essentially a "plastic
Pintail". It's very confidence inspiring in rough water and seems to
be a bit faster than a Pintail. It's definitely faster than a Passage
and feels far more "spirited". I like the boat a lot. I would own one
for teaching and rock play if I could justify buying another boat.


What a terrific assessment of the Skerray, though the Skerray RM is
actually essentially a plastic Skerray. "Spirited" is a very good
description of how it paddles. It's just a fun boat to paddle. Do you
really think the Skerray (I assume you mean the composite version) is
faster than a Pintail?

Actually, I was referring to the Skerray RM and yes, it seems a bit
faster, but perhaps it's just that I consider my Pintail to be a real
pig on flat water. It's the best rough water boat I've ever paddled and
I wouldn't want to be without a pre-'95 Pintail in the "fleet", but
it's drudgery to paddle when it's dead-flat-calm and I'm trying to keep
up with other paddlers in higher performance boats. As you know, it
pretty much "hits a wall" at around 4 knots. I have to admit that I've
never paddled these boats back to back, so perhaps I'm mistaken about
the speed difference.

Could be. Some boats just "feel" faster. When I built my Outer Island I
knew it was supposed to be a fast boat and I could easily tell that it was
quick but I didn't realize how efficient it was at higher speeds until I was
paddling with a friend of mine that's a strong paddler. When he's in his
Artic Hawk I always struggled to keep up him over longer distances but in
the OI I felt like I was just cruising and he wasn't pulling away from me as
he normally would.


Would you be interested in a fiberglass version with an ocean cockpit?
I've considered selling mine (but always change my mind when I get
out and paddle it again) and might consider selling it to someone I
know would appreciate it.

I should hate you for tempting me like that! ;-)

Actually, there wouldn't be much point in my getting a 'glass Skerray,
since it wouldn't be much different from the Pintail. I would like to
have an RM for teaching and rock bashing, and had a line on one a while
back, but I just can't swing it right now.

That's actually my primary motivation for selling it. There are some pretty
nice RM boats coming out these days and I wouldn't mind having something
that would take the abuse of teaching and running a few big rivers like the
Delaware. On the the other hand, for a glass boat the Skerray (and a
Pintail) can take quite a beating. According to the serial number in mine
it's 14 years old.

John Fereira wrote:
Brian Nystrom wrote in
:


John Fereira wrote:

Brian Nystrom wrote in
news:0K8rd.76575$7i4.55243 @bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:



Vee wrote:


I am buying my first kayak but have been renting and demoing for a
couple of years. I have narrowed my choices to 3 similar boats. I am
very interested in hearing from those that own or have used these
boats for a period of time.
The boats are VCP Skerray RMX, CD Sirocco, and P&H Cappella 166 RM.


The kayaks on your list are very different boats.

The Passage is at the crossover point between recreational boats and
true sea kayaks. It's pretty capable in rough water, but it's a too
short, too wide and a bit too stable to be optimum. It's also rather
slow, which can be a real handicap on longer days. It tracks
moderately strongly compared to the others. It's a great boat for what
it is and it served me well. If its size and capabilities suit your
needs, it would be a good choice.


Good description of the Passage. It's also worth mentioning that it's
probably the shortest boat on the market that comes equipped with a
skeg. I found that it tracks reasonably well without the skeg
deployed but improves considerabled when dropped. Unlike another boat
I won't mention the Passage is a boat that has been made better with
the addition of the skeg.



The Skerray is a very maneuverable boat, essentially a "plastic
Pintail". It's very confidence inspiring in rough water and seems to
be a bit faster than a Pintail. It's definitely faster than a Passage
and feels far more "spirited". I like the boat a lot. I would own one
for teaching and rock play if I could justify buying another boat.


What a terrific assessment of the Skerray, though the Skerray RM is
actually essentially a plastic Skerray. "Spirited" is a very good
description of how it paddles. It's just a fun boat to paddle. Do you
really think the Skerray (I assume you mean the composite version) is
faster than a Pintail?

Actually, I was referring to the Skerray RM and yes, it seems a bit
faster, but perhaps it's just that I consider my Pintail to be a real
pig on flat water. It's the best rough water boat I've ever paddled and
I wouldn't want to be without a pre-'95 Pintail in the "fleet", but
it's drudgery to paddle when it's dead-flat-calm and I'm trying to keep
up with other paddlers in higher performance boats. As you know, it
pretty much "hits a wall" at around 4 knots. I have to admit that I've
never paddled these boats back to back, so perhaps I'm mistaken about
the speed difference.


Could be. Some boats just "feel" faster. When I built my Outer Island I
knew it was supposed to be a fast boat and I could easily tell that it was
quick but I didn't realize how efficient it was at higher speeds until I was
paddling with a friend of mine that's a strong paddler. When he's in his
Artic Hawk I always struggled to keep up him over longer distances but in
the OI I felt like I was just cruising and he wasn't pulling away from me as
he normally would.

I have OI plans and will eventually get around to building one. After
paddling the fiberglass version recently, I was reminded of how great a
boat it is. That's definitely got me more psyched about building it.

Would you be interested in a fiberglass version with an ocean cockpit?
I've considered selling mine (but always change my mind when I get
out and paddle it again) and might consider selling it to someone I
know would appreciate it.

I should hate you for tempting me like that! ;-)

Actually, there wouldn't be much point in my getting a 'glass Skerray,
since it wouldn't be much different from the Pintail. I would like to
have an RM for teaching and rock bashing, and had a line on one a while
back, but I just can't swing it right now.


That's actually my primary motivation for selling it. There are some pretty
nice RM boats coming out these days and I wouldn't mind having something
that would take the abuse of teaching and running a few big rivers like the
Delaware. On the the other hand, for a glass boat the Skerray (and a
Pintail) can take quite a beating. According to the serial number in mine
it's 14 years old.

My Pintail is a '93. It was rough when I bought it and it's taken plenty
of abuse since then. It's held up remarkably well, needing only a bit of
gelcoat work.

Vee wrote:
I am buying my first kayak but have been renting and demoing for a
couple of years. I have narrowed my choices to 3 similar boats. I am
very interested in hearing from those that own or have used these
boats for a period of time.
The boats are VCP Skerray RMX, CD Sirocco, and P&H Cappella 166 RM.

I would also like owner feedback on a Walden Passage, unrelated to
the
above boats. Interested for general fooling around usage in addition
to one of the above. Thanks!

Thanks to both of you. From your feedback I surmise that the Skerray
would be the best choice but the Walden Passage is a good boat until I
figure out what I want be when I grow up. I live in W.NY and my initial
usage will probably be a mix of finger lakes, small rivers and the
canal. These trips will probably be evenings after work, 1/2 day
Saturdays and a rare overnight. I have not tried the Passage but will
attempt to locate one. I have tried the smaller Waldens at Bay Creek
but found the deck height too low to get comfortable. I don't have any
rolling skills so the mention that it rolls well was encouraging
because i was concerned about the width 24". I am in my 50's , 5'10
,190# and size 10 shoes. Fit has been the issue with some other boats.
I tried a CD Squamish and it felt tight that's why I asked about the
Sirocco. Based on price the Passage is a winner and if $ were not an
issue to the Skerray would be the way to go? My concern is probably
the same as other first time buyers afraid to buy too low or too much
for our beginning usage. Thanks for sharing your experience.

In a previous article, "vee" said:
attempt to locate one. I have tried the smaller Waldens at Bay Creek
but found the deck height too low to get comfortable. I don't have any

If you're paddling at Bay Creek (I assume you mean the one in Irondequoit
Creek?), don't judge the Skerray RMX by the yellow one they rent out. I
was paddling that one about twice a week this summer. I bought a brand
new one that they had on the racks at their end-of-year sale, and while it
handles about the same, it had a much better seat, much better thigh pads
and the skeg is controlled by a slider (much like the rental Avocets)
instead of the rope brake. Oh, and the plastic doesn't cut into your
hands when you pick it up by the cockpit. The yellow Skerray was a
trade-in, and evidently the previous owner customized it by ripping out
the coaming(? is that the term?) that goes around the inside of the
cockpit so that he could put in his own thigh pads.


--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
The software said it requires Windows 95 or better, so I installed Linux