OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 19:39:52 -0500, DSK wrote:

JohnH wrote:


Harry, just what rights have you lost under the Patriot Act. I've asked you this
before, but you apparently missed the question.

I'm not Harry (not by a long way) but I believe I can answer this.

** from http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitut...lofrights.html **

Bill of Rights

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects,
against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no
warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and
particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things
to be seized.

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless
on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the
land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or
public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put
in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a
witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due
process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just
compensation.

Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and
public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall

have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law,
and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be
confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining
witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his
defense.

Amendment VII

In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars,
the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall
be otherwise reexamined in any court of the United States, than according to the
rules of the common law.

Amendment IX

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to
deny or disparage others retained by the people.

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by
it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

Can you please show us the title, sub-title, and section numbers of the act
which remove those rights?

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

"JohnH" wrote in message
...


Each citizen of the US is entitled to a full spectrum
of civil rights until *convicted* (not merely accused of) a serious
crime."

Hey professor - remember yesterday's news? Jose Padilla ***is*** a U.S.
citizen, so what happened to HIS rights under the so-called Patriot Act? No
due process, professor.

Perhaps you have a unusual definition of "each", in your phrase "each
citizen".

Well, could you please give us the
title, sub-title, and section number of that portion of the bill which
provides
for: "Merely by uttering the word, "Terrorist" or "Enemy Combatant", under
the
Patriot Act, the Executive branch can strip any citizen of the United
States of
any and all civil rights.

Perhaps YOU could point out where in the Patriot Act it's written that U.S.
citizens can be held incommunicado for indefinite periods of time.

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

"JohnH" wrote in message
...


The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor
prohibited by
it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the
people.

Can you please show us the title, sub-title, and section numbers of the
act
which remove those rights?

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD

He doesn't need to, John. You've already seen one glaring example of the
government's willingness and ability to remove certain rights. Unless, of
course, you are claiming that the case of Jose Padilla is a complete
fabrication, and that the 2nd Circuit Court of Appeals reviewed something
that didn't exist. Is that what you're saying?

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

snip
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor
prohibited by
it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the
people.

Can you please show us the title, sub-title, and section numbers of the act
which remove those rights?

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
I will give you some pointers to find this out for your self:

http://www.eff.org/Privacy/Surveilla...t_analysis.php

http://www.aclu.org/SafeandFree/Safe...ID=12126&c=207

http://www.fas.org/irp/crs/RS21203.pdf

Mark Browne

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

snip
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor
prohibited by
it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the
people.

Can you please show us the title, sub-title, and section numbers of the act
which remove those rights?

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD

The most direct answer to your question:

http://www.aclu.org/Files/OpenFile.cfm?id=11812

Mark Browne

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

"Mark Browne" wrote in message
news:IOIEb.598754$Tr4.1566177@attbi_s03...

The most direct answer to your question:

http://www.aclu.org/Files/OpenFile.cfm?id=11812

Mark Browne

J. Edgar would've LOVED this. It codifies things he was already doing.

JohnH won't believe it, though. He just wants to have a nice weekend.

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

On Fri, 19 Dec 2003 19:58:31 GMT, "Mark Browne"
wrote:

snip
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor
prohibited by
it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the
people.

Can you please show us the title, sub-title, and section numbers of the act
which remove those rights?

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
I will give you some pointers to find this out for your self:

http://www.eff.org/Privacy/Surveilla...t_analysis.php

http://www.aclu.org/SafeandFree/Safe...ID=12126&c=207

http://www.fas.org/irp/crs/RS21203.pdf

Mark Browne

Mark, I found none of the 'panic' in the Federation of American Scientists
report that is in the ACLU report and the ravings of some of the folks in the
NG. Perhaps I'm just not the brightest light in the chandelier, but I don't see
the reason for the implications that we have lost all the rights granted us by
the Bill of Rights.

Yes, I plan to enjoy the weekend.

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

On Fri, 19 Dec 2003 18:12:42 -0500, Harry Krause wrote:

Doug Kanter wrote:

"Mark Browne" wrote in message
news:IOIEb.598754$Tr4.1566177@attbi_s03...

The most direct answer to your question:

http://www.aclu.org/Files/OpenFile.cfm?id=11812

Mark Browne

J. Edgar would've LOVED this. It codifies things he was already doing.

JohnH won't believe it, though. He just wants to have a nice weekend.



And wear his uniform and pretend he's still a soldier.

From whence came this tidbit, Harry?

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

Doug Kanter wrote:

"Mark Browne" wrote in message
news:IOIEb.598754$Tr4.1566177@attbi_s03...

The most direct answer to your question:

http://www.aclu.org/Files/OpenFile.cfm?id=11812

Mark Browne

J. Edgar would've LOVED this. It codifies things he was already doing.

JohnH won't believe it, though. He just wants to have a nice weekend.



And wear his uniform and pretend he's still a soldier.

--
Email sent to is never read.

OT--If you're a liberal, be careful what you ask for
 

JohnH wrote:
On Fri, 19 Dec 2003 18:12:42 -0500, Harry Krause wrote:

Doug Kanter wrote:

"Mark Browne" wrote in message
news:IOIEb.598754$Tr4.1566177@attbi_s03...

The most direct answer to your question:

http://www.aclu.org/Files/OpenFile.cfm?id=11812

Mark Browne

J. Edgar would've LOVED this. It codifies things he was already doing.

JohnH won't believe it, though. He just wants to have a nice weekend.



And wear his uniform and pretend he's still a soldier.

From whence came this tidbit, Harry?

Why, from this here post of yours:

"I, along with other retirees, wore my uniform as a teacher every
Veterans' Day."

But don't fret, John, I wore my old uniform as a teacher, too.



--
Email sent to is never read.