Newbie Navigation questions
 

I am interested in learning to navigate, but am wondering where to
start. Basic questions I have include:
- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),
- is there a recommended class (online or distance learning) for
navigation this winter, and
- in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator
that is worth obtaining for cruising?

All input is appreciated, thank you.

Alan

On 28 Sep 2004 06:56:27 -0700, (Alan Parr) wrote:

I am interested in learning to navigate, but am wondering where to
start. Basic questions I have include:
- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),

Generally West Marine online, or any West Marine store can help.
I would read up a little first and see what makes you comfortable.
You might want to also look at Blue Water Navigation for books and
tools.

Personal Note: I'm a person who prefers using Nav triangles rather
than a parallel ruler - it's just easier for me. I would suggest that
you get a set of dividers that have a fine control thumb wheel in the
middle - much easier to use and you can get a pretty fine adjustment
with them. Purchase a set of triangles and a set of parallel rulers
and just return the one you don't like.

I would also get a long steel ruler - that helps a lot when learning
how to set up a course line and measure long lines of lat/long.

At least for me that is. :)

- is there a recommended class (online or distance learning) for
navigation this winter, and

United States Power Squadron does basic and advanced courses around
these parts (CT) as does the Coast Guard Auxillary. Their courses are
fairly basic, but you will be able to get a sense of how navigation is
accomplished and a basic idea of how to get from point A to point B.

- in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator
that is worth obtaining for cruising?

Another good question.

It is worth it if you want to know how to do some of the more
difficult navigation problems, a deeper understanding of Colregs,
navigation rules and other bits and pieces of the waterman's world.
Even a basic OUPV (Operator of Uninspected Passenger Vessel) license
class (sometimes called the Six Pack or Captains license) will give
you some neat knowledge that you would have to dig to obtain.

One piece of advice I would give you is that you check out the OUPV
courses - some are just diploma mills - they teach the test they
themselves develop. Find one where you are actually going to get
some education.

Is it worth getting the license? Depends. The physicals, drug tests,
paperwork, etc, you eventually end up spending anywhere from $1,600 to
$2,000 obtaining the license. And if you plan on using the license,
remember that there about 20 bizllion Captains out there. :)

If you get a good course, it's great.

However, having said that, there really isn't much you can't learn by
yourself if you pay attention and do some reading and research. Some
good books a

A recent copy of the USCG Navigation Rules.

A copy of "The American Navigator" by Nathaniel Bowditch. (Minor
claim to fame here - I'm related to him). It has been seriously
updated over the years and it THE source of information about
navigation.

"The Boater's Bowditch" which is a terrific companion book to the
American Navigator" for folks to read through or to get a slightly
different slant on a problem. It's written in a very stilted and
formal style, but the information it contains is very good.

Those three will get you pretty much where you want to go.

I would purchase a "Chapman's" only as a last resort.

Good luck - have fun.

Take care.

Tom

"The beatings will stop when morale improves."
E. Teach, 1717

"Alan Parr" wrote in message
om...
I am interested in learning to navigate, but am wondering where to
start. Basic questions I have include:

- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),

Online at www.westmarine.com or www.boatus.com (same company, actually -
the former owns the latter). The major diff is that if you walk into a West
Marine store, you can have a catalog for free. At BoatUS, they insult you by
charging you fourteen bucks for a catalog.


- is there a recommended class (online or distance learning) for
navigation this winter, and
- in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator
that is worth obtaining for cruising?

Not sure where the St. Croix river is. But, if you've got a Coast Guard
station anywhere nearby, give them a call and ask about Power Squadron
classes. They're usually given at local high schools, fire halls, churches,
or other hideously overheated placed. Well worthwhile, though.

"Alan Parr" wrote in message
om...
I am interested in learning to navigate, but am wondering where to
start. Basic questions I have include:
- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),
- is there a recommended class (online or distance learning) for
navigation this winter, and
- in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator
that is worth obtaining for cruising?

All input is appreciated, thank you.

Alan

......and I forgot to mention: Absolutely, positively get yourself the book
"Chapman Piloting, Seamanship and Small Boat Handling", by Elbert S.
Maloney. Not easy to find in bookstores, but you can order it from
www.westmarine.com.

On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 14:43:50 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Alan Parr" wrote in message
. com...
I am interested in learning to navigate, but am wondering where to
start. Basic questions I have include:

- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),

Online at www.westmarine.com or www.boatus.com (same company, actually -
the former owns the latter). The major diff is that if you walk into a West
Marine store, you can have a catalog for free. At BoatUS, they insult you by
charging you fourteen bucks for a catalog.


- is there a recommended class (online or distance learning) for
navigation this winter, and
- in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator
that is worth obtaining for cruising?

Not sure where the St. Croix river is. But, if you've got a Coast Guard
station anywhere nearby, give them a call and ask about Power Squadron
classes. They're usually given at local high schools, fire halls, churches,
or other hideously overheated placed. Well worthwhile, though.

ROTFL!!!!

I helped a friend with a Nav course last winter and it was held in a
Holiday Inn conference room.

On a Sunday.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

With the Greater Hartford Nigerian Christian Evangelical Church
services being held three conference rooms down the hall.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

With drums - BIG drums.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

Not a drum set, but REAL African drums.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

And what sounded like a Hammond B3.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

With a Leslie.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

And a band with guitars and four Marshall amps.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

And a bass player.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

And a preacher who made up for his lack of singing ability with a LOT
of enthusiasm.

(PRAISE JESUS!!!!)

Overheating wasn't the major problem. :)

(AMEN!!!!)

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 14:47:57 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
. com...
I am interested in learning to navigate, but am wondering where to
start. Basic questions I have include:
- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),
- is there a recommended class (online or distance learning) for
navigation this winter, and
- in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator
that is worth obtaining for cruising?

All input is appreciated, thank you.

Alan

.....and I forgot to mention: Absolutely, positively get yourself the book
"Chapman Piloting, Seamanship and Small Boat Handling", by Elbert S.
Maloney. Not easy to find in bookstores, but you can order it from
www.westmarine.com.

IDIOT!!!! NIMROD!!!! BOZO!!!! NUMB NUTS!!!!

Oh, wait, this is a boating thread.

Never mind - my bad. :)

Later,

Tom

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 14:47:57 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
.com...
I am interested in learning to navigate, but am wondering where to
start. Basic questions I have include:
- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),
- is there a recommended class (online or distance learning) for
navigation this winter, and
- in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator
that is worth obtaining for cruising?

All input is appreciated, thank you.

Alan

.....and I forgot to mention: Absolutely, positively get yourself the book
"Chapman Piloting, Seamanship and Small Boat Handling", by Elbert S.
Maloney. Not easy to find in bookstores, but you can order it from
www.westmarine.com.

IDIOT!!!! NIMROD!!!! BOZO!!!! NUMB NUTS!!!!

Oh, wait, this is a boating thread.

Never mind - my bad. :)

Later,

Tom

Bad indeed. Nimrod was a mighty hunter, among other attributes.

--
We today have a president of the United States who looks like he is the
son of Howdy Doody or Alfred E. Newman, who isn't smarter than either of
them, who is arrogant about his ignorance, who is reckless and
incompetent, and whose backers are turning the United States into a pariah.

What, me worry?

On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 10:59:57 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 14:47:57 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
e.com...
I am interested in learning to navigate, but am wondering where to
start. Basic questions I have include:
- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),
- is there a recommended class (online or distance learning) for
navigation this winter, and
- in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator
that is worth obtaining for cruising?

All input is appreciated, thank you.

Alan

.....and I forgot to mention: Absolutely, positively get yourself the book
"Chapman Piloting, Seamanship and Small Boat Handling", by Elbert S.
Maloney. Not easy to find in bookstores, but you can order it from
www.westmarine.com.

IDIOT!!!! NIMROD!!!! BOZO!!!! NUMB NUTS!!!!

Oh, wait, this is a boating thread.

Never mind - my bad. :)

Bad indeed. Nimrod was a mighty hunter, among other attributes.

Well I'll be....er.....hornswoggled!!!

I never knew that.

Interesting read. Thanks Harry.

http://www.ldolphin.org/Nimrod.html

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

- where can I buy dividers, compass and charts (e.g. St. Croix river
area),

St Crois River? Best I can say is, go downstream until you hit a bridge, turn
right and that is Minnesota, turn left and it is Wisconsin.

seriously, if you really want a genuine nav course, go to any small airport
that gives flying lessons and sign for a nav course. you won't learn celestial
nav, because that went the way of the dodo bird in aviation about 60 years ago,
and in seagoing about 20 years ago. Sorta like button hooks and boots.

Bad indeed. Nimrod was a mighty hunter, among other attributes.


what Nimrod hunted was human beings. A sadistic ******* he was too, but you
are right hoary, Nimrod was good at it.

Bad indeed. Nimrod was a mighty hunter, among other attributes.

Well I'll be....er.....hornswoggled!!!

I never knew that.

Nimrod the mighty hunter of humans of biblical times became the stupid yo-yo
hunter of modern times in 1955(?) when Daffy Duck (?) taunted Elmer Fudd (?)
calling him "my little Nimrod".

alanxparr asks:

- - in the long-term is there a certification for pilot or navigator that is
worth obtaining for cruising?-

Bilge- There's some down sides to obtaining USCG licensure that not many folks
are acquainted with.

If you've ever had a DUI conviction, you may not be eligible to be licensed
without jumping through a lot of bureaucratic hoops. If you do get a license,
and you subsequently get a DUI, the Coast Guard will likely "ask" you to
"surrender" your license. The National Driver Registry is now open to the
USCG,(Hazelwood's Legacy to the industry).

And, I'm not sure if it applies down at "Six-Pack Level", but upper level
licenses and Mariner's documents have to be renewed every 5 years now, showing
at least one year of seatime in the interval.

You also might have to "dance" to IMO's STCW (Standards of Training for the
Certification of Watchstanders), which has been imposed on us recently.

On the upside, you become a licensed captain. The Coast Guard holds your
license "in esteem". So, say you are involved in a collision with "Cap'n" Joe
Blow, and there are "gray areas" to what happened...it comes down to your word
against his word.
You have an up to date bound logbook, corrected charts with your course track,
waypoints...all that "literate deck-ape" stuff, and your Master's license in
the "stud rack".

Whose insurance company do you s'pose is going to eat the expensive fecal
biscuit?

It's well worth consideration.


Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

jaxashby asserts:

-seriously, if you really want a genuine nav course, go to any small airport
that gives flying lessons and sign for a nav course. you won't learn celestial
nav, because that went the way of the dodo bird in aviation about 60 years
ago,and in seagoing about 20 years ago. Sorta like button hooks and boots.-

Bilge- Izzatso? I'll let the deck officers on my ship know that. ABS is aboard
today, I'm sure they can all use a laugh.

Aren't you the clown who wants to have people thrown in prison if their anchor
drags in a storm and they collide with another craft?

And yet here you are...advising someone to set sail without learning celestial
navigation...so what do they do when the genny ****s the bed and the batteries
short out and no more satellite or LORAN...in the middle of the passage...huh,
bright boy?

Oh, that's right...head...somewhere. And if the fuel runs out, or the winds
die, you can scream for help...The professionals will divert to assist your
sorry ass, if your radio works.

So you can come back in here and post your inane garbage.

You do realize that someone light actually take your dreck as sound advice,
right?

GFY


Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

bilge rat, the electric wire runner, tells us he is at least two decades out of
date on navigation, maybe three decades.

(Bilgeman)
Date: 9/28/2004 12:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

jaxashby asserts:

-seriously, if you really want a genuine nav course, go to any small
airport
that gives flying lessons and sign for a nav course. you won't learn
celestial
nav, because that went the way of the dodo bird in aviation about 60 years
ago,and in seagoing about 20 years ago. Sorta like button hooks and
boots.-

Bilge- Izzatso? I'll let the deck officers on my ship know that. ABS is
aboard
today, I'm sure they can all use a laugh.

Aren't you the clown who wants to have people thrown in prison if their
anchor
drags in a storm and they collide with another craft?

And yet here you are...advising someone to set sail without learning
celestial
navigation...so what do they do when the genny ****s the bed and the
batteries
short out and no more satellite or LORAN...in the middle of the
passage...huh,
bright boy?

Oh, that's right...head...somewhere. And if the fuel runs out, or the winds
die, you can scream for help...The professionals will divert to assist your
sorry ass, if your radio works.

So you can come back in here and post your inane garbage.

You do realize that someone light actually take your dreck as sound advice,
right?

GFY


Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

Thanks to all for your prompt responses. I have West Marine online
and am checking out a Nav kit, I've shot off a couple of queries to
the CG about local courses, and only time will tell if it will be
worthwhile pursuing a certification - but the experience will improve
my sailing, and that's what counts.

Thank you,

Alan

"Alan Parr" wrote in message
om...
Thanks to all for your prompt responses. I have West Marine online
and am checking out a Nav kit, I've shot off a couple of queries to
the CG about local courses, and only time will tell if it will be
worthwhile pursuing a certification - but the experience will improve
my sailing, and that's what counts.

Thank you,

Alan

Don't forget that book, Alan! Even if you ignore the sections on navigation,
it'll still serve a very important purpose: If other family members read it,
they might learn some of the things that the captain sometimes needs to YELL
during tense situations. Unfortunately, the book is missing one thing. I've
repeatedly told my first mate that for safety reasons, she should remove her
shirt while on the boat during nice weather. She wants to see it in writing
from another source, and I can't find it anywhere.

On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 20:36:27 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
. com...
Thanks to all for your prompt responses. I have West Marine online
and am checking out a Nav kit, I've shot off a couple of queries to
the CG about local courses, and only time will tell if it will be
worthwhile pursuing a certification - but the experience will improve
my sailing, and that's what counts.

Thank you,

Alan

Don't forget that book, Alan! Even if you ignore the sections on navigation,
it'll still serve a very important purpose: If other family members read it,
they might learn some of the things that the captain sometimes needs to YELL
during tense situations. Unfortunately, the book is missing one thing. I've
repeatedly told my first mate that for safety reasons, she should remove her
shirt while on the boat during nice weather. She wants to see it in writing
from another source, and I can't find it anywhere.

It's a well known nautical fact that females have to take their shirts
off and expose their...er....themselves to the elements.

Why the hell do you think the female mastheads are half naked all the
time? [1]

Take care.

Tom

"The beatings will stop when morale improves."
E. Teach, 1717

[1] Think that will help Doug?

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 20:36:27 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
. com...
Thanks to all for your prompt responses. I have West Marine online
and am checking out a Nav kit, I've shot off a couple of queries to
the CG about local courses, and only time will tell if it will be
worthwhile pursuing a certification - but the experience will improve
my sailing, and that's what counts.

Thank you,

Alan

Don't forget that book, Alan! Even if you ignore the sections on
navigation,
it'll still serve a very important purpose: If other family members read
it,
they might learn some of the things that the captain sometimes needs to
YELL
during tense situations. Unfortunately, the book is missing one thing.
I've
repeatedly told my first mate that for safety reasons, she should remove
her
shirt while on the boat during nice weather. She wants to see it in
writing
from another source, and I can't find it anywhere.

It's a well known nautical fact that females have to take their shirts
off and expose their...er....themselves to the elements.

Why the hell do you think the female mastheads are half naked all the
time? [1]

Take care.

Tom

Thank you, Tom. This may be the "another source" that takes care of my
onboard disagreement. It's unbelievable how some people don't understand the
meaning of the word "captain".

Also, you could try to find out if there is a maritime academy or college
near you that gives courses to the public.

to learn nav? what on Earth for? That is like going to a college to learn how
to brush one's teeth.

nav is simple. even more simple on the St. Croix River. Upstream is north,
downstream is south. Hit the dam and you are in St Croix Falls (east, where
the sun comes up) or Taylor's Falls (west, where the sun goes down).

Alan, don't sweat it. nav is easy

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
Also, you could try to find out if there is a maritime academy or college
near you that gives courses to the public.

to learn nav? what on Earth for? That is like going to a college to
learn how
to brush one's teeth.

nav is simple. even more simple on the St. Croix River. Upstream is
north,
downstream is south. Hit the dam and you are in St Croix Falls (east,
where
the sun comes up) or Taylor's Falls (west, where the sun goes down).

Alan, don't sweat it. nav is easy

Yeah. Easy. Compass variation & deviation can be lurnt rite on the bak of a
serial box.

Alan is a genius for wanting to learn. But, you are a complete moron.

Yeah. Easy. Compass variation & deviation can be lurnt rite on the bak of a
serial box.

actually, it is a cereal box, but yes, of course. but spelling doesn't count.

jaxashby the AOTOS doesn't reply:

-bilge rat, the electric wire runner, tells us he is at least two decades out
of date on navigation, maybe three decades.-

Bilge-Cute comeback, ****-lick, but why didn't you answer the questions?

Were they too hard for you to understand?

These are not really "hypotheticals", you know...it's a lot easier to answer
them here in the comfort of cyberspace than on a dead craft in the middle of
the sea or Great Lakes.

Waiting...

GFY;




Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

ancientangler comments:

-Yeah. Easy. Compass variation & deviation can be lurnt rite on the bak of a
serial box.-

Bilge-jaxashby doesn't know that a compass can be used for more than holding a
beer can.

Regards;


Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 00:36:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 20:36:27 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
. com...
Thanks to all for your prompt responses. I have West Marine online
and am checking out a Nav kit, I've shot off a couple of queries to
the CG about local courses, and only time will tell if it will be
worthwhile pursuing a certification - but the experience will improve
my sailing, and that's what counts.

Thank you,

Alan

Don't forget that book, Alan! Even if you ignore the sections on
navigation,
it'll still serve a very important purpose: If other family members read
it,
they might learn some of the things that the captain sometimes needs to
YELL
during tense situations. Unfortunately, the book is missing one thing.
I've
repeatedly told my first mate that for safety reasons, she should remove
her
shirt while on the boat during nice weather. She wants to see it in
writing
from another source, and I can't find it anywhere.

It's a well known nautical fact that females have to take their shirts
off and expose their...er....themselves to the elements.

Why the hell do you think the female mastheads are half naked all the
time? [1]

Take care.

Tom

Thank you, Tom. This may be the "another source" that takes care of my
onboard disagreement. It's unbelievable how some people don't understand the
meaning of the word "captain".

Trust me, I have the same problem. ;)

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

On 29 Sep 2004 03:51:34 GMT, (Bilgeman) wrote:

ancientangler comments:

-Yeah. Easy. Compass variation & deviation can be lurnt rite on the bak of a
serial box.-

Bilge-jaxashby doesn't know that a compass can be used for more than holding a
beer can.

You mean it does something other than holding my soda can?

Damn....

Later,

Tom

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 10:43:48 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 00:36:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 20:36:27 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
. com...
Thanks to all for your prompt responses. I have West Marine online
and am checking out a Nav kit, I've shot off a couple of queries to
the CG about local courses, and only time will tell if it will be
worthwhile pursuing a certification - but the experience will improve
my sailing, and that's what counts.

Thank you,

Alan

Don't forget that book, Alan! Even if you ignore the sections on
navigation,
it'll still serve a very important purpose: If other family members read
it,
they might learn some of the things that the captain sometimes needs to
YELL
during tense situations. Unfortunately, the book is missing one thing.
I've
repeatedly told my first mate that for safety reasons, she should remove
her
shirt while on the boat during nice weather. She wants to see it in
writing
from another source, and I can't find it anywhere.

It's a well known nautical fact that females have to take their shirts
off and expose their...er....themselves to the elements.

Why the hell do you think the female mastheads are half naked all the
time? [1]

Take care.

Tom

Thank you, Tom. This may be the "another source" that takes care of my
onboard disagreement. It's unbelievable how some people don't understand the
meaning of the word "captain".

Trust me, I have the same problem. ;)

Then again, I just thought of something.

Wouldn't this attract the attention of those over zealous Coasties you
encountered the last time? :)

All the best,

Tom
--------------

"What the hell's the deal with this newsgroup...
is there a computer terminal in the day room of
some looney bin somewhere?"

Bilgeman - circa 2004

bilge rat the original poster lives in east central Minnesota or or northwest
Wisconsin. he wants to learn navigation. a local FBO (licensed by the Federal
Government to teach navigation) will teach him more and more thoroughly than
any USPS course done at a distance.

btw, why should some bilge rat crawling around underdeck pulling wires know
diddly squat about navigation?


(Bilgeman)
Date: 9/28/2004 11:46 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

jaxashby the AOTOS doesn't reply:

-bilge rat, the electric wire runner, tells us he is at least two decades
out
of date on navigation, maybe three decades.-

Bilge-Cute comeback, ****-lick, but why didn't you answer the questions?

Were they too hard for you to understand?

These are not really "hypotheticals", you know...it's a lot easier to answer
them here in the comfort of cyberspace than on a dead craft in the middle of
the sea or Great Lakes.

Waiting...

GFY;




Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 10:43:48 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 00:36:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
message
. ..
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 20:36:27 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
. com...
Thanks to all for your prompt responses. I have West Marine online
and am checking out a Nav kit, I've shot off a couple of queries to
the CG about local courses, and only time will tell if it will be
worthwhile pursuing a certification - but the experience will
improve
my sailing, and that's what counts.

Thank you,

Alan

Don't forget that book, Alan! Even if you ignore the sections on
navigation,
it'll still serve a very important purpose: If other family members
read
it,
they might learn some of the things that the captain sometimes needs
to
YELL
during tense situations. Unfortunately, the book is missing one
thing.
I've
repeatedly told my first mate that for safety reasons, she should
remove
her
shirt while on the boat during nice weather. She wants to see it in
writing
from another source, and I can't find it anywhere.

It's a well known nautical fact that females have to take their shirts
off and expose their...er....themselves to the elements.

Why the hell do you think the female mastheads are half naked all the
time? [1]

Take care.

Tom

Thank you, Tom. This may be the "another source" that takes care of my
onboard disagreement. It's unbelievable how some people don't understand
the
meaning of the word "captain".

Trust me, I have the same problem. ;)

Then again, I just thought of something.

Wouldn't this attract the attention of those over zealous Coasties you
encountered the last time? :)

I know a cove where there's about 12" of water. Great bass & pike, and fine
entertainment when phat boats come cranking in at anything over 2 knots. :-)

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 12:53:11 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 10:43:48 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 00:36:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
message
. ..
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 20:36:27 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Alan Parr" wrote in message
. com...
Thanks to all for your prompt responses. I have West Marine online
and am checking out a Nav kit, I've shot off a couple of queries to
the CG about local courses, and only time will tell if it will be
worthwhile pursuing a certification - but the experience will
improve
my sailing, and that's what counts.

Thank you,

Alan

Don't forget that book, Alan! Even if you ignore the sections on
navigation,
it'll still serve a very important purpose: If other family members
read
it,
they might learn some of the things that the captain sometimes needs
to
YELL
during tense situations. Unfortunately, the book is missing one
thing.
I've
repeatedly told my first mate that for safety reasons, she should
remove
her
shirt while on the boat during nice weather. She wants to see it in
writing
from another source, and I can't find it anywhere.

It's a well known nautical fact that females have to take their shirts
off and expose their...er....themselves to the elements.

Why the hell do you think the female mastheads are half naked all the
time? [1]

Take care.

Tom

Thank you, Tom. This may be the "another source" that takes care of my
onboard disagreement. It's unbelievable how some people don't understand
the
meaning of the word "captain".

Trust me, I have the same problem. ;)

Then again, I just thought of something.

Wouldn't this attract the attention of those over zealous Coasties you
encountered the last time? :)

I know a cove where there's about 12" of water. Great bass & pike, and fine
entertainment when phat boats come cranking in at anything over 2 knots. :-)

Ah - I see.

Well, not I don't "see" as it were, but I...

Never mind.

Later,

Tom

tomf123 asks:

-You mean it does something other than holding my soda can?-

Bilge- Yeah, man! It can hold your bong, your ashtray, with a little duct tape
it makes a wicked lava lamp platform...like dude! There's a zillion uses for
the thing.

I've even heard, back in the "Golden Age", that some ship turned their
binnacle into the "no-****-'em" finest wet bar anyone had ever seen!

Well, that was only the starboard one...for the licensed officers, the
unlicensed had the port binnacle, which had been converted into a keg chiller &
tap. James Bond and "Q" were mere hobbyists compared to that crew.

Quartermasters were chosen mainly for their skills at dry martini assembly.

Some of the most vicious fistfights anyone could ever witness would be between
two AB's over which one had "First Wheel".

Cheers;


Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

jaxashby asks through his slobber:

-bilge rat the original poster lives in east central Minnesota or or
northwest Wisconsin. he wants to learn navigation. a local FBO (licensed by
the Federal Government to teach navigation) will teach him more and more
thoroughly than any USPS course done at a distance.-

Bilge-Was he sentenced there? Is he free to say, charter a boat and diddy-bop
around the Bahamas or Carribean?

Has this fellow been put on the Great Lakes "unauthorized boater list"?

-btw, why should some bilge rat crawling around underdeck pulling wires know
diddly squat about navigation?-jaxashby

Bilge- Better to know a little something about it and not need it, than to need
it and know diddly squat about it.

We carry "passengers", you know. I could conceivably end up the senior seaman
in a lifeboat with a bunch of "farmboys and girls" looking to ME for answers
about What, Where, Who, When, Why...

You think you'll get by in a situation like that by covering up ignorance with
arrogance?

You won't. If the sea doesn't exact it's due, your passengers might. Far better
to know some basics and rudimentary skills, and be honest about it, than try to
"bluff"...or crawl under a thwart, curl into a ball and suck yer thumb.

In fact, I once sea-trialed the MV Cape Ducato out of the Sparrows Point Yard
in Bawlmer, and spent most of one night helping the Second mate set the
waypoints into the channel, (Bremerton, IIRC), for our out bound passage down
the Bay.

Now, why bother with "waypoints" and all that jazz when we'd be under pilotage
all the way out through the Capes?

Because the guys on that ship were professionals...not a bunch of slack-asses,
and I respected 'em for it. And I was glad to help out a shipmate and maybe
learn something useful.

Which I did...not to the point where I'm "horny" to tackle spherical
trigonometry as a hobby, but enough to appreciate that the 2nd Mates aren't
necessarily sitting up in the chart room with their thumbs stuck up their
asses.

GFY;


Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

On 29 Sep 2004 21:01:20 GMT, (Bilgeman) wrote:

tomf123 asks:

-You mean it does something other than holding my soda can?-

Bilge- Yeah, man! It can hold your bong, your ashtray, with a little duct tape
it makes a wicked lava lamp platform...like dude! There's a zillion uses for
the thing.

I've even heard, back in the "Golden Age", that some ship turned their
binnacle into the "no-****-'em" finest wet bar anyone had ever seen!

Well, that was only the starboard one...for the licensed officers, the
unlicensed had the port binnacle, which had been converted into a keg chiller &
tap. James Bond and "Q" were mere hobbyists compared to that crew.

Quartermasters were chosen mainly for their skills at dry martini assembly.

Some of the most vicious fistfights anyone could ever witness would be between
two AB's over which one had "First Wheel".

Back in the day, I was called in by one of our electronics suppliers
to take a look at a ships radar that was giving the local technician
fits. It was a courtesy thing as we occasionally used this German
cargo line for hauling pipe and what not to the North Sea staging
areas and they couldn't leave port unless the radars were working.

Everybody was doing everybody a favour.

Anyway,

I'm here to say, without a doubt, that was the finest food and beer I
have ever had 'lo these many years that I have been on Earth.

Those Germans knew how to live on ship, I'll tell you what... )

Take care.

Tom

"The beatings will stop when morale improves."
E. Teach, 1717

bilge, you are so drunk you won't remember a thing for days.

Bilge-Was he sentenced there? Is he free to say, charter a boat and diddy-bop
around the Bahamas or Carribean?

Has this fellow been put on the Great Lakes "unauthorized boater list"?

-btw, why should some bilge rat crawling around underdeck pulling wires
know
diddly squat about navigation?-jaxashby

Bilge- Better to know a little something about it and not need it, than to
need
it and know diddly squat about it.

We carry "passengers", you know. I could conceivably end up the senior
seaman
in a lifeboat with a bunch of "farmboys and girls" looking to ME for answers
about What, Where, Who, When, Why...

You think you'll get by in a situation like that by covering up ignorance
with
arrogance?

You won't. If the sea doesn't exact it's due, your passengers might. Far
better
to know some basics and rudimentary skills, and be honest about it, than try
to
"bluff"...or crawl under a thwart, curl into a ball and suck yer thumb.

In fact, I once sea-trialed the MV Cape Ducato out of the Sparrows Point
Yard
in Bawlmer, and spent most of one night helping the Second mate set the
waypoints into the channel, (Bremerton, IIRC), for our out bound passage down
the Bay.

Now, why bother with "waypoints" and all that jazz when we'd be under
pilotage
all the way out through the Capes?

Because the guys on that ship were professionals...not a bunch of
slack-asses,
and I respected 'em for it. And I was glad to help out a shipmate and maybe
learn something useful.

Which I did...not to the point where I'm "horny" to tackle spherical
trigonometry as a hobby, but enough to appreciate that the 2nd Mates aren't
necessarily sitting up in the chart room with their thumbs stuck up their
asses.

GFY;


Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

tomf123 relates:

-I'm here to say, without a doubt, that was the finest food and beer Ihave
ever had 'lo these many years that I have been on Earth.

Those Germans knew how to live on ship, I'll tell you what... )-

Bilge-Hate to say it, but all the Western Euros know how to live on their ships
better'n us.

I helped to "organize" Global Marine, a British cable ship operation that had
won the Atlantic Cable Maintenance Agreement for a few years.

http://www.globalmarinesystems.com/s...esentinel.html

British flagged, she was. We went out and buried the fiberoptic line between
West Palm Beach and Freeport,Bahamas. Took the robot (and us) 30 days.

Great bunch of guys and gals! Although it was a real chore having to learn
what the "Geordies" were saying..."mrbles 'n th' mouth y'know,mate."

Sho' nuff, they had their little"pub" all set up and runnin' before we'd even
left Bawlmer.

And since the Steward department was American, we had good eats. In fact, the
steward, who'd been a shipmate of mine several times over, called me one day to
tell me the Limeys were bitchin' about his breakfasts.

Now Harry is half-Hawaiian, so you have to keep him away from the Spam, but
otherwise he's a real good cook.
It turns out the Brits didn't want flapjacks, eggs n' bacon, waffles and
whatnot...
They wanted proper English breakfast food:

Stewed tomatoes and baked beans...

Honest to God, we'd take turns going by the licensed mess hatch to gape at 'em
as they packed the muck away with gusto.

Of course, they'd do the same with us...to them, we were eating hot greasy
heart-attack on a plate...with butter.

It was one of the things that made for a real fun trip. Everyone had lots of
opportunities to laugh at each other, and ourselves.

I mean, a blotto 5' 2" Glaswegian 2nd Engineer dancing about in his thong
underwear in the messes to celebrate New Year's 2001...

The other thing I learned from that lot was that it is nearly IMPOSSIBLE to
run a proper engine room on a ship where everyone drinks tea...no empty coffee
cans, y'see...EVERYTHING was a 5 gallon,(or...twenty liter), bucket.

God, the squabbles we had with the deck gang, (also Yanks), when they were
painting.

But yeah, we really lived pretty well on that ship....one of the few trips
I've had where I honestly got along well with absolutely everyone...lotta fond
memories.

Too bad the *******s didn't split the electrician gig UK-US. They kept the
Electrical Officer, although Lord knows there was enough work for an
Electronics Officer AND an Electrician.

I split to Engineer for McCallister Towing...Gawd, what a mistake!

Regards;


Mutiny is a Management Tool
Select Your Tattoo while Sober

On 30 Sep 2004 01:50:36 GMT, (Bilgeman) wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

I split to Engineer for McCallister Towing...Gawd, what a mistake!

I know a couple of Captains for McAllister Towing - HS classmates of
mine. One's out of Portland, ME and the other out of NYC.

They seem to like it.

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653