On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:12:11 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:

Gunner wrote:

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 19:40:30 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:


During Viet Nam they said we couldn't just leave Viet Nam, the evil
north Viet Namese
would bring chaos and death to the south.

The truth is they brought peace.

Sure they did.

First they killed or imprisioned most of the surviving Viet Cong,
along with anyone who worked for the Americans.

Then they purged themselves several times.

Then they ****ed off the Chinese who had to kick their ass several
times, as well as ****ing off a number of their neighbors who also
kicked their ass.

Then they started begging for US dollars by shipping home the remains
of US military personell they claimed they didnt have.

Now they have whored themselves for foriegn investment. Along with US
dollars.


Yep, peace without American aggression.


Yup..peace of their own bloody minded ideology and the business end of
an AK-47. The peace of tiger cages and mass graves in the jungle.
The kind of peace you so evidently approve of.

Orwell was writing about in and your ilk.

Gunner


Gunner


"In my humble opinion, the petty carping levied against Bush by
the Democrats proves again, it is better to have your eye plucked
out by an eagle than to be nibbled to death by ducks." - Norman
Liebmann

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:12:11 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:

Gunner wrote:

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 19:40:30 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:


During Viet Nam they said we couldn't just leave Viet Nam, the evil
north Viet Namese
would bring chaos and death to the south.

The truth is they brought peace.

Sure they did.

First they killed or imprisioned most of the surviving Viet Cong,
along with anyone who worked for the Americans.

Finishing off Tet.

But, then, our Civil War was ever so delicate an affair.

Then they ****ed off the Chinese who had to kick their ass several
times, as well as ****ing off a number of their neighbors who also
kicked their ass.

Not much of a student of history, I guess. The Vietnamese and
Chinese have been pretty much at war for centuries...

That's why they laughed so hard when US newpapers portrayed
them as Chinese puppets!

Dan

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 23:08:12 -0700, "Dan"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:12:11 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:

Gunner wrote:

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 19:40:30 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:


During Viet Nam they said we couldn't just leave Viet Nam, the evil
north Viet Namese
would bring chaos and death to the south.

The truth is they brought peace.

Sure they did.

First they killed or imprisioned most of the surviving Viet Cong,
along with anyone who worked for the Americans.

Finishing off Tet.

Tet ended in 1968 as a horrific defeat for the Communists.

But, then, our Civil War was ever so delicate an affair.

Thread change?

Then they ****ed off the Chinese who had to kick their ass several
times, as well as ****ing off a number of their neighbors who also
kicked their ass.

Not much of a student of history, I guess. The Vietnamese and
Chinese have been pretty much at war for centuries...

Yes and? They have also been buddies. The two rounds that dinged me
were manufactured in China, as were the grenades.

That's why they laughed so hard when US newpapers portrayed
them as Chinese puppets!

Dan

The Vietnamese and Chinese have had a love/hate relationship for many
years.

Still doesnt refute my statements, and you still look like an utter
dickhead. As does Haywierd.

And the Vietnamese and the Chinese are still Communists.

Sat Cong!

Gunner


"In my humble opinion, the petty carping levied against Bush by
the Democrats proves again, it is better to have your eye plucked
out by an eagle than to be nibbled to death by ducks." - Norman
Liebmann

"Gunner" wrote in message
news
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 23:08:12 -0700, "Dan"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:12:11 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:

Gunner wrote:

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 19:40:30 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:


During Viet Nam they said we couldn't just leave Viet Nam, the evil
north Viet Namese
would bring chaos and death to the south.

The truth is they brought peace.

Sure they did.

First they killed or imprisioned most of the surviving Viet Cong,
along with anyone who worked for the Americans.

Finishing off Tet.

Tet ended in 1968 as a horrific defeat for the Communists.

But, then, our Civil War was ever so delicate an affair.

Thread change?

Then they ****ed off the Chinese who had to kick their ass several
times, as well as ****ing off a number of their neighbors who also
kicked their ass.

Not much of a student of history, I guess. The Vietnamese and
Chinese have been pretty much at war for centuries...

Yes and? They have also been buddies. The two rounds that dinged me
were manufactured in China, as were the grenades.

That's why they laughed so hard when US newpapers portrayed
them as Chinese puppets!

Dan

The Vietnamese and Chinese have had a love/hate relationship for many
years.

Still doesnt refute my statements, and you still look like an utter
dickhead. As does Haywierd.

And the Vietnamese and the Chinese are still Communists.

Sat Cong!

Gunner

Man I love it hen you put your "thoughts" to the keyboard.

Every time, open your mouth and prove to all you are a fool.

Dan

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 17:58:59 -0700, "Dan"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
news
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 23:08:12 -0700, "Dan"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:12:11 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:

Gunner wrote:

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 19:40:30 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:


During Viet Nam they said we couldn't just leave Viet Nam, the evil
north Viet Namese
would bring chaos and death to the south.

The truth is they brought peace.

Sure they did.

First they killed or imprisioned most of the surviving Viet Cong,
along with anyone who worked for the Americans.

Finishing off Tet.

Tet ended in 1968 as a horrific defeat for the Communists.

But, then, our Civil War was ever so delicate an affair.

Thread change?

Then they ****ed off the Chinese who had to kick their ass several
times, as well as ****ing off a number of their neighbors who also
kicked their ass.

Not much of a student of history, I guess. The Vietnamese and
Chinese have been pretty much at war for centuries...

Yes and? They have also been buddies. The two rounds that dinged me
were manufactured in China, as were the grenades.

That's why they laughed so hard when US newpapers portrayed
them as Chinese puppets!

Dan

The Vietnamese and Chinese have had a love/hate relationship for many
years.

Still doesnt refute my statements, and you still look like an utter
dickhead. As does Haywierd.

And the Vietnamese and the Chinese are still Communists.

so not living in communes and having free market economies makes you a
coummunist??? What an interesting thought process.

THOM

Sat Cong!

Gunner

Man I love it hen you put your "thoughts" to the keyboard.

Every time, open your mouth and prove to all you are a fool.

Dan

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 08:02:02 GMT, (Thom)
wrote:

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 17:58:59 -0700, "Dan"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
news
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 23:08:12 -0700, "Dan"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:12:11 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:

Gunner wrote:

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 19:40:30 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:


During Viet Nam they said we couldn't just leave Viet Nam, the evil
north Viet Namese
would bring chaos and death to the south.

The truth is they brought peace.

Sure they did.

First they killed or imprisioned most of the surviving Viet Cong,
along with anyone who worked for the Americans.

Finishing off Tet.

Tet ended in 1968 as a horrific defeat for the Communists.

But, then, our Civil War was ever so delicate an affair.

Thread change?

Then they ****ed off the Chinese who had to kick their ass several
times, as well as ****ing off a number of their neighbors who also
kicked their ass.

Not much of a student of history, I guess. The Vietnamese and
Chinese have been pretty much at war for centuries...

Yes and? They have also been buddies. The two rounds that dinged me
were manufactured in China, as were the grenades.

That's why they laughed so hard when US newpapers portrayed
them as Chinese puppets!

Dan

The Vietnamese and Chinese have had a love/hate relationship for many
years.

Still doesnt refute my statements, and you still look like an utter
dickhead. As does Haywierd.

And the Vietnamese and the Chinese are still Communists.

so not living in communes and having free market economies makes you a
coummunist??? What an interesting thought process.

THOM

Of course not. But then eating pussy doesn't make you a lesbian unless
you are female.

Thom old wank..do you somehow think that Communism simply dried up and
died with Marx? Are you the same ****ing moron that made the claim
that the Union of Soviet Socialists Republics was not Communist? That
Cuba is not a Communist Country? That North Vietnam was not
Communist? That Uncle Ho was not Communist?

Pragmatic uses of capitalist tools to earn hard currency doesnt make
them Capitalists, when their core Dilectic remains Communist, any
more than my shooting a 1891 Mosin Nagant makes me Communist.

You truely are an ignorant ****.

Gunner


Sat Cong!

Gunner

Man I love it hen you put your "thoughts" to the keyboard.

Every time, open your mouth and prove to all you are a fool.

Dan



"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child -
miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied,
demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats." -- P.J. O'Rourke

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 09:04:38 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 08:02:02 GMT, (Thom)
wrote:

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 17:58:59 -0700, "Dan"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
news On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 23:08:12 -0700, "Dan"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:12:11 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:

Gunner wrote:

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 19:40:30 GMT, Nicholas Heyward
wrote:


During Viet Nam they said we couldn't just leave Viet Nam, the evil
north Viet Namese
would bring chaos and death to the south.

The truth is they brought peace.

Sure they did.

First they killed or imprisioned most of the surviving Viet Cong,
along with anyone who worked for the Americans.

Finishing off Tet.

Tet ended in 1968 as a horrific defeat for the Communists.

But, then, our Civil War was ever so delicate an affair.

Thread change?

Then they ****ed off the Chinese who had to kick their ass several
times, as well as ****ing off a number of their neighbors who also
kicked their ass.

Not much of a student of history, I guess. The Vietnamese and
Chinese have been pretty much at war for centuries...

Yes and? They have also been buddies. The two rounds that dinged me
were manufactured in China, as were the grenades.

That's why they laughed so hard when US newpapers portrayed
them as Chinese puppets!

Dan

The Vietnamese and Chinese have had a love/hate relationship for many
years.

Still doesnt refute my statements, and you still look like an utter
dickhead. As does Haywierd.

And the Vietnamese and the Chinese are still Communists.

so not living in communes and having free market economies makes you a
coummunist??? What an interesting thought process.

THOM

Of course not. But then eating pussy doesn't make you a lesbian unless
you are female.

Thom old wank..do you somehow think that Communism simply dried up and
died with Marx?

Nope its still around, its call THE CHURCH. String central unelected
leader and people living communally in things called convents and
monistaries.
Are you the same ****ing moron that made the claim
that the Union of Soviet Socialists Republics was not Communist?

Nope, but it was also Stalinist. Please read up and learn what that
is.

That Cuba is not a Communist Country?

correct, Cuba doesn't have communes. It turned to the USSR for help
when the right wingers in the USA supporting the Mafia and big
business turned against a popular revolution. It is a socialist state
but not a communist. There is a big difference.

That North Vietnam was not Communist?

correct. The North never really existed and is an artificial entity
created by the UN as a tempory state untill elections were held. Same
with the south. Nixon and Ike refused to hold free elections in March
1955 and Ho said I've had it and turned to whoever would aid him. He
would have been a card carrying raindeer if Santa had supplied him
with arms. He was first and foremost a Nationalists

You have to understand that everyone that waved the red flag was a
real commie. Look at Tito, he told Stalin to get bent how many times?

That Uncle Ho was not Communist?

see above

Pragmatic uses of capitalist tools to earn hard currency doesnt make
them Capitalists, when their core Dilectic remains Communist, any
more than my shooting a 1891 Mosin Nagant makes me Communist.

Hold on. Communism is an economic model. It basically says that
people should work as a group for group good and the physical
expression is places like a collective farm. But even those farms had
to deal with money or some method of exchange. Pure communism is
quite old and the first 2000 years of the Egyptian Empire was
communist in that respect. People all had good homes (for the day),
ate the same food and when the farms were not in use seasonally they
wored on public works.

Viet Nam has currency, people have jobs, many of the companies there
are actually swet shops for western compabies like NIKE. There are 9
political parties and free market socialism is the norm now.

The issue with the USSR is that something needed to be done to drag
Russia etc out of the Tzarist stone age where 90% of the population
was peasants and illiterate. Hence the 5 year plans and central
planning. Stalin was a ******* of course but someone had to take the
reins and make a decision as how to bring the country up to western
standards. I disagree with the methods as any sane person would but
it worked. It might have been a necessary evil, same with China.
Since we can't re-run the experiment we will never know will we.

You truely are an ignorant ****.

Yah right. Have you even been to a communist or socialist country?
Or do you just believe all the right wing BS? The truth lies
somewhere in the middle between right wing BS and far left wing
propaghanda.

Even been to a real communist country called the Vatican?

THOM

Gunner


Sat Cong!

Gunner

Man I love it hen you put your "thoughts" to the keyboard.

Every time, open your mouth and prove to all you are a fool.

Dan



"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child -
miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied,
demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats." -- P.J. O'Rourke

I missed the staff meeting but the minutes show Gunner
wrote back on Sun, 19 Sep 2004 09:04:38 GMT in
misc.survivalism :

Pragmatic uses of capitalist tools to earn hard currency doesnt make
them Capitalists, when their core Dilectic remains Communist, any
more than my shooting a 1891 Mosin Nagant makes me Communist.

Of course not. Using a 1891 Mosin Nagant would make you a Tsarist
Imperialist. :-) It is using a 1938 Mosin Nagant which makes you a
communist. (or a 1930 or 1944 model).


pyotr



--
pyotr filipivich
Denial is not a river in Egypt, "Denial is a save-now-pay-later scheme,
a contract written entirely in small print, for in the long run, the
denying person knows the truth on some level. LtCol Grossman.

I missed the staff meeting but the minutes show Gunner
wrote back on Fri, 17 Sep 2004 08:31:40 GMT
in misc.survivalism :

That's why they laughed so hard when US newpapers portrayed
them as Chinese puppets!

The Vietnamese and Chinese have had a love/hate relationship for many
years.

Still doesnt refute my statements, and you still look like an utter
dickhead. As does Haywierd.

And the Vietnamese and the Chinese are still Communists.

My observation of events in that area in the late 1970s was that having
eliminated the running dog capitalists, it was time for the Fraternal
Socialists Brothers to get back to what has always been important: tribal
warfare. With the Viet trying to bring Civilization to the Khymer, and
the Chinese once again attempting to bring the benefits of the Mandate of
Heaven to their wayward 'little brothers'.

Never underestimate the ability for tribalism to express itself in_any_
perfect system.

Sat Cong!

What he said.

Gunner

p.s. just heard a variation on your observation about opinions. "Their
like armpits: everybody has a couple and they both stink!"

--
pyotr filipivich
Next Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them, Selecting a new Them

"pyotr filipivich" wrote in message
...
I missed the staff meeting but the minutes show Gunner
wrote back on Fri, 17 Sep 2004 08:31:40 GMT
in misc.survivalism :

That's why they laughed so hard when US newpapers portrayed
them as Chinese puppets!

The Vietnamese and Chinese have had a love/hate relationship for many
years.

Still doesnt refute my statements, and you still look like an utter
dickhead. As does Haywierd.

And the Vietnamese and the Chinese are still Communists.

My observation of events in that area in the late 1970s was that having
eliminated the running dog capitalists, it was time for the Fraternal
Socialists Brothers to get back to what has always been important: tribal
warfare. With the Viet trying to bring Civilization to the Khymer, and
the Chinese once again attempting to bring the benefits of the Mandate of
Heaven to their wayward 'little brothers'.

Never underestimate the ability for tribalism to express itself in_any_
perfect system.

Sat Cong!

What he said.

Gunner

p.s. just heard a variation on your observation about opinions. "Their
like armpits: everybody has a couple and they both stink!"

--
pyotr filipivich
Next Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them, Selecting a new Them